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Thread: Rand releases immigration bill

  1. #1



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  3. #2
    What chance is there of anything Rand introduces of passing? What good is it to have lone warriors elected? Do they accomplish anything? What did Ron accomplish? The argument is always that Ron educated us and got the movement going. Hmm and where are all those awoken people? The only way Rand or Thomas Massie or any elected person can make a significant change is if they were the majority not the lone warrior. I have not read his bill but I will guarantee that it will not pass.

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    What chance is there of anything Rand introduces of passing? What good is it to have lone warriors elected? Do they accomplish anything? What did Ron accomplish? The argument is always that Ron educated us and got the movement going. Hmm and where are all those awoken people? The only way Rand or Thomas Massie or any elected person can make a significant change is if they were the majority not the lone warrior. I have not read his bill but I will guarantee that it will not pass.
    Considering how we (Ron Paul supporters) have been ripped apart on the immigration issue, seeing some leadership from Rand on this issue is most welcome. Or to coin a phrase "Education begins at home." Thank you @Warlord for posting this.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Warlord View Post
    Ouch, this isn't going to go over well here.
    "The Patriarch"

    Quote Originally Posted by RJB View Post
    Now a days the future freedoms of ones posterity is less important than the freedom today to insert what one wants into ones posterior.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    That is a lie.
    @Brian4Liberty, devil keeps spreading this lie.
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  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    Ouch, this isn't going to go over well here.
    Let the chips fall where they may. I #StandWithRand.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    What chance is there of anything Rand introduces of passing? What good is it to have lone warriors elected? Do they accomplish anything? What did Ron accomplish? The argument is always that Ron educated us and got the movement going. Hmm and where are all those awoken people? The only way Rand or Thomas Massie or any elected person can make a significant change is if they were the majority not the lone warrior. I have not read his bill but I will guarantee that it will not pass.
    I totally get what you're saying, and I think you're basically right.

    But it's funny how we get opposing objections here that if our guys listened to them, they couldn't do anything.

    If Amash supports impeaching Trump and leaves the GOP it means he won't be able to accomplish anything anymore, and he should supposedly instead be more like Rand and build bridges with Trump. But if he were like Rand and stayed in the GOP and kissed Trump's butt more, it would still be pointless and he still wouldn't be able to accomplish anything.

  8. #7
    Incidentally, we just had a discussion here recently where some posters expressed doubts about my claim that Rand supported increasing H1-B visas. It doesn't look like this bill does precisely that, but it does increase employment based green cards fourfold.

    CATO also says, "No legislation since the 2013 immigration reform bill that passed the Senate would increase skilled immigration more than this bill."

    Kudos to Rand for this.

  9. #8
    Rand’s bill focuses on green cards for people who are already here in the US and waiting in line for a green card.

    It does not increase H-1B limits.

    There are a couple of problems with skilled immigration that the bill doesn’t address—including the outdated H-1B limit and the burdensome and nonsensical labor certification process for employers
    An earlier thread was about why Rand had blocked a different immigration bill to force a vote. It’s likely that something he has proposed in this bill was missing from other legislation. IDK if Rand has explicitly given his reasoning for forcing the vote.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.



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  11. #9
    Rand Justin Clinton must have lost his mind.
    “The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.” --George Orwell

    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    In terms of a full spectrum candidate, Rand is leaps and bounds above Trump. I'm not disputing that.
    Who else in public life has called for a pre-emptive strike on North Korea?--Donald Trump

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by kcchiefs6465 View Post
    Rand Justin Clinton must have lost his mind.
    Beltway libertarian policy is almost identical to US Chamber policy. Cato, Koch, and the US Chamber will reward those who help them.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Rand’s bill focuses on green cards for people who are already here in the US and waiting in line for a green card.

    It does not increase H-1B limits.



    An earlier thread was about why Rand had blocked a different immigration bill to force a vote. It’s likely that something he has proposed in this bill was missing from other legislation. IDK if Rand has explicitly given his reasoning for forcing the vote.
    Indirectly it does.

    Increases the limit on green cards for employment-based immigrants from 140,000 to 270,000 (pp. 1-3). This increase would double the caps for the first through third preference categories (mainly employees of U.S. businesses) as well as the fifth preference category for major investors in U.S. enterprises. The worldwide limits have not increased since 1990 when the U.S. economy was half the size that it is today, and most of the major tech companies did not exist or were in their infancy. About three quarters of the Fortune 500’s largest companies in 1990 have been replaced. This update reflects the changes in the economy since 1990.

    Exempts spouses and minor children of employment-based immgirants from the limit (p. 3). This change accords with the actual statute as it exists today, but this legislation would explicitly require the government not to count them against the quotas. About half of all green cards issued under the employment-based categories are actually used by spouses and minor children. It makes no sense to reduce the quota on workers simply because the worker is married or has a child. In other words, this would further double the employment-based cap. As a result, these two changes would end wait times for all immigrants in a very short period of time.

    Exempts “shortage occupations” (currently nurses) from the limit (pp. 3-4). If the Department of Labor (DOL) currently lists an occupation as a shortage occupation, employers may hire foreign workers on green cards without the normal burdensome labor certification process. So far, DOL has listed only two occupations as shortage occupations: nurses and physical therapists. The BELIEVE Act would exempt shortage occupations from the green card limit entirely. This change is important because nurses are currently ineligible for H-1B high-skilled visas, which means that the only way for them to get a foot in the door of a U.S. business is a green card. There are not precise statistics from the government on the number of foreign nurses, but it is likely about 7,000. While this would immediately benefit nurses and physical therapists, this change would also allow DOL to exempt occupations in future years if it updated its regulations.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by kcchiefs6465 View Post
    Rand Justin Clinton must have lost his mind.
    Or maybe a large segment of RPF lost its mind with Trump's election.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  15. #13
    It's a very bad idea, hopefully It won't pass or Trump will veto it.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It's a very bad idea, hopefully It won't pass or Trump will veto it.
    I agree and hope Rand is in his ear about most other issues other than increasing immigration. If he does bring it up I hope Trump shuts him down.

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by kahless View Post
    I agree and hope Rand is in his ear about most other issues other than increasing immigration. If he does bring it up I hope Trump shuts him down.
    On this one issue I hope Trump rubs off on Rand, Immigration is THE most important issue for the preservation and restoration of liberty and we can't afford to allow the status quo let alone make things worse.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It's a very bad idea, hopefully It won't pass or Trump will veto it.
    Hopefully Rand becomes POTUS in 2024 and can sign the bill himself.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Hopefully Rand becomes POTUS in 2024 and can sign the bill himself.
    Hopefully he does become President and can't sign it because the new Congress doesn't send it to him
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Hopefully he does become President and can't sign it because the new Congress doesn't send it to him
    They'll probably send him a complete amnesty bill along with a border wall, face scanning cameras and a large capacity magazine ban.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    They'll probably send him a complete amnesty bill along with a border wall, face scanning cameras and a large capacity magazine ban.
    Not if we get the right kind of Congressmen.
    But if he does have a Demoncrat Congress he will veto any such bill.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Not if we get the right kind of Congressmen.
    LOL

    But if he does have a Demoncrat Congress he will veto any such bill.
    Republicans will vote in mass for the surveillance state. They have from the beginning. They'll compromise with the dems on banning weapons. That's how the 1993 Clintonista Crime Bill which both supported mass incarceration and an assault weapons ban passed.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    LOL



    Republicans will vote in mass for the surveillance state. They have from the beginning. They'll compromise with the dems on banning weapons. That's how the 1993 Clintonista Crime Bill which both supported mass incarceration and an assault weapons ban passed.
    Times are changing.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  25. #22
    Rearrangement of the deck chairs on the Titanic.

    Tweaking the visa numbers by single digit percentage points within a legal framework does nothing to address the hordes of illegal invaders crossing the border by the hundreds of thousands every year.

    And where are the sections on reducing handouts, welfare and government incentives, that I am told is the only way to stop the invasion?

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Rearrangement of the deck chairs on the Titanic.

    Tweaking the visa numbers by single digit percentage points within a legal framework does nothing to address the hordes of illegal invaders crossing the border by the hundreds of thousands every year.

    And where are the sections on reducing handouts, welfare and government incentives, that I am told is the only way to stop the invasion?
    I'm very disappointed in Rand about this bill, the globalibertarians are quite pleased because of the points you make.

    Their agenda is to flood us with immigrants and they aren't really interested in cutting incentives, that's just a mantra they use to oppose any attempts to actually stop the invasion or evict the invaders.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I'm very disappointed in Rand about this bill, the globalibertarians are quite pleased because of the points you make.

    Their agenda is to flood us with immigrants and they aren't really interested in cutting incentives, that's just a mantra they use to oppose any attempts to actually stop the invasion or evict the invaders.
    But just think of the growth of our economy, comrade!

    "Only after disaster can we be resurrected."

    Heil Honkler!



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Rearrangement of the deck chairs on the Titanic.

    Tweaking the visa numbers by single digit percentage points within a legal framework does nothing to address the hordes of illegal invaders crossing the border by the hundreds of thousands every year.

    And where are the sections on reducing handouts, welfare and government incentives, that I am told is the only way to stop the invasion?

    There will be no cuts whatsoever to welfare no matter who holds office. This is about NWO/MIC using pawns in order to accomplish the goal. Excuses will be made why we must restrict our right to travel freely and give up private/business property rights (sustainable development), and implement biometrics not only in America, but on a global scale.

    It is Bush's TSA all over again. Only this will seal our fate.

    Rand is doing whatever he can to hang on to the last threads of our freedom, especially knowing how the GOV/MIC operates.


    It is no longer a matter of if, but when. 2030 is the stated goal, but you can count on 2022.


    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...in-the-Swamp-)

    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...ense-Databases

    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...ometric-Update


    EVERYTHING OCCURING TODAY AND IN THE NEWS IS A DISTRACTION.
    Last edited by PAF; 07-14-2019 at 07:32 AM.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    There will be no cuts whatsoever to welfare no matter who holds office. This is about NWO/MIC using pawns in order to accomplish the goal. Excuses will be made why we must restrict our right to travel freely and give up private/business property rights (sustainable development), and implement biometrics not only in America, but on a global scale.

    It is Bush's TSA all over again. Only this will seal our fate.

    Rand is doing whatever he can to hang on to the last threads of our freedom, especially knowing how the GOV/MIC operates.


    It is no longer a matter of if, but when. 2030 is the stated goal, but you can count on 2022.


    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...in-the-Swamp-)

    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...ense-Databases

    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...ometric-Update


    EVERYTHING OCCURING TODAY AND IN THE NEWS IS A DISTRACTION.
    Rand is (inadvertently) helping the globalists with this and undermining any hope of preserving and restoring our liberty.

    Thanks for admitting that your "cut the incentives" mantra is just garbage you spew to try and prevent any attempt to secure our borders against the communist invasion the globalists are using to destroy us.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Rand is (inadvertently) helping the globalists with this and undermining any hope of preserving and restoring our liberty.

    Thanks for admitting that your "cut the incentives" mantra is just garbage you spew to try and prevent any attempt to secure our borders against the communist invasion the globalists are using to destroy us.
    I know that you have been wanting to have that sit down with Ron to explain reality to him. Don't forget to block out some of your valuable time to sit Rand down afterward to provide your valuable words of wisdom to him also. Perhaps you should run for president to set the world free since you are all knowing.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    I know that you have been wanting to have that sit down with Ron to explain reality to him. Don't forget to block out some of your valuable time to sit Rand down afterward to provide your valuable words of wisdom to him also. Perhaps you should run for president to set the world free since you are all knowing.
    I am neither rich nor connected but if I could I would.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  33. #29

  34. #30
    The content of Rand's bill matters not. It would not pass if it were a great bill!

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