The late, great Will Grigg on the border invasion

[Superfluous Man]

People can change their minds.

I agree. And when quoting the pre-2006 Will Grigg, it's good to keep in mind that he subsequently changed his mind, and that his more mature perspective is not the older one that he repudiated, but the later one that he maintained until his death.

Will Grigg is not with us (sadly) to comment on the current crisis, so what he would think of the situation, today, is nothing but speculation.

It's true that we can't say for sure if he would have changed his mind again. But since the situation today is no different than it was when he died, or in 2006 when he left JBS, I see no reason to think that the many wonderful pro-immigration and anti-police-state editorials he wrote over the course of that decade would be any less relevant and instructive now than they were when he wrote them.

If there's one thing Will Grigg was most consistent on, it's also the one thing Donald Trump is most consistent on, which is his evaluation of the police-state that is worshiped by "law-and-order conservatives." Trump and his pro-DHS pro-ICE pro-wall pro-E-verify pro-deportation followers epitomize it, and Grigg was its nemesis.

This excuse-making reminds me of a recent thread where you lamented the more consistent libertarians and the liberties they wished to afford fellow Americans and immigrants for the way you felt compelled in your responses to them to defend the cops, and you complained with essentially a variation of the wife-beater's accusation, "Look what you made me do," as if you still imagined yourself to be the same anti-police-state champion you once were back when you shared the late great Will Grigg's openness to immigration and weren't prepared to recognize your own cognitive dissonance.

[Anti Federalist]

I agree. And when quoting the pre-2006 Will Grigg, it's good to keep in mind that he subsequently changed his mind, and that his more mature perspective is not the older one that he repudiated, but the later one that he maintained until his death.

Being biased toward that opinion, you assume that is more "mature"...you assign worth to it because you agree.

My evaluation is neutral.

It's true that we can't say for sure if he would have changed his mind again. But since the situation today is no different than it was when he died, or in 2006 when he left JBS, I see no reason to think that the many wonderful pro-immigration and anti-police-state editorials he wrote over the course of that decade would be any less relevant and instructive now than they were when he wrote them.

I disagree. I think the situation and especially the goals and tone of the opposition has radically changed and has clearly shown, to me at least, what the real goals of the opposition are, and the future that the opposition has planned for me and mine.

I still fully agree with those opinions that he held and that I posted so frequently.

Allowing millions of illegal invaders from nations and cultures immersed in police tyranny, abuse, murder and corruption many times worse than what we are already suffering under now, here, will not improve the situation. As they become embedded in the body politic and start making their political will known, you will lose freedom even more rapidly.

Exhibit A: California.

If there's one thing Will Grigg was most consistent on, it's also the one thing Donald Trump is most consistent on, which is his evaluation of the police-state that is worshiped by "law-and-order conservatives." Trump and his pro-DHS pro-ICE pro-wall pro-E-verify pro-deportation followers epitomize it, and Grigg was its nemesis.

Yet it was Trump that picked up the flag of prison and sentencing reform...something Grigg and I both have been railing about for years.

This excuse-making reminds me of a recent thread where you lamented the more consistent libertarians and the liberties they wished to afford fellow Americans and immigrants for the way you felt compelled in your responses to them to defend the cops, and you complained with essentially a variation of the wife-beater's accusation, "Look what you made me do," as if you still imagined yourself to be the same anti-police-state champion you once were back when you shared the late great Will Grigg's openness to immigration and weren't prepared to recognize your own cognitive dissonance.

Pull the thread and we'll discuss it.

Like I have stated numerous times, I have changed my mind regarding the seriousness of the current migrant invasion...current events and things that have been made clear to me have forced me to re-evaluate.

I still have no love of police, I still do not recommend that they ever be called for anything, I still advise to avoid them at all costs.

What have I significantly changed in that regard?

ETA - Just like I have re-evaluated my position on "gay marriage".

Sadly, I had people close to me warn me about taking a "live and let live" position on this, that it would degenerate into something much more than just two homosexuals being allowed to register their bonds with the state...who I still maintain should not be involved at all in any kind of marriage.

But if I had known ten years ago that the effort to legitimize gay marriage as a means to remove the state from something it should not have been involved with in the first place would morph into this hateful, fascist, authoritarian, fagggot mafia of insane wierdosexuals and normalizing kiddie diddlers, I would have told them all to $#@! off, get back into the $#@!ing closet you came out of, you bunch of $#@!ing sodomites.

[TheTexan]

But if I had known ten years ago that the effort to legitimize gay marriage as a means to remove the state from something it should not have been involved with in the first place would morph into this hateful, fascist, authoritarian, fagggot mafia of insane wierdosexuals and normalizing kiddie diddlers, I would have told them all to $#@! off, get back into the $#@!ing closet you came out of, you bunch of $#@!ing sodomites.

+rep I can't stand how hateful they have become

[PAF]

People can change their minds.

They can address new realities within a framework of bedrock principles and come to differing conclusions.

To wed oneself to a particular policy or action, ignoring the reality around you, is pedantic cant masquerading as informed opinion.

Will Grigg is not with us (sadly) to comment on the current crisis, so what he would think of the situation, today, is nothing but speculation.

Fortunate for me, I do but succumb to peer pressure and do not change my mind on principled positions. I got out of that teeny-bopper phase many decades ago. One of the reasons we are in this mess is because “republicans” toe the party line no matter what the loss. Wonder why my signature gets grossly spit on on the other republican forum - this be it.

[Stratovarious]

Yes, of course. Because, you are a big government lackey. Nothing new here.

We need nappy open borers, why ?
Well because it works nowhere in the world , so we should do it
here just to prove that that is true. Doh, Doh, Doh, Doh........

[Stratovarious]

Why get mad at me? You are the one who backs this corrupt government organization. I am simply standing by principle here and trying to get You/Swordy/AF/Fed off of my freaking financial back. It is my money, after all, and you guys think you have rightful claim to it.

Who's money pays for Illegal Alien welfare, med costs, education, prisons stays etc......


Not yours ?


Don't bich when it's coming out of your own back yard, and you approve, want more .

[Stratovarious]

This always pisses @Danke off when I bring it up, but...

My great-great Uncle Smedley said there are only two legitimate reasons to go to war: to defend your home or to defend the bill of rights. War for any other reason is a racket.

What is happening right now is open, Fifth Gen demographic warfare, being waged against both, my home and my liberty.

Those who fail to see that do so not only at their own peril but at the peril of all those around them.

Smedely was really your uncle, cool........

[Stratovarious]

Try to be original there, Swordy... I recall originally coining “It sickens me”, referring to you and the other STATISTS on this RPF.

Look, you are well known to be the “resident statist” here in these parts. I am pretty sure a poll would back that up.

You're making us all car sick.
Sickeningly.

[Stratovarious]

Fortunate for me, I do but succumb to peer pressure and do not change my mind on principled positions. I got out of that teeny-bopper phase many decades ago. One of the reasons we are in this mess is because “republicans” toe the party line no matter what the loss. Wonder why my signature gets grossly spit on on the other republican forum - this be it.

Then it sickens me that you haven't fixed your signature, its based on
property rights, and you don't even address the taxation / 'rent' aspect, or literally renting from the gobt' ,
and if I recall your problem is 'public domain' , so if we need a damn , fk off
build it in Mexico, you're not taking my shack, even though the gbt is
probably paying you twice what its worth.

[Swordsmyth]

Voluntary association as long as it does not puke on the natural rights of others, otherwise I would be no better than those who I oppose.

Foreigners have no natural right to come here and they will violate our natural rights.
But you know that.

I can not explain it because it is simply not true. You are the one who violates the RPF site mission. We can through that exercise one by one but I believe that was already done in a prior thread.

Shill, my positions and why are widely known, do not try to twist my words completely out of context to suit your own pro-government-growth agenda.

You jumped the shark in this thread.
It's obvious you want the invaders to succeed and impose their governmental preferences on us.

[Swordsmyth]

I made it clear that we are talking about a private, volunteer fire brigade...doing nothing more than accessing the fire around you by going across your property with hoses and equipment, not hut hutting into your home to chop it to bits and drown it.

You would be opposed to that community effort?

But yet you have no opposition to communal efforts brought about by specialization in labor and commerce?

He would very happily allow his neighbor's houses to burn and prevent the fire fighters from putting out the blaze because he wants to rip off his insurance company.

[Swordsmyth]

There are many human endeavors that take a village to complete successfully.

The ability to co-operate toward a common goal is what separates us from the animals.

The poison that Hillary was talking about was injecting it into areas it should not be, and substituting "village" with "government", which brings with it forced compliance.

Assuming you have had children, wouldn't you much rather live in a community, that, if somebody sees your child in trouble of some sort, steps in to help, or to contact you, instead of anonymously calling cops on them?

Defending against the armies of tyrants and pillaging barbarians takes a village.

At least a village.

[Anti Federalist]

Fortunate for me, I do but succumb to peer pressure and do not change my mind on principled positions. I got out of that teeny-bopper phase many decades ago. One of the reasons we are in this mess is because “republicans” toe the party line no matter what the loss. Wonder why my signature gets grossly spit on on the other republican forum - this be it.

I would suggest that refusing to acknowledge clear indicators of a changed dynamic would be more indicative of an immature, "teeny bopper" mindset.

[Anti Federalist]

Smedely was really your uncle, cool........

Yes, on my paternal grandmother's side of the family.

[Stratovarious]

Yes, on my paternal grandmother's side of the family.

Very cool.

[Stratovarious]

''War Is A Racket''

[Swordsmyth]

I would suggest that refusing to acknowledge clear indicators of a changed dynamic would be more indicative of an immature, "teeny bopper" mindset.

Or ulterior motives.

[PAF]

He would very happily allow his neighbor's houses to burn and prevent the fire fighters from putting out the blaze because he wants to rip off his insurance company.

There you go again. Boy you are a hoot lately

No, Swordy, I would not let my neighbors houses to burn. I live next to great folks and we actually help each other when the need arises, voluntarily of course. A smoke and a beer typically follow ;-)

[Swordsmyth]

There you go again. Boy you are a hoot lately

No, Swordy, I would not let my neighbors houses to burn. I live next to great folks and we actually help each other when the need arises, voluntarily of course. A smoke and a beer typically follow ;-)

You would let the house burn down rather than allow the volunteers put it out:

You replied just as I edited that I am within my right to contract that out if I choose to do so, and in that case yes they may access my property for that reason only. If I choose not to contract that out but others around me do, then the private fire brigade must find another route outside of my property.

[PAF]

Yes, on my paternal grandmother's side of the family.

Our group actually bought quite a few copies and handed them out when we thought they showed serious interest in reading it and changed some minds.

[PAF]

You would let the house burn down rather than allow the volunteers put it out:

Oh get off of it. I was merely making a strong point about property rights and the requirements that I demand before anybody sets foot on it. I know a few volunteer fire fighters, and also cops. The fire dept I sometimes throw money at when they have their fund drives, the cops I tell them straight up they are a criminal organization and go f&cking hike, they will never get a single penny from me.

[Anti Federalist]

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