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Thread: Texan landowners don't want their land stolen for Trump's wall

  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I guarantee that the problem if left unchecked will be much worse, I have a different solution that I prefer but I'm not going to try and preserve the problem until it kills me.
    Well there ya have it, folks. Issue resolved - Swordsmyth GUARANTEES that his position is the right one.

    Silly folks, thinking that the state is a bigger problem...

    Wrap it up, last one out turn off the lights.



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  3. #122
    Semi-related:

    Ron Paul: 'We Don't Need A Border Wall If Trump Removes Incentives For Illegal Immigrants'
    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-...gal-immigrants

    Former Congressman and libertarian icon Ron Paul has some advice for President Trump.

    Instead of building a wall along the southern border to keep out illegal immigrants, maybe he should instead try removing the incentives that attract them to the US in the first place - incentives like a relatively easy path to citizenship and easy access to welfare benefits.

    After Paul said the shutdown "isn't significant in the scheme of things," Paul's interviewer, Squawk Box's Andrew Ross Sorkin, asked if he supported Trump's border wall, Paul responded that he "doesn't like walls" (though he didn't say outright that he opposes Trump's plans).

    "I don't like walls. I'm a libertarian I don't want to wall people in and wall people out."

    "I don’t want free, open borders either," he continued.

    "I think you have to remove the incentives for people to come. They come because there's a welfare system here, there's easy access to citizenship its politicized one group wants them here because they think they can get the votes."

    Paul said he understands this dynamic thanks to his experience working as a doctor near the border.

    "I'm an OBGYN doctor close to the border. People would pop in they'd have a baby then the next day they'd be at the courthouse signing up for welfare benefits."

    When asked whether he and his son, Sen. Rand Paul, had discussed this difference in opinion, Paul said that though they talk often, his son doesn't feel like he needs to run all of his political positions by him first.

    Watch a clip from the interview below:

    (video at link)
    Welfare Warfare Paradigm.

    Illegals are brought in to replace the current voters because of the perceived tendency to vote for bigger government. That same side of government wants Wars because Wars are PROFITABLE to Central Banks, and those who own stock in the manufacture of the Weapons of War. Then you end up with a population willing to commit atrocities unto other people because they believe in the absurdities of Communism / Socialism / Fascism and see the benefits of Endless Wars, yet, morally, feel no responsibility to harming others. I'll take your welfare, and / or I will join their army and bomb the $#@! out of your free country because $#@! you thats why. That is NOT the attitude any person that loves Freedom should ever think. And sadly, I think that is what is being lost due to Uncontrolled Immigration. When they come, they displace our ideals and values. They come and crush Liberty because they have no respect for others, or a desire to be free themselves. The only thing it appears that they want is to take what you got, so they dream up a reason to make those that love Liberty and Freedom the Enemy.

    Welfare IS Theft.

    Welfare steals from those that work and are forced to pay into the system, which removes all incentive to choose to work and pay into the system. Everyone wants to live at the expense of everyone else. That is the GREAT LIE of Socialism in its various forms.
    Last edited by DamianTV; 01-10-2019 at 05:41 PM.
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.

  4. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by A Son of Liberty View Post
    Well there ya have it, folks. Issue resolved - Swordsmyth GUARANTEES that his position is the right one.

    Silly folks, thinking that the state is a bigger problem...

    Wrap it up, last one out turn off the lights.
    The state is the biggest problem...............the communist state that the invaders will impose.

    Problem-reaction-solution works because the problem IS ALWAYS worse than the solution.
    We must offer a different solution or seek to undo the damage of the solution.

    And the "solution" that the creators of the problem want is amnesty and open borders NOT a wall or any other method of increasing border security.
    If the manipulators wanted a wall we would have gotten one as part of the PATRIOT act.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  5. #124
    So a little bit of state now, and you promise no more state in the future?


  6. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by A Son of Liberty View Post
    So a little bit of state now, and you promise no more state in the future?

    So if we just let in millions of communists they will be so grateful that they won't impose communism on us?

    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  7. #126
    So if we just let in millions of communists they will be so grateful that they won't impose communism on us?
    *citation needed*

  8. #127
    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/18/t...all-lidar.html

    theres one description of how new technology would have been enough. real-time tracking and location deployment.
    of course, you all know RP is against the wall and has not shied away from his opinion.

    Trump will pay the price after he declares National Emergency, you will see all sorts of machinations against him
    and the 1976 act provides Congressional interference, plus impeachment is automatic.

  9. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowball View Post
    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/18/t...all-lidar.html

    theres one description of how new technology would have been enough. real-time tracking and location deployment.
    of course, you all know RP is against the wall and has not shied away from his opinion.

    Trump will pay the price after he declares National Emergency, you will see all sorts of machinations against him
    and the 1976 act provides Congressional interference, plus impeachment is automatic.
    LOL
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  11. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowball View Post
    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/18/t...all-lidar.html

    theres one description of how new technology would have been enough. real-time tracking and location deployment.
    of course, you all know RP is against the wall and has not shied away from his opinion.

    Trump will pay the price after he declares National Emergency, you will see all sorts of machinations against him
    and the 1976 act provides Congressional interference, plus impeachment is automatic.
    If President Donald Trump uses the U.S. military to build the border wall along the United States’ international with Mexico by declaring a national emergency, won’t liberals simply run to a Federal judge whom they believe to be left-wing within the Ninth Circuit and block Trump? Can Congress vote to overturn Trump’s declaration of an emergency?
    No. If the federal courts actually follow the law, President Trump cannot be prevented from “reprogramming” funds appropriated for the U.S. Department of Defense and actually using the military (such as the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers) to build the border wall.


    As noted in the first installment on this topic, Congress has given a president the power to declare a national emergency by 50 U.S.C. 1621 and 50 U.S.C. 1622. A declaration of an emergency allows the President to reprogram funds in the military budget. See 33 U.S. Code ß 2293 “Reprogramming during national emergencies.”
    Trump could reprogram funds from other parts of the Department of Defense budget — including from other DoD construction projects such as on bases, military housing, etc. — and engage in construction in areas of need for the national defense. The statute says that explicitly (although statutes are never easy reading).
    But Democrats are threatening and commentators are warning that such an action would be challenged in court and in Congress immediately. Can such a plan be blocked?
    First, 50 U.S.C. ß1622 allows the Congress to over-turn a president’s declaration of an emergency. If both the Senate and the House each pass s resolution terminating the President’s declaration of an emergency, than the emergency status terminates under 50 U.S.C. ß1622. But clearly the Republican-controlled U.S. Senate would not join the Democrat-controlled U.S. House of Representatives. Unless a significant number of Republican Senators vote against a border wall built by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers or contractors with military funds, Congress could not block Trump’s efforts.
    (Note, although I argue in the next section that this power has been invalidated by the U.S. Supreme Court, if a court disagrees on that, a legislative veto power should block a lawsuit. Where Congress has provided a specific method for challenging a declaration of an emergency, the federal courts would normally hold that that method becomes the exclusive remedy. A lawsuit would be blocked by the fact that Congress provided a non-litigation remedy.)


    Second, however, the Congressional veto process described above has been ruled unconstitutional by the U.S. Supreme Court, in INS v. Chadha, 462 U.S. 919 (1983), finding a legislative veto of Executive Branch action unconstitutional. Congress passed many laws which specifically enabled Congress to veto regulations or actions under that law. The U.S. Supreme Court found a legislative veto violates the structure or architecture of the Constitutional system.
    Laws go to the President for signature or veto. Congress cannot reach over and pull a law back. Congress must pass a new law and present it to the President for signature if dissatisfied with how the law is working out. The U.S. Supreme Court had no hesitation finding that the Congress had over-reached, based only on the implied architecture of the Constitution.
    In Chadha, 50 U.S.C. 1622 was one of the laws explicitly discussed. The dissenting opinion specifically warned that the Chadha decision invalidated Congress’s ability to overturn a presidential declaration of a national emergency.
    Therefore, Congress cannot overturn a declaration by President Trump that the open border is a national emergency. Even if the U.S. Senate were to side with the Democrats, Chadha explicitly ruled the Congressional veto (termination) of a presidential declaration to be an unconstitutional distortion of the familiar “Schoolhouse Rock” means by which laws are passed and signed by presidents. Once a law is signed, there is no “claw back” right by Congress.
    Third, of course, critics are discussing whether Trump’s actions would be constitutional. Here, however, Congress passed a specific statute, in fact a series of statutes. So there is no question about the President’s power to do what the Congressional statute has explicitly empowered him to do.


    Some even point to a rather famous Constitutional landmark case — Youngstown Sheet & Tube Co. v. Sawyer, 343 U.S. 579 (1952) — in which the U.S. Supreme Court explicitly ruled that President Dwight D. Eisenhower did not have the power to temporarily nationalize the U.S. steel industry to avert a strike for national defense. However, Youngstown was not that simple. Youngstown analyzed the inherent powers of Commander in Chief as modified by Congressional agreement by statute.
    The U.S. Supreme Court explicitly analyzed that the President’s powers are at their greatest (zenith) when he acts not only by his inherent powers as President but also by the agreement of a statute passed by Congress. In Youngstown, Eisenhower did not have any statute supporting his action and the Court reasoned that he was actually acting in conflict with relevant statutes.
    Here, the Congress has already enacted and President George W. Bush signed into law, the Secure Fence Act of 2006. It is already the law of the land that a border wall shall be built along the United States’ Southern border. Neither Congress nor any private plaintiff can challenge the official determination that a border wall or barrier shall built. That is the law. That is the official determination of both the U.S. Congress and the Commander in Chief.
    The Secure Fence Act of 2006 was never implemented (other than a few miles) because Congress did not appropriate the funds to pay for it. There are two steps: Authorization and Appropriation of funds. The decision to build a border wall is final. The only question is applying funds to make it happen.
    Building of a border wall under the 2006 Act was also not completed because the Swamp and Deep State sabotaged it. Using classic bureaucratic games, the bureaucracy and open borders legislators followed “designed to fail” steps that ground the construction to a halt.
    Note that in spite of the word “fence” in the title, the law does not actually mandate a “fence” in particular. The wording of the Act is not about a “fence” but about any kind of barrier customized to the particular terrain in each location to the extent necessary to “the prevention of all unlawful entries into the United States, including entries by terrorists, other unlawful aliens, instruments of terrorism, narcotics, and other contraband.” That is “all.” As in “all.”
    So the Secure Fence Act of 2006 requires building “whatever it takes— not a “fence” per se. The Act does require specific enhanced barriers and lights, cameras, and sensors, in some named locations.
    Fourth, could liberals run to the courts to block Trump from using the military to build a border wall? No. Only those with “standing” can bring a lawsuit. How is anyone harmed?
    The federal courts have been waging Jihad against citizens bringing lawsuits for decades. The federal courts have been raising the bar higher and higher to make it nearly impossible for anyone to challenge the actions of government agencies or public officials. Specifically a complaint that is shared generally by much of the population cannot establish standing.
    Contrary to strongly-held popular belief, the U.S. Supreme Court has clearly ruled that taxpayers do not have standing to challenge government spending, revenue, or action merely because they are taxpayers. See, Daimlerchrysler Corp. v. Cuno, 126 S.Ct. 1854, 164 L.Ed.2d 589, 547 U.S. 332 (2006). So the Left cannot block Trump’s plans by suing as taxpayers. (The only exceptions involve use of funds to establish a religion or local government taxpayers.)
    Similarly, Members of Congress do not have standing either. Certainly individual Members of Congress do not. See Raines v. Byrd, 521 U.S. 811 (1997).
    To bring a lawsuit, one must show that they are tangibly harmed, personally, not just in disagreement with a policy. If Trump uses some of the $700 billion in the omnibus bill to build a border wall, everyone will be more safe. How is anyone harmed?
    Fifth, can private landowners, some of whom will be liberals, go to court and stop the use of private land as an easement taken by eminent domain? No.
    There is absolutely no defense available to taking land by eminent domain. How much compensation is owed for taking an easement as a strip of land could take years to fight out in court. But the actual right to use the land cannot be contested. The government can take an easement immediately and then fight later over how much money should be paid to the landowner. Remember that this was the legal holding of the over-the-top, controversial U.S. Supreme Court precedent Kelo v. City of New London, Connecticut, 545 U.S. 469, 125 S. Ct. 2655; 162 L. Ed. 2d 439 (2005). (Kelo ruled that it is not even necessary to show a “public purpose” for eminent domain, which goes too far.)
    Legal challenges will not stop construction, even it takes years to reach agreement on the compensation payable to landowners. To finance payment of compensation, Trump should consider offering a land swap of federally-owned tracts of land or selling such public lands.
    Sixth, opponents of Trump’s agenda will try to find individual landowners along the border, who might be liberal, to object in general to the reprogramming of military funds to build the border wall. But those landowners should not be considered to have standing, for several reasons:
    (A) It would be speculation as to whether the government will take any action at their particular section of the border. How would a landowner know that his or her part of the border is a stretch where the planners believe an actual wall is truly needed, as opposed to other natural or physical barriers? It would be — under standard doctrines of standing — insufficient to speculate that that particular landowner’s land is going to be affected at all.
    (B) There is a concept called “exhaustion of administrative remedies.” If an individual landowner doesn’t want a border fence along their particular stretch of the border, they would first have to tell the government that they object. The courts would traditionally wait until the government can try to find agreement with the landowner before allowing a lawsuit. A lawsuit would be invalid as not yet being “ripe.” Traditionally the courts would require a plaintiff to actually talk to the government agency first to see if their stretch of land is actually going to be affected or not, whether a compromise can be worked out, etc. Those are the currently-existing standard rules that always govern. (In fact, on policy, one could argue if a landowner doesn’t want a wall along their property, fine. Let all the trespassers funnel through that person’s land, trampling the ground, leaving trash everywhere, and frightening their family in their home at all hours. If they don’t want a border wall on their property, fine. Check back with us later and tell us how that worked out for you.)
    Seventh, open border advocates of course will also find some would-be gate-crashers from another country to say that they want to break the law and cross the border in the unmanned frontier and the border wall will stop them from breaking the law. That should be laughed out of court, because one does not have a “right” to break the law. Similarly, they will try to find immigrants in the U.S. who want to bring family members into the U.S.A. But they have legal avenues for doing that, by sponsoring their family members to come in legally. Those ideas may impress an individual federal trial judge for a short time, but it should not survive on appeal.
    (Note: Trump does need to get changes in the law through Congress or perhaps just issue clarifying regulations from DHS that a foreigner can apply for asylum at a U.S. consulate without entering the United States.)
    As an attorney in Virginia for 21 years, who has worked for both Judicial Watch and more recently Freedom Watch created by Larry Klayman, I often have to explain the concept of “standing” to clients who want to bring “good government” lawsuits or hold the government accountable to its rules.
    When Sheriff Joe Arpaio sued to challenge Barack Obama’s amnesty by executive order, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia ruled that Arpaio did not have standing, even though illegal immigration cost him actual money in (then) running the jails of Maricopa County. I worked on that legal case, from helping write the original complaint (with an eye toward establishing standing from word one) to legal memoranda in the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia, filed by Larry Klayman, to the appeal by Larry Klayman to the U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia. Arpaio’s legal pleadings established standing as strong as one could imagine, an iron lock on showing standing.
    Didn’t matter. The courts completely contradicted other precedents, as powerfully demonstrated by the dissenting opinion of the Honorable Janice Rogers Brown, an African-American appeals judge with more intellect and intellectual integrity in her little finger than the U.S. Congress combined.
    In deadly seriousness and a straight face, I honestly have to explain the law of standing in federal courts as follows: If you want to encourage the expansion of government and government intervention in the economy or society or prevent the streamlining of government, you have standing. If you want to hold government accountable to staying within its rules or you want to block left-wing policies, you don’t have standing. it’s pretty much that simple. Are you a liberal? You have standing. Are you a conservative? You don’t have standing. Having studied hundreds of precedents on standing, I must say that with absolutely no humor, exaggeration or hyperbole. I could not truthfully say anything different.
    However, the federal courts have established some very strong precedents ruling that almost no one has standing to challenge anything that the government wants to do — unless the government action directly harms the plaintiff personally and individually.
    Therefore, it will be extremely awkward for the federal courts to ignore and contradict their past precedents and claim that anyone has standing to object to the building of a border wall by the U.S military.
    Finally, President Trump’s Administration under incoming Attorney General William Barr has got to stop this foolishness with lawsuits brought before a cherry-picked judge in the Ninth Circuit whom the plaintiffs believe will be unusually sympathetic to them and hostile to Trump’s policies.
    The Department of Justice under Bill Barr must always file a motion for a change of venue to the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia. Readers will be familiar with changes of venue requests in famous criminal cases. But this is different. This is not about whether a criminal defendant can get a fair trial due to pre-trial publicity.
    A change of venue in a civil dispute is based upon other considerations: Where are all the witnesses? Where are the records and evidence kept? Where was the decision made? Where are the decision-makers to be affected by the lawsuit located? Those venue rules strongly if not conclusively favor moving any such lawsuit to the District of Columbia, where the decisions were made, where the officials and witnesses reside, and where all the evidence is located.
    Again, those are the standard, currently-existing, non-controversial rules. None of these lawsuits should be tolerated out in the Ninth Circuit on the Left Coast. There is no valid reason to have such lawsuits spread around the country instead of being held in Washington, D.C., where the action is — and where the action took place.


    More at: https://bigleaguepolitics.com/obama-...-still-active/
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  12. #130
    29,530/33 = ~ 895

    895/30 = ~ 30

    30/24 = ~ 1.25

  13. #131
    @Swordsmyth

    Riddle me this:

    Trump bans bump stocks. He publicly announced raising age to 21 to buy a gun. He signs USMCA which has United Nations/ILO Sustainable Development written all over it. You actually believe he is America First?

    How about reading that USMCA thread that you created. Read all of it, and then put 2 and 2 together to see why he wants 2,000 miles of Texan land affecting over 3 Million residents and businesses. Keep in mind that his predecessor took the largest land grab of all presidents in history and handed control over to the Fed.

    Put this puzzle together and share your findings here, if you are up to that challenge.

  14. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Their primary issue is the gaining of power.

    From that standpoint, migrant invasion makes perfect sense.
    That is certainly the highest priority for establishment Democrat leadship, to be achieved by importing more Democrats.

    Every Democrat is an individual, and most of them are pretty confused anyway. Priorities will vary. You would probably find that virtue signaling is important to all of them. Opposing anything that Trump wants to do is probably another universal priority. Both would contribute to the immigration at any cost position.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
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    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
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    ďThey are what they hate.Ē - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  15. #133
    Quote Originally Posted by A Son of Liberty View Post
    Well there ya have it, folks. Issue resolved - Swordsmyth GUARANTEES that his position is the right one.

    Silly folks, thinking that the state is a bigger problem...

    Wrap it up, last one out turn off the lights.

    Well, if the great omniscient Swordsmyth says so that's good enough for me.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  16. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post

    Trump bans bump stocks.
    Wrong but trivial, bumpstocks are a useless gimmick.


    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    He publicly announced raising age to 21 to buy a gun.
    Wrong but meaningless, the law doesn't change because he says something.


    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    He signs USMCA which has United Nations/ILO Sustainable Development written all over it. You actually believe he is America First?
    There are many bad things about the USMCA but there are also good things about it like the sunset provision, Trump is a mixed bag but he is far more America 1st than any president we have had in a very long time.

    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    How about reading that USMCA thread that you created. Read all of it, and then put 2 and 2 together to see why he wants 2,000 miles of Texan land affecting over 3 Million residents and businesses. Keep in mind that his predecessor took the largest land grab of all presidents in history and handed control over to the Fed.

    Put this puzzle together and share your findings here, if you are up to that challenge.
    Building a wall may not be the best solution but it is contrary to the goal of creating the NAU, "No borders, No wall, No USA at all" is the NAU position.
    Trump has done many anti-globalist things that you are ignoring.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  17. #135
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    Well, if the great omniscient Swordsmyth says so that's good enough for me.
    Just like it's good enough for me that you anarchists promise that importing millions of communists won't turn us into a single party communist dictatorship like California.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  18. #136
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Wrong but trivial, bumpstocks are a useless gimmick.



    Wrong but meaningless, the law doesn't change because he says something.



    There are many bad things about the USMCA but there are also good things about it like the sunset provision, Trump is a mixed bag but he is far more America 1st than any president we have had in a very long time.


    Building a wall may not be the best solution but it is contrary to the goal of creating the NAU, "No borders, No wall, No USA at all" is the NAU position.
    Trump has done many anti-globalist things that you are ignoring.
    I didn’t think you could do it. Thanks for playing.



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  20. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    The state is the biggest problem...............the communist state that the invaders will impose.
    Damn immigrants, always wanting to increase the power of the state to solve some problem that often doesn't even need solving because it's not really even the problem
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  21. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    Damn immigrants, always wanting to increase the power of the state to solve some problem that often doesn't even need solving because it's not really even the problem
    True whether you are joking or not.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  22. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    True whether you are joking or not.
    I'm glad at least we can both agree that illegal immigration is the #1 threat to this country's future.

    Every year, 100,000 people illegally enter this country, and 100,000 people illegally leave this country.

    Do you know how much damage that does to our border? We have to re-paint it like 10 times a year.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  23. #140
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    I'm glad at least we can both agree that illegal immigration is the #1 threat to this country's future.

    Every year, 100,000 people illegally enter this country, and 100,000 people illegally leave this country.

    Do you know how much damage that does to our border? We have to re-paint it like 10 times a year.


    That must be how we ended up with 20M+ illegals here.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  24. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post


    That must be how we ended up with 20M+ illegals here.
    http://www.pewhispanic.org/2015/11/1...ng-to-the-u-s/

    More Mexicans Leaving Than Coming to the U.S.

    Net Loss of 140,000 from 2009 to 2014; Family Reunification Top Reason for Return

    More Mexican immigrants have returned to Mexico from the U.S. than have migrated here since the end of the Great Recession, according to a new Pew Research Center analysis of newly available government data from both countries. The same data sources also show the overall flow of Mexican immigrants between the two countries is at its smallest since the 1990s, mostly due to a drop in the number of Mexican immigrants coming to the U.S.

    From 2009 to 2014, 1 million Mexicans and their families (including U.S.-born children) left the U.S. for Mexico, according to data from the 2014 Mexican National Survey of Demographic Dynamics (ENADID). U.S. census data for the same period show an estimated 870,000 Mexican nationals left Mexico to come to the U.S., a smaller number than the flow of families from the U.S. to Mexico.
    More at link.


    Donald Trump: 'What you're seeing and what you're reading is not what's happening'

    "Truth isn't truth"- Rudy Giuliani

    "China has total respect for Donald Trump and for Donald Trump's very, very large brain," - Donald Trump.

    "Yeah, I have to say these guys(trolls) are pretty sharp. Sort of good to get a challenge and sharpen your thoughts." NorthCarolinaLiberty

    I am Zippy and I approve of this post. But you don't have to.

  25. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    That must be how we got up to 20M+:

    Yale study finds illegal migrant numbers twice the accepted norm of 11 million

    The used to tell us we had about 10M back then.


    If we keep losing them at this rate we will have 100M in no time flat.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  26. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post


    That must be how we ended up with 20M+ illegals here.
    This country was headed in just such a great direction before illegal immigration was a thing. (sigh)
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  27. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    This country was headed in just such a great direction before illegal immigration was a thing. (sigh)
    It wasn't heading where it is headed now and it wasn't heading where it was heading nearly as fast.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  29. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    This country was headed in just such a great direction before illegal immigration was a thing. (sigh)
    They were going back to Mexico before Trump saved us from the recession.

    So, actually, the illegal immigration problem is Trump's fault...


  30. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by A Son of Liberty View Post
    They were going back to Mexico before Trump saved us from the recession.

    So, actually, the illegal immigration problem is Trump's fault...

    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  31. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It wasn't heading where it is headed now and it wasn't heading where it was heading nearly as fast.
    Back in the late 19th century, before "illegal immigration" even existed? Agreed.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  32. #148

  33. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    Back in the late 19th century, before "illegal immigration" even existed? Agreed.
    No, back then we almost turned into a marxist dictatorship under Lincoln due to excessive legal immigration.

    The political dangers of unchecked immigration are why laws were made to limit it and they helped until certain groups decided to encourage illegal immigration to get around them.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  34. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by A Son of Liberty View Post
    They were going back to Mexico before Trump saved us from the recession.

    So, actually, the illegal immigration problem is Trump's fault...

    That is a lie but even if it was true that would just prove that the only way we can have open borders and not have an invasion problem is if we lose our wealth and standard of living.

    Thanks for making my case for me.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

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