Texas Libertarian Ron Paul: We don't need Trump's border wall to stop illegal immigration

[Stratovarious]

See post 231.

But I'm not moving the subject around, this is the same question I've asked you several times, and it comes in response to precisely what you said in your own words in your first post in this exchange with me. You were the one who proffered that definition of "illegal alien." Did you really mean to limit the meaning of the phrase to such a small group or not? It shouldn't be hard to say one way or the other.

No son, without all the riddles, ostentatious, rhetorical beating around the bush, and
double speak gibberish, state your position on immigration.
What is your position.....

[Superfluous Man]

No son, without all the riddles, ostentatious beating around the bush, and
double speak gibberish, state your position on immigration.
What is your position.....

This is interesting.

I've said clearly what my position was. When you asked again I pointed you back to the post where you can read it in my own words. I can do no more than that, until you actually read that post and accept that my position is just that.

Meanwhile, I've posed the same question to you multiple times, and you've repeatedly flat out refused to answer it.

I still can't tell if your position is what you said it was in the post that started this all, to the effect that the only people who count as illegal aliens as you use that phrase are criminals and the contagious, which differs little from my own position, or if you wish to retract that.

[Stratovarious]

This is interesting.

I've said clearly what my position was. When I asked again I pointed you back to the post where you can read it in my own words.

Meanwhile, I've posed the same question to you multiple times, and you've repeatedly flat out refused to answer it.

I still can't tell if your position is what you said it was in the post that started this all, to the effect that the only people who count as illegal aliens as you use that phrase are criminals and the contagious, which differs little from my own position, or if you wish to retract that.

lol, you badgered me relentlessly to re-state my position, I did, now wtf is yours

[Superfluous Man]

lol, you badgered me relentlessly to re-state my position, I did, now wtf is yours

I missed it. What post is that in?

N.B. you say badgered, but it was your choice not to just answer the question when asked. You will see that when you asked me for my position, I told you in my very next post.

[Stratovarious]

I missed it. What post is that in?

N.B. you say badgered, but it was your choice not to just answer the question when asked. You will see that when you asked me for my position, I told you in my very next post.

lmao, I'm against anyone being in this country illegally?
Your position on immigration?

[Superfluous Man]

lmao, I'm against anyone being in this country illegally?

The question is: Do you still define being in the country illegally the way you did in that post we've been talking about this whole time, or are do you want to retract that?

Surely you realize that the definition you provided is not the usual one.

Your position on immigration?

Post 231.

[Stratovarious]

The question is: Do you still define being in the country illegally the way you did in that post we've been talking about this whole time, or are do you want to retract that?

Surely you realize that the definition you provided is not the usual one.



Post 231.

''Interesting that you would pose that question after refusing to answer it yourself.

My position is that we should rely on morally justifiable means of dealing with all the problems you listed. We should never resort to injustice as our tool. And going through the middle man of the state does not give us a loophole to do that. Within the free market we will always find that we can better handle all those problems, as well as every other one, than trying to control them through the central planners of the state.

Furthermore, even if I did support state-based solutions for the specific immigration-related problems you listed, so as to exclude the kinds of people you listed from legally entering the USA, while still allowing all others to enter without limit, the result would be a de facto open immigration system that would allow the very same millions and millions of new immigrants that immigration restrictionists like Swordsmyth (whose position, recall you were defending, which was the whole instigation of this discussion between you and me) don't want to let in. If the US adopted such a position (only excluding the groups you listed), it would be a huge step toward much more open immigration, and rates of illegal immigration would plummet solely by way of all the people who would simply come legally when they currently aren't able to do so and instead resort to coming illegally under the current much more restrictive immigration laws. '' superfluous

Good lord, what a bunch of useless rhetorical gibberish,
'' ... if stratovarious this and that
and Swordsmyth blah blah, and US Adopted....''
Non of that is a 'position' ,
like I said,
you can't state your position , I get it .....

[Superfluous Man]

Good lord, what a bunch of useless rhetorical gibberish,
'' ... if stratovarious this and that
and Swordsmyth blah blah, and US Adopted....''
Non of that is a 'position' ,
like I said,
you can't state your position , I get it .....

Check the sentence that starts with the words, "My position is."

Off topic: Did you ever talk to a poster here with the handle HVAC Tech. If so, I would like to see your exchanges.

[Stratovarious]

Check the sentence that starts with the words, "My position is."

Off topic: Did you ever talk to a poster here with the handle HVAC Tech. If so, I would like to see your exchanges.

[RJB]

Off topic: Did you ever talk to a poster here with the handle HVAC Tech. If so, I would like to see your exchanges.

Did you ever talk to a poster here with the handle erowe1?

[Origanalist]

Did you ever talk to a poster here with the handle erowe1?

What kind of a barefoot hippie question is that?

[RJB]

What kind of a barefoot hippie question is that?

Hey, smell this foot!

[Origanalist]

Hey, smell this foot!

I can, wash the damn thing will ya?

[RJB]

I can, wash the damn thing will ya?

Dang, I got some power. You're across the country and against the prevailing wind. Wait until I eat some chili tonight.

[Origanalist]

Dang, I got some power. You're across the country and against the prevailing wind. Wait until I eat some chili tonight.

When is dinner time, I'm going to shut off the computer.

[RJB]

When is dinner time, I'm going to shut off the computer.

I took a detour and am headed to White Castle...

[Swordsmyth]

How did any of this work out for the American Indians?

Not well at all.

[Swordsmyth]

I think they could be classified as 'potential' socialists due to their lack of resources. I doubt that many of the Irish at the time were capable of reading Engels or Marx.

The Marxists have always had rabble rousers to spread their gospel by the spoken word.

[Swordsmyth]

Ok, then lets discuss New York. And Washington State. And Maine. And Oregon. And Massachusetts. Etc. etc.

And lets discuss the public school system and the colleges pumping the youth with progressive propaganda and them becoming voters and running for office. And the MSM. And all the social media thoughtcrime crackdown going on.

Is California worse than New York? New Jersey? Washington State?

Are you trying to claim that those other places weren't corrupted by excessive immigration?
Because I'm pretty sure that they were corrupted by foreigners and Californians/New Yorkers etc.

[Swordsmyth]

I welcome that discussion.

I will take the side of the debate that says that California's problems result from too much government. And I welcome you to take the position that their problems result from too little government, and debate me about that.

And who tilted the balance in favor of the excess government?

Immigrants.

[AuH20]

And who tilted the balance in favor of the excess government?

Immigrants.

I would agree with that. Without immigrants, I doubt the New Deal would have arrived as soon as it did.

[Schifference]

Not well at all.

Is that a pertinent question in this discussion?

[Swordsmyth]

Is that a pertinent question in this discussion?

I would say so, they allowed excessive immigration either through ignorance or inability to prevent it and they were destroyed and subjugated because of it.

[Swordsmyth]

I would agree with that. Without immigrants, I doubt the New Deal would have arrived as soon as it did.

If at all.

[Origanalist]

Are you trying to claim that those other places weren't corrupted by excessive immigration?
Because I'm pretty sure that they were corrupted by foreigners and Californians/New Yorkers etc.

So lets build a wall around all the coastal States. That's where progressiveness is at it's worst.

[Schifference]

I would say so, they allowed excessive immigration either through ignorance or inability to prevent it and they were destroyed and subjugated because of it.

If they could have a do over would they attack the people before they could get ashore?

[Swordsmyth]

So lets build a wall around all the coastal States. That's where progressiveness is at it's worst.

Sounds good to me but you open borders types wouldn't let us even if they seceded or were expelled.

[Swordsmyth]

If they could have a do over would they attack the people before they could get ashore?

If they exceeded any limits that the natives placed on them, what those limits would need to be is another question.

[Schifference]

If they exceeded any limits that the natives placed on them, what those limits would need to be is another question.

What do you think the indians were thinking when the white man kept coming and coming and they started to get pushed off their land?

[Origanalist]

Sounds good to me but you open borders types wouldn't let us even if they seceded or were expelled.

So you don't support a border wall with Mexico but you're ok with building one around all the coastal states, huh. Maybe we could build one around every state and put watch towers every 300 feet. That would be some real security there.