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Thread: Amash has a primary challenge...

  1. #1

    Amash has a primary challenge...

    You knew this was coming...

    It prompted Jim Lower, a Michigan state representative who once supported Amash, to announce Monday that he would run in next year's Republican primary.

    Lower said he had been planning to announce his candidacy in July, but moved up the announcement after Amash's comments.

    https://edition.cnn.com/2019/05/20/p...ent/index.html



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  3. #2

  4. #3
    I don't think this has been posted here yet? Maybe I missed it. I don't have a strong opinion on what is written below, I would hope he is mostly doing it for the Constitution tho..


    Justin Amash’s Business Interests in China Underscore His Push to Impeach Trump

    It may be more than constitutionalism driving Amash’s dogged opposition to President Trump.

    Published
    1 day ago on
    May 19, 2019
    By
    Shane Trejo

    Rep. Justin Amash (R-MI) has become the darling of anti-Trump liberals following his declaration in favor of impeaching President Donald Trumpyesterday.

    While Amash acts like his support of impeachment is rooted in constitutional grounds, there may be a financial motive to his opposition to Trump. It has been revealed that Amash has significant business interests in China that may be harmed by Trump’s ‘America First’ trade policies.

    In Amash’s financial disclosure forms for the year of 2015, he was shown as receiving up to $1 million in annual income due to his ownership stake in Michigan Industrial Tools (MIT). MIT is the parent company of Tekton Tools, Amash’s family business, that benefits directly from Chinese manufacturing.

    An article from MLive in 2010 exposed Amash as being the co-owner of Dynamic Source International (DSI), a Chinese company that was once an MIT supplier. Amash’s family have been outspoken advocates of the globalist trade status quo for many years.


    https://bigleaguepolitics.com/justin...impeach-trump/
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  5. #4

  6. #5
    Where is all the metal coming from? Metal tariffs are a huge political driver right now.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It may be more than constitutionalism driving Amash’s dogged opposition to President Trump.

    Published
    1 day ago on
    May 19, 2019
    By
    Shane Trejo
    May need to exercise some skepticism when evaluating claims made by this author.
    Does not necessarily means all his arguments and claims should be discredited as biased. There are only two Palestinians in US Congress and it is bit peculair that he found time to 'expose' both based on quick lookup but did not find time to expose any of the many pro-Netanyahu/pro-Likud pro-wars folks in Congress, administration or any of the powerful lobbies that generally buy fund our politicians.

    Rashida Tlaib’s Social Media Account Traffics in Anti-Semitic Hate


    Published
    2 months ago on
    Mar 9, 2019
    By
    Shane Trejo

    Jewish Consultant Attempts to Whitewash Ilhan Omar's Anti-Semitic Reputation
    qwiket.com
    Apr 4, 2019
    Shane Trejo

    Shane Trejo: Libertarian Party Vice Chair Releases Controversial Anti-Military Manifesto

    If you were tricked by military recruiters, help prevent the same thing from happening to others. Share your experiences, and speak out boldly,” Vohra said in a Facebook post that immediately generated a polarizing reaction with most of the feedback being resoundingly negative.

    228 Replies

    Thomas L. Knapp May 12, 2017 at 06:29

    I really, really hate playing the “as a veteran” card, but in this case it seems applicable. As a veteran — US Marine Corps, infantry, non-commissioned officer, Desert Storm, honorably discharged — I say that Mr. Vohra is 100%, completely and without question, right in the thrust of his comments.

    I’ve run into Mr. Trejo before — he hangs out with the anti-libertarian nationalist types on Facebook, and he’s obviously learned their tactics (hell, maybe he TAUGHT them their tactics) vis a vis messaging. The “pressure is building on Vohra to resign his post” horseapples isn’t anything based in reality, it’s a “fake it ’til you make it” attempt to create such pressure. Presumably this little gem is an offshoot of the similar ongoing nationalist attacks on LNC chair Nick Sarwark by e.g. Augustus Invictus.

    These people are not the Libertarian Party’s friends. Ceteris paribus, everything they say should be disbelieved and all their advice should be ignored. Their mission is to hijack the party for their authoritarian purposes if they can and destroy it if they can’t.
    The primary long-term effect of the US entering World War II was to hand eastern Europe over to Stalin and his successors for nearly half a century instead of leaving the Soviet Union as exhausted from defeating Hitler as Germany would have been from being defeated. FDR spent two years trying like hell to find a way to get us into that war and finally managed to bait Japan into giving him a casus belli. Claire Booth Luce was not ENTIRELY correct when she said that he “lied us into a war because he did not have the political courage to lead us into it” — it wasn’t a problem of political courage on his part, but rather reluctance on the part of the American public — but she wasn’t TOO far off the mark.
    https://independentpoliticalreport.c...ary-manifesto/





    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    I don't think this has been posted here yet? Maybe I missed it. I don't have a strong opinion on what is written below, I would hope he is mostly doing it for the Constitution tho..

    Justin Amash’s Business Interests in China Underscore His Push to Impeach Trump

    It may be more than constitutionalism driving Amash’s dogged opposition to President Trump.


    I don't think have seen this innuendo posted here so far. But there is no financial impact as a possible motive outlined other than a very vague speculation of guilt by assumption?
    But if the main inneuendo here is that 'swamp factor' "MAY" be involved here, then all swamps must be drained as I'm sure you'll agree.

    By same logic, MAYBE all of MAGA's foreign policy regarding Israel, Iran sanctions, Qatar blockade, foreign interventions, $38B taxpayers aid to Israel is being driven by Millions of dollars he took from famous Israel-First Iran war activist and neocon Sheldon Adelson?

    Curious, have you /these investigative minds looking into Amash's motives ever looked into that possibility that swamp is running our globalist foreign interventins policies... because money.




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    Quote Originally Posted by Firestarter View Post
    After, becoming “unpaid” advisers to Ivanka’s father, President Donald Trump, Ivanka and Jared Kushner made a total income of between $82 million and $222 million in 2017, compared to $89 to $201 million in 2016.
    That’s an average of $225 to 608 thousands dollar per day in 2017!
    The couple’s real estate holdings and other investments went from $761 million in 2016 to $811 last year.

    The biggest single transaction for the Kushner couple was in September, when Quail Ridge purchased residential real estate in Plainsboro, New Jersey for $5-25 million.

    Last month, Kushner Companies made Brookfield Asset Management an offer they can’t refuse for financing the 666 Fifth Avenue in Manhattan (remember the earlier Qatar blockade?)…
    Brookfield Asset Management is partly owned by the Qatar government: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/11/b...investing.html

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  8. #7
    If that's true, the tariffs might help him beat his competitors. I assume that is 10% of the value of the tools they buy, or close, and not just # of tools.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    If that's true, the tariffs might help him beat his competitors. I assume that is 10% of the value of the tools they buy, or close, and not just # of tools.
    Not if China is the source for all the metal no matter where they are made.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by ATruepatriot View Post
    Not if China is the source for all the metal no matter where they are made.
    If China ships the steel to Taiwan, then Taiwan makes the tool and ships it here, then there is no tariff.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    If China ships the steel to Taiwan, then Taiwan makes the tool and ships it here, then there is no tariff.
    Good point and fact.

  13. #11
    They were caught lying about where their tools were made before.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  14. #12
    There was a news item today that said that the Democrat used the China business connection against Amash last time, but Amash had a denial/explanation.

    Perhaps someone can find that.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
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    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  15. #13
    I don't think Justin has much to worry about.


  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    I don't think Justin has much to worry about.

    Lol, dude, turn off the television...
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    I don't think Justin has much to worry about.

    Some of the attacks on the dude looking to unseat Justin are getting bit out of hand.

    https://twitter.com/Cody_A_Mott/stat...80028356550656

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by enhanced_deficit View Post
    Some of the attacks on the dude looking to unseat Justin are getting bit out of hand.

    https://twitter.com/Cody_A_Mott/stat...80028356550656
    I thought the same thing when I saw that line about endorsing him after the Access Hollywood tape. Sadly, in a Republican primary in today's climate, that really could be a selling point. I don't know if it's as bad in Amash's district as it is where I live, but judging from the primary ads I endured last election, pledging blind support for Trump is obligatory for Republicans if they have serious primary challengers.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    I don't think this has been posted here yet? Maybe I missed it. I don't have a strong opinion on what is written below, I would hope he is mostly doing it for the Constitution tho..


    Justin Amash’s Business Interests in China Underscore His Push to Impeach Trump

    It may be more than constitutionalism driving Amash’s dogged opposition to President Trump.

    Published
    1 day ago on
    May 19, 2019
    By
    Shane Trejo

    Rep. Justin Amash (R-MI) has become the darling of anti-Trump liberals following his declaration in favor of impeaching President Donald Trumpyesterday.

    While Amash acts like his support of impeachment is rooted in constitutional grounds, there may be a financial motive to his opposition to Trump. It has been revealed that Amash has significant business interests in China that may be harmed by Trump’s ‘America First’ trade policies.

    In Amash’s financial disclosure forms for the year of 2015, he was shown as receiving up to $1 million in annual income due to his ownership stake in Michigan Industrial Tools (MIT). MIT is the parent company of Tekton Tools, Amash’s family business, that benefits directly from Chinese manufacturing.

    An article from MLive in 2010 exposed Amash as being the co-owner of Dynamic Source International (DSI), a Chinese company that was once an MIT supplier. Amash’s family have been outspoken advocates of the globalist trade status quo for many years.


    https://bigleaguepolitics.com/justin...impeach-trump/
    I predict Amash will lose the primary if he runs. He knows this.
    Can you imagine the tv ads ? Trump will hold a huge rally there for his opponent.
    It's over for Amash.
    Last edited by Snowball; 05-21-2019 at 12:55 PM.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowball View Post
    I predict Amash will lose the primary if he runs. He knows this.
    Can you imagine the tv ads ? Trump will hold a huge rally there for his opponent.
    It's over for Amash.
    It could happen.. and full playout of this scenario would almost certainly mean that it's over of GOP-Adelson Zionism wing in 2020 also looking at various dynamics in play already. Factors that allowed Bush-Cheney (the original Fake Conservatives + Neocons cabal 1.0) to finish 8 years no longer exist.
    Heaven forbid if sugar high deficit spending eceonomy or debt baloon risks had any unexpected surprise before Nov 2020 similar to Bush-Cheny sugar high spending bubble crash in 07, then even without a libertarian Republican Primary it's pretty much over for GOP-neocon wing.

  22. #19
    The DeVos family, the rich conservatives who are a mainstay of west Michigan GOP politics, have announced that they no longer support Rep. Justin Amash (R-MI) following his public endorsement for impeachment of President Donald Trump this weekend.
    DeVos family spokesman Nick Wasmiller told the Detroit News that they have not contributed to Amash during this political cycle and “they have no plans to do so.” He says they came to this decision before Amash announced his belief that Trump was guilty of “impeachable conduct,” as they had noticed a decided shift from the Congressman.
    “Family members have expressed increasing concerns about a lack of representation for their district, the 3rd Congressional, and I would say an inability to advance efforts connected to important policy matters,” Wasmiller said.


    Despite losing the support of the DeVos family, Amash still arrogantly dismisses primary challengers who have announced their opposition to him.
    “It’s not serious,” Amash said today of his announced opponents, Michigan House Rep. Jim Lower and veterans rights advocate Tom Norton.

    The DeVos family is currently undecided on whether they plan to support one of Amash’s announced opponents, or perhaps a future one as the Grand Rapids Congressman has become a lightning rod within Michigan conservative politics.
    “I don’t think they’ve considered that up until this point,” Wasmiller said. “I think those folks have announced fairly recently, and (the family will) go through their standard review process to determine if they will support someone, and if so, who that is.”

    More at: https://bigleaguepolitics.com/justin...-devos-family/
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Another article by Trejo. Shocking.

    Meanwhile, here's what our Ron-Paul writin' elector hero Professor Bill Greene says, bolding mine:

    You know what I don't give a single s**t about? The Amash family's investments in China. FFS, Trump supporters, are you going to start agreeing with Democrats on Trump's Russian hotel investments as evidence of collusion and "doing Russia's bidding"? Y'all sound RIDICULOUS.

    And hey, you never-Trumpers and Democrats, y'all sound just as ridiculous when you say crap like "I don't agree with anything else that damn libertarian Justin Amash says, but he's right this time!" Confirmation bias much?

    Whether you do or you don't agree with Amash's conclusions, GREAT -- provide legal evidence to support or refute his position, and engage in conversation and debate about it. But STFU about China and all of your unsubstantiated opinions.

    Now excuse me while I pop more popcorn.
    Especially on these forums. $#@! Trump.
    *******

    I didn't start out thinking that anti-vax people were fools or impervious to reason, it's from my experience here that I now think that.
    - AmyPi 2014 (RIP)

    Anti-vaxxers, responsible for a 30 percent uptick in totally preventable diseases in the world, have blood on their hands. They shouldn't be considered civilized members of society. If they refuse to listen to a century of scientific studies confirming time and time again that vaccination is an unquestionable good for humanity, then it's time for us to start treating anti-vaxxers as what they are: dangerous and worthy of shame and condemnation. If we can't convince anti-vaxxers to change their minds, we must attach enough social stigma to the delusion that agnostics cease to join them.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    Another article by Trejo. Shocking.

    Meanwhile, here's what our Ron-Paul writin' elector hero Professor Bill Greene says, bolding mine:



    Especially on these forums. $#@! Trump.
    Amash is so wrong that his motives bear examination, if you don't like the open borders TDS theory, the family business in China theory or the putting Palestinian loyalty and hatred of Israel ahead of the truth and America theory then I must warn you that the other possibilities are far worse.

    Amash is not only endorsing injustice and perverting the Constitution, he is making himself party to treason.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  25. #22
    Members of the House Freedom Caucus voted Monday evening to condemn one of the group’s co-founders, Representative Justin Amash (R., Mich.) in response to his impeachment stand against President Trump.
    Representative Jim Jordan, the ranking Republican on the Oversight Committee and former chairman of the Freedom Caucus, told Politico that the group easily passed the 80 percent threshold for the adoption of a formal position.
    “It was every single person who totally disagrees with what he says,” Jordan said after the meeting, which Amash did not attend.

    More at: https://news.yahoo.com/house-freedom...125421691.html
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  26. #23
    Amash is not going to have any problem defeating his dopey primary challenger.

    .

    And any other challengers will just dillute the pool.

  27. #24



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    Another article by Trejo. Shocking.

    Meanwhile, here's what our Ron-Paul writin' elector hero Professor Bill Greene says, bolding mine:



    Especially on these forums. $#@! Trump.
    ON. THE. NOSE.

    Cracked me up when I read about the China BS- HYPOCRITES!
    There is no spoon.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    Amash is not going to have any problem defeating his dopey primary challenger.

    .

    And any other challengers will just dillute the pool.

    As a kid I first heard of Ron Paul when he was on the radio talking about how NO ONE had read the Patriot Act. I thought: "Who is this guy?" and looked him up - and became a follower of his political principles.

    It's one thing to disagree with Amash- it's another to call him names and scream & bluster over something that no one else has bothered to read.
    There is no spoon.

  31. #27
    Justin's down 16 points in the early polling. I suspect that's what it would be if he were facing any "Generic Pro-Trump Republican". He has his work cut out for him, but he is politically savvy. If he survives another serious primary challenge and is re-elected, that's a lot of political capital to run for a higher office. Especially if Trump isn't re-elected.

    I don't think that's why he did this though. He suggested impeachment because--right or wrong--he actually believes the president committed impeachable offenses. It doesn't make him a leftist though.

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    Justin's down 16 points in the early polling. I suspect that's what it would be if he were facing any "Generic Pro-Trump Republican". He has his work cut out for him, but he is politically savvy. If he survives another serious primary challenge and is re-elected, that's a lot of political capital to run for a higher office. Especially if Trump isn't re-elected.

    I don't think that's why he did this though. He suggested impeachment because--right or wrong--he actually believes the president committed impeachable offenses. It doesn't make him a leftist though.
    Pretty much my POV.
    There is no spoon.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    As a kid I first heard of Ron Paul when he was on the radio talking about how NO ONE had read the Patriot Act. I thought: "Who is this guy?" and looked him up - and became a follower of his political principles.

    It's one thing to disagree with Amash- it's another to call him names and scream & bluster over something that no one else has bothered to read.
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    Justin's down 16 points in the early polling. I suspect that's what it would be if he were facing any "Generic Pro-Trump Republican". He has his work cut out for him, but he is politically savvy. If he survives another serious primary challenge and is re-elected, that's a lot of political capital to run for a higher office. Especially if Trump isn't re-elected.

    I don't think that's why he did this though. He suggested impeachment because--right or wrong--he actually believes the president committed impeachable offenses. It doesn't make him a leftist though.
    Plenty of others have bothered to read it and Amash is dead wrong:

    Originally Posted by Swordsmyth

    Justin Amash has become an albatross upon the liberty movement in the last week. Through his calls to impeach President Trump, Amash has burned much of the goodwill the movement had built up through the actions of Rand Paul and Thomas Massie during the Trump era. Worst of all, he did so base upon logic which is fundamentally anti libertarian.
    Amash has posted several tweet threads supporting a narrative on obstruction not dissimilar from those pushed by networks such as CNN. In his latest thread, among many other things, Amash lays out an argument on obstruction which will strike any libertarian who has read the Mueller report as absurd.
    For the vast majority of Americans who have not read the entire report, I have broken down below exactly why Amash is wrong below. I list Amash’s six reasons in quotes, with my response directly below each one.


    “1. Trump asked the FBI director to stop investigating Michael Flynn, who had been his campaign adviser and national security adviser, and who had already committed a crime by lying to the FBI.”

    First of all, there’s no evidence that this conversation took place beyond the word of James Comey. We have his claim, and a “memo” that he illegally leaked to the press. The same James Comey who submitted a FISA warrant application which claimed Christopher Steele’s dossier was verified, when he months later went on to call it unverified when testifying to Congress. Comey’s word vs Trump’s is what you would base an obstruction charge on if this were your argument. That doesn’t pass the laugh test.

    Even if you can get past both of those things, they did not let the Flynn thing go and the POTUS never pushed them to do so afterwards, therefore no actions resulted from these alleged conversations between the POTUS and the FBI Director. No obstructive act can happen if no act happened.

    “2. After AG Sessions recused himself from the Russian investigation on the advice of DoJ ethics lawyers, Trump directly asked Sessions to reverse his recusal so that he could retain control over the investigation and help the president.”

    Asking the Attorney General to remain in charge of an investigation does not end the investigation, it does not impede the investigation, it does not deprive the investigation of any item required to complete it, and therefore it does not obstruct. Furthermore, the reasoning Amash spells out for why Trump did this is pure speculation. There are competing speculations which are just as valid as his, if not moreso. Some were even in the Mueller report.
    Even if asking someone not to recuse themselves would rise to the level of obstruction in normal circumstances (it wouldn’t), the POTUS has Article II power over his inferior officers. Even if you could get past the fact that there’s no obstructive act, no attempt to end the investigation, no misconduct of any kind, the argument fails because of that. Even if you can get past both of those things, Sessions remained recused, therefore no actions resulted from these conversations between the POTUS and the Attorney General. No obstructive act can happen if no act happened. Next argument.

    “3. Trump directed the White House counsel, Don McGahn, to have Special Counsel Mueller removed on the basis of pretextual conflicts of interest that Trump’s advisers had already told him were “ridiculous” and could not justify removing the special counsel.”


    Like keeping on Sessions as the AG, removing Mueller as head of the special counsel does not end the special counsel. It does not end the investigation, it does not impede the investigation, it does not deprive the investigation of any item required to complete it, and therefore it does not obstruct.
    This makes the reasoning for having done this irrelevant, but the implication that the reasoning matters goes to the notion of corrupt intent, so let’s briefly address that. Donald Trump had what he described as a “nasty business transaction” involving Robert Mueller. Mueller applied to be the FBI director and didn’t get the job. Mueller was a close personal friend of James Comey. For all of these reasons, Trump may very well have thought the conflicts were legitimate and disagreed with McGahn. Therefore, proving intent is also virtually impossible.
    Furthermore, and most importantly, McGahn did not follow through on this alleged request. Not a single action was taken as the result of these discussions between the POTUS and his White House Counsel. Since no act was taken at all, there was no obstructive act. Next argument.

    “4. When that event was publicly reported, Trump asked that McGahn make a public statement and create a false internal record stating that Trump had not asked him to fire the special counsel, and suggested that McGahn would be fired if he did not comply.”

    Let’s say that this was true, and Donald Trump intentionally told Don McGahn to lie to the public about Trump asking him to fire Mueller. Lying to the media and the American people is not lying to the special counsel, and therefore cannot possibly be considered obstruction of justice. Since the special counsel never asked him this question directly, it could not have possibly been necessary to their investigation, so the idea that this statement to the press deprived them of something necessary to their investigation is refuted by the record.

    Furthermore, Mueller actually laid out a fairly strong argument that Trump genuinely disputed McGahn’s characterization that he told McGahn to fire Mueller. Finally, McGahn refused the alleged request and never called Rod Rosenstein to make this case. So, even if you threw the entire above paragraph away, no action resulted from these discussions between the POTUS and his White House Counsel. That fact alone makes any obstruction argument absurd.

    “5. Trump asked Corey Lewandowski, his former campaign manager, to tell AG Sessions to limit the special counsel’s investigation only to future election interference. Trump said Lewandowski should tell Sessions he was fired if he would not meet with him.”

    Similarly to the above, Trump disputes this characterization, and Lewandowski says he refused the alleged order and never told Sessions to do this. The only evidence you have that it took place is the word of a former campaign manager, and even if you could prove it happened there wasn’t a single action which resulted from these alleged discussions. So, you have the problem of it being one mans word against another, and then the problem of no action having resulted from the alleged discussion. That makes the case that an obstructive act occurred untenable.

    “6. Trump used his pardon power to influence his associates, including Paul Manafort and Michael Cohen, not to fully cooperate with the investigation.”

    That is just plainly false. Let’s break down what Amash is claiming that Mueller laid out as evidence of Trump ‘using his pardon power’ in these cases:
    What Mueller claimed that Trump and Trump aides said to Cohen consisted of support lines such as “the POTUS wants to check in and see if you’re okay”, “hang in there”, “stay strong”, “the POTUS says he loves you and not to worry” and “You are loved, stay well tonight, you have friends in high places”. This was all in the aftermath of Cohen’s office being raided by the feds. None of these messages mention a pardon or hint at anything transactional. The notion that these messages amounted to dangling his pardon power over Cohen is absurd.
    The only thing Mueller says in relation to pardons is that Cohen claims he discussed one with the POTUS’s personal counsel, and that he understood the counsel’s responses to these questions that “(Cohen) would be fine” to mean that he would get a pardon as long as he stayed on message. A convicted perjurer saying that he understood this as an implication. Not exactly ironclad credibility or a bombshell allegation.
    The evidence in regards to Manafort is even flimsier. It consists of two pieces of evidence: Trump saying Manafort was treated unfairly in public and Guiliani suggesting in TV interviews that nonspecific people may be pardoned, but only once the investigation ends.
    In the case of both, Mueller brought up the instances of Trump saying that neither Cohen nor Manafort would “flip”. At every point where Trump says this he makes clear that he believes this is a witch hunt investigation, and that “flipping” means they will tell the investigators a falsehood at his expense in exchange for a reduced sentence. These lines are no evidence of obstruction, they are evidence that Trump knew he was dealing with dirty cops.
    To review, not only did Amash not manage to point out an obstructive act in his analysis of the Mueller report, his impotent attempt exposes the inherent weakness of the argument for obstruction. 5 of the 6 things he brings up involve conversations (some of which are disputed by Trump himself) between Trump and various campaign and White House officials, where in each case the White House or campaign official in question did not act upon what was supposedly discussed.
    In each of these cases, since there was no act taken at all, there can be no obstructive act.
    In the final case, the notion of dangling pardons for Cohen and Manafort, Amash relies on generic well wishing and Guiliani stating the President’s pardon powers as a basis for the notion that there was an implication that President Trump would pardon these people. No quid pro quo was established, no offer was ever made, and no pardon was ever granted.
    Make no mistake, ladies and gentlemen, you should be very angry at Justin Amash for the position his anti liberty stance has put every Liberty Conservative in with the GOP base. His pro FBI crusade, if it is allowed to be seen as the libertarian position, may have severe negative repercussions upon our movement which last for a very long time.


    https://libertyconservativenews.com/...tion-argument/
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  34. #30
    the same thing happened to Sanford that is happening to Justin. The signs are bad!



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