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Thread: I Pledge Allegiance to the Tribe

  1. #1

    Exclamation I Pledge Allegiance to the Tribe

    Not going to buy the "Trump as leader of the right" line, but otherwise valid points, and pretty much what I have been pushed into.

    Or more accurately, reverted back to.


    I Pledge Allegiance to the Tribe

    https://theresurgent.com/2019/03/29/...-to-the-tribe/

    Our divisions run deep. That’s not accidental.

    by Marc Giller

    You hear a lot these days about how the country just might be on the verge of splitting. I’ve even speculated about that myself, as there seems to be so little common ground left between how the left and the right view what’s best for America, or even what America has been and what it’s supposed to be. This conflict, in large part, was responsible for the election of Donald Trump—a political earthquake if there has ever been one, which has exposed the fault lines than run through not only the Democrat Party and GOP, but also the media, the culture and the very foundations of our Republic.

    It has also caused the battle lines to be drawn, with issues that have long simmered on the back burner suddenly flaring up. Immigration is probably the most visible, with the crisis at the border exposing in sharp relief not only the Democrats’ cynical ploy to remake the political makeup of the country by allowing millions of illegals to come in, but also the GOP’s refusal to deal with the issue. Conservatives also see their freedom of speech under assault—not so much through government censorship, but through tech companies that have appointed themselves as the final arbiter of what constitutes acceptable discourse, or universities that invent flimsy reasons to dis-invite right-leaning speakers from their campuses.

    In short, it’s gotten pretty vicious out there—which has increasingly pushed the right to adopt the same tribal instincts that have guided the left for years. To conservatives, it has become more than a matter of politics. It had turned into a matter of survival—the protection of not merely their policy preferences, but their families, their values, their way of life. When that’s how you view the stakes, you’re gonna stick with your tribe. And right now, if you’re on the right, the leader of that tribe happens to be Donald J. Trump.

    Peggy Noonan has an interesting take on where we’ve ended up in the Wall Street Journal today. In her column, she remembers how fractured the country was back when she grew up in the 1960s—Vietnam, the draft, women’s liberation, civil rights—but notes how much the divide has grown more personal, with partisans staking out territory and never giving so much as an inch.

    Both sides will be intensely human. And inhuman. Because the past few years the character of our political divisions has changed, and this must be noted again. People are proud of their bitterness now. Old America used to accept our splits as part of the price of being us—numerous, varied, ornery. Current America, with its moderating institutions (churches) going down and its dividing institutions (the internet) rising, sees our polarization not as something to be healed but a reason for being, something to get up for. There’s a finality to it, a war-to-the-death quality.

    There’s a lot of truth in this, but also something that Noonan almost—but not quite—touches upon: The organized left has actually thought this way for decades, whereas with the right it’s a comparatively recent phenomenon—a reaction to the slow, steady, relentless march progressives have been making through the institutions that form the basis of American society. Only now that progressives have fully taken over academia, the media and the popular culture—and also indoctrinated generations of young Americans in their belief system—are they confident enough to finally pull off the mask and make their true intentions known.

    That’s some scary stuff.

    Noonan goes on to say:

    It’s not enough that contraceptives be covered in the government-mandated plan; the nuns must conform. It’s not enough you be sensitive to the effect of your words and language; you must be punished for saying or thinking the wrong thing. It’s not enough that gay marriage is legal; you must be forced to bake the cake. It won’t do that attention be paid to scientific arguments on the environment; America must upend itself with green new deals or be judged not to care about children.

    Nothing can be moderate or incremental, everything must be sweeping and definitive. It is all so maximalist, and bullying.

    Also very true. But did you notice what those policies she mentions have in common? They’re all examples of the left trying to impose their agenda on the country, and force everyone to conform to their vision. If all this is part and parcel of the culture war, then it is most certainly the progressives who are the aggressors.

    That is not, however, the way the mainstream media and the popular culture, portrays what’s been going on—and that’s a huge part of the problem. When one side of the partisan divide is always presented as noble, virtuous and on the side of truth and justice while the other is always presented as bigoted, hateful and evil, that not only encourages extremism—it virtually guarantees it.

    In the case of progressives, this one-sided presentation gives them license to indulge their worst instincts, while inviting all kinds of corruption because they will never be held to account. In the case of conservatives, the opposite is true, with them being held to ridiculous standards that demand they constantly prove how they’re not racist, not sexist, not out to kill people with tax cuts and destroy the planet with fossil fuels. After a while, extremism simply becomes the status quo.

    What’s more is that none of this is an accident. The organized left wants things this way. It’s one of the ways in which they’ve edged the Overton Window farther and farther in their direction. Need proof that the strategy has worked? A scant few years ago, Democrats would never have dreamed of openly advocating illegal immigration; now some have declared they want to abolish ICE and open the borders. Bill Clinton once talked about abortion as “safe, legal and rare”; now some blue states are allowing abortion up to the moment of birth. The list of issues goes on and on, but you get the idea. As far as the media are concerned, progressives get to define the terms of the debate.

    So long as that’s the case, I don’t see the divide ever getting bridged.
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11



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  3. #2
    Anyone who wants bigger government is the enemy, even if they agree with us on some topics.
    Anyone who wants smaller government is our ally even if they disagree with us on some things.

    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  4. #3
    They know the debt crisis is high, and that the FRN won't survive it. And they want us fighting each other, because we outnumber them.

    And some people clearly intend to do everything in their power to help the power mongers pull that off.

    It's stupid. But, you know, most people are stupid. Even so, I'm betting that when the dust settles, God will bless the peacemakers among the people.

    The enemy is the people who would purposely distract people from their real enemies, and turn them against one another. And those enemies reside on both sides of "The Aisle".
    Last edited by acptulsa; 03-30-2019 at 06:08 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    They know the debt crisis is high, and that the FRN won't survive it. And they want us fighting each other, because we outnumber them.

    And some people clearly intend to do everything in their power to help the power mongers pull that off.

    It's stupid. But, you know, most people are stupid. Even so, I'm betting that when the dust settles, God will bless the peacemakers among the people.
    There is a time for peace and a time for war.
    We are still in a time for peace and we should use it to peacefully separate but if they don't allow that it will become a time for war, when we have won the war we can offer a time of peace again.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    There is a time for peace and a time for war.
    We are still in a time for peace and we should use it to peacefully separate but if they don't allow that it will become a time for war, when we have won the war we can offer a time of peace again.
    Uh huh.

    We should unite and let it be known that any of the psychopaths that isn't in Dubai yet is running dangerously late. And that goes for their media lapdogs too.

    That's the separation we need. Everyone else can learn the error of their ways.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Uh huh.

    We should unite and let it be known that any of the psychopaths that isn't in Dubai yet is running dangerously late. And that goes for their media lapdogs too.

    That's the separation we need. Everyone else can learn the error of their ways.
    We can't unite with people who want bigger government, they won't unite with us and they are as bad as the oligarchs that use them.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We can't unite with people who want bigger government, they won't unite with us and they are as bad as the oligarchs that use them.
    And you pretend to be a Christian.

    There's only one kind of person in the whole human race who can't learn a damned thing: Psychopaths who are getting what they want. That demographic is small, as likely to "self-identify" as conservative as liberal, and mostly in Washington and lower Manhattan.

    Every other human can learn.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    And you pretend to be a Christian.

    There's only one kind of person in the whole human race who can't learn a damned thing: Psychopaths who are getting what they want. That demographic is small, as likely to "self-identify" as conservative as liberal, and mostly in Washington and lower Manhattan.

    Every other human can learn.
    And they can learn in their own territory.


    Isaiah 48:20

    “Go ye forth of Babylon, flee ye from the Chaldeans, with a voice of singing declare ye, tell this, utter it even to the end of the earth; say ye, The LORD hath redeemed his servant Jacob.”

    King James Version (KJV)
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  11. #9

    Exclamation Pledge Allegiance to the Tribe

    Wahhabi-Israel Zionist Tribe

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You only show up to attack Trump when he is wrong
    Make America the Land of the Free & the Home of the Brave again

  12. #10
    2 Chronicles 19:2

    “And Jehu the son of Hanani the seer went out to meet him, and said to king Jehoshaphat, Shouldest thou help the ungodly, and love them that hate the LORD? therefore is wrath upon thee from before the LORD.”

    King James Version (KJV)
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We can't unite with people who want bigger government, they won't unite with us and they are as bad as the oligarchs that use them.

    What are you talking about? You constantly advocate for bigger government.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Pinochet is the model
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Liberty preserving authoritarianism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Enforced internal open borders was one of the worst elements of the Constitution.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    And you pretend to be a Christian.
    I don't.

    Or at least I don't pretend to be part of the suicide pact wing of Christianity that wants to open the gates to the barbarians, parades around in Africa in shackles with shirts that say "I'm Sorry", and wants to burn down Western Civilization (for all it's warts, the only place on the planet that even gives lip service to individual rights, property rights and liberty) in the name of god-damned "charity" and "kindness that can kill".

    Then again, maybe a good healthy dose of the Caliphate and Sharia law is what is needed, like they just imposed in Brunei.

    Sure will get the woemen and weirdosexuals in check.
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    What are you talking about? You constantly advocate for bigger government.
    Yup, he's here every day pushing for higher taxes, gun confiscations, more regulations, climate change mandates and all the rest...
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    What are you talking about? You constantly advocate for bigger government.
    LOL
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  17. #15
    Every time I see people say the country is divided, I always play the same scene in my head with a lefty crying non-stop about something stupid, then stating "Look how divided we are" before the other guy even gets a word in.
    A savage barbaric tribal society where thugs parade the streets and illegally assault and murder innocent civilians, yeah that is the alternative to having police. Oh wait, that is the police

    We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.
    - Edward R. Murrow

    ...I think we have moral obligations to disobey unjust laws, because non-cooperation with evil is as much as a moral obligation as cooperation with good. - MLK Jr.

    How to trigger a liberal: "I didn't get vaccinated."

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Yup, he's here every day pushing for higher taxes, gun confiscations, more regulations, climate change mandates and all the rest...
    Who needs him when we have you?

    Deploy Marines and Army troops along every mile.

    Shoot those crossing the line in the face.

    Arrest the directors of Catholic Charities for sedition and treason.

    Or not, and become an annex of Central America, with all that entails.

    Your choice AmeriKa...



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by A Son of Liberty View Post
    Who needs him when we have you?
    I got into trouble with Libertarians because I said there may well be a time when immigration is like an invasion and we have to treat it differently. - Ron Paul on "Meet the Press" 23 Dec 2007

    Congress shall have the power:

    To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

    Ron Paul said he was the Champion of the Constitution.

    Why do you hate Ron Paul?
    Last edited by Anti Federalist; 03-31-2019 at 07:34 AM.
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    I got into trouble with Libertarians because I said there may well be a time when immigration is like an invasion and we have to treat it differently. - Ron Paul on "Meet the Press" 23 Dec 2007

    Congress shall have the power:

    To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

    Ron Paul said he was the Champion of the Constitution.

    Why do you hate Ron Paul?
    Deploy Marines and Army troops along every mile.

    Shoot those crossing the line in the face.

    Arrest the directors of Catholic Charities for sedition and treason.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by A Son of Liberty View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post

    ...
    Pfizer Macht Frei!

    Openly Straight Man, Danke, Awarded Top Rated Influencer. Community Standards Enforcer.


    Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!

    Short Income Tax Video

    The Income Tax Is An Excise, And Excise Taxes Are Privilege Taxes

    The Federalist Papers, No. 15:

    Except as to the rule of appointment, the United States have an indefinite discretion to make requisitions for men and money; but they have no authority to raise either by regulations extending to the individual citizens of America.

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Yup, he's here every day pushing for higher taxes, gun confiscations, more regulations, climate change mandates and all the rest...
    Oh, so big government means the things that you don't like. Meanwhile, advocating for direct state control over the entire economy and all of the internet = small government.

    Carry on.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Pinochet is the model
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Liberty preserving authoritarianism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Enforced internal open borders was one of the worst elements of the Constitution.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Oh, so big government means the things that you don't like. Meanwhile, advocating for direct state control over the entire economy and all of the internet = small government.

    Carry on.
    Huh?

    Where have I supported government control and prosecution of people based on what they say on the internet?
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Huh?

    Where have I supported government control and prosecution of people based on what they say on the internet?
    He's talking about Swordshyll, who has advocated here for the postal service operating the 'net.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    He's talking about Swordshyll, who has advocated here for the postal service operating the 'net.
    Oh...well...OK...I'm punchy from another thread.

    I'm not in favor of that, by the way.
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    I got into trouble with Libertarians because I said there may well be a time when immigration is like an invasion and we have to treat it differently. - Ron Paul on "Meet the Press" 23 Dec 2007

    Congress shall have the power:

    To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;

    Ron Paul said he was the Champion of the Constitution.

    Why do you hate Ron Paul?
    And you and I both understand the Anti-federalists were right.

    Time for real freedom and that will entail not falling for the right/left paradigm.
    There is no spoon.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Oh, so big government means the things that you don't like. Meanwhile, advocating for direct state control over the entire economy and all of the internet = small government.

    Carry on.
    I don't advocate for those either.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    He's talking about Swordshyll, who has advocated here for the postal service operating the 'net.
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Oh...well...OK...I'm punchy from another thread.

    I'm not in favor of that, by the way.
    I once said it would be a reasonable option for the PO to operate as one option in the internet business just as they are one option in the letter delivery/package delivery business.

    Information distribution is vital to the health of a Republic, that is why the founders created the PO.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  31. #27
    Pfizer Macht Frei!

    Openly Straight Man, Danke, Awarded Top Rated Influencer. Community Standards Enforcer.


    Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!

    Short Income Tax Video

    The Income Tax Is An Excise, And Excise Taxes Are Privilege Taxes

    The Federalist Papers, No. 15:

    Except as to the rule of appointment, the United States have an indefinite discretion to make requisitions for men and money; but they have no authority to raise either by regulations extending to the individual citizens of America.

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I once said it would be a reasonable option for the PO to operate as one option in the internet business just as they are one option in the letter delivery/package delivery business.

    Information distribution is vital to the health of a Republic, that is why the founders created the PO.
    Got it...Yes, it is, but it wouldn't be a good idea to have a .gov operating in that realm, I think.

    Keep in mind that, until fairly recently, the postal service would censor and limit what you could send in the mail.
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Anyone who wants bigger government is the enemy, even if they agree with us on some topics.
    It's very ironic that you would say this.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    And you and I both understand the Anti-federalists were right.

    Time for real freedom and that will entail not falling for the right/left paradigm.
    I think it's there whether you fall for it or not. Realistically, "us versus them" has motivated practically every struggle in the history of mankind, not just politically. I don't see that changing, even if we turn the wishful-thinking up to max level. Just embrace it and figure out a way to use it to your advantage.
    Last edited by nobody's_hero; 04-01-2019 at 08:18 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    This is getting silly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It started silly.
    T.S. Eliot's The Hollow Men

    "One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors." - Plato

    We Are Running Out of Time - Mini Me

    Quote Originally Posted by Philhelm
    I part ways with "libertarianism" when it transitions from ideology grounded in logic into self-defeating autism for the sake of ideological purity.

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