Trump demands you turn over your bump stocks
More gun control than Obama!
https://www.cnn.com/2018/12/18/polit...ban/index.html
__________________________________________________ ________________
"A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst
But it's the best victim disarmament (gun control). The very best.
Chris
"Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon
"...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul
I'm going to hold off and wait for the Trumpsplanation.
God damn it Matt...Originally Posted by Matt Collins
The relevant paragraph:
This is pretty good, we've got a:Those who possess the devices, which make it easier to fire rounds from a semi-automatic weapon by harnessing the gun's recoil to "bump" the trigger faster, will have 90 days to turn in or otherwise destroy them from the date that the final rule is published in the federal register -- likely this Friday -- according to senior DOJ officials.
1 - An ex post facto violation.
2 - A Second Amendment violation.
3 - A Fifth Amendment "takings" violation.
most libertarian president evar, amirite?
Brawndo's got what plants crave. Its got electrolytes.
H. L. Mencken said it best:
“Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.”
"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron."
Ron Paul on steroids! MAGA baby!
Chris
"Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon
"...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul
At least Massie is sticking to principle
After Las Vegas massacre, Ky. congressman emerges as vocal, if lonely, defender of bump stocksFull story, including Massie Tweets:WASHINGTON — If bump stocks need a defender in Congress after last week’s deadly massacre in Las Vegas, Rep. Thomas Massie is their man...
...Massie, a Kentucky Republican and self-described collector of such things as machine guns, short-barrelled shotguns and silencers, has pushed back—hard.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ock/751577001/
Brawndo's got what plants crave. Its got electrolytes.
H. L. Mencken said it best:
“Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.”
"As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron."
I must nitpick, this isn't actually an ex post facto violation. But yes, it does violate 2A and the Takings Clause.
__________________________________________________ ________________
"A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst
It's Quantum Dark Energy Wormhole Chess.
Anyone who doesn't see that this is just a tricksy feint designed to stick it to the Swamp and put the G in MAGA is a stooge or a shill.
(And anyway, Trump isn't perfect and Hillary would have been worse, so stop being such an ingrate. You should be thankful ...)
Last edited by Occam's Banana; 12-18-2018 at 05:37 PM.
So you admit it won't hold up in court?
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
If Trump hadn't done this, then the Dems would very likely have tried and put forward some legislation that might have had teeth. This doesn't have teeth, it will get shot down in court.
Now go ahead and make fun of my for my explanation of why what Trump did will result in a better outcome for gun owners.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
I tend to agree. This was written terribly and the resulting court beatdown (if there is one, these days who know?) will set good precedent.
Make fun of you? Perish the thought!
Rather, I thank you for the QED.
The National Rifle Association is "disappointed" with the Trump administration's plan to outlaw bump stocks, which allow semi-automatic weapons to fire continuously.
Spokeswoman Jennifer Baker says the Justice Department should provide amnesty for gun owners who already have the devices.
More at: https://news.yahoo.com/latest-nra-di...210052225.html
Cute.
It's a good thing we have real gun rights organizations around.
Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Robert Heinlein
Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler
Groucho Marx
I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.
Linus, from the Peanuts comic
You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith
Alexis de Torqueville
Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it
A Zero Hedge comment
You and dannno are trying to have it both ways ...
If the courts are going to beat down Trump's crappy gun-grabby laws, then why wouldn't they beat down the Democrats' crappier gun-grabbier laws? Or to state things the other way around, if the courts are at all likely to allow the Democrats' crappier gun-grabbier laws, then why wouldn't they be at least as likely (if not more) to allow Trump's crappy gun-grabby laws?
If they WOULD beat down the Democrats' crap, then why does Trump need to do anything? But if they would NOT beat down the Democrats' crap, then why should anyone expect them to beat down Trump's?
IOW: Either Trump's crap is pointless and unnecessary at best (at worst, it is counter-productively dangerous if it does manage to pass judicial muster), or it is not a ploy ...
Last edited by Occam's Banana; 12-18-2018 at 07:30 PM.
I disagree with Trump about this either way but the difference is that one is a regulation that the BATFE has already admitted it doesn't have the authority to issue and the other would be an act of Congress that the courts would give more deference to.
Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Robert Heinlein
Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler
Groucho Marx
I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.
Linus, from the Peanuts comic
You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith
Alexis de Torqueville
Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it
A Zero Hedge comment
Oh, and as for the whole gun thing; I'm totally suprised that the life-long NYC Democrat who spent decades supporting gun control...
...supports gun control.
But this just puts it under the best-case "pointless and unnecessary" branch of the "either-or" I presented. (And it could end up under the worst-case "counter-productively dangerous" scenario if the BATFE decides to change its mind.)
What is the point of issuing a regulatory EO that won't be enforced? How is an unenforced EO (or an enforced one, for that matter) supposed to preempt or beat down the Democrats' gun-grabbing efforts in any way? And if, as you say, the courts would give greater deference to an act of Congress, then why should the Democrats feel at all inhibited or stymied by Trump's supposedly toothless EO? Indeed, it seems that just the opposite should be the case. After all, sharks don't go away when there's blood in the water ...
In short: the Trumpslanation we have been offered for this makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
The sensible explanation is that this is not a ploy and that Trump is simply a half-assed gun-grabber (as accords with the history of his remarks on the issue going back decades). No chess required.
Last edited by Occam's Banana; 12-18-2018 at 10:14 PM.
The idea isn't that it won't be enforced, the idea is that the courts will strike it down where they might not have struck down an act of Congress.
Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Robert Heinlein
Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler
Groucho Marx
I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.
Linus, from the Peanuts comic
You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith
Alexis de Torqueville
Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it
A Zero Hedge comment
And so we come full circle ...
If they are going to strike it down because of its source (EO vs. act of Congress), then:
How can it possibly work to our advantage if the courts say, "This does not pass muster as an EO - but it might as an act of Congress ..."?
But if they are going to strike it down because of its substance, then:
Last edited by Occam's Banana; 12-18-2018 at 09:43 PM.
Which is part of why I don't agree even if Trump is doing it for that reason, the Demoncrats can simply say that since the courts struck down the regulation they will now try to pass a law.
The only supposed advantage will be that hopefully public support for the ban will have subsided because the Las Vegas shooting will be a distant memory, it was also supposed to decrease liberal enthusiasm for voting in the midterms but that didn't work which those of us who disagreed with Trump said at the time.
Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Robert Heinlein
Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler
Groucho Marx
I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.
Linus, from the Peanuts comic
You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith
Alexis de Torqueville
Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it
A Zero Hedge comment
Just because it is unconstitutional doesn't mean the courts are going to strike it down. Hell, most of the stuff that gets upheld by the courts is unconstitutional.
And who cares what the Dems do? You fight this stuff, not cave to them and give them an inch. That's strategy 101.
__________________________________________________ ________________
"A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst
What if you give them a pretend inch for one real one?
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
LOL
Hold on, let me compose myself.
What I mean to say is...
Now, now - that was only for business purposes.
It's just not right to suggest that it might signify anything else ...
In order tobe a junior partner in a construction project tobuild ugly apartments in NYC, you have to write a book espousing leftism.
...everyone knows that...
I'm thinking it's a camel's nose under the tent sort of thing. Are gun rights folks sufficiently dumb and numb enough yet under Trump to let him "just stick the mushroom tip in"?
(Yeah I know, I grossed myself out with that reference but it's apropos)
"Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul
"We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book
It depends on the precise nature of a given analysis and the assumptions on which it is based, as well as the wording of the statute.
If someone has purchased a bumpstock, which is the act of acquisition, and purchasing becomes a crime, then criminalization of purchase does in fact constitute an ex post facto edict for those who possessed their stocks prior. The same may be said for possession.
Such a ban is shyte no matter how one attempts to slice the turd.
freedomisobvious.blogspot.com
There is only one correct way: freedom. All other solutions are non-solutions.
It appears that artificial intelligence is at least slightly superior to natural stupidity.
Our words make us the ghosts that we are.
Convincing the world he didn't exist was the Devil's second greatest trick; the first was convincing us that God didn't exist.
Are you trying to deny that the construction industry in NYC is politicized?
How about the television industry?
Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Robert Heinlein
Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler
Groucho Marx
I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.
Linus, from the Peanuts comic
You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith
Alexis de Torqueville
Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it
A Zero Hedge comment
//
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