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Thread: [Video] Justin Amash town hall 5/28/19

  1. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    If your beliefs were correct then what advantage is there in Amash running farther to the left?
    You can either give up entirely or attempt to work with conservatives and convert them to be more small government.

    I am a Conservertarian and I have never attempted to hide it, I was anti-Trump before he exceeded my expectations and I was part of the Ron Paul movement since before he ran in '08.
    Why is allying with the people who don't think you are innocent until proven guilty such a bad idea? Its not like they weaponized the IRS against us.



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  3. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Todd View Post
    Look. I'm an old man and don't believe your young man, naive fairy tale anymore about left vs right. I grew up listening to Reagan beat the drums of small government tripe and then run up the first mega deficit. I then was proud to supporter of the Buchanan brigade because I really believed "conservatives" wanted to change from big government in the 90's to small government. And then in my absolute stupidity, I voted for W. Bush not once, but twice. Then I learned my lesson. I'm too young to believe that there is a significant number of people left who even resemble true small government conservatism

    You haven't nor will you convert $#@!. I watched it for front and center for the last 10 years and this movement had the single best chance in my lifetime to try to buck the system and it didn't happen.

    Here's the truth. Most people you call Conservative are just Progressive lite.

    THE default position for the majority of "Conservatives" and the left is one of complete capitulation on ever ending Government growth.

    The new measure of left vs right in this country is

    1. How much deficit spending your willing to tolerate.
    2. Unlimited state growth by degree
    3. Social welfare of your personal political preferences. (where you just bad mouth the other guys projects exp. Welfare vs warfare)

    Those are new axioms in governing philosophy of the majority of politicians right and left. Get used to it.

    You know what I think. I think your just a run of the mill "Republican" and Trump supporter who decided after the election to just show up and test the waters at old "Liberty Forest". You know......See if everyone was ripe for MAGA! I don't for one second believe you have any belief system beyond Trumpism...else you would have a better grasp of what the stakes were here around 2008 to 12 time frame. You slip up way too much and then have the audacity to think some of us are stupid not to see it. There are few that see right through it.
    WHOA, DUDE!

    I think this just became my favorite post for the past 3 years!!!
    There is no spoon.

  4. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    If your beliefs were correct then what advantage is there in Amash running farther to the left?
    You can either give up entirely or attempt to work with conservatives and convert them to be more small government.

    I am a Conservertarian and I have never attempted to hide it, I was anti-Trump before he exceeded my expectations and I was part of the Ron Paul movement since before he ran in '08.
    The expectations must have been low. Sure he's done some decent things but they've mostly been the small stuff. Talking with Russia and North Korea is good. Supreme Court appointees were decent. Could have been worse.

    Lower spending, non intervention, audit the Fed. He's done none of these. You've lost your way.
    Last edited by loveshiscountry; 05-30-2019 at 09:18 PM.
    go small or go home
    Taxation is Theft

  5. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by loveshiscountry View Post
    The expectations must have been low. Sure he's done some decent things but they've mostly been the small stuff. Talking with Russia and North Korea is good. Supreme Court appointees were decent. Could have been worse.

    Lower spending, non intervention, audit the Fed. He's done none of these. You've lost your way.
    My expectations were very low and I am open to any better option that comes along but he has done more good things than you list and he has kept the intervention below what the rest of DC wants.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  6. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    If your beliefs were correct then what advantage is there in Amash running farther to the left?
    You can either give up entirely or attempt to work with conservatives and convert them to be more small government.

    I am a Conservertarian and I have never attempted to hide it, I was anti-Trump before he exceeded my expectations and I was part of the Ron Paul movement since before he ran in '08.
    Well enjoy spinning your wheels. I will NEVER tell anyone not to try, I just don't believe it works at the Federal or even party organized political level anymore. And I will always support grassroots efforts to change things. That's why I came here.

    But there is more to it than your false dichotomy. Just because I don't believe it's Either/Or doesn't make me one who "Gives Up". I'm not "working" with any "Conservatives" for small government. I'm going to work with EVERY persuasion to dialogue on what's in our own best interests as citizens.

    Conservatarian sounds confused, just like I thought. It's a bunch of garbage. Not much of a guiding philosophy I'd say. Not one of any foundation aspect anyhow.
    Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect - Mark Twain

  7. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    My expectations were very low and I am open to any better option that comes along but he has done more good things than you list and he has kept the intervention below what the rest of DC wants.
    Your employer throws you and the base little bones. His restrictionism, failure to address root problems, never talking to his constituents about underlying cause/effect, will do nothing to advance liberty and fiscal responsibility. Everything that he does results in bigger government "solutions".

    This is RPF. Those of us in the know are not buying what you are selling. In fact, you can't give it away.

    As @loveshiscountry correctly stated: "Lower spending, non intervention, audit the Fed. He's done none of these." And he never will.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”



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  9. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Your employer throws you and the base little bones. His restrictionism, failure to address root problems, never talking to his constituents about underlying cause/effect, will do nothing to advance liberty and fiscal responsibility. Everything that he does results in bigger government "solutions".

    This is RPF. Those of us in the know are not buying what you are selling. In fact, you can't give it away.

    As @loveshiscountry correctly stated: "Lower spending, non intervention, audit the Fed. He's done none of these." And he never will.
    Rand seems to have good rapport with Trump what would you say about that? I think Trump has a chance to really advance civil liberties like speech and privacy but not if we get rid of him, not if we help his opposition tear him down.

  10. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Why is allying with the people who don't think you are innocent until proven guilty such a bad idea?
    You mean people who want to take your gun first and do due process later?

  11. #99

  12. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    I think Trump has a chance to really advance civil liberties like speech and privacy

    I like this response:

    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    You mean people who want to take your gun first and do due process later?

    And also that pathetic 6 year extension of 702 signed January 2018 - by trump himself.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

  13. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    like the democrats that Amash is siding with? Are you $#@!ing kidding me.
    Oh ok. So you're only talking about them, and not expressing a rule that would apply to others who don't think you're innocent until proven guilty.

    I had a feeling you were being hypocritical there. But that's for saying it yourself so I didn't have to.

  14. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    Oh ok. So you're only talking about them, and not expressing a rule that would apply to others who don't think you're innocent until proven guilty.

    I had a feeling you were being hypocritical there. But that's for saying it yourself so I didn't have to.
    Right so lets throw Rand's efforts with Trump away and give the presidency and Senate to the democrats I am sure they won't take our guns.

  15. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Right so lets throw Rand's efforts with Trump away and give the presidency and Senate to the democrats I am sure they won't take our guns.
    It's not my rule, it's yours. Perhaps you should rethink it for this reason.

    But be honest, you don't follow your own rule either, as you're admitting now. You only made it up as a pretext for your blind support of Trump. It's only a rule you follow when it supports that cause, and can be discarded if it ever gets in the way of it.

  16. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    It's not my rule, it's yours. Perhaps you should rethink it for this reason.

    But be honest, you don't follow your own rule either, as you're admitting now. You only made it up as a pretext for your blind support of Trump. It's only a rule you follow when it supports that cause, and can be discarded if it ever gets in the way of it.
    I dont support Trump I support Rand and his efforts, I have gotten more neg reps from Trump supporters than you will ever give me.



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  18. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    I dont support Trump I support Rand and his efforts, I have gotten more neg reps from Trump supporters than you will ever give me.
    Good. So you are comfortable with making alliances with people who don't believe you are innocent until proven guilty.

    Do you stand by this? Or are you going to find some way to weasel back into pretending otherwise so that you can keep making baseless and irrational accusations against Amash?

  19. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    Good. So you are comfortable with making alliances with people who don't believe you are innocent until proven guilty.

    Do you stand by this? Or are you going to find some way to weasel back into pretending otherwise so that you can keep making baseless and irrational accusations against Amash?
    I stand with Rand I would support him if he ran against Trump whole heartedly.

  20. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    I stand with Rand I would support him if he ran against Trump whole heartedly.
    That's great to hear. I just want to make sure that you follow through on what you're saying and admit that you don't really think that someone believing people are guilty until proven innocent is a deal breaker when it comes to cooperating with them for some other cause. Because earlier in the thread you were pretending it was a deal breaker when you couldn't come up with any other basis for your irrational and baseless accusations against Amash.

  21. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    That's great to hear. I just want to make sure that you follow through on what you're saying and admit that you don't really think that someone believing people are guilty until proven innocent is a deal breaker when it comes to cooperating with them for some other cause. Because earlier in the thread you were pretending it was a deal breaker when you couldn't come up with any other basis for your irrational and baseless accusations against Amash.
    Lots of reasons for not supporting Amash's impeachment efforts, my very first reason is Pence is worse than Trump. Rand has no rapport with Pence.

  22. #109

  23. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    I like this response:

    Originally Posted by Superfluous Man
    You mean people who want to take your gun first and do due process later?
    And also that pathetic 6 year extension of 702 signed January 2018 - by trump himself.
    Had to look that number up.....

    What is Section 702 surveillance?

    Under Section 702 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA), the U.S. government engages in mass, warrantless surveillance of Americans' and foreigners' phone calls, text messages, emails, and other electronic communications.
    You're being monitored closely by Donnell's surveillance grid, don't try anything.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You only show up to attack Trump when he is wrong
    DACA S**thole Dreamers - Make America Great Again?

  24. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by RonZeplin View Post
    Had to look that number up.....


    You're being monitored closely by Donnell's surveillance grid, don't try anything.
    Rand said when he spoke to Trump he told him that he doesn't want warrantless spying on the next president or political activists.

  25. #112
    This lady went nuclear on Justin at his townhall. Shes a Trump supporter but most importantly, she was an Amash supporter first, from his initial 2010 campaign. I have to admit, it doesn't look good. Imagine someone as active as she is, fighting for his primary opponent.

    Many "all or nothing Libertarians" love to see this because it's entertaining but it won't be so entertaining if Amash loses his seat.

    How to plug a TWEET in post [ TWEET] [/TWEET ]



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  27. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by eleganz View Post
    but it won't be so entertaining if Amash loses his seat.
    Why not?

  28. #114
    Jesse Watters interviews pro-Trump town hall attendee and calls Justin a "Pelosi Democrat"



    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gC5NyXPGv80

  29. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by jct74 View Post
    Jesse Watters interviews pro-Trump town hall attendee and calls Justin a "Pelosi Democrat"



    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gC5NyXPGv80
    She made a fair point about FISA abuse but her stammering and forced phrasing of words and checking the phone for her script and lack of conviction in the way she speaks makes me think she was a plant. I sort of think she was paid to do that by whoever is runniing against Amash.

  30. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    She made a fair point about FISA abuse but her stammering and forced phrasing of words and checking the phone for her script and lack of conviction in the way she speaks makes me think she was a plant. I sort of think she was paid to do that by whoever is runniing against Amash.
    Are you trying to refute what she said?

  31. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    Are you trying to refute what she said?
    no just that the way she said the words she was speaking in other peoples words, they weren't her own words. That's why I thought Watter's comment on whether or not she would run against Amash was funny because politicans talk like that sometimes when they are reading from a script.

  32. #118
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    no just that the way she said the words she was speaking in other peoples words, they weren't her own words. That's why I thought Watter's comment on whether or not she would run against Amash was funny because politicans talk like that sometimes when they are reading from a script.
    Did you ever think it was bulletpoints she wrote herself to make sure she got her point across without being interrupted/distracted and taken off the points she wanted to make?
    My website: https://www.theherbsofthefield.com/

    "No one is useless in this world who lightens the burdens of another.” ~ Charles Dickens

  33. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by donnay View Post
    Did you ever think it was bulletpoints she wrote herself to make sure she got her point across without being interrupted/distracted and taken off the points she wanted to make?
    Yeah because you go to political rallys to make points instead of having a rapport with the representative.

  34. #120
    Let me check my check list of keywords so I can hit every political group possible. I don't really want you to repond to me with any of my points, I don't want you to change your mind on any of this, I just want to have a sound byte so I can go viral and campaign with your competitor against you.



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