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Thread: Trump: I want to scrap all H1B visas

  1. #31
    Fwiw, I've heard from very reliable sources that visas for foreign born workers are becoming harder to obtain. Whether that applies to the multi-nationals/Silicon Valley also, as opposed to being only a problem for smallish biz, I don't know. I'd guess the big boys aren't hampered but that's supposition.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book



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  3. #32
    132 users now. What happened ??



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  5. #33
    Indian IT companies must open offices/work in Africa. Export worldwide. Africa is close by and Indian currency is stronger than African currencies.

    Just as Indian IT companies have Indian workers in USA, they will have Indian workers in Africa. Why USA all the time ??

  6. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by homahr View Post
    The company I worked for outsourced all IT operations to India. There were also plenty of Indian-Americans there who lost their jobs to their fellow Indian nationals back in their own country.
    Which is why blocking H1B visas is stupid. IT is the industry that it is the easiest to outsource to another country.

    Quote Originally Posted by Itsback View Post
    Indian IT companies must open offices/work in Africa. Export worldwide. Africa is close by and Indian currency is stronger than African currencies.

    Just as Indian IT companies have Indian workers in USA, they will have Indian workers in Africa. Why USA all the time ??
    Many Indian IT professionals are now going to Canada and Toronto's tech sector is booming.

    See: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...ian-H-1B-Visas

    Banning H1B visas is an monumentally stupid idea.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  7. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Which is why blocking H1B visas is stupid. IT is the industry that it is the easiest to outsource to another country.



    Many Indian IT professionals are now going to Canada and Toronto's tech sector is booming.

    See: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...ian-H-1B-Visas

    Banning H1B visas is an monumentally stupid idea.

  8. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I have helped run the family business.
    Which makes no sense because this is the second time you've insinuated that productions costs are meaningless. The other time was in regards to tariffs.

  9. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    Which makes no sense because this is the second time you've insinuated that productions costs are meaningless. The other time was in regards to tariffs.
    I didn't say they were meaningless, I said that outsourcing and importing slave labor were crutches used to support other problems and that they were bad just like the other problems they were supporting.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  10. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Which is why blocking H1B visas is stupid. IT is the industry that it is the easiest to outsource to another country.
    Do you have a lot of experience managing or being involved in IT projects outsourced to another country? I do, as I get a lot of work from such projects gone bad.

  11. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    Do you have a lot of experience managing or being involved in IT projects outsourced to another country? I do, as I get a lot of work from such projects gone bad.
    That's good. Always happy to see a programmer employed. I have not outsourced or managed an outsourced project. I have known people that do. These were people with no programming experience of their own who would hunt down projects that needed workers and would offshore them. Maybe these are the people keeping you employed. I have worked on the same team as an H1B visa holder and he was just as competent and westernized as anyone else. In computer science graduate school most of my colleagues were from China, Japan, India and Pakistan. (There may have been some other Asian countries in the mix but forgive me for not being able to distinguish all the ethnicities.) The real problem is our own broken education system. But that's a whole different thread.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  12. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Many Indian IT professionals are now going to Canada and Toronto's tech sector is booming. Banning H1B visas is an monumentally stupid idea.
    When 75% of employees in Indian IT companies are from India they can set up their offices in Africa also. Africans are good at English and I spoke to a computer programmer in Africa. Why USA all the time ??



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  14. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    That's good. Always happy to see a programmer employed. I have not outsourced or managed an outsourced project. I have known people that do. These were people with no programming experience of their own who would hunt down projects that needed workers and would offshore them. Maybe these are the people keeping you employed.
    It just bugs me when people claim that something is "easy" when they have no real experience. If outsourcing the work to another country was "easy" or successful, then we wouldn't really need many of those of those H1-Bs anyways -- why not pay them the much lower rate to stay in their home country? I know when I outsource work (to americans) I generally target people in states with a lower cost of living; as you get more for your money.

  15. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    It just bugs me when people claim that something is "easy" when they have no real experience. If outsourcing the work to another country was "easy" or successful, then we wouldn't really need many of those of those H1-Bs anyways -- why not pay them the much lower rate to stay in their home country? I know when I outsource work (to americans) I generally target people in states with a lower cost of living; as you get more for your money.
    It needs some $1 million for business migration to United States of America [start some business in USA] and the validity for single visa is 5 to 7 years only. But job takers reach USA easily. It is not easy to earn $1 million by age 30.

  16. #43
    Anti-immigration types: We need a merit-based immigration policy


    Also anti-immigration types: Let's get rid of our merit-based work visa
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Pinochet is the model
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Liberty preserving authoritarianism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Enforced internal open borders was one of the worst elements of the Constitution.

  17. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Anti-immigration types: We need a merit-based immigration policy


    Also anti-immigration types: Let's get rid of our merit-based work visa
    Define merit.

  18. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Anti-immigration types: We need a merit-based immigration policy


    Also anti-immigration types: Let's get rid of our merit-based work visa
    H1B visas are not designed well, they help employers abuse the recipients.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  19. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Itsback View Post
    When 75% of employees in Indian IT companies are from India they can set up their offices in Africa also. Africans are good at English and I spoke to a computer programmer in Africa. Why USA all the time ??
    Ummm...it's not USA all the time. Did you not see where I mentioned Canada?
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  20. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    It just bugs me when people claim that something is "easy" when they have no real experience. If outsourcing the work to another country was "easy" or successful, then we wouldn't really need many of those of those H1-Bs anyways -- why not pay them the much lower rate to stay in their home country? I know when I outsource work (to americans) I generally target people in states with a lower cost of living; as you get more for your money.
    Okay. Let me put it another way. It's much easier to outsource IT then it is to move a factory. And some jobs can't be outsourced at all. (Trauma nurse for instance. Even with telemedicine, at some point somebody has to stick the IV in.) I may not have direct experience with someone doing the managing but I've seen it done successfully by people not nearly as smart as you or me. And as to your question on "would we need many of those H1-Bs", it's a cost / benefit curve. How many extra workers do you need for a particular task and how much of a problem is the time zone / language barrier? If adding a few worker who got their PhD in computer linguistics as a foreign student helps your smart phone design team then hire them. If you can't hire them because they can't get an H1-B then at some point it makes sense to outsource.
    Last edited by jmdrake; 10-16-2018 at 10:08 PM.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  21. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Okay. Let me put it another way. It's much easier to outsource IT then it is to move a factory. And some jobs can't be outsourced at all. (Trauma nurse for instance. Even with telemedicine, at some point somebody has to stick the IV in.) I may not have direct experience with someone doing the managing but I've seen it done successfully by people not nearly as smart as you or me. And as to your question on "would we need many of those H1-Bs", it's a cost / benefit curve. How many extra workers do you need for a particular task and how much of a problem is the time zone / language barrier? If adding a few worker who got their PhD in computer linguistics as a foreign student helps your smart phone design team then hire them. If you can't hire them because they can't get an H1-B then at some point it makes sense to outsource.
    Outsourcing IT is going to be the ultimate death of brands that don't manage their customers data securely. Ashley Madison was destroyed this way. It's basically gambling and competitors have every incentive to use dark money to exploit your vulnerability.



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  23. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Outsourcing IT is going to be the ultimate death of brands that don't manage their customers data securely. Ashley Madison was destroyed this way. It's basically gambling and competitors have every incentive to use dark money to exploit your vulnerability.
    Ashley Madison's business model makes no sense outsourcing or no outsourcing. Anybody can be hacked. You had people using government email addresses to sign up for a website based on adultery. Not a hookup website (there are plenty of them) where you might fight single people, swingers and cheaters, but a 100% "this is for having an affair" website. Not that I have never done something stupid in my life. Just not that particular brand of stupid. And yet.....Ashley Madison is still in business. Sucker born every minute I suppose.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  24. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Ashley Madison's business model makes no sense outsourcing or no outsourcing. Anybody can be hacked. You had people using government email addresses to sign up for a website based on adultery. Not a hookup website (there are plenty of them) where you might fight single people, swingers and cheaters, but a 100% "this is for having an affair" website. Not that I have never done something stupid in my life. Just not that particular brand of stupid. And yet.....Ashley Madison is still in business. Sucker born every minute I suppose.
    Their CEO had to resign, they changed their logo, motto. I guess that's not a big deal to just completely redo your brand, change your logo get a new CEO and have everyone lose confidence in your companies client confidentiality because you maintain your IT infrastructure at the lowest possible cost. I wonder if people considered their competition because of this?

  25. #51
    I'd rather take my chances with outsourcing of IT than bringing foreign workers here.

  26. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Itsback View Post
    Donald Trump had said many things in 2016.
    Have to agree, he says many things... but only does what is approved by his largest donors/PSMs.

    One of the many examples:


    Said this:






    Did the opposite:

    Book Claim: McMaster, ‘Jarvanka,’ Dina Powell Backed Sending Up to 7K Troops to Afghanistan

    Justin Sullivan/Getty Images 5 Jan 2018732
    The establishment wing in the White House pushed for a “middle option” plan in Afghanistan that would send as many as 7,000 U.S. troops to the war zone, according to Fire and Fury, a controversial new book by Michael Wolff.


    https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2018/01/05/mcmaster-jarvanka-dina-powell-backed-sending-up-to-7k-troops-to-afghanistan/




    On 2nd Amendment, he said this:

    Before the Election















    After the Election






    Click here to view the original image of 979x620px.





    From:
    Federal court rules state firearm laws invalid


  27. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by enhanced_deficit View Post
    Have to agree, he says many things... but only does what is approved by his largest donors/PSMs.
    American workers are the voters in elections. That is BIGGER donors.

  28. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Their CEO had to resign, they changed their logo, motto. I guess that's not a big deal to just completely redo your brand, change your logo get a new CEO and have everyone lose confidence in your companies client confidentiality because you maintain your IT infrastructure at the lowest possible cost. I wonder if people considered their competition because of this?
    Do you honestly think that someone who signs up for Ashley Madison doesn't know what they are all about just because there is a new CEO, logo and motto? The name Ashley Madison is synonymous with "hook up site that specializes in married people who want to have affairs." I assume that all websites can be hacked. I assume they are also crooked enough to sell my information to the highest bidder. I also assume that they are in bed (pardon the pun) with the NSA and will give them full access any time it is asked. One of the things that Edward Snowden revealed is that the NSA found an exploit to crack SSL but didn't inform anybody because they wanted to be able to use it at will, but the exploit leaked out and black hat and white hat hackers were using it. The idea that your information on a site like Ashley Madison might be secure if they just didn't outsource to foreign nationals and/or bring those nationals here is extremely naive.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  29. #55
    MAGA = Make America Great Again

  30. #56
    Anyone remember a few years back when we had several US companies that were forcing their employees to train H1B Visa REPLACEMENTS or risk losing all their benefits? American companies that did NOT want American Employees?
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.



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  32. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by DamianTV View Post
    Anyone remember a few years back when we had several US companies that were forcing their employees to train H1B Visa REPLACEMENTS or risk losing all their benefits? American companies that did NOT want American Employees?
    It is surprising there is unemployment in USA when its population is 320,000,000 people and U.S military is fighting wars all over the world. 3000 people killed in 9/11 attacks. 2000 to 4000 U.S soldiers killed in Afghanistan since 2001.
    Last edited by Itsback; 10-17-2018 at 10:10 PM.

  33. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by DamianTV View Post
    Anyone remember a few years back when we had several US companies that were forcing their employees to train H1B Visa REPLACEMENTS or risk losing all their benefits? American companies that did NOT want American Employees?
    It's still happening. Verizon is doing it en masse right now.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book

  34. #59
    Another US H1B visa shock for Indian workers coming! Trump admin to effect major changes

    It will "propose to revise the definition of specialty occupation" to increase focus on obtaining the best and the brightest foreign nationals via the H-1B programme.

    US H1B visa: The Trump administration has said it is coming out with new proposals to not only revise the definition of specialty occupations under H-1B visas, but also the definition of employment under this foreign work visa category which is popular among Indian companies.

    https://www.zeebiz.com/india

  35. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Itsback View Post
    It is surprising there is unemployment in USA when its population is 320,000,000 people and U.S military is fighting wars all over the world. 3000 people killed in 9/11 attacks. 2000 to 4000 U.S soldiers killed in Afghanistan since 2001.
    Dont be surprised. People are unemployed because the jobs that were created since 2008 treat people as Disposable Humans. Far too many very low paying jobs and temp work. The REAL Unemployment rate is still in the 20% range, despite the utter horse$#@! that comes out of Zippy's fingers. He will probably post if he reads this and immediately point directly to the Bureau of Lies. The only reason the Unemployment Rate has gone down is Smoke and Mirrors. Obama changed the law so the legal definition of long term unemployed went from 2 years to 1 year. It doesnt mean those people found jobs.
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.

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