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Thread: Federal judge rules Trump cannot block subpoena for financial records

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    Ohh...SLAM!
    You think I'm an anarchist?

    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    The progressive neo-cons haven't gotten the message. This is the type of $#@! that will lead to a 2020 victory. Formerly apathetic individuals have found a cure in the the total assault on the sitting POTUS. He hasn't lost his base. And he picks up more every single day this $#@! continues. Not a single individual I know gives a $#@! about his IRS accounting. Only Dems, and they aren't going to vote for him anyway.
    The message this forum is sending today is that they're doing exactly the right thing. This partisan pecker waving is energizing people, distracting people from all the problems the government is causing, rallying establishmentarians and anti-establishmentarians alike behind establishment tools, dividing and conquering. All this wailing and gnashing of teeth is music to their ears.

    This game is going perfectly, as far as they're concerned.
    Last edited by acptulsa; 05-20-2019 at 07:27 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    There's not a liberty lover on the planet who isn't called a liberal by the right, and a con by the left.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I don't really care if I happen to be wrong about your positions, you are wrong about mine.



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  3. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by ATruepatriot View Post
    Yep... Back to 2011. It s a fishing expedition because they got nothing else.
    They are going on the "three felonies a day" principle. Search long enough and hard enough you will find Something. Trump should direct the FBI to investigate every Democrat House and Senate member. EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. Tie up the F.B.I. with these investigations.



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  5. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    I do not care about prior to office, that is each individuals own business and not any of mine.

    Your question was: "Who else here supports unlimited search and seizure for Congress?"
    Since they are looking prior would it be then a wrongful action in whole to you? If not then the accusation is accurate.

  6. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    You think I'm an anarchist?
    Read the thread again, that was about PAF.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  7. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    That was the context of this thread.


    And it's still both a very bad idea and hypocritical for an "anarchist".
    I know the context of the thread. But you posed a question without those parameters, and I simply responded. If MY money is being forcefully taken from me via "representation", I want to know who why how when where.

    If that makes me an anarchist, so be it. At least I am not a statist who holds his head up proudly to support the empire.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

  8. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    They are going on the "three felonies a day" principle. Search long enough and hard enough you will find Something. Trump should direct the FBI to investigate every Democrat House and Senate member. EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. Tie up the F.B.I. with these investigations.
    All the judges too. What nefarious business are they engaged in?

  9. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    You think I'm an anarchist?
    I think you are calling for the House to subpoena financial records of any American citizen they feel fit to persecute. Don't give a $#@! if you are an anarchist. You know damn well what I was saying. Nice try at dodging though.

  10. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by ATruepatriot View Post
    Since they are looking prior would it be then a wrongful action in whole to you? If not then the accusation is accurate.
    As I stated, prior to holding public office it is none of my business.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

  11. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Read the thread again, that was about PAF.
    You said "another".

    You post so fast trying to keep all your balls in the air you don't even know what you say. You read the thread again.
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    There's not a liberty lover on the planet who isn't called a liberal by the right, and a con by the left.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I don't really care if I happen to be wrong about your positions, you are wrong about mine.

  12. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    They are going on the "three felonies a day" principle. Search long enough and hard enough you will find Something. Trump should direct the FBI to investigate every Democrat House and Senate member. EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. Tie up the F.B.I. with these investigations.
    This is what they did to Al Capone. They never could prove any real criminal activity so they went after him for Tax Evasion. Text book historical fishing expedition.



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  14. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    I know the context of the thread. But you posed a question without those parameters, and I simply responded.
    If you don't support digging up bones from the past then then you don't support "UNLIMITED" search and seizure for Congress, just Unreasonable Search and Seizure.


    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    If MY money is being forcefully taken from me via "representation", I want to know who why how when where.
    That has nothing to do with allowing another branch of the government to go over the President's life with a fine-toothed comb with no justification at all, even if the President's past is excluded that is a HORRIBLE idea and a VERY big government one.

    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    If that makes me an anarchist, so be it. At least I am not a statist who holds his head up proudly to support an empire.
    You are an anarchist (or at least you claim to be when supporting other destructive policies) and you are supporting the imperials in Congress in their desire to kill the 4th and 5th Amendments further.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  15. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    You said "another".

    You post so fast trying to keep all your balls in the air you don't even know what you say. You read the thread again.
    I said "another" because I have run into many others who are just like that.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  16. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post

    The message this forum is sending today is that they're doing exactly the right thing. This partisan pecker waving is energizing people, distracting people from all the problems the government is causing, rallying establishmentarians and anti-establishmentarians alike behind establishment tools, dividing and conquering. All this wailing and gnashing of teeth is music to their ears.

    This game is going perfectly, as far as they're concerned.
    It's going perfectly. As far as I'm concerned. Division is a wonderful thing that leads to change when it exposes extremists.

  17. #44

  18. #45
    // triple post.........Cripes!

  19. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    I think you are calling for the House to subpoena financial records of any American citizen they feel fit to persecute. Don't give a $#@! if you are an anarchist. You know damn well what I was saying. Nice try at dodging though.
    I do not, and I don't appreciate the lie.

    One, these are records which are kept for government inspection via audit. For Trump to withhold them when he has made no attempt to relieve us from the onus of keeping them is for Trump to make a claim of protected status. American tradition has been for politicians to reveal more than the public; he wants to keep secrets none of us are allowed to keep.
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    There's not a liberty lover on the planet who isn't called a liberal by the right, and a con by the left.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I don't really care if I happen to be wrong about your positions, you are wrong about mine.

  20. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    You said "another".

    You post so fast trying to keep all your balls in the air you don't even know what you say. You read the thread again.
    Feeling a little guilty are ya?

  21. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by ATruepatriot View Post
    This is what they did to Al Capone. They never could prove any real criminal activity so they went after him for Tax Evasion. Text book historical fishing expedition.
    Yup. I wonder what a thorough investigation of the Clintons and Obama's would result in? Or the Shumers or Pelosi's?



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  23. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by ATruepatriot View Post
    Feeling a little guilty are ya?
    Excuse me? Does that silly question have a basis outside your imagination? Care to share with the class?
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    There's not a liberty lover on the planet who isn't called a liberal by the right, and a con by the left.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I don't really care if I happen to be wrong about your positions, you are wrong about mine.

  24. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    It's going perfectly. As far as I'm concerned. Division is a wonderful thing that leads to change when it exposes extremists.
    I never knew that Ron's Revolution was intended to make us one with Big Brother.

    What other wonders can @acptulsa reveal to us?
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  25. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    As I stated, prior to holding public office it is none of my business.
    Because these are indeed the parameters of the investigation then you would agree the whole action is wrong then?

  26. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    I do not, and I don't appreciate the lie.

    One, these are records which are kept for government inspection via audit. For Trump to withhold them when he has made no attempt to relieve us from the onus of keeping them is for Trump to make a claim of protected status. American tradition has been for politicians to reveal more than the public; he wants to keep secrets none of us are allowed to keep.
    That's some progressive jibberish right there. Audits are conducted FOR A PURPOSE. They are NOT conducted for a fishing expedition unless it is politically motivated. If they want his records they need to name the crime they are investigating. Same as you or I.

  27. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    I do not, and I don't appreciate the lie.

    One, these are records which are kept for government inspection via audit. For Trump to withhold them when he has made no attempt to relieve us from the onus of keeping them is for Trump to make a claim of protected status. American tradition has been for politicians to reveal more than the public; he wants to keep secrets none of us are allowed to keep.
    The Income Tax law is a violation of the 4th and 5th Amendments and Congress is not authorized to have those records even according to it.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  28. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    // triple post.........Cripes!
    @Anti Federalist, phill is trying to make your double posts look weak.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  29. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    You think I'm an anarchist?



    The message this forum is sending today is that they're doing exactly the right thing. This partisan pecker waving is energizing people, distracting people from all the problems the government is causing, rallying establishmentarians and anti-establishmentarians alike behind establishment tools, dividing and conquering. All this wailing and gnashing of teeth is music to their ears.

    This game is going perfectly, as far as they're concerned.
    Hey I'm ready to stop any time democrats are. I've found you can't really just walk away from them though, they're damned persistent. Then we've got libertarians that see something like this and go "sic 'em democrats! sic'em". So, it's kind of hard to accuse the right of "partisan pecker waving." when you've got so many people here on the forums egging it on. The whole strategy from day one by the left is to drag everyone down into the mud and bamboozle people with shipments of nothing-burgers, precisely so there is no substantial discussion over important matters.

    If you really desire the latter, then you should be as fed up with these shenanigans as I am. I've been ready to move on since election day 2016.

    Just look at 'em and say: H.L.G.O.I.
    Last edited by nobody's_hero; 05-20-2019 at 07:52 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    This is getting silly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It started silly.
    T.S. Elliot's The Hollow Men

  30. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I never knew that Ron's Revolution was intended to make us one with Big Brother.

    What other wonders can @acptulsa reveal to us?
    Exactly right. UNLESS there is specifically a valid claim of crime then his records are his alone. Same as you and I. No crime, or even a claim of, no authority to subpoena.



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  32. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    That's some progressive jibberish right there. Audits are conducted FOR A PURPOSE. They are NOT conducted for a fishing expedition unless it is politically motivated. If they want his records they need to name the crime they are investigating. Same as you or I.
    You've never had any real-world dealings with the IRS, have you? Because you're the first person I've ever seen say anything this naive about them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    The Income Tax law is a violation of the 4th and 5th Amendments and Congress is not authorized to have those records even according to it.
    So why isn't your golden-combovered boy giving us all relief from their abuses, instead of just himself?
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    There's not a liberty lover on the planet who isn't called a liberal by the right, and a con by the left.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I don't really care if I happen to be wrong about your positions, you are wrong about mine.

  33. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    If you don't support digging up bones from the past then then you don't support "UNLIMITED" search and seizure for Congress, just Unreasonable Search and Seizure.
    I do not consider public office "unlimited" or "unreasonable" "search and seizure". I believe public workers taking money from tax payers should have everything out in the open as a condition of employment. Think of it as a Contract Right; I employ a worker under such and such condition(s) - if you do not like it there are other jobs to seek. But then a person has to understand Contract Rights to agree with this approach, which many here on this forum seems to suddenly oppose as of recent.

    That has nothing to do with allowing another branch of the government to go over the President's life with a fine-toothed comb with no justification at all, even if the President's past is excluded that is a HORRIBLE idea and a VERY big government one.
    I stated a couple of times already that what he did in his personal life/business is none of my business; the 4th and 5th apply, and should.

    You are an anarchist (or at least you claim to be when supporting other destructive policies) and you are supporting the imperials in Congress in their desire to kill the 4th and 5th Amendments further.
    So to be NON-destructive, you would opt that I go with the flow and be a good statist. Just like you.

    Swordy, I have already noted how the centralists took a good set of natural rights and wrote them in a fashion that forfeits power to the Fed.
    Last edited by PAF; 05-20-2019 at 07:49 PM.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

  34. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Excuse me? Does that silly question have a basis outside your imagination? Care to share with the class?
    It apparently bothered you even though it was not a finger pointed at you. It should not have offended you if there was no truth to it and your mind was clear of it. But it did...

  35. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    You've never had any real-world dealings with the IRS, have you? Because you're the first person I've ever seen say anything this naive about them.
    So you think that Congress should be able to gain the tax record of any citizen...because...they simply want them?

    Is this what you advocate?

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