Trade Or Don’t Trade

[PAF]

Nations do not trade, people do. Trade is not war, it is peace.

When outsiders or governments impose tariffs, duties, sanctions, whether across the street or country lines, they are directly infringing on the rights of people to negotiate among themselves. It is also theft.

The term “Trade War” is used by people who are not part of the trade ie; those in government seeking to profit from a product they did not make.

Free Trade is voluntary. Fair Trade is forced.

We do not need missiles or bloodshed or military bases to trade. To do so means fair trade, which equates to force, meaning lobbyists/outsiders are in bed with government at the two individuals expense.


PAF

[dean.engelhardt]

Well said.

[nobody's_hero]

Agree with the missiles, bloodshed, or military bases bit. The rest of it is overly simplified.

[CCTelander]

Nations do not trade, people do. Trade is not war, it is peace.

When outsiders or governments impose tariffs, duties, sanctions, whether across the street or country lines, they are directly infringing on the rights of people to negotiate among themselves. It is also theft.

The term “Trade War” is used by people who are not part of the trade ie; those in government seeking to profit from a product they did not make.

Free Trade is voluntary. Fair Trade is forced.

We do not need missiles or bloodshed or military bases to trade. To do so means fair trade, which equates to force, meaning lobbyists/outsiders are in bed with government at the two individuals expense.


PAF

"You must spread some Reputation around..."

[Swordsmyth]

Agree with the missiles, bloodshed, or military bases bit. The rest of it is overly simplified.

^^^THIS^^^

[PAF]

Agree with the missiles, bloodshed, or military bases bit. The rest of it is overly simplified.

^^^THIS^^^

“republicans”, I see. Ah well, we all start somewhere.

[nobody's_hero]

“republicans”, I see. Ah well, we all start somewhere.

I tried being a libertarian but I got burnt out on the purity tests. Not much different than liberal behavior, where you step out of line and get dog-piled. Sorry if that ruffles some feathers but it's just what I've observed over the last decade, and frankly it's tiresome. I believe what I believe. Most of it aligns with Ron Paul's views. A dogmatic belief in "free trade" is one issue I couldn't come around on simply because I —speaking only for myself —got tired of feeling like a useful idiot for the globalists.

[Swordsmyth]

I tried being a libertarian but I got burnt out on the purity tests. Not much different than liberal behavior, where you step out of line and get dog-piled. Sorry if that ruffles some feathers but it's just what I've observed over the last decade, and frankly it's tiresome. I believe what I believe. Most of it aligns with Ron Paul's views. A dogmatic belief in "free trade" is one issue I couldn't come around on simply because I —speaking only for myself —got tired of feeling like a useful idiot for the globalists.

Purists are so enthralled by the theory of free trade that they don't see that foreign government intervention is as bad or worse than domestic government intervention.

Then there are the "cash register" libertarians who don't care about the moral, political or market implications of foreign government intervention as long as they save a buck.

I recognize that my liberty is protected as much as it is by my country and that which hurts my country or my fellow Americans hurts me, I will not sell my birthright for a mess of pottage.

[Swordsmyth]

Aside from everything else you can no more have free trade and a regulatory state than you can have open borders and a welfare state.

[William Tell]

Nations do not trade, people do. Trade is not war, it is peace.

When outsiders or governments impose tariffs, duties, sanctions, whether across the street or country lines, they are directly infringing on the rights of people to negotiate among themselves. It is also theft.

When you are trading with countries that use their citizens as slave labor, is that really voluntary? Don't get me wrong, I'm not here to advocate for any sanctions, I am aware of the harm that they can cause too. But the fact is that when there is exploitation involved it is not a win/win libertarian paradise situation for everyone.

[Origanalist]

When you are trading with countries that use their citizens as slave labor, is that really voluntary? Don't get me wrong, I'm not here to advocate for any regula When outsiders or governments impose tariffs, duties, sanctions, whether across the street or country lines, they are directly infringing on the rights of people to negotiate among themselves. It is also theft.

When you are trading with countries that use their citizens as slave labor, is that really voluntary? Don't get me wrong, I'm not here to advocate for any sanctions, I am aware of the harm that they can cause too. But the fact is that when there is exploitation involved it is not a win/win libertarian paradise situation for everyone.[/QUOTE]
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Posting from your phone sometimes makes you look like a bot. I hate that.

[William Tell]

Posting from your phone sometimes makes you look like a bot. I hate that.

Today I'm a Turkeybot. Happy Thanksgiving!

[Origanalist]

Today I'm a Turkeybot. Happy Thanksgiving!

Back at you, I have to start the turkey trot pretty soon, we're hosting this year.

[William Tell]

Back at you, I have to start the turkey trot pretty soon, we're hosting this year.

Somehow I already knew that, I must be the NSA.

[phill4paul]

Back at you, I have to start the turkey trot pretty soon, we're hosting this year.

Same. Everything here is GTG. All sides and desserts done. Turkey won't go in the oven for a bit longer. 4pm E.S.T. (Eat. Savory. Turkey.)

[presence]

Purists are so enthralled by the theory of free trade that they don't see that foreign government intervention is as bad or worse than domestic government intervention.

Then there are the "cash register" libertarians who don't care about the moral, political or market implications of foreign government intervention as long as they save a buck.

I recognize that my liberty is protected as much as it is by my country and that which hurts my country or my fellow Americans hurts me, I will not sell my birthright for a mess of pottage.

regardless the economic occupation
stem local or abroad;
be it tax tarriff or ban;
any purported "government" that intervenes in markets
is a foreign state to free men otherwise peacefully contracting


my liberty is solely protected by my willingness to exercise it

[PAF]

Some [visitors] are aware of the difference, some are not.

I posted this thread because of two reasons:

1. USMCA (NAFTA 2.0) is being promoted as Free Trade, however it is clearly NOT.

2. To resurrect/raise awareness about Objectivism, which I fully support:

[Ender]

"You must spread some Reputation around..."

Covered.

[Ender]

regardless the economic occupation
stem local or abroad;
be it tax tarriff or ban;
any purported "government" that intervenes in markets
is a foreign state to free men otherwise peacefully contracting


my liberty is solely protected by my willingness to exercise it

Exactly.

And I'd + rep you again if I could.

[Todd]

“republicans”, I see. Ah well, we all start somewhere.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to PAF again.

Nailed it.