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Thread: Yes! Rand to vote against emergency declaration

  1. #331
    Amen brother.

    "All that is necessary for the triumpth of evil is that good men do nothing"



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  3. #332
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    You have nothing BUT time.

    This country has been tanking since pen hit the parchment. Certainly since 1913, 1971, and other notable points in history.
    That is why we are almost out of time.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  4. #333
    Our Constitutional Republic works when you have a free press which holds high and ethical journalistic integrity to disseminate the truth in an unbiased manner.

    It works when you have freedom of speech and do not allow the ability of monopolistic media outlets whose intentions are not for the good of the nation state (and its citizens) to be censoring conservative voices which run counter to the globalist agenda of their traitorous masters.

    It works when you have a well informed, morally sound and educated citizenry.

    When those three are corrupted, evil men flourish and do selfish and traitorous acts which chip away at the fabric and foundations as well as ultimately the freedoms of those they seek power over.

    I firmly believe we are at a historical crossroads in this nation. The nation is sick and in many ways dying. The old rules may not apply as well when the corruption is so great and the time so short. Sometimes you need to send 300 watts of electricity right into the heart, knowing that in normal times that may be lethal, to give the dying person in front of you a chance to survive.
    Last edited by TER; 03-04-2019 at 09:17 PM.
    +
    'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ

  5. #334
    Quote Originally Posted by TER View Post
    Our Constitutional Republic works when you have a free press which holds high and ethical journalistic integrity to disseminate the truth in an unbiased manner.

    It works when you have freedom of speech and do not allow the ability of monopolistic media outlets whose intentions are not for the good of the nation state (and its citizens) to be censoring conservative voices which run counter to the globalist agenda of their traitorous masters.

    It works when you have a well informed, morally sound and educated citizenry.

    When those three are corrupted, evil men flourish and do selfish and traitorous acts which chip away at the fabric and foundations as well as ultimately the freedoms of those they seek power over.

    I firmly believe we are at a historical crossroads in this nation. The nation is sick. The old rules may not apply as well when the corruption is so great and the time so short. Sometimes you need to send 300 watts of electricity right into the heart, knowing that in normal times that may be lethal, to give the dying person in front of you a chance to survive.
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to TER again.

  6. #335
    TER has been killing it all day and night and no logical rebuttals just personal attacks or i miss old RPF like liberals when they move from cali or ny and ruin another state not realizing its them

    Quote Originally Posted by TER View Post
    Our Constitutional Republic works when you have a free press which holds high and ethical journalistic integrity to disseminate the truth in an unbiased manner.

    It works when you have freedom of speech and do not allow the ability of monopolistic media outlets whose intentions are not for the good of the nation state (and its citizens) to be censoring conservative voices which run counter to the globalist agenda of their traitorous masters.

    It works when you have a well informed, morally sound and educated citizenry.

    When those three are corrupted, evil men flourish and do selfish and traitorous acts which chip away at the fabric and foundations as well as ultimately the freedoms of those they seek power over.

    I firmly believe we are at a historical crossroads in this nation. The nation is sick and in many ways dying. The old rules may not apply as well when the corruption is so great and the time so short. Sometimes you need to send 300 watts of electricity right into the heart, knowing that in normal times that may be lethal, to give the dying person in front of you a chance to survive.

  7. #336
    I respect and admire the staunch fidelity set forth by the libertines who are consistent with their ideological positions and trust towards the Constitution. It’s what drew me to Ron Paul when I started to awaken to the corruption of the government post 9/11.

    But as good as Ron and Rand is, they are not infallible. And as good as the Constitution is, it too is neither infallible nor some kind of holy book or gospel that I hold to be as some sort of panacea or ultimate authority. I do not worship at the altar of the Constitution. It works pretty well in a normal functioning Republic, (with the conditions I mentioned above - like free and honest press, free speech, informed citizenry) but, as is evident in the mess we are in right now, it does not eliminate corruption or prevent serious degradation. When the foundation which allows a Republic to work is destroyed, then the Constitutuon can only do so much. “A Republic, if you can keep it”. Well, we have pretty much lost much of our government to foreign interests and entities, fighting wars for corporate profit and losing our blood and treasure in the process. We were one President away (Hillary) from seeing the implementation of a one world government and loss of this country’s sovereignty to the NWO globalists.

    I can not be upset with Rand, because I agree with him on 98% of his positions. But, I do not worship at the altar of the Constitution nor do I blindly follow any man, be it Rand, Ron or Trump. I follow what my heart and my mind feels is right given the circumstances that are present, knowing I too am not infallible. But I can only do what my conscience and heart believes is right.
    +
    'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ



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  9. #337
    This belongs here:

    Quote Originally Posted by Valli6 View Post
    Rand Paul Introduces ‘BE SAFE’ Act to Fund Border Security
    https://www.paul.senate.gov/news/dr-...order-security


    March 4, 2019

    WASHINGTON, D.C. – Today, U.S. Senator Rand Paul (R-KY) introduced the Border Enforcement, Security, And Funding Enhancement (BE SAFE) Act to strengthen border security and improve other aspects of our broken immigration system.

    The legislation would impose a $2,500 border security fee on each new green card issued to fund the construction of new border walls or physical barriers and other immigration-related improvements.

    “As both sides debate the path forward on reforming our immigration system, the BE SAFE Act provides a constitutional answer that guarantees funding for our needs on the border without taking away from other priorities or increasing the burden on American taxpayers,” said Dr. Paul.

    Since 1998, the U.S. government has handed out just over 1 million green cards on average per year. At this level of demand, the BE SAFE Act will generate some $2.5 billion annually in new revenue.

    You can find more details and the entire bill below:

    Dr. Rand Paul’s BE SAFE Act
    Requires each new lawful permanent resident to pay an additional $2,500 fee to U.S. Citizenship & Immigration Services (USCIS)

    Establishes a Border Security Enhancement Fund at Treasury

    Directs USCIS to deposit all fees paid under the BE SAFE Act into the Border Security Enhancement Fund

    Authorizes the president to use Border Security Enhancement Fund for certain immigration-related purposes

    Enumerates the authorized uses of funds in the Border Security Enhancement Fund, including: border barriers, fencing or wall construction; enforcement, detention, and removal operations; counter-trafficking; improving ports of entry; reducing visa overstays; conducting oversight of student visa holders, refugees, and asylees; expanding trusted traveler programs; reducing immigration court backlogs; completing a biometric entry-exit system.

    https://www.paul.senate.gov/news/dr-...order-security

    Read Dr. Rand Paul's BE SAFE (Scribd) https://www.scribd.com/document/4010...Act#from_embed

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Since it involves revenue and spending, it is supposed to originate in the House.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Maybe Rand should be more careful after attacking Trump over a less clear cut Constitutional question.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  10. #338
    Quote Originally Posted by TER View Post
    It’s coming out that the Democrats including the President (Obama) ordered a political campaign to be illegally spied on by a BS FISA warrant which was based on a fake dossier paid for by the Clintons and allowed to slide by a politically weaponized FBI and DOJ, and some here are worried that if Trump fullfills his campaign promise which got him elected by the people to build a wall (which up until TDS appeared was a bipartisan notion) via emergency declaration, it may send a bad precedent!
    Not 1 in 100 of the people currently complaining about FISA as it relates to Trump cared about FISA in the past. The people currently complaining are pure partisans, whose love of due process is awakened only when the lack of it affects the chimps of their own tribe. They will revert to their former Bush-voter selves (i.e. utter indifference to due process) the moment it's the other tribe's chimps being harassed.

    There are people (i.e. libertarians) who aren't so much opposed to Trump's emergency declaration because it's a laughably overt violation of the Constitution, which will set a precedent for more of the same, but because the underlying policy (i.e. kidnapping people who, unlike Trump, never stole any American's property) is obviously unjust, and motivated by the xenophobic fantasies of illiterates who are themselves the cause, every election, of the march toward socialism which they're told is the fault of foreigners.

    I’m sorry, but as far as I see it, there is a WAR going on and we are most certainly in an emergency situation, where you have the will of the people being subverted by an immoral Deep State whose weapons (the news media, entertainement industry, social media outlets) have done everything possible to bury this duly elected President and destroy this nation.

    I hope Trump declares more emergencies and smokes out all of the rats!
    The will of the people is worth exactly nothing.

    How readily you swallow the entire world-view presented by the party's media organs (Deep State, etc) demonstrates the above point.
    "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."

    -H. L. Mencken

  11. #339
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Not 1 in 100 of the people currently complaining about FISA as it relates to Trump cared about FISA in the past. The people currently complaining are pure partisans, whose love of due process is awakened only when the lack of it affects the chimps of their own tribe. They will revert to their former Bush-voter selves (i.e. utter indifference to due process) the moment it's the other tribe's chimps being harassed.

    There are people (i.e. libertarians) who aren't so much opposed to Trump's emergency declaration because it's a laughably overt violation of the Constitution, which will set a precedent for more of the same, but because the underlying policy (i.e. kidnapping people who, unlike Trump, never stole any American's property) is obviously unjust, and motivated by the xenophobic fantasies of illiterates who are themselves the cause, every election, of the march toward socialism which they're told is the fault of foreigners.



    The will of the people is worth exactly nothing.

    How readily you swallow the entire world-view presented by the party's media organs (Deep State, etc) demonstrates the above point.
    The abuse of FISA against Trump was unprecedented and his emergency is not.
    Your characterization of defending our border against the communist invasion is to idiotic to even bother with.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  12. #340
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    The abuse of FISA against Trump was unprecedented
    FISA has existed since 1978.

    What evidence supported the previous 40 years of secret warrants and how was it stronger than the evidence put forth against Trump?

    SS: "But, r3v, I don't know, it's all secret.."

    r3vo: "QED."

    Your characterization of defending our border against the communist invasion is to idiotic to even bother with.
    Your ignorance of basic principles of libertarian ethics, or basic human decency (like, kidnapping is bad...), is totally unsurprising.
    Last edited by r3volution 3.0; 03-04-2019 at 11:38 PM.
    "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."

    -H. L. Mencken

  13. #341
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    FISA has existed since 1978.

    What evidence supported the previous 40 years of secret warrants and how was it weaker than the evidence put forth against Trump?

    SS: "But, r3v, I don't know, it's all secret.."

    r3vo: "QED."



    Your ignorance of basic principles of libertarian ethics, or basic human decency (like, kidnapping is bad...), is totally unsurprising.
    LOL
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  14. #342
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Picture it: In 2015, the the subject of an RPF thread reads "President declares national emergency, seizes land from states and private parties"

    What do the replies to that hypothetical thread look like?
    (2015)

    ABC user: "Tyranny!!?!?!"

    XYZ user: "That's what you can expect from the feds, Rand should never have endorsed Romney!"

    (2019)


    ABC user: "Gotta stop the invasionnnnnnn!!!!!"

    XYZ user: "See, Rand's on board with Trump; he's saving the country (and he's not even a politician)!"

    r3volution 3.0:

    "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."

    -H. L. Mencken

  15. #343
    Quote Originally Posted by jon4liberty View Post
    Not quick enough. No time is not abundant and this spiral has accelerated like never before.
    Yeah, a wall is going to save us. Sure.
    "The rifle itself has no moral stature, since it has no will of its own. Naturally, it may be used by evil men for evil purposes, but there are more good men than evil, and while the latter cannot be persuaded to the path of righteousness by propaganda, they can certainly be corrected by good men with rifles." —Jeff Cooper

    Out of suffering have emerged the strongest souls; the most massive characters are seared with scars.

  16. #344



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  18. #345
    Quote Originally Posted by jon4liberty View Post
    Remind us your strategy?
    Love your schtick of pretending that you don't know how to use the reply function. That says to members that you haven't been around much but you know my enemies call me Che and/or most importantly that you are a very slow learner.

    Love, love, love it

  19. #346
    Personal attacks between yesterday and today such intellectual debating. I understand the paranoia of trolls but has gone entirely too far. Proceed to just personal attacks and running off members for your small echo chamber.

  20. #347
    Che was a CIA stooge. So your big middle finger is such a strong indication of how anti globalist you are lol the fact a commie is one of the few people here saddens me.

  21. #348
    Ahh yes... "attacks" and "paranoia" lol


    Can I get you a tissue?



    We know why you're here.
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  22. #349
    Quote Originally Posted by jon4liberty View Post
    Che was a CIA stooge. So your big middle finger is such a strong indication of how anti globalist you are lol the fact a commie is one of the few people here saddens me.
    Ah, one of those people that think everybody is CIA. Trump is CIA, Gaddafi is CIA, Mao is CIA, Castro is CIA, Maduro is CIA, KGB is CIA all complete and utter rubbish. Jon4liberty CIA? hmm, can't say if it makes any difference

    I bet you used to be a liberty person and now you are a Trump fan boy. There are kinds of people in the world, those who change for the better and then we have you. I am still trying to figure out which member you are cos I don't believe your story.

  23. #350
    Quote Originally Posted by TER View Post
    I respect and admire the staunch fidelity set forth by the libertines
    Somebody who scrupulously upholds moral standards even in the face of a threat that doing so is disadvantageous to them is the opposite of a libertine.

    Ironically, the very position you've been defending throughout this entire thread, the one that prescribes doing away with the necessity to do what we know is right, and adopt in its place a path that we know to be sinful which you justify with the belief that we are being threatened by other people using sinful means themselves, is truly libertine.

    I don't share your fears that we're facing some existential crisis that can be solved or even mitigated by a border wall. But even if I did, there is a time when it is right for a man to stand up with integrity before his enemies and say to them, "You may war against me with all the weapons of Satan. But I will die before I do the same." I follow a Savior who did that, who, by a stroke of irony that can only be attributed to the cosmic design of God himself, defeated his enemies by letting them shed his blood, and who commands me to take up my cross and follow him.

    I am not a libertine. The utilitarian ethics that you and others cling to as a nonnegotiable is a foreign thing to me.
    Last edited by Superfluous Man; 03-05-2019 at 08:04 AM.

  24. #351
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Ah, one of those people that think everybody is CIA. Trump is CIA, Gaddafi is CIA, Mao is CIA, Castro is CIA, Maduro is CIA, KGB is CIA all complete and utter rubbish. Jon4liberty CIA? hmm, can't say if it makes any difference

    I bet you used to be a liberty person and now you are a Trump fan boy. There are kinds of people in the world, those who change for the better and then we have you. I am still trying to figure out which member you are cos I don't believe your story.
    Lol between you, captusa, and super i can see the torch of liberty has been left in the right hands. Yall are doing great work sniffing out trolls while zippy and krug are in your corner lol you 5 are jokes...great work you all are doing.

    This CIA troll has to be at the capital with real liberty people getting real things done not with tinfoil hats and flashlights

  25. #352
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post

    I don't share your fears that we're facing some existential crisis that can be solved or even mitigated by a border wall.
    And that is all you need to know. The unbelievably magical thinking of some here that the damn Wall is a Panacea for immigration control.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    They are coming home, all the naysayers said they would never leave Syria and then they said they were going to stay in Iraq forever..... just like Trump said.



    Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect - Mark Twain

    Fascism Defined



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  27. #353
    Quote Originally Posted by jon4liberty View Post

    This CIA troll has to be at the capital with real liberty people getting real things done not with tinfoil hats and flashlights

    You stated that a couple of times the past couple of days. What is the phone number at the capital where I can reach you?
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  28. #354
    Quote Originally Posted by Todd View Post
    And that is all you need to know. The unbelievably magical thinking of some here that the damn Wall is a Panacea for immigration control.
    If the wall is such a non solution, why is it that all the pro immigration people are against it?
    @jon4liberty, see I am on your side

  29. #355
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    You stated that a couple of times the past couple of days. What is the phone number at the capital where I can reach you?
    You can see it listed at the Capitol's contact page here.

  30. #356
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    You can see it listed at the Capitol's contact page here.

    Sweet, I wonder if they have good hot wings! Are bikers welcome, and is smoking allowed?
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  31. #357
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Are bikers welcome, and is smoking allowed?
    I will leave it to readers of his posts to conclude for themselves whether or not you even need to ask.

  32. #358
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    Somebody who scrupulously upholds moral standards even in the face of a threat that doing so is disadvantageous to them is the opposite of a libertine.

    Ironically, the very position you've been defending throughout this entire thread, the one that prescribes doing away with the necessity to do what we know is right, and adopt in its place a path that we know to be sinful which you justify with the belief that we are being threatened by other people using sinful means themselves, is truly libertine.

    I don't share your fears that we're facing some existential crisis that can be solved or even mitigated by a border wall. But even if I did, there is a time when it is right for a man to stand up with integrity before his enemies and say to them, "You may war against me with all the weapons of Satan. But I will die before I do the same." I follow a Savior who did that, who, by a stroke of irony that can only be attributed to the cosmic design of God himself, defeated his enemies by letting them shed his blood, and who commands me to take up my cross and follow him.

    I am not a libertine. The utilitarian ethics that you and others cling to as a nonnegotiable is a foreign thing to me.
    Good for you.

    I don’t hold the Constitution to be a holy book or the Founders to be Saints. I don’t recall Christ, the Apostles, or any inspired Scriptures or writings of the Saints espousing Constitutional Republics to be some sort of panacea against the evil in the world. My Lord said be as wise as serpents and as innocent as doves. To be in the world, but not of the world. God wants us to be firm and stand up to injustice and evil, not to be worshippers of the State or the Constitution which it is based on. The only government sanctioned by God (begrudgingly) and blessed by Him is the monarchy, which is an image of the Kingdom of Heaven. Look at what this governmental system we have here now has allowed to flourish? Infanticide, sexual degeneracy being glorified, rampant materialism and relativism.

    I think our governmental structure can work when under the framework which the Founders stressed were required. But when degeneracy has become widespread within the people wholesale, it can also be one of the worst forms of government. So, I believe there are times when a monarchy is needed, other times when a Constitutuonal Republic is preferred, but far away from me to put my faith or worship in some governmental structure, especially one foreign to the teachings of the Saints and which has led us to the condition we are currently in.
    Last edited by TER; 03-05-2019 at 08:57 AM.
    +
    'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ

  33. #359
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    Somebody who scrupulously upholds moral standards even in the face of a threat that doing so is disadvantageous to them is the opposite of a libertine.

    Ironically, the very position you've been defending throughout this entire thread, the one that prescribes doing away with the necessity to do what we know is right, and adopt in its place a path that we know to be sinful which you justify with the belief that we are being threatened by other people using sinful means themselves, is truly libertine.

    I don't share your fears that we're facing some existential crisis that can be solved or even mitigated by a border wall. But even if I did, there is a time when it is right for a man to stand up with integrity before his enemies and say to them, "You may war against me with all the weapons of Satan. But I will die before I do the same." I follow a Savior who did that, who, by a stroke of irony that can only be attributed to the cosmic design of God himself, defeated his enemies by letting them shed his blood, and who commands me to take up my cross and follow him.

    I am not a libertine. The utilitarian ethics that you and others cling to as a nonnegotiable is a foreign thing to me.
    This whole meme of we might as well kill the constitution because its half dead anyway sickens me. It's the law of the land until a majority grow stupid enough to say its not, and when we do they go full Stalin on us.

    These libertines who call themselves virtuous call that "worship" of a piece of paper, but that paper has helped us make this the greatest nation on earth by the grace of God. Then those same people say trust Trump, who honestly hasn't done much for us but give us silly things to focus on (like walls) to distract us from real solutions. Or they misplace their faith in Q, who hasn't done jack for anyone.

    This is maintaining the faith? This is hewing to the path God laid out for us, which is proven? Putting faith in these men follows Biblical advice?
    Last edited by acptulsa; 03-05-2019 at 08:58 AM.
    'I prefer someone who burns the flag and then wraps themselves up in the Constitution over someone who burns the Constitution and then wraps themselves up in the flag.'--Molly Ivins

    'Well, you can get no more liberty than you give.'--Will Rogers

  34. #360
    Quote Originally Posted by TER View Post
    Good for you.

    I don’t hold the Constitution to be a holy book or the Founders to be Saints. I don’t recall Christ, the Apostles, or any inspired Scriptures or writings of the Saints espousing Constitutional Republics to be some sort of panacea against the evil in the world. My Lord said be as wise as serpents and as innocent as doves. God wants us to be firm and stand up to injustice and evil, not to be worshippers of the State or the Constitution which it is based on. The only government sanctioned by God (begrudgingly) and blessed by Him is the monarchy, which is an image of the Kingdom of Heaven. Look at what this governmental system we have here now has allowed to flourish? Infanticide, sexual degeneracy being glorified, rampant materialism and relativism.

    I think our governmental structure can work when under the framework which the Founders stressed were required. But when degeneracy has become widespread within the people wholesale, it can also be the worst form of government. So, I believe there are times when a monarchy is needed, other times when a Constitutuonal Rebublic is preferred, but far away from me to put my faith or worship in some governmental structure which has led us to the condition we are currently in.
    What I am advocating is not the US Constitution in and of itself. What I am advocating is precisely what Christ and his apostles commanded.

    The Lord condemns the tools of the state, and explicitly forbids me to use them to rule over others like the rulers of the nations do (Matthew 20:25-26; Mark 10:42-43).

    You know full well that were you to rule over me and others the way you call for the government to do that it would not be permitted for you to treat us that way by God's moral laws. You should also know that God has no double-standard, and that just as you are prohibited from ruling us that way, so is everyone else. There is no loophole for "the government" that makes what is unjust when you or I do it just for them to do. God is no respecter of persons, which the scriptures proclaim repeatedly as one of the grand unifying themes of the biblical doctrine of the state.

    Even if I shared your belief that it would be beneficial to my material well-being if I were to abandon God's laws (which I do not), I would not resort to your libertine prescriptions.

    I may not be able to convince you to change your mind. But you should at least use words truthfully, rather than with the exact opposite meanings of what they really have, such as the way you used the word "libertine."
    Last edited by Superfluous Man; 03-05-2019 at 09:03 AM.



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