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Thread: IRS: TAXES ARE VOLUNTARY

  1. #1

    IRS: TAXES ARE VOLUNTARY




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  3. #2
    yeah, make sure to let Ed and Elaine Brown know that fact.

  4. #3

  5. #4
    Why does the title say "admits," as if it's actually a true statement.

    It should say, "IRS Director Engages in Propaganda on the Level of Claiming War is Peace and Slavery is Freedom by Claiming Taxes are Voluntary."

  6. #5
    LOL
    Do something Danke

  7. #6
    You shouldn't be taking everything they say literally.

  8. #7

  9. #8
    Reporting people for tax evasion is also voluntary.

    Reported.
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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    Reporting people for tax evasion is also voluntary.

    Reported.
    I think you are right Harry Reid has been dodging taxes .
    Do something Danke

  12. #10
    Working is voluntary. Taxes are a part of that. Its right there in the EULA.
    In New Zealand:
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    The DMV is a private non-profit
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    5% of the national vote, gets you 5 seats in Parliament
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    Business licenses aren't a thing
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  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    Reporting people for tax evasion is also voluntary.

    Reported.
    ''You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to TheTexan again.''

  14. #12
    Not this voluntary crap again...

    "Over and over again courts have said that there is nothing sinister in so arranging one's affairs as to keep taxes as low as possible. Everybody does so, rich or poor; and all do right, for nobody owes any public duty to pay more than the law demands: taxes are enforced exactions, not voluntary contributions. To demand more in the name of morals is mere cant. Judge Learned Hand, dissenting in Commissioner v. Newman, 159 F2d 848 (1947).
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    Not this voluntary crap again...

    "Over and over again courts have said that there is nothing sinister in so arranging one's affairs as to keep taxes as low as possible. Everybody does so, rich or poor; and all do right, for nobody owes any public duty to pay more than the law demands: taxes are enforced exactions, not voluntary contributions. To demand more in the name of morals is mere cant. Judge Learned Hand, dissenting in Commissioner v. Newman, 159 F2d 848 (1947).
    I agree with you about the folly of those who pretend they can simply not pay taxes and expect to find the law on their side.

    But it is interesting to see high-level politicians and bureaucrats insist on saying that taxes are voluntary. The congressman in that video repeatedly stated that as a dogma that he took as an unquestioned axiom on which further conclusions could be built, and acted like he wasn't even saying anything remarkable.
    Last edited by Superfluous Man; 01-09-2019 at 05:10 PM.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    But it is interesting to see high-level politicians and bureaucrats insist on saying that taxes are voluntary. The congressman in that video repeatedly stated that as a dogma that he took as an unquestioned axiom on which further conclusions could be built, and acted like he wasn't even saying anything remarkable.
    Politicians always say misleading things. Remember "If you like your health care plan, you can keep it."? Even Ron Paul is guilty -- ""We should have the lowest tax that we’ve ever had, and up until 1913, it was 0 percent. What’s so bad about that?" -- ignoring the Civil War era income tax that lasted for 8 years. He has also claimed that the federal income tax was ruled unconstitutional during the Civil War period (to the contrary -- it was ruled constitutional) because there was no explicit authorization for it (there was).

    But the income tax is voluntary in the sense that the system relies on the disclosure by taxpayers of information about one's income and deductions that is solely within their possession. Yes, there are information returns that the IRS gets from payors of wages, dividends, and interest, but there are many other types of income that don't involve information returns.
    Last edited by Sonny Tufts; 01-09-2019 at 10:31 AM.
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    Politicians always say misleading things. Remember "If you like your health care plan, you can keep it."? Even Ron Paul is guilty -- ""We should have the lowest tax that we’ve ever had, and up until 1913, it was 0 percent. What’s so bad about that?" -- ignoring the Civil War era income tax that lasted for 8 years. He has also claimed that the federal income tax was ruled unconstitutional during the Civil War period (to the contrary -- it was ruled constitutional) because there was no explicit authorization for it (there was).

    But the income tax is voluntary in the sense that the system relies on the disclosure by taxpayers of information about one's income and deductions that is solely within their possession. Yes, there are information returns that the IRS gets from payors of wages, dividends, and interest, but there are many other types of income that don't involve information returns.
    Still theft.
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  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    But the income tax is voluntary in the sense that the system relies on the disclosure by taxpayers of information about one's income and deductions that is solely within their possession. Yes, there are information returns that the IRS gets from payors of wages, dividends, and interest, but there are many other types of income that don't involve information returns.
    I assume that we are obligated to tell the IRS about that income, and subject to punishment if they can prove that we failed to do so.

    The fact that it's sometimes difficult or impossible to prove someone guilty doesn't mean that the law they've broken is voluntary.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by idiom View Post
    Working is voluntary. Taxes are a part of that. Its right there in the EULA.
    Working or earning income in a field that has a nexus to government privilege is what creates the tax liability. So yes, it is voluntary in that sense.
    Pfizer Macht Frei!

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  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    I agree with what you about the folly of those who pretend they can simply not pay taxes and expect to find the law on their side.

    But it is interesting to see high-level politicians and bureaucrats insist on saying that taxes are voluntary. The congressman in that video repeatedly stated that as a dogma that he took as an unquestioned axiom on which further conclusions could be built, and acted like he wasn't even saying anything remarkable.
    ''it depends on what the meaning of is' is...''- Billy 1998

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Still theft.
    Learn to spell "robbery".
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  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Danke View Post
    Working or earning income in a field that has a nexus to government privilege is what creates the tax liability.
    Another myth.
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    Not this voluntary crap again...

    "Over and over again courts have said that there is nothing sinister in so arranging one's affairs as to keep taxes as low as possible. Everybody does so, rich or poor; and all do right, for nobody owes any public duty to pay more than the law demands: taxes are enforced exactions, not voluntary contributions. To demand more in the name of morals is mere cant. Judge Learned Hand, dissenting in Commissioner v. Newman, 159 F2d 848 (1947).
    Not this ''its not voluntary'' crap again.

    What a crappy quote.

    Taxes are paid voluntarily.

  25. #22
    This entire system is voluntary. One has a choice. One might seriously consider the consequences of their choices though.

    If there are enough people who voluntarily choose not to pay tax, then it will be nearly impossible for them to collect. The closer we get to this so called cashless society though, makes it that much more difficult.

    Just as with the open carry marches in gun free zones...

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    "Article 58-1a, twenty five years... What did you get it for?"
    Gulag Prisoner: "For nothing at all."
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  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Stratovarious View Post
    Not this ''its not voluntary'' crap again.

    What a crappy quote.

    Taxes are paid voluntarily.
    Stupid tax deniers* (a redundant term) think that under the law as written they have no obligation to pay income tax unless [they engage in a "federally privileged" activity] [sign a W-9] [reside in a "federal area"] [have foreign-sourced income] [some other idiotic theory] and that if none of these apply any payment of tax is purely voluntary with absolutely no legal compulsion and no legal sanction for failure to pay. These people are hopelessly wrong; as Hand said, taxes are forced exactions and cannot be compared to purely voluntary charitable contributions.

    *To be distinguished from a tax protester who doesn't pay purely on moral grounds. Such folks don't deny what the law says; they just feel a moral obligation not to pay.
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    Stupid tax deniers* (a redundant term) think that under the law as written they have no obligation to pay income tax unless [they engage in a "federally privileged" activity] [sign a W-9] [reside in a "federal area"] [have foreign-sourced income] [some other idiotic theory] and that if none of these apply any payment of tax is purely voluntary with absolutely no legal compulsion and no legal sanction for failure to pay. These people are hopelessly wrong; as Hand said, taxes are forced exactions and cannot be compared to purely voluntary charitable contributions.

    *To be distinguished from a tax protester who doesn't pay purely on moral grounds. Such folks don't deny what the law says; they just feel a moral obligation not to pay.
    Then your mission is to morally-pay voluntarily, good boy!!



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Stratovarious View Post
    Taxes are paid voluntarily.
    No they aren't. People pay them because they are threatened with violence that will be done to them if they don't pay them. That's not voluntary.

    Taxes are a form of extortion or theft.

    ETA: Of course there are some who do pay them voluntarily and gladly. But the whole point of taxes is to make sure that the people wouldn't pay them voluntarily still have to pay them, like it or not.
    Last edited by Superfluous Man; 02-20-2019 at 11:07 AM.

  30. #26
    I’ve started a court case against the Kingdom of the Netherlands in which I’ve argued that paying taxes is a criminal offence, as it is illegal to support a terrorist organisation...


    William Cooper was killed a couple of months after he predicted 9/11 after refusing to pay taxes, here he talks a bit on taxes, the Gore-Bush elections...
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