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Thread: Have open border moles in Trumpís Administration conned him to not stop the border invasion?

  1. #1

    Have open border moles in Trumpís Administration conned him to not stop the border invasion?

    Letís remember the good old days during the entire year of 2008 when total apprehensionís at our southwestern border was a mere was 723,840 LINK. And today, during just the first few months of the year, the apprehensions are at a staggering 100,000 LINK


    Keep in mind almost all of these apprehensions are being released into our population by the Trump Administration. In fact, our country is being invaded by tens of thousands of unwanted foreigners each month and Trump appears to have been conned into not using his constitutionally assigned duty to protect our border against ďinvasions.Ē


    The fact is, under the existing conditions, our President would be acting well within his assigned duty to suspend the privilege of the writ of habeas corpus and place our military on our southwestern border with instructions to use every humanitarian means [repeated warnings and then tear gas, rubber bullets, etc.,] to discourage these invaders from setting foot on American soil. Allowing these invaders to set foot on American soil, under existing conditions, is the same as inviting them to join our population. Detention centers are full, the use of expedited removals is obstructed by open border judicial activist judges and ACLU activists, and this has resulted in the very definition of an open border, which was not the case in 2008 and before.


    Why is President Trump not taking extronarary measures to deal with existing extronarary circumstances, which are in fact destructive to our nationís general welfare? Our Constitution is not a suicide pact!


    The answer may very well be, President Trump is being conned and ďadvisedĒ by open border wolves in sheepís clothing who have infiltrated his Administration. But in the end, the buck stops with our President, and he is not protecting us from an ongoing invasion.

    JWK

    President Trump, by the terms of our Constitution, is empowered ďTo provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel InvasionsĒ.



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  3. #2
    This is so laughable...so let me get this straight, We are being told that MAGA is in fact a gullible fool right? He's being manipulated and coerced on his domestic agenda AND his foreign policy? Well then, it seems that MAGA, the grand master chess player, is in fact not even a mediocre checker player...Right? So if this is true, why should anyone vote for this idiot to run the country? Things that make you go hmmm.
    Last edited by Cap; 05-07-2019 at 06:47 AM.
    ClydeCoulter on the Liberty Movement:
    Yeah, they'll argue over roads and religion, but there are certain themes that bind, among those are freedom and the search for truth and justice.

    Loyalists gonna loyal.

  4. #3
    Is it possible that Trump's singular infatuation with building a border wall is more about having a legacy of getting credit for building a huge and impressive construction project--the "Trump Wall," as he himself has called it--than it is about immigration?

    So far he's done a remarkable job of dramatically increasing illegal immigration. And his own expressed opinions on that subject, when his precious wall is not the issue, have been equivocal at best, if not positively approving of amnesty for those who already have immigrated illegally and a process by which those who might in the future could instead just come in legally through the big beautiful door in his big beautiful wall.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Cap View Post
    This is so laughable...so let me get this straight, We are being told that MAGA is in fact a gullible fool right? He's being manipulated and coerced on his domestic agenda AND his foreign policy? Well then, it seems that MAGA, the grand master chess player, is in fact not even a mediocre checker player...Right? So if this is true, why should anyone vote for this idiot to run the country? Things that make you go hmmm.

    I believe the most appropriate action to address the current invasion is using our military to prevent this army of foreign invaders from setting foot on American soil. The question is, does President Trump realize this, and that it is within his constitutionally assigned duty? Those are the questions I am struggling with. What say you?


    JWK

    Without a Fifth Column Media and Yellow Journalism [our MSM], the crisis at our southern border would never have grown to what now amounts to an outright invasion and threatens the general welfare of the United states.

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    So far he's done a remarkable job of dramatically increasing illegal immigration.
    You fail to take into account that every time President Trump has attempted to deal with illegal immigration in an effective way, some Fifth Column Activist judge has stepped in his way. Why do you ignore the actions of these obstructionist judges?


    JWK

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Cap View Post
    This is so laughable...so let me get this straight, We are being told that MAGA is in fact a gullible fool right? He's being manipulated and coerced on his domestic agenda AND his foreign policy? Well then, it seems that MAGA, the grand master chess player, is in fact not even a mediocre checker player...Right? So if this is true, why should anyone vote for this idiot to run the country? Things that make you go hmmm.
    You must hate American insert noun. I'm going to make up an acronym and diagnose you with it.
    "It's probably the biggest hoax since Big Foot!" - Mitt Romney 1-16-2012 SC Debate

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    Is it possible that Trump's singular infatuation with building a border wall is more about having a legacy of getting credit for building a huge and impressive construction project--the "Trump Wall," as he himself has called it--than it is about immigration?

    So far he's done a remarkable job of dramatically increasing illegal immigration. And his own expressed opinions on that subject, when his precious wall is not the issue, have been equivocal at best, if not positively approving of amnesty for those who already have immigrated illegally and a process by which those who might in the future could instead just come in legally through the big beautiful door in his big beautiful wall.
    This does fit hand and glove with someone that has a Narcissistic personality disorder. Occam's razor basically.
    ClydeCoulter on the Liberty Movement:
    Yeah, they'll argue over roads and religion, but there are certain themes that bind, among those are freedom and the search for truth and justice.

    Loyalists gonna loyal.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by johnwk View Post
    The question is, does President Trump realize this, and that it is within his constitutionally assigned duty?
    For the sake of argument, let's say you're right about the president's constitutionally assigned duty.

    Where in the world did you ever get the idea that Donald Effing Trump gives the slightest care about the Constitution?

    Rather than ask if Trump realizes anything you're saying, you should ask if he cares about any of it. He clearly doesn't.



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  11. #9
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    Reagan, Clinton, Obama... all participants in that wall which is not even the actual border. The Rio Grande river is the actual border, miles and miles away from where the wall is. The wall has caused more damage and prevented Circular Flow. It eliminates the 4th amendment, requires government Eminent Domain to take rightful Private Property, ceases Private Contract Rights between employer/employee, among a host of other anti-liberty and police state tactics. It also requires "papers please" which automatically allows them access to free benefits when they visit the local government office. What more can a this/NWO want.

    I would answer who the real Moles are but I will be polite.
    ďThe right to life is the source of all rightsóand the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.Ē

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    For the sake of argument, let's say you're right about the president's constitutionally assigned duty.

    Where in the world did you ever get the idea that Donald Effing Trump gives the slightest care about the Constitution?

    Rather than ask if Trump realizes anything you're saying, you should ask if he cares about any of it. He clearly doesn't.


    Your Trump Derangement Syndrome is showing, and it is preventing you from having a productive discussion.



    JWK

    Without a Fifth Column Media and Yellow Journalism [our MSM], the crisis at our southern border would never have grown to what now amounts to an outright invasion and threatens the general welfare of the United states.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by johnwk View Post
    You fail to take into account that every time President Trump has attempted to deal with illegal immigration in an effective way, some Fifth Column Activist judge has stepped in his way. Why do you ignore the actions of these obstructionist judges?


    JWK
    I am not ignoring that. I am talking about how Trump's own empty promises and anti-immigration rhetoric have positively contributed to the surge of illegal immigration.

    It is parallel to how Obama, just by being president and saying negative things about guns, contributed to a huge surge in gun sales. There is no denying that Obama's being president was hugely effective in putting more guns, especially AR-style guns, in American homes, as well as on the streets.

    Both of these phenomena illustrate the unintended consequences that are bound to result any time government acts or threatens to act in some intervention in the marketplace.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by johnwk View Post
    Your Trump Derangement Syndrome is showing, and it is preventing you from having a productive discussion.
    You say that as if something I said in that post is even controversial.

    Is there any part of it that anyone at all, except the most blindly loyal Trump worshipers would dispute? Has he ever done or said anything that you honestly think indicated he cared about the Constitution?

    I notice that you avoided answering the question of where you got the idea that Trump cared about the Constitution. I can't imagine that you have any decent reason for that assumption.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by johnwk View Post
    You fail to take into account that every time President Trump has attempted to deal with illegal immigration in an effective way, some Fifth Column Activist judge has stepped in his way. Why do you ignore the actions of these obstructionist judges?


    JWK
    I'm leaning more in the direction that MAGA has a Narcissistic personality disorder, with severe neo-con tendencies. Does that answer your question?
    ClydeCoulter on the Liberty Movement:
    Yeah, they'll argue over roads and religion, but there are certain themes that bind, among those are freedom and the search for truth and justice.

    Loyalists gonna loyal.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Reagan, Clinton, Obama... all participants in that wall which is not even the actual border. The Rio Grande river is the actual border, miles and miles away from where the wall is. The wall has caused more damage and prevented Circular Flow. It eliminates the 4th amendment, requires government Eminent Domain to take rightful Private Property, ceases Private Contract Rights between employer/employee, among a host of other anti-liberty and police state tactics. It also requires "papers please" which automatically allows them access to free benefits when they visit the local government office. What more can a this/NWO want.

    I would answer who the real Moles are but I will be polite.
    I take it you have no problem with the tens of thousands of poverty stricken, poorly educated, low skilled, disease carrying and criminals flooding across our southwest border each month.


    JWK

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Cap View Post


    Originally Posted by johnwk
    You fail to take into account that every time President Trump has attempted to deal with illegal immigration in an effective way, some Fifth Column Activist judge has stepped in his way. Why do you ignore the actions of these obstructionist judges?


    JWK
    I'm leaning more in the direction that MAGA has a Narcissistic personality disorder, with severe neo-con tendencies. Does that answer your question?
    No. It has nothing to do with the problem at our southwest border.


    JWK

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by johnwk View Post
    I take it you have no problem with the tens of thousands of poverty stricken, poorly educated, low skilled, disease carrying and criminals flooding across our southwest border each month.


    JWK
    What is apparent is that MAGA doesn't. Isn't that what is important to you?
    ClydeCoulter on the Liberty Movement:
    Yeah, they'll argue over roads and religion, but there are certain themes that bind, among those are freedom and the search for truth and justice.

    Loyalists gonna loyal.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by johnwk View Post
    I take it you have no problem with the tens of thousands of poverty stricken, poorly educated, low skilled, disease carrying and criminals flooding across our southwest border each month.


    JWK

    It is NONE of my business, unless a crime has been committed against person or property and he/she has their day in court to face their accuser.

    I see that your left wing is much bigger than your right.
    ďThe right to life is the source of all rightsóand the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.Ē

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by johnwk View Post
    You fail to take into account that every time President Trump has attempted to deal with illegal immigration in an effective way, some Fifth Column Activist judge has stepped in his way. Why do you ignore the actions of these obstructionist judges?


    JWK
    He could have done everything he wanted when he had the house and Senate but instead he decides to make a stink once the democrats took over the house. Maybe he is playing games with his supporters.

    Personally I don't think he really cares about stopping illegal immigration. Look at the lot he sounds himself with and u will see that they are the ones who created the refugee crisis in ME and NA and then sent an to Europe. He is now trying to create more refugees in South America who again will just end up coming North to seek refuge. He is the problem not part of the solution
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    I am not ignoring that. I am talking about how Trump's own empty promises and anti-immigration rhetoric ...

    You see? You wont even make the distinction between illegal immigration and immigration.


    JWK

  23. #20
    The government (every president on both sides of the isle) wants a "wall".......but they REFUSE to eliminate free handouts to foreigners.

    Kind of ironic, isn't it?


    Ron Paul has said: "Good intentions almost always leads to bad consequences".
    ďThe right to life is the source of all rightsóand the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.Ē

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    It is NONE of my business, unless a crime has been committed against person or property and he/she has their day in court to face their accuser.

    I see that your left wing is much bigger than your right.
    Left wing? You are the one who ignores rights associated with property ownership. Those swarming across our border are trespassing on private property. And you appear to embrace that criminal activity.


    JWK

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Cap View Post
    This is so laughable...so let me get this straight, We are being told that MAGA is in fact a gullible fool right? He's being manipulated and coerced on his domestic agenda AND his foreign policy? Well then, it seems that MAGA, the grand master chess player, is in fact not even a mediocre checker player...Right? So if this is true, why should anyone vote for this idiot to run the country? Things that make you go hmmm.
    Says what you know about 3D chess. I read comics as a kid growing up and one of the comics I read was set in zombie apocalypse. This universe, the zombies weren't completely brainless and they recruited human agents to help then infiltrate the human communities. Well in one of the episodes, the protagonist defeated the main zombie faction by inviting it to enclave. This way when the zombies started rampaging on the citizens, the human agents were forced to work together with the rest of the humans and kill off the zombies.

    It's a high risk high reward strategy. See why let your enemy undermine you from the outside when u can invite them in for them to undermine you from the inside? Your TDS might be preventing u from understanding why this strategy makes sense but give it time, Trump knows exactly what he is doing.
    Last edited by juleswin; 05-07-2019 at 07:56 AM.
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    The government (every president on both sides of the isle) wants a "wall".......but they REFUSE to eliminate free handouts to foreigners.

    Kind of ironic, isn't it?


    Ron Paul has said: "Good intentions almost always leads to bad consequences".
    Hey, Trump would in essence have his own Mt. Rushmore. How cool is that?
    ClydeCoulter on the Liberty Movement:
    Yeah, they'll argue over roads and religion, but there are certain themes that bind, among those are freedom and the search for truth and justice.

    Loyalists gonna loyal.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    I am not ignoring that. I am talking about how Trump's own empty promises and anti-immigration rhetoric have positively contributed to the surge of illegal immigration.

    It is parallel to how Obama, just by being president and saying negative things about guns, contributed to a huge surge in gun sales. There is no denying that Obama's being president was hugely effective in putting more guns, especially AR-style guns, in American homes, as well as on the streets.

    Both of these phenomena illustrate the unintended consequences that are bound to result any time government acts or threatens to act in some intervention in the marketplace.
    I have been watching you argue this point and concept for a couple days now. And I understand the cause and effect residuals you are trying to propose with this. But you are conveniently ignoring the fact that Trump has been ham-stringed with lies every step of the way preventing him from keeping his promises. And that the Democrats and mainstream media have facilitated, promoted, and cheered on the illegal immigration leading to the invasion we have now. To blame this all on Trump's actions alone without also recognizing all the factors in the whole picture is a dishonest and deceptive spin.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by johnwk View Post
    Left wing? You are the one who ignores rights associated with property ownership. Those swarming across our border are trespassing on private property. And you appear to embrace that criminal activity.


    JWK

    There are still countless court battles going on since the Obama years over Eminent Domain. If ranchers and businesses want a wall, they can freely do so
    on their own dime - NOT by tax payer money and forced government take-over.

    Next up, once they are no longer termed "illegal", they will be granted free handouts, and minimum wage mandates set forth by the government - well, the businesses that are able to remain open as their rightful private property is controlled by the government/DHS/ICE, etc.

    As far as criminal activity - nobody exceeds in that more than or own government - and you are supporting it - and it is costing me money.

    I have listed a host of anti-liberty initiatives but instead of commenting on each and every one of them you make blanket statements about foreigners without due process.

    Post #20 is of significance.
    ďThe right to life is the source of all rightsóand the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.Ē

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Says what you know about 3D chess. I read comics as a kid growing up and one of the comics I read was set in zombie apocalypse. This universe, the zombies weren't completely brainless and they recruited human agents to help then infiltrate the human communities. Well in one of the episodes, the protagonist defeated the main zombie faction by inviting it to enclave. This way when the zombies started rampaging on the citizens, the human agents were forced to work together with the rest of the humans and kill off the zombies.

    It's a high risk high reward strategy. See why let your enemy undermine you from the outside when u can invite them in for them to undermine you from the inside? Your YES might be preventing u from understanding why this strategy males sense but give it time, Trump knows exactly what he is doing.
    That's gold there.
    ClydeCoulter on the Liberty Movement:
    Yeah, they'll argue over roads and religion, but there are certain themes that bind, among those are freedom and the search for truth and justice.

    Loyalists gonna loyal.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Cap View Post
    Hey, Trump would in essence have his own Mt. Rushmore. How cool is that?
    Oh def! - on OUR tax dime!

    I'm still out of + Rep for you.
    ďThe right to life is the source of all rightsóand the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.Ē

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post

    Originally Posted by johnwk
    Left wing? You are the one who ignores rights associated with property ownership. Those swarming across our border are trespassing on private property. And you appear to embrace that criminal activity.


    JWK


    There are still countless court battles going on since the Obama years over Eminent Domain. If ranchers and businesses want a wall, they can freely do so
    on their own dime - NOT by tax payer money and forced government take-over.

    Next up, once they are no longer termed "illegal", they will be granted free handouts, and minimum wage mandates set forth by the government - well, the businesses that are able to remain open as their rightful private property is controlled by the government/DHS/ICE, etc.

    As far as criminal activity - nobody exceeds in that more than or own government - and you are supporting it - and it is costing me money.

    I have listed a host of anti-liberty initiatives but instead of commenting on each and every one of them you make blanket statements about foreigners without due process.

    Post #20 is of significance.

    That was not a very clever way to dodge the fact that the swarm of foreigners flooding across our southwest border are trespassing on private property. But hey, most libertarians embrace anarchy and reject the rule of law, and in this regard they are closely aligned with communists and socialists.


    JWK

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by johnwk View Post
    Left wing? You are the one who ignores rights associated with property ownership. Those swarming across our border are trespassing on private property.
    Actually, no, it's you who ignores that.

    I, and I'm certain PAF too, fully support the rights of private property owners to exclude from their own personal property the people you're talking about.

    By the same token, we must support the rights of private property owners to welcome those same people onto their property if they so choose. If you support the government intervening to stop other Americans from welcoming the people you consider illegal immigrants onto their own personal property, whether as renters, employees, or guests, or to sell their property to those same people, at which point it would be their own property, then it is you who ignores the rights of property ownership.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by ATruepatriot View Post
    I have been watching you argue this point and concept for a couple days now. And I understand the cause and effect residuals you are trying to propose with this. But you are conveniently ignoring the fact that Trump has been ham-stringed with lies every step of the way preventing him from keeping his promises. And that the Democrats and mainstream media have facilitated, promoted, and cheered on the illegal immigration leading to the invasion we have now. To blame this all on Trump's actions alone without also recognizing all the factors in the whole picture is a dishonest and deceptive spin.
    Which promises? Keep in mind that his promises with respect to immigration have included many that are mutually contradictory, with some favoring more and others favoring less. Based on his promises, it's impossible to tell his actual agenda, unless it's by choosing to accept one group of promises as the real ones and discard others as things he didn't really mean.

    Also, keep in mind that one of the things Trump attempted and was prevented from accomplishing, was to get Congress to legislate DACA. In 2017 it was Trump who wanted legislation that would allow him to continue DACA with the full support of the law and not as a mere executive order, and it was Congress who would not give him that.

    Finally, I haven't blamed Trump alone. I have only insisted that Trump's contribution has resulted in more illegal immigration, not less. There would be less illegal immigration right now if Obama were still president, still enforcing DACA as an executive order, doing relatively little to impede illegal immigration, and not constantly talking about it and making would-be immigrants think they need to rush in before the gates close.

    No amount of yeah-buts will change that fact.

    I keep repeating it because it's not just important to realize for this issue, but also as an illustration of a more general principle about the counterproductivity of government interference in the market. There will always be unintended consequences, often ones that result in the very thing you're trying to stifle occurring with greater frequency, intensity, and danger.
    Last edited by Superfluous Man; 05-07-2019 at 08:17 AM.

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