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Thread: If it came down to it, which Demo candidates could push Nuke button?

  1. #1

    If it came down to it, which Demo candidates could push Nuke button?

    If it came down to it, out of all of the Democratic candidates, which could push the Nuke button?

    Maybe Biden.

    All of the rest? I doubt it very much.

    Trump though? No doubt about it.
    Last edited by Dary; 06-11-2019 at 09:46 PM.



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  3. #2
    Good question. I always base my vote on a candidate's nuke button pushability. That and ability to assign cool nicknames.
    "It's probably the biggest hoax since Big Foot!" - Mitt Romney 1-16-2012 SC Debate

  4. #3

  5. #4
    Swalwell.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  6. #5
    All of them.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Dary View Post
    All of the rest? I doubt it very much.
    Why?

    I see absolutely zero reason to think any of them are any less psychopathic than the typical politician at that level.

  8. #7
    Let's see, they all think that its ok to kill babies up until the moment of birth and even after. They all blame humans for destroying the world and seem to hate humankind. I think the problem might be keeping them from pushing the button.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    Why?

    I see absolutely zero reason to think any of them are any less psychopathic than the typical politician at that level.
    Take Bernie (and many of the other candidates who think along the same lines) for instance. I just don't see him/them wiping out millions of people that he/they agree(s) with. They considers the other countries systems of government more legitimate than our own.

    They care more for the welfare of other countries populations than our own. Like the politicians in CA who want to give medical benefits to illegal aliens by taxing american citizens who don't have insurance.

    Beto has apologized for just about everything. I'm sure that the last thing he'd want to do is apologize for pushing the button, so why do it in the first place?



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    Let's see, they all think that its ok to kill babies up until the moment of birth and even after. They all blame humans for destroying the world and seem to hate humankind. I think the problem might be keeping them from pushing the button.
    If they did, then I'm afraid that WE might be the target.

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Dary View Post
    If they did, then I'm afraid that WE might be the target.
    That is what im saying.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Dary View Post
    Take Bernie (and many of the other candidates who think along the same lines) for instance. I just don't see him/them wiping out millions of people that he/they agree(s) with. They considers the other countries systems of government more legitimate than our own.

    They care more for the welfare of other countries populations than our own. Like the politicians in CA who want to give medical benefits to illegal aliens by taxing american citizens who don't have insurance.

    Beto has apologized for just about everything. I'm sure that the last thing he'd want to do is apologize for pushing the button, so why do it in the first place?
    If you're talking about whether or not circumstances would likely develop that would make nuking some place advantageous for any president, then I see very little likelihood of that for anyone from either party, just from a cost benefit analysis from their own perspectives.

    So it's all a big hypothetical.

    But *if* any circumstances were to develop that they *did* believe made it personally beneficial for any of them to nuke anyone, then they'd do it.

    War has always proven to be a powerful catalyst for regimes accruing more domestic power to themselves. And it's not hard for any of them to come up with foreign enemies, even if they have to make them from scratch, to pave the way for a war. But generally speaking, actually using nukes doesn't accomplish much for them, just like it doesn't do a dairy farmer much good to just kill off a bunch of his cattle.

    That said, there are some who see the prospect of decreasing human population as a net positive and may want to cull the herd some Thanos-style. I don't really see this as a factor yet in presidential politics in 2019, but it could get there. And both parties have their own versions of this mindset.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    If you're talking about whether or not circumstances would likely develop that would make nuking some place advantageous for any president, then I see very little likelihood of that for anyone from either party, just from a cost benefit analysis from their own perspectives.

    So it's all a big hypothetical.

    But *if* any circumstances were to develop that they *did* believe made it personally beneficial for any of them to nuke anyone, then they'd do it.

    War has always proven to be a powerful catalyst for regimes accruing more domestic power to themselves. And it's not hard for any of them to come up with foreign enemies, even if they have to make them from scratch, to pave the way for a war. But generally speaking, actually using nukes doesn't accomplish much for them, just like it doesn't do a dairy farmer much good to just kill off a bunch of his cattle.

    That said, there are some who see the prospect of decreasing human population as a net positive and may want to cull the herd some Thanos-style. I don't really see this as a factor yet in presidential politics in 2019, but it could get there. And both parties have their own versions of this mindset.
    When I posted "If it came down to it", I was considering a response to a preemptive nuke attack against the U.S.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    That is what im saying.
    You said "humans" and "human kind". You didn't say "The United States".

    Most of them (if not all of them) consider the U.S. to be the problem.

    But if a foreign government (or terrorist organization) believes that they can get away with a preemptive nuke strike on the U.S., then that certainly removes the major disincentive that MAD provides.
    Last edited by Dary; 06-12-2019 at 07:52 AM.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Dary View Post
    When I posted "If it came down to it", I was considering a response to a preemptive nuke attack against the U.S.
    I don't see why any of them would let a crisis like that go to waste.

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    I don't see why any of them would let a crisis like that go to waste.
    By not responding, they wouldn't be.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Dary View Post
    By not responding, they wouldn't be.
    I don't see where you're coming from. Why would any king want to kill off all his own loyal subjects and tax base? They thrive on our fear to get more control over us. A nuclear attack against us would be the greatest opportunity in history for them to compel the American people to give them more control.
    Last edited by Superfluous Man; 06-12-2019 at 08:15 AM.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    I don't see where you're coming from. Why would any king want to kill off all his own loyal subjects? They thrive on our fear to get more control over us. A nuclear attack against us would be the greatest opportunity in history for them to compel the American people to give them more control.
    In an all out preemptive attack, many if not most of "his loyal subjects" would already be dead or dying. What's left to control?

    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    Why would any king want to kill off all his own loyal subjects?
    Did I post that?
    Last edited by Dary; 06-12-2019 at 08:23 AM.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Dary View Post
    In an all out preemptive attack, many if not most of "his loyal subjects" would already be dead or dying. What's left to control?


    Did I post that?
    Absolute power corrupts absolutely, its addictive- at the moment they don't control everything, people still have a free will. TPTB want to force their will onto us because they think they know whats best for us. They feel like they can make better choices for us than we can. They think of us like dogs.

  22. #19
    Butt Gig. He seems to succumb easily to peer pressure:

    There is only one kind of freedom and that's individual liberty. Our lives come from our creator
    and our liberty comes from our creator. It has nothing to do with government granting it. -Ron Paul

    RAND 20/20

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Absolute power corrupts absolutely, its addictive- at the moment they don't control everything, people still have a free will. TPTB want to force their will onto us because they think they know whats best for us. They feel like they can make better choices for us than we can. They think of us like dogs.
    ...and?

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Dary View Post
    ...and?
    The people left after any sort of disaster would be absolutely devoted to the establishment that keeps it safe, fear is the absolute power driver people cannot turn it off, the ones that do are crazy.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Dary View Post
    In an all out preemptive attack, many if not most of "his loyal subjects" would already be dead or dying. What's left to control?
    Whoever is left would be what's left to control. The decision to retaliate with nukes would need to be made prior to knowing how many survivors there would be. There would be no opportunity for the president to take inventory and conclude that there's no point any more. Plus, any existing power in the world that did preemptively nuke the US would not have the means to wipe out our population or come anywhere close to that.

    The foreign power that sent the nukes, who would then quickly become a conquered nation devoid of its former regime would also potentially be left for this president to control. Again, an opportunity hardly any US president of any party could pass up.
    Last edited by Superfluous Man; 06-12-2019 at 09:24 AM.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    The people left after any sort of disaster would be absolutely devoted to the establishment that keeps it safe, fear is the absolute power driver people cannot turn it off, the ones that do are crazy.
    I'm not sure what that has do with my OP.

    Maybe I should re-state/re-ask the question.

    If the U.S. were to be attacked in an all out preemptive nuclear strike, do you believe that ANY democratic candidate would respond with an equal and overwhelming nuclear attack against the attackers insuring mutually assured destruction?

    My contention is that MAYBE there might be one.

    Joe Biden. But only because he is from the old school.

    Trump. No doubt about it.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Dary View Post
    I'm not sure what that has do with my OP.

    Maybe I should re-ask the question.

    If the U.S. were to be attacked in an all out preemptive nuclear strike, do you believe that ANY democratic candidate would respond with an equal and overwhelming nuclear attack against the attackers insuring mutually assured destruction?


    My contention is that MAYBE there might be one.


    Joe Biden. But only because he is from the old school.

    Trump. No doubt about it.
    I think they all would.

    But I think I may have misunderstood where you were coming from in the OP. Are you saying all this from the perspective of one who sees responding with a nuclear attack in those circumstances as a good thing, so that when you say Trump would do that and the Dems wouldn't, this is a selling point in Trump's favor?



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    I think they all would.

    But I think I may have misunderstood where you were coming from in the OP. Are you saying all this from the perspective of one who sees responding with a nuclear attack in those circumstances as a good thing, so that when you say Trump would do that and the Dems wouldn't, this is a selling point in Trump's favor?
    Fear is always the biggest selling point in presidential elections. Its like when that guy on the news in 2015 said Rand would have to say he would nuke a middle eastern country to win the presidency, he wasn't being dishonest.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    Are you saying all this from the perspective of one who sees responding with a nuclear attack in those circumstances as a good thing?
    I see it as a good thing that any country even thinking about attacking the U.S. with a preemptive nuclear first strike, understand that their country will suffer a similar fate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    So that when you say Trump would do that and the Dems wouldn't, this is a selling point in Trump's favor?
    In a really $#@!ed up sort of way... yes.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Dary View Post
    I see it as a good thing that any country even thinking about attacking the U.S. with a preemptive nuclear first strike, understand that their country will suffer a similar fate.

    Preserve the Imperialistic Socialist Order?
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Preserve the Imperialistic Socialist Order?
    So then if it were up to you, you wouldn't respond?

    Do you want to be nuked?

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Dary View Post
    So then if it were up to you, you wouldn't respond?
    If it was up to me, we would have a completely different country. One based upon accurate history, quality education to provide truth and understanding, and allow the people to respond to threats, not corporatist bureaucrats.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    If it was up to me, we would have a completely different country. One based upon accurate history, quality education to provide truth and understanding, and allow the people to respond to threats, not corporatist bureaucrats.
    On that I couldn't agree with you more.

    But that wasn't the question.

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