Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 31 to 33 of 33

Thread: Why do police ask for ID first?

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    So you ARE claiming that lower courts always rule correctly on such matters.
    LOL
    Yes, generally. You're confusing me, however, since you claim they don't rule correctly on such matters but then say they don't follow those legal principles in the first place.

    That just isn't true, I have a relative whose court case involved a real question of jurisdiction and the lawyer made a special filing to inform the court that it lacked jurisdiction, they won.
    Your family member's successful argument was a lack of subject matter jurisdiction, not personal jurisdiction.

    My family has had sufficient experience with the judicial system to make an informed guess. (see the example above)
    So, none then, just second hand information.

    I'm still waiting for you to give me any examples of the kops or the courts following such principles.
    Ha well, is the fact that I had a case dismissed over it good enough?
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    Visiting the Outer Banks of NC?
    Outer Banks NC Fishing Boat Rentals



  2. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  3. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Yes, generally. You're confusing me, however, since you claim they don't rule correctly on such matters but then say they don't follow those legal principles in the first place.
    I'm saying that if the system operated on such principles there would surely be cases where lower courts ruled incorrectly and were then overruled on appeal.



    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Your family member's successful argument was a lack of subject matter jurisdiction, not personal jurisdiction.
    No, it was personal jurisdiction, the case was filed in the wrong state by the other party in an attempt to take advantage of more favorable laws there based on the fact they they both used to live there and he had moved back.


    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    So, none then, just second hand information.
    That was just one example, I have been in court myself as have other family members.



    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Ha well, is the fact that I had a case dismissed over it good enough?
    For the sake of argument I will take your word for it but I know of other anomalous rulings about other subjects, that doesn't mean that the system actually works that way, just that you were able to convince a single judge that it did.

    I wouldn't recommend putting it to the test very often because the odds are that sooner or later you will get a judge that doesn't buy it.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



  4. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  5. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I'm saying that if the system operated on such principles there would surely be cases where lower courts ruled incorrectly and were then overruled on appeal.
    You still don't quite the basis here. It is a personal jurisdiction question. If the courts are making repeated rulings, up through appeals level courts, then jurisdiction was obtained/established at some point. There can't be years of court proceedings if jurisdiction has never been obtained in the first place. All such cases would have been disposed of one way or another at the lower court level (district court, superior/circuit court) and never get to appeals courts and supreme courts, where case cites and opinions are issued. Besides, that also assumes they would publish such case opinions for public consumption.

    No, it was personal jurisdiction, the case was filed in the wrong state by the other party in an attempt to take advantage of more favorable laws there based on the fact they they both used to live there and he had moved back.
    Oh ok, but that is a different personal jurisdiction argument since that was a civil matter. The hiring of an attorney submitted your family member to the court's jurisdiction only to decide if it had personal jurisdiction on that particular civil matter. The personal jurisdiction I'm talking about is to prosecute criminal and infraction offenses, not civil damage lawsuits.

    For the sake of argument I will take your word for it but I know of other anomalous rulings about other subjects, that doesn't mean that the system actually works that way, just that you were able to convince a single judge that it did.

    I wouldn't recommend putting it to the test very often because the odds are that sooner or later you will get a judge that doesn't buy it.
    Be scared and worry and just bend over, eh? Naaa it is how the system works and they know it.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    Visiting the Outer Banks of NC?
    Outer Banks NC Fishing Boat Rentals

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12


Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 8
    Last Post: 11-29-2014, 10:35 AM
  2. Replies: 20
    Last Post: 02-01-2014, 02:57 PM
  3. Replies: 49
    Last Post: 03-23-2013, 10:16 AM
  4. Replies: 21
    Last Post: 12-31-2011, 01:59 PM
  5. Replies: 6
    Last Post: 09-23-2010, 02:07 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •