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Thread: Rand Paul 2020

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by nobody's_hero View Post
    Matt will run just to split the vote.
    Sometimes I think we get the president we deserve.



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  3. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    No. To explain that comment, his 2016 campaign was a disaster and quite frankly an embarrassment. It actually did damage to the cause of liberty. I don't want to see that repeated, which is what any future attempt at POTUS for him will end up being.
    When I read your last post I was like wtf since why would one here not want Rand taking another crack at it. Then I read this post above and it jogged my memory back to the 2016 race which your observation is spot on.

    What I still do not understand is what was behind the disaster? It was so obvious and a course correction could have been taken at any time but was not. I have always wondered was it his advisors - the advice he was getting or was it not a serious run, but rather setting the stage for his Senate re-election and a future campaign banking on a Trump loss?



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  5. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    Would you be willing to be his campaign manager, for a more successful run in 2024?
    uh no LOL.... I don't work in politics full time any more. And even if I did there are better more qualified people than I for that particular position.


    However even if Rand had the best manager he has zero grassroots credibility any more. If he worked hard to change that between now and then yeah he might be able to pull off a serious run. But Rand isn't willing to do that.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  6. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    No, it's the plan for running in 2024, I don't believe Rand will run against Trump in 2020, if he does the plan will be to run as Trump's best buddy who understands how to MAGA even better than Trump and knows best what to build on Trump's foundation, it would probably be best to promise Trump a cabinet position where his positions best align with liberty.
    I would like to see Trump dump Pence and run with Rand in 2020. That would start Rand off in a better position for 2024. But it would depend on Rand's platform. If he runs on a platform catering to the Republican establishment, Neocons and the open borders crowd rather than Americans first he would be toast and rightfully so. This was somewhat the mistake of his 2016 campaign and the direction the news media and the establishment will again steer him to.

  7. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by kahless View Post
    What I still do not understand is what was behind the disaster? It was so obvious and a course correction could have been taken at any time but was not. I have always wondered was it his advisors - the advice he was getting or was it not a serious run, but rather setting the stage for his Senate re-election and a future campaign banking on a Trump loss?
    Rand's problem in 2016 was multi-fold:


    - it pains me to say this but there was no way he could have beaten Trump in that year. He wasn't willing to out Trump Trump, not that he would have been able to either (everyone tried, including Rand). HOWEVER, there is no excuse for having such poor performance in Iowa (less than Ron's performance in 08).

    - Rand's downfall started with the way he endorsed Romney in 2012. His messaging was horrible on that and it was the first hard step in a long slow decline that he never recovered from

    - Rand, and his team, did not keep the grassroots close.

    - Rand endorsed Mitch over Matt in KY which also caused him to lose a lot of credibility with the base, although I can understand the calculated strategic reasons for it

    - His votes for relatively minor sanctions was not messaged to the grassroots very well (or at all)

    - His campaign staff were full of establishment hacks who didn't understand Rand, the philosophy, the base, or the grassroots, and didn't care to either.



    All of these things combined resulted in lousy performance in 2016 mostly because he didn't keep the grassroots as an integral part of his plan.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  8. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    No. To explain that comment, his 2016 campaign was a disaster and quite frankly an embarrassment. It actually did damage to the cause of liberty. I don't want to see that repeated, which is what any future attempt at POTUS for him will end up being.
    I don't agree that his campaign did damage or that a future campaign would be the same as the last one, if you are being honest then that just means you see things that way because it suits your feud with Rand.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  9. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Rand's problem in 2016 was multi-fold:


    - it pains me to say this but there was no way he could have beaten Trump in that year. He wasn't willing to out Trump Trump, not that he would have been able to either (everyone tried, including Rand). HOWEVER, there is no excuse for having such poor performance in Iowa (less than Ron's performance in 08).

    - Rand's downfall started with the way he endorsed Romney in 2012. His messaging was horrible on that and it was the first hard step in a long slow decline that he never recovered from

    - Rand, and his team, did not keep the grassroots close.

    - Rand endorsed Mitch over Matt in KY which also caused him to lose a lot of credibility with the base, although I can understand the calculated strategic reasons for it

    - His votes for relatively minor sanctions was not messaged to the grassroots very well (or at all)

    - His campaign staff were full of establishment hacks who didn't understand Rand, the philosophy, the base, or the grassroots, and didn't care to either.



    All of these things combined resulted in lousy performance in 2016 mostly because he didn't keep the grassroots as an integral part of his plan.
    Rand needs to come back strong on what Rand does best, the Constitution. Announce that he will repeal NDAA and Patriot Act. Pick up Justin Amash for VP and it's a dream ticket, a win win for America. The Millennials will like Amash.
    His name was Seth Rich.

  10. #38
    To be honest I don't think Rand will get anywhere close to being president. I appreciate everything hes done for the past few years from the bottom of my heart but he doesn't have the personality of a winner. Like people have pointed out before he's got a bland personality. Unless Trump starts giving him pointers on how to win and be an alpha male(which probably won't work because you can't teach someone to be alpha), he won't even make it to super tuesday.
    Last edited by Anti Globalist; 10-20-2018 at 06:24 PM.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  11. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I don't agree that his campaign did damage or that a future campaign would be the same as the last one, if you are being honest then that just means you see things that way because it suits your feud with Rand.
    Uh no.

    Rand did great damage to the liberty movement by alienating most of it thus causing it to become diffuse and less effective/potent.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  12. #40
    Trump may be God's gift to Rand, and by extension, libertarians. Rand can run as Trump's protege, promising to restore liberty even further. An endorsement from Trump would be monumental!

    I'm sick of the nitpicking regarding what Rand may or may not do. I would rather live in a country where I complain about Rand as prez, than complain about anyone else.
    Last edited by kona; 10-20-2018 at 11:30 PM.



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  14. #41

  15. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by kona View Post

    I'm sick of the nitpicking regarding what Rand may or may not do. I would rather live in a country where I complain about Rand as prez, than complain about anyone else.
    Opportunity to complain about Rand's policies would be fantastic


    Luck is when opportunity meets preparation. Rand should be prepared, the way GOP-JVD (Jarvanka Democrats) faction is overplaying its hand in foreign policy, there could be opportunity ahead.

  16. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    2024
    That might be too late, various signs indicate that 2020 will be emerging as promising opportunity.

  17. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by enhanced_deficit View Post
    That might be too late, various signs indicate that 2020 will be emerging as promising opportunity.
    LOL
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  18. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Rand's problem in 2016 was multi-fold:

    - it pains me to say this but there was no way he could have beaten Trump in that year. He wasn't willing to out Trump Trump, not that he would have been able to either (everyone tried, including Rand). HOWEVER, there is no excuse for having such poor performance in Iowa (less than Ron's performance in 08).

    - Rand's downfall started with the way he endorsed Romney in 2012. His messaging was horrible on that and it was the first hard step in a long slow decline that he never recovered from

    - Rand, and his team, did not keep the grassroots close.

    - Rand endorsed Mitch over Matt in KY which also caused him to lose a lot of credibility with the base, although I can understand the calculated strategic reasons for it

    - His votes for relatively minor sanctions was not messaged to the grassroots very well (or at all)

    - His campaign staff were full of establishment hacks who didn't understand Rand, the philosophy, the base, or the grassroots, and didn't care to either.

    All of these things combined resulted in lousy performance in 2016 mostly because he didn't keep the grassroots as an integral part of his plan.
    The Romney endorsement shouldn't be debited against Rand's account; it wasn't even his decision, and it had to be done.

    ...

    As much as I love Ron, he had it easier in many ways.

    It's easier to simply refuse to vote the way they want you to, period, in all circumstances,

    Trying to maneuver around D.C. is much, much harder.

    Rand's $#@!ed now, to a point beyond repair, mind you, but he had an extremely hard job: not everybody is suited for that.

  19. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    The Romney endorsement shouldn't be debited against Rand's account; it wasn't even his decision, and it had to be done.
    I don't disagree... but the way he did it was poorly executed and in a way that angered everyone. He shouldn't have done it on Hannity. It should have been tacit and not glowing. And he should have pre-sold it to the grassroots first so that no one would be caught by surprise. And he should have had Ron on board too.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  20. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    I don't disagree... but the way he did it was poorly executed and in a way that angered everyone. He shouldn't have done it on Hannity. It should have been tacit and not glowing. And he should have pre-sold it to the grassroots first so that no one would be caught by surprise. And he should have had Ron on board too.
    Agreed, except for the underlined; it was Ron's idea in the first place.

  21. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Globalist View Post
    To be honest I don't think Rand will get anywhere close to being president. I appreciate everything hes done for the past few years from the bottom of my heart but he doesn't have the personality of a winner. Like people have pointed out before he's got a bland personality. Unless Trump starts giving him pointers on how to win and be an alpha male(which probably won't work because you can't teach someone to be alpha), he won't even make it to super tuesday.
    Rand Paul 2020 is possible with Donald Trump making bad decisions.



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  23. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Itsback View Post
    Rand Paul 2020 is possible with Donald Trump making bad decisions.
    Orange man bad.

  24. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Agreed, except for the underlined; it was Ron's idea in the first place.
    And the part where the grassroots were caught by surprise. There are threads here where the subject was debated for many pages before the fact.

    And I don't remember it being all that "glowing".
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    There's not a liberty lover on the planet who isn't called a liberal by the right, and a con by the left.

  25. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    And the part where the grassroots were caught by surprise. There are threads here where the subject was debated for many pages before the fact.

    And I don't remember it being all that "glowing".
    This is the age of stupid nonsense; so, no one cares about any of this (except insofar as they are stupid and nonsensical).

    "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."

    -H. L. Mencken

  26. #52
    Ther could be an opening for sensible GOP or genuine libertarian 3rd party candidate in near future. This time around GOP-Adelson/Neocon wing might not have much of a chance against Rand or simialr candidate, too much secret stuff is out in public now.



    Potentially Related

    Trump could be the first president since Carter to run for re-election during a recession

  27. #53
    Why should he bother?

    ...the pubic deserves what's coming to them.
    "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."

    -H. L. Mencken

  28. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Rand's downfall started with the way he endorsed Romney in 2012.
    It's only taken 6 plus years, but finally...you've accepted the truth of the matter.

  29. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Agreed, except for the underlined; it was Ron's idea in the first place.
    Post the source for that.

  30. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Globalist View Post
    If Rand wants to prevent this from happening to him, maybe he should have the Trumpster teach him the ways of being an alpha male. No way in hell is a beta male ever saving this country.
    Yep, we need a Trump/T. Roosevelt type. A pissed off liberty lover. An American Putin?
    - SUPPORT FREE TRADE, SMUGGLE -

    2 + 2 = 5.



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  32. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Post the source for that.
    Piss up a rope.
    "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."

    -H. L. Mencken

  33. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    Yep, we need a Trump/T. Roosevelt type. A pissed off liberty lover. An American Putin?
    Yellowstone Caldera 2020
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  34. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    It's only taken 6 plus years, but finally...you've accepted the truth of the matter.
    It's the way he did it, not THAT he did it.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  35. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by James_Madison_Lives View Post
    Rand needs to come back strong on what Rand does best, the Constitution. Announce that he will repeal NDAA and Patriot Act. Pick up Justin Amash for VP and it's a dream ticket, a win win for America. The Millennials will like Amash.
    If one is to stick to principle, Justin is not qualified, he is not a nbc.

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