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Thread: Libertarian Party Endorses Illegal Immigration

  1. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Historically people have migrated seeking work and freedom, trying to escape the clutches of government and oppressors.

    Poor or working people don’t travel thousands of miles to just conquer or take over another country.

    It is this government that forces “solutions”... taxation, centralized government and education, redistribution of wealth, encroachment of private property.

    It is the goal of the establishment to have us rewrite and abandon our principles.
    Either you are unable to think outside textbook or college professor conditioning or are part of the scam to ensure such a society never comes to fruition in the US. I am thinking the later since no where did I say these people came here to conquer. I clearly said it was the goal of globalist establishment to eradicate any potential of a more libertarian like society in the US.

    Evidently you chose to assist them in that role by supporting open borders policies which clearly deny our ability to live and grow such a society here.



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  3. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You look at the government and culture of the country they come from and you err on the side of letting fewer people in.
    If you don't let many people in from cultures that have less of a belief in liberty then you will not likely let in enough to take power and violate the natives' rights.
    Like a Muslim travel ban?
    - SUPPORT FREE TRADE, SMUGGLE -

    2 + 2 = 5.

  4. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    Like a Muslim travel ban?
    That is a reasonable idea.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  5. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Historically people have migrated seeking work and freedom, trying to escape the clutches of government and oppressors.

    Poor or working people don’t travel thousands of miles to just conquer or take over another country.

    It is this government that forces “solutions”... taxation, centralized government and education, redistribution of wealth, encroachment of private property.

    It is the goal of the establishment to have us rewrite and abandon our principles.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Yep.

    The whole immigration thing is a ruse to keep everyone arguing and their eye off of the real things that are destroying freedom.
    Historically people have migrated seeking wealth and they bring their ideology with them, in modern times that ideology is overwhelmingly one that seeks to use the government to take the wealth they seek from those who created it, they do not understand or care how the wealth was created through liberty and only seek to consume.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  6. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by kahless View Post
    Probably by design. It has been pretty obvious letting in immigrants that have no concept of freedom ensures the death of freedom. Even long ago the founding fathers warned exactly of that problem.

    The people that truly believe in achieving a more libertarian society in the US need to take over the LP. Otherwise it is just another tool of the globalist establishment to promote open borders to deny us a more libertarian like society in the US.
    Their bizarre interpretation of 'freedom' likely includes the banning of all firearms, cradle to grave government provided medical care, regulated climate restrictions, government income assistance as well as government paid tuition. These are predominately low educated socialists desperate for a better life at someone else's expense. Not exactly a deviation from your average human. But you have to be an idiot or dyed in the wool ideologue to fall for this refugee ploy.
    Last edited by AuH20; 02-03-2019 at 03:08 PM.

  7. #216
    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    Like a Muslim travel ban?
    Does that bother you?



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  9. #217
    Dunno if true but I just read a thread elsewhere that Judge Jeanine floated the trial balloon that biometric IDs and human chipping start with immigrants, instead of a wall. The real agenda always comes out eventually.

    If anyone has that video do post it.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

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  10. #218
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    In the realm of things that a libertarian party could support that would gain them money and votes, what would those things be?
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    They need to endorse positions that are outside of the mainstream, like legalizing machine guns, freezing immigration, bringing all the troops home from everywhere, etc.

    Their only chance is if they offer things that people care about that the other two parties aren't offering.
    If the ideas are outside of the “mainstream”, would these positions bring in any new voters or money?

    Guns would fit in with principles, but the NRA sucks that niche pretty dry. Pro-2A might be a good position to bring in conservatives, and immigration/borders might bring in even more. The rub would be many conservatives have a blinding love of the MIC and intervention. That alone means they will not join libertarians, unless their minds on intervention and the MIC can be changed. “No more policing the world” caught a lot of traction, but the neocons have subverted that again.

    Quote Originally Posted by spudea View Post
    None. Because the premise is wrong. Freedom is not popular. Force is popular. Human nature includes the inclination to affect others with force, particularly when resources are limited. Libertarianism, I. E. Non interventionism, I. E. Leave people alone that are not hurting others... This is a socialogical philosophy. Not a political philosophy.
    Seems that immigration and open borders is pretty popular with a lot of people, including a good portion of libertarians. It will bring in (corporatist) money, which is why most beltway libertarian groups support more immigration. Once again, it is the Democrats niche right now, and they throw in free stuff. That free stuff is a killer, and socialists despise libertarians for opposing it on principle. The LP will not bring over Democrat voters based on immigration and border policy without the free stuff. Thus the only reason for the LP to stand on this issue is either principle or money. When it comes to an organization, I’d wager it’s about the money.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Globalist View Post
    Practically nothing.
    Isn’t that the essence of what libertarianism offers, and why the socialists and statists hate them so much?

    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    1. End the Nanny state.
    2. Bring the troops home. End Nanny foreign policy, including financial and military intervention.
    3. Criminal justice reform.
    4. Protection of civil liberties for the individual. No more special interest pandering.
    5. End lifetime support of federal employees, including Congress.
    They all sound good, but for exactly those reasons, the vested interests with political donor money to spare hate libertarians.

    Quote Originally Posted by kahless View Post
    Historically immigration has yielded immigrants that overwhelming vote Democrat and with pathway to citizenship being offered the days of being secure in our private property rights are numbered.

    The far left Presidential candidates are already talking about confiscation of wealth. How long before they are promoting confiscation of private property since they claim you have too much or are not a good enough steward over your land.
    It is a fact that immigration in order to increase support and power has been the strategy of the Democrat Party for decades. The same way that giving away free stuff was before that. It is a conscience and intentional deception by the Democrat elite. It is working, and it can not be denied.

    ——

    Follow the money, and follow the hidden agendas. That’s the key to understanding why positions are taken.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    ...there is always an agenda, often hidden. Everyone has a vested interest in their position. They believe it will benefit them in some way. Even those who want a moratorium on immigration want that because they believe it is in their best interest, although they tend to be the most open and honest about their agenda.

    Businesses (and GOP) want cheap and pliable labor. Democrats want voters and new people who will depend upon them and government for support. Many people want to bring over more of their family or what they think of as “their people”. Others with vested interests consider themselves global in nature. Religious and political groups are the biggest in that category. Religions don’t want borders that will hinder the expansion of their religion. They believe that new immigrants are ripe for conversion, especially if they are aided in their immigration. Political ideologies, like religious ones, also want to convert, and being global in nature, they often want to convert foreign lands to their ideology, often by force.

    Look to the hidden agenda...
    Last edited by Brian4Liberty; 02-03-2019 at 04:18 PM.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
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    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  11. #219
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    If the ideas are outside of the “mainstream”, would these positions bring in any new voters or money?

    Guns would fit in with principles, but the NRA sucks that niche pretty dry. Pro-2A might be a good position to bring in conservatives, and immigration/borders might bring in even more. The rub would be many conservatives have a blinding love of the MIC and intervention. That alone means they will not join libertarians, unless their minds on intervention and the MIC can be changed. “No more policing the world” caught a lot of traction, but the neocons have subverted that again.
    My suggestion assumes that there is still a "Silent Majority Plurality Significant Fraction" that doesn't have a party that represents their beliefs and that many of them come out to support Trump and if the LP adopted the positions that nobody else will they could get their support. (especially if they made the kind of alliance with Trump that Rand has)
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  12. #220
    I suggest and support Legalizing Immigration to eliminate illegal immigration.

    problem solved as simple as that..
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  13. #221
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    I suggest and support Legalizing Immigration to eliminate illegal immigration.

    problem solved as simple as that..
    And a new problem immediately created...........................A communist dictatorship with an incentive to kill anyone perceived as a white male.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  14. #222
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Dunno if true but I just read a thread elsewhere that Judge Jeanine floated the trial balloon that biometric IDs and human chipping start with immigrants, instead of a wall. The real agenda always comes out eventually.

    If anyone has that video do post it.

    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

  15. #223
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    I suggest and support Legalizing Immigration to eliminate illegal immigration.

    problem solved as simple as that..
    I agree, and it is as simple as that, for one half of the Free Market equation. The challenging part is to convince the "let's-pretend-we-are-republicans" and half of the so-called "liberty" folks who have lost their way to ground swell shout and demand End Any/All Incentives.

    It seems that the Wall is an ever so popular idea to transfer Private Property over to the Fed - 2,000 miles of Texan land. Trump excels in this area as he has been an unwavering and devout proponent of Eminent Domain most of his business life.

    It truly does baffle me how gullible people are, especially after the repeal the 4th Amendment Act (Patriot Act) that Bush shoved down our throats.

    Now there is discussion of 1,100 miles of Property along the entire West Coast. Not to mention USMCA which contains "sustainable development".

    The globalist can't snicker enough at stupid people.

    Read my sig.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

  16. #224
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    And a new problem immediately created...........................A communist dictatorship with an incentive to kill anyone perceived as a white male.
    Only in your Fear Filled Mind. it is a robust though ugly fantasy. But that is all it is.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom



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  18. #225
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Only in your Fear Filled Mind. it is a robust though ugly fantasy. But that is all it is.
    Go tell that to the people who are saying it, teaching, writing about it and speaking about it.

    Get them to shut up first, then I'll be inclined to ignore it.

  19. #226
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Yep, that narrative has been slowly and carefully laid. There was also a vid of Trump saying that "everyone shows a card to buy groceries" or similar. Uh no, no one does that.

    Softening up the sheep on the right, who should be brutally opposed to such measures, under the guise of controlling the illegal immigrant problem.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    Visiting the Outer Banks of NC?
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  20. #227
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Go tell that to the people who are saying it, teaching, writing about it and speaking about it.

    Get them to shut up first, then I'll be inclined to ignore it.
    AF,, the people who have brought and instilled Socialism in this country are long dead,, and it is firmly established..

    They were not "Foreigners" but established Businessmen,, and Bankers and the "Intelligentsia" of High Society.

    This fantasy that Mexicans are taking over the country is delusional at best.

    I simply refuse to play along with the deception.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  21. #228
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    AF,, the people who have brought and instilled Socialism in this country are long dead,, and it is firmly established..

    They were not "Foreigners" but established Businessmen,, and Bankers and the "Intelligentsia" of High Society.

    This fantasy that Mexicans are taking over the country is delusional at best.

    I simply refuse to play along with the deception.
    You have a point, when I read or hear or watch the loudest proponents of white displacement/disenfranchisement/dispossession it's usually a lily white, loud mouthed Marxist.

    That said, importing millions of people that are ambivalent at best, sympathetic at worst, of that cause does not bode well for limited government, property rights and liberty for the future of my posterity.

    End all immigration for at least ten years and give all of some breathing room to sort this out.

    Or separate, which at this point is probably the best solution.

  22. #229
    Quote Originally Posted by kahless View Post
    Probably by design. It has been pretty obvious letting in immigrants that have no concept of freedom ensures the death of freedom. Even long ago the founding fathers warned exactly of that problem.

    The people that truly believe in achieving a more libertarian society in the US need to take over the LP. Otherwise it is just another tool of the globalist establishment to promote open borders to deny us a more libertarian like society in the US.
    ^^^This

  23. #230
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    I suggest and support Legalizing Immigration to eliminate illegal immigration.

    problem solved as simple as that..
    Immigration has always been legal.

  24. #231
    Quote Originally Posted by kahless View Post
    The people that truly believe in achieving a more libertarian society in the US need to take over the LP.
    This is a great idea. If only there were a truly libertarian candidate running for President, then surely everyone would vote for him!

    Fool-proof plan!

    Why have we never thought of this before?
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  25. #232
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Or separate, which at this point is probably the best solution.
    Just be sure to get all the proper permissions at the federal level before doing so.

    Thanks in advance for your cooperation.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!



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  27. #233
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    AF,, the people who have brought and instilled Socialism in this country are long dead,, and it is firmly established..

    They were not "Foreigners" but established Businessmen,, and Bankers and the "Intelligentsia" of High Society.

    This fantasy that Mexicans are taking over the country is delusional at best.

    I simply refuse to play along with the deception.
    My POV as well.
    There is no spoon.

  28. #234
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    This is a great idea. If only there were a truly libertarian candidate running for President, then surely everyone would vote for him!

    Fool-proof plan!

    Why have we never thought of this before?
    If it was not for Fox News shutting out Ron Paul in the first NH debate in 2008 he may have gone on to win the nomination. McCain was broke and polling low and should have never been in that debate. But do you remember part of the reason why Ron led in fund raising and straw polls in 2007? It was his strong stance on illegal immigration and his language/policies was to the right of Trump.

    We all remember what happened to Ron when he tried to run again in 2012 but that time backing away from his policies on illegal immigration.

  29. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    AF,, the people who have brought and instilled Socialism in this country are long dead,, and it is firmly established..

    They were not "Foreigners" but established Businessmen,, and Bankers and the "Intelligentsia" of High Society.

    This fantasy that Mexicans are taking over the country is delusional at best.

    I simply refuse to play along with the deception.
    All true. But the foreigners will be the closers for the fulfillment of the said experiment. Closing the door on us PERMANENTLY. There will be no pockets of resistance or regional fight. That is what these people will be used for. To permanently tip the scales in such a dramatic fashion, so we can never see secession or some type of reckoning with our oppressors.

    Demographic subterfuge because ((THEY)) know closing down on us permanently with conventional means will prove VERY COSTLY. Yes, we live in a Communist country at moment, but 40% of the population still poses a major thorn in the side for the TPTB. Society is hanging by a thread, especially when you see how fragile the resource and delivery systems are.
    Last edited by AuH20; 02-03-2019 at 09:44 PM.

  30. #236
    Quote Originally Posted by kahless View Post
    If it was not for Fox News shutting out Ron Paul in the first NH debate in 2008 he may have gone on to win the nomination.
    Good point. Why did Fox News exclude Ron Paul given his super strong 5th place performance in one of his strongest states (Iowa) ??

    We may never know.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  31. #237
    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    To permanently tip the scales in such a dramatic fashion, so we can never see secession or some type of reckoning with our oppressors.
    Good point. We should focus our immediate current efforts on limiting immigration, so that at a later date many many years in the future it may be possible to do some kind of secession maybe.

    Because we have our priorities totally in order
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  32. #238
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    Good point. We should focus our immediate current efforts on limiting immigration, so that at a later date many many years in the future it may be possible to do some kind of secession maybe.

    Because we have our priorities totally in order
    The federal government as we know it is on borrowed time. At some point, states will cut the cord because it will be too expensive to conduct business as usual. Eventually, the battered spouse leaves, especially when the benefits become liabilities.

  33. #239
    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    The federal government is on borrowed time. At some point, states will cut the cord because it will be too expensive to conduct business as usual.
    Well then, let's just make sure that wall gets built before that happens.

    It would be such a tragedy if Texas has to pay for the wall out of state coffers instead of federal ones.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  34. #240
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    Well then, let's just make sure that wall gets built before that happens.

    It would be such a tragedy if Texas has to pay for the wall out of state coffers instead of federal ones.
    Yes. The wall needs to get built, especially since the Mexicans & OTMs can't read history books. 1865 may as well be a rare tequila to them.
    They have no concept of what is transpiring or perhaps never will.

    Actual dumber, less intellectually curious people than Boobus. That's saying something. LaReconquistaed by a bunch of fools. Put that on our tombstone if we are this gullible. Given the demographic trends, I bet book reading will be outlawed in 25 years.
    Last edited by AuH20; 02-03-2019 at 09:42 PM.



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