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Thread: Apparently the Lord of the Rings is racist

  1. #1

    Apparently the Lord of the Rings is racist

    https://www.dailywire.com/news/38755...-emily-zanotti

    Science fiction author Andrew Duncan has a message for J.R.R. Tolkien fans, particularly fans of the famed writer's "Lord of the Rings" trilogy: Tolkien discriminated against orcs and the "Lord of the Rings" books promote racism.

    Duncan was discussing "Lord of the Rings" as part of a wider discussion on fantasy literature for WIRED magazine's Geek's Guide to the Galaxy podcast when his assessment of Tolkien's masterpiece took a decidedly "woke" turn.

    "It's hard to miss the repeated notion in Tolkien that some races are just worse than others, or that some peoples are just worse than others," Duncan said.
    .
    Last edited by RJB; 12-01-2018 at 03:29 PM.



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  3. #2
    And dwarphobic too.
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    There's not a liberty lover on the planet who isn't called a liberal by the right, and a con by the left.

  4. #3
    Well,, in the the Fantasy world of Middle Earth,, different races actually exist.

    This is also true in Azeroth.
    Last edited by pcosmar; 12-01-2018 at 03:13 PM.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

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  5. #4
    and the entire question of Good v Evil goes drifting off in a haze of confusion.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  6. #5
    Racism is like ketchup. You can put it on anything.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  7. #6
    I pasted a video that I didn't watch all the way. I then thought I hit preview but I must have hit post. I re-edited and posted an article instead.

  8. #7
    Of course it is...what isn't these days?

  9. #8
    Racist against Orcs? Seriously? Man, whatever this assclown is smoking is some gooood $#@!.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by RJB View Post
    I pasted a video that I didn't watch all the way. I then thought I hit preview but I must have hit post. I re-edited and posted an article instead.
    Lol, I started watching that earlier today and didn't make it too far either.
    "The Patriarch"

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    The man did not think clearly. It was almost as if he had brain cancer of something.
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  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    Racist against Orcs? Seriously? Man, whatever this assclown is smoking is some gooood $#@!.
    If he is, he's committing a crime.

    Of course, it's a victimless crime. But so is racism against imaginary orcs.
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    There's not a liberty lover on the planet who isn't called a liberal by the right, and a con by the left.

  13. #11
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    Well, in the strictest sense, it is. Elves, dwarves, humans, and orcs all have traits that aren't just cultural but racial. They think and act certain ways not because they've been taught to do that but because that is just who they are by birth.

    That said, to focus on this issue really misses the point. Through the myriad multi-racial relationships in LoTR -Gimli and Legolas, Aragorn and Arwen, Frodo and Gandalf, Merry and Eowyn, etc.- Tolkien does a lot of work to break down the idea that racial differences truly matter. They don't, and by getting to know each other we discover that for all our seeming differences racial and cultural that we really all are truly the same. Aragorm and Arwen are an interracial couple. Elrond is mixed-race himself. And these are the heroes.

    Interestingly enough it is all the ones who don't want to mix races and cultures that are the enemies. Sauron wants to conquer and force everyone to accept his cultural and political superiority. Denethor has turned Gondor into an isolationist kingdom. Under the influence of Wormtounge, Theoden has turned inwards and refuses to aid Gondor or listen to anyone form outside his lands. Saruman has done something similar at his tower. They're all cultural and political isolationist. Economically they're certainly protectionist.

    By contrast, our heroes open themselves and their lands up to the world around them. Even teh previously isolated Shire becomes more connected to the world and people around it under Sam's leadership.

  14. #12
    Well it does kind of cast trolls, orcs and goblins in a bad light - serving the dark lord, going total viking - raiding, killing and pillaging and all that. That's just a part of their culture. Tolkien should be more respecting of that.
    And dwarves and elves - LOTR perpetuates the stereotype that dwarves are short, stubborn, grow beards and have a greed for treasure.
    LOTR also stereotypes elves as inherently good at bowmanship. Just because their elves doesn't mean they play archery. Some elves might prefer digging tunnels in mountains, and some dwarves might just prefer climbing trees and shooting the longbow.
    And hobbits - furry footed harmless little people with big feet, that like to grow vegetables and smoke pipes.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Dr. Ron Paul. "Stand up for what you believe in, even if you are standing alone." - Sophie Magdalena Scholl
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  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by PierzStyx View Post
    By contrast, our heroes open themselves and their lands up to the world around them. Even teh previously isolated Shire becomes more connected to the world and people around it under Sam's leadership.
    And then there was the part where Saruman took advantage of the Shire's open borders, immigrated transformed their government and turned it into a tyranny.
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  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by AZJoe View Post
    ... going total viking - raiding, killing and pillaging and all that. That's just a part of their culture.

    That is a racist stereotype and not even true. I wish people on RPFs would knock that $#@! off.

    It is demeaning and hurtful to me and the contributions from my rich and inclusive culture.

    Next time I see some disparaging my heritage, I'm reporting it.
    Last edited by Danke; 12-02-2018 at 08:16 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Ron Paul know some weird people...



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  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Danke View Post
    That is a racist stereotype and not even true. I wish people on RPFs would knock that $#@! off.
    It is demeaning and hurtful to me and the contributions from my rich and inclusive culture.
    Next time I see some disparaging my heritage, I'm reporting it.
    Thanks for pointing that out. I see it now. Honestly, I meant no offense to the orcs and trolls.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Dr. Ron Paul. "Stand up for what you believe in, even if you are standing alone." - Sophie Magdalena Scholl
    "War is the health of the State." - Randolph Bourne "Freedom is the answer. ... Now, what's the question?" - Ernie Hancock.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by AZJoe View Post
    Thanks for pointing that out. I see it now. Honestly, I meant no offense to the orcs and trolls.
    Reported.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Ron Paul know some weird people...



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    And then there was the part where Saruman took advantage of the Shire's open borders, immigrated transformed their government and turned it into a tyranny.
    Actually, the Dúnedain of the North (i.e., the Rangers) patrolled the Shire's borders - and the areas around Bree and the road to Imladris (Elrond's haven).

    It wasn't until they went South to join the War of the Ring that Saruman's henchmen started moving in ...

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Actually, the Dúnedain of the North (i.e., the Rangers) patrolled the Shire's borders - and the areas around Bree and the road to Imladris (Elrond's haven).

    It wasn't until they went South to join the War of the Ring that Saruman's henchmen started moving in ...
    I think you put your finger on it. Secure borders aren't racist because they keep brown people out. Secure borders just have to be demonized as racist (or some kind of "-ist") because they sap resources from the task of bombing brown people off their oil and poppies.
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    There's not a liberty lover on the planet who isn't called a liberal by the right, and a con by the left.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Actually, the Dúnedain of the North (i.e., the Rangers) patrolled the Shire's borders - and the areas around Bree and the road to Imladris (Elrond's haven).

    It wasn't until they went South to join the War of the Ring that Saruman's henchmen started moving in ...
    Here goes 4 eyes injecting nerdy info into the kitschy RPF conversation. Dunedain? Imladris? WTF? you don't know it yet but you have in essence shut down this thread

    J/k learned some trivia knowledge today, 1+ nerdy point for you
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  23. #20
    I see this sort of headlines as an indicator that the economy is booming cos you got to be very comfortable in your life to be getting all worked up about the treatment of orcs in TLOTR.

    Yay Trump?
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Actually, the Dúnedain of the North (i.e., the Rangers) patrolled the Shire's borders - and the areas around Bree and the road to Imladris (Elrond's haven).

    It wasn't until they went South to join the War of the Ring that Saruman's henchmen started moving in ...
    Yes, that's what happens when no one guards the borders.
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It's a balance between appeasing his supporters, appeasing the deep state and reaching his own goals.
    ~Resident Badgiraffe




  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    and the entire question of Good v Evil goes drifting off in a haze of confusion.
    This. English 101: In a good story there is always a protagonist (good guy) and an antagonist (bad guy).
    "There are two freedoms - the false, where a man is free to do what he likes; the true, where he is free to do what he ought."~~Charles Kingsley

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Actually, the Dúnedain of the North (i.e., the Rangers) patrolled the Shire's borders - and the areas around Bree and the road to Imladris (Elrond's haven).

    It wasn't until they went South to join the War of the Ring that Saruman's henchmen started moving in ...
    And then there was Orlando Bloom.
    "There are two freedoms - the false, where a man is free to do what he likes; the true, where he is free to do what he ought."~~Charles Kingsley

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Actually, the Dúnedain of the North (i.e., the Rangers) patrolled the Shire's borders - and the areas around Bree and the road to Imladris (Elrond's haven).

    It wasn't until they went South to join the War of the Ring that Saruman's henchmen started moving in ...
    I don't remember that part. I actually didn't even realize that the ranger, Strider, and Aragorn were all the same person for awhile there. When I figured that part out, the book made more sense and was much less racist.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    This intellectually stimulating conversation is the reason I keep coming here.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    This. English 101: In a good story there is always a protagonist (good guy) and an antagonist (bad guy).
    English 102: Protagonists are only flawless and antagonists are only completely irredeemable in comic books.
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    There's not a liberty lover on the planet who isn't called a liberal by the right, and a con by the left.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    English 102: Protagonists are only flawless and antagonists are only completely irredeemable in comic books.

    Actually, thanks to Stan Lee, this hasn't even been true in comic books since the early 1960s.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    English 102: Protagonists are only flawless and antagonists are only completely irredeemable in comic books.
    Comic Book 101: Stan Lee. His heroes weren't flawless and his villains weren't always irredeemable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    This intellectually stimulating conversation is the reason I keep coming here.

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    Actually, thanks to Stan Lee, this hasn't even been true in comic books since the early 1960s.
    Quote Originally Posted by Suzanimal View Post
    Comic Book 101: Stan Lee. His heroes weren't flawless and his villains weren't always irredeemable.
    True enough.

    Actually, Creative Writing 101 is a protagonist doesn't have to be a "good guy", he or she must merely make a momentous decision. And an antagonist doesn't have to be a " bad guy", he or she must merely interfere with the protagonist.

    I defy anyone to watch the entire The Godfather film franchise and find a single protagonist who is a good guy.
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    There's not a liberty lover on the planet who isn't called a liberal by the right, and a con by the left.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Suzanimal View Post
    Comic Book 101: Stan Lee. His heroes weren't flawless and his villains weren't always irredeemable.
    GMTA!

    I'd +rep you if I could.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    GMTA!

    I'd +rep you if I could.
    I didn't mean to repeat you. I was in the middle of commenting and decided to go make my cornbread and when I came back I finished my post and noticed you had already posted and thought about just deleting but then I thought of a good gift for oyarde and went to that thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    This intellectually stimulating conversation is the reason I keep coming here.

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