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Thread: Senate Democrats Investigate a New Allegation of Sexual Misconduct, from Brett Kavanaugh’s Col

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    Senate Democrats Investigate a New Allegation of Sexual Misconduct, from Brett Kavanaugh’s Col

    https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-...eborah-ramirez

    Senate Democrats Investigate a New Allegation of Sexual Misconduct, from Brett Kavanaugh’s College Years

    As Senate Republicans press for a swift vote to confirm Brett Kavanaugh, President Trump’s nominee to the Supreme Court, Senate Democrats are investigating a new allegation of sexual misconduct against Kavanaugh. The claim dates to the 1983-84 academic school year, when Kavanaugh was a freshman at Yale University. The offices of at least four Democratic senators have received information about the allegation, and at least two have begun investigating it. Senior Republican staffers also learned of the allegation last week and, in conversations with The New Yorker, expressed concern about its potential impact on Kavanaugh’s nomination. Soon after, Senate Republicans issued renewed calls to accelerate the timing of a committee vote. The Democratic Senate offices reviewing the allegations believe that they merit further investigation. “This is another serious, credible, and disturbing allegation against Brett Kavanaugh. It should be fully investigated,” Senator Mazie Hirono, of Hawaii, said. An aide in one of the other Senate offices added, “These allegations seem credible, and we’re taking them very seriously. If established, they’re clearly disqualifying.”

    The woman at the center of the story, Deborah Ramirez, who is fifty-three, attended Yale with Kavanaugh, where she studied sociology and psychology. Later, she spent years working for an organization that supports victims of domestic violence. The New Yorker contacted Ramirez after learning of her possible involvement in an incident involving Kavanaugh. The allegation was conveyed to Democratic senators by a civil-rights lawyer. For Ramirez, the sudden attention has been unwelcome, and prompted difficult choices. She was at first hesitant to speak publicly, partly because her memories contained gaps because she had been drinking at the time of the alleged incident. In her initial conversations with The New Yorker, she was reluctant to characterize Kavanaugh’s role in the alleged incident with certainty. After six days of carefully assessing her memories and consulting with her attorney, Ramirez said that she felt confident enough of her recollections to say that she remembers Kavanaugh had exposed himself at a drunken dormitory party, thrust his penis in her face, and caused her to touch it without her consent as she pushed him away. Ramirez is now calling for the F.B.I. to investigate Kavanaugh’s role in the incident. “I would think an F.B.I. investigation would be warranted,” she said.

    In a statement, Kavanaugh wrote, “This alleged event from 35 years ago did not happen. The people who knew me then know that this did not happen, and have said so. This is a smear, plain and simple. I look forward to testifying on Thursday about the truth, and defending my good name--and the reputation for character and integrity I have spent a lifetime building--against these last-minute allegations.”

    The White House spokesperson Kerri Kupec said the Administration stood by Kavanaugh. “This 35-year-old, uncorroborated claim is the latest in a coordinated smear campaign by the Democrats designed to tear down a good man. This claim is denied by all who were said to be present and is wholly inconsistent with what many women and men who knew Judge Kavanaugh at the time in college say. The White House stands firmly behind Judge Kavanaugh.”

    Ramirez said that, when both she and Kavanaugh were freshmen at Yale, she was invited by a friend on the women’s soccer team to a dorm-room party. She recalled that the party took place in a suite at Lawrance Hall, in the part of Yale known as Old Campus, and that a small group of students decided to play a drinking game together. “We were sitting in a circle,” she said. “People would pick who drank.” Ramirez was chosen repeatedly, she said, and quickly became inebriated. At one point, she said, a male student pointed a gag plastic penis in her direction. Later, she said, she was on the floor, foggy and slurring her words as that male student and another stood nearby. (Ramirez identified the two male onlookers, but, at her request, The New Yorker is not naming them.)

    A third male student then exposed himself to her. “I remember a penis being in front of my face,” she said. “I knew that's not what I wanted, even in that state of mind.” She recalled remarking, “That’s not a real penis,” and the other students laughing at her confusion and taunting her, one encouraging her to “kiss it.” She said that she pushed the person away, touching it in the process. Ramirez, who was raised a devout Catholic in Connecticut, said that she was shaken. “I wasn’t going to touch a penis until I was married,” she said. “I was embarrassed and ashamed and humiliated.” She remembers Kavanaugh standing to her right and laughing, pulling up his pants. “Brett was laughing,” she said. “I can still see his face, and his hips coming forward, like when you pull up your pants.” She recalled another male student shouting about the incident. “Somebody yelled down the hall, ‘Brett Kavanaugh just put his penis in Debbie’s face,’ ” she said. “It was his full name. I don’t think it was just ‘Brett.’ And I remember hearing and being mortified that this was out there.”

    Ramirez acknowledged that there are significant gaps in her memories of the evening, and that, if she ever presents her story to the F.B.I. or members of the Senate, she will inevitably be pressed on her motivation for coming forward after so many years, and questioned about her memory, given her drinking at the party.

    And yet, after several days of considering the matter carefully, she said, “I’m confident about the pants coming up, and I’m confident about Brett being there.” Ramirez said that what has stayed with her most forcefully is the memory of laughter at her expense from Kavanaugh and the other students. “It was kind of a joke,” she recalled. “And now it’s clear to me it wasn’t a joke.”

    By his freshman year, Kavanaugh was eighteen, and legally an adult. During his confirmation hearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee, Kavanaugh swore under oath that as a legal adult he had never “committed any verbal or physical harassment or assault of a sexual nature.”

    The New Yorker has not confirmed with other eyewitnesses that Kavanaugh was present at the party. The magazine contacted several dozen classmates of Ramirez and Kavanaugh regarding the incident. Many did not respond to interview requests; others declined to comment, or said they did not attend or remember the party. A classmate of Ramirez’s, who declined to be identified because of the partisan battle over Kavanaugh’s nomination, said that another student told him about the incident either on the night of the party or in the next day or two. The classmate said that he is “one hundred per cent sure” that he was told at the time that Kavanaugh was the student who exposed himself to Ramirez. He independently recalled many of the same details offered by Ramirez, including that a male student had encouraged Kavanaugh as he exposed himself. The classmate, like Ramirez, recalled that the party took place in a common room on the first floor in Entryway B of Lawrance Hall, during their freshman year. “I’ve known this all along,” he said. “It’s been on my mind all these years when his name came up. It was a big deal.” The story stayed with him, he said, because it was disturbing and seemed outside the bounds of typically acceptable behavior, even during heavy drinking at parties on campus. The classmate said that he had been shocked, but not necessarily surprised, because the social group to which Kavanaugh belonged often drank to excess. He recalled Kavanaugh as “relatively shy” until he drank, at which point he said that Kavanaugh could become “aggressive and even belligerent.”

    Another classmate, Richard Oh, an emergency-room doctor in California, recalled overhearing, soon after the party, a female student tearfully recounting to another student an incident at a party involving a gag with a fake penis, followed by a male student exposing himself. Oh is not certain of the identity of the female student. Ramirez told her mother and sister about an upsetting incident at the time, but did not describe the details to either due to her embarrassment.

    Mark Krasberg, an assistant professor of neurosurgery at the University of New Mexico who was also a member of Kavanaugh and Ramirez’s class at Yale, said Kavanaugh’s college behavior had become a topic of discussion among former Yale students soon after Kavanaugh’s nomination. In one e-mail that Krasberg received in September, the classmate who recalled hearing about the incident with Ramirez alluded to it and wrote that it “would qualify as a sexual assault,” he speculated, “if it’s true.”

    One of the male classmates who Ramirez said egged on Kavanaugh denied any memory of the party. “I don’t think Brett would flash himself to Debbie, or anyone, for that matter,” he said. Asked why he thought Ramirez was making the allegation, he responded, “I have no idea.” The other male classmate Ramirez said was involved in the incident commented, “I have zero recollection.”

    In a statement, two of those male classmates who Ramirez alleged were involved the incident, the wife of a third male student she said was involved, and three other classmates, Dino Ewing, Louisa Garry, and Dan Murphy, disputed Ramirez’s account of events: “We were the people closest to Brett Kavanaugh during his first year at Yale. He was a roommate to some of us, and we spent a great deal of time with him, including in the dorm where this incident allegedly took place. Some of us were also friends with Debbie Ramirez during and after her time at Yale. We can say with confidence that if the incident Debbie alleges ever occurred, we would have seen or heard about it—and we did not. The behavior she describes would be completely out of character for Brett. In addition, some of us knew Debbie long after Yale, and she never described this incident until Brett’s Supreme Court nomination was pending. Editors from the New Yorker contacted some of us because we are the people who would know the truth, and we told them that we never saw or heard about this.”

    The former friend who was married to the male classmate alleged to be involved, and who signed the statement said of Ramirez, “This is a woman I was best friends with. We shared intimate details of our lives. And I was never told this story by her, or by anyone else. It never came up. I didn’t see it; I never heard of it happening.” She said she hadn’t spoken with Ramirez for about ten years, but that the two women had been close all through college, and Kavanaugh had remained part of what she called their “larger social circle.” In an initial conversation with The New Yorker, she suggested that Ramirez may have been politically motivated. Later, she said that she did not know if this was the case.

    Ramirez is a registered Democrat, but said that her decision to speak out was not politically motivated and, regarding her views, that she “works toward human rights, social justice, and social change.” Ramirez said that she felt “disappointed and betrayed” by the statements from classmates questioning her allegation, “because I clearly remember people in the room whose names are on this letter.”

    Several other classmates said that they believed Ramirez to be credible and honest, and vouched for her integrity. James Roche was roommates with Kavanaugh at the time of the alleged incident and is now the C.E.O. of a software company in San Francisco. “Debbie and I became close friends shortly after we both arrived at Yale,” he said. “She stood out as being exceptionally honest and gentle. I cannot imagine her making this up.” He said that he never witnessed Kavanaugh engage in any sexual misconduct, but did recall him being “frequently, incoherently drunk.” He described Ramirez as a vulnerable outsider. “Is it believable that she was alone with a wolfy group of guys who thought it was funny to sexually torment a girl like Debbie? Yeah, definitely. Is it believable that Kavanaugh was one of them? Yes.” Another acquaintance from college, Jennifer Klaus, similarly said that she considered the allegation plausible, adding, “Debbie’s always been a very truthful, kind—almost to the point of being selfless—individual.” A third classmate, who Ramirez thought had attended the party, said that she was not present at the incident. The former student, who asked not to be named, said that she also found Ramirez credible.

    Former students described an atmosphere at Yale at the time in which alcohol-fuelled parties often led to behavior similar to that described by Ramirez. “I believe it could have happened,” another classmate who knew both Kavanaugh and Ramirez said. Though she was not aware of Kavanaugh being involved in any specific misconduct, she recalled that heavy drinking was routine and that Ramirez was sometimes victimized and taunted by male students in his social circle. “They were always, like, ‘Debbie’s here!,’ and then they’d get into their ‘Lord of the Flies’ thing,” she said. While at Yale, Kavanaugh became a member of the Delta Kappa Epsilon fraternity, or “Deke,” which several students said was known for its wild and, in the view of some critics, misogynistic parties. Kavanaugh was also a member of an all-male secret society, Truth and Courage, which was popularly known by the nickname “Tit and Clit.”
    Long article- more at the link.
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 09-23-2018 at 06:17 PM.



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  3. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

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    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  4. #3
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  6. #5
    So Clinton should not have been impeached for lying about a tryst?

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    So Clinton should not have been impeached for lying about a tryst?
    No. He shouldn't have.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    So Clinton should not have been impeached for lying about a tryst?
    No, there were much better reasons to impeach him.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    So Clinton should not have been impeached for lying about a tryst?
    Has Trump lied under Oath, as a Lawyer to boot?
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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Danke View Post
    Has Trump lied under Oath, as a Lawyer to boot?
    That is why his lawyers don't want him to testify under oath in the Mueller investigation. He has troubles with the truth and sticking to one story. He has said he wants do to it.


    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...sk/1037010002/

    'Truth isn't truth': Trump lawyer Rudy Giuliani worries Mueller interview could lead to perjury charge

    WASHINGTON – Donald Trump's lawyer Rudy Giuliani on Sunday said he won't let special counsel Robert Mueller rush him into an interview with the president, arguing investigators could trap Trump into lying based on their interpretation of the facts.

    "I'm not going to be rushed into having him testify so that he gets trapped into perjury," Giuliani said during an appearance on NBC's "Meet the Press."

    "When you tell me, you know, that he should testify because he's going to tell the truth, and he shouldn't worry, well that's so silly because it's somebody's version of the truth, not the truth," Giuliani said.

    Giuliani, a former New York City mayor who has become the leading voice on Trump's defense team, then entered into an unusual back-and-forth with "Meet the Press" host Chuck Todd about the definition of truth.

    "Truth is truth," Todd replied.

    "No, it isn't truth," Giuliani said. "Truth isn't truth."


    "Truth isn't truth?" Todd said at one point in the exchange. "Mr. Mayor, do you realize ... this is going to become a bad meme."

    As an example, Giuliani said the president and former FBI director James Comey have sharply conflicting accounts about fired White House National Security Adviser Mike Flynn.

    Giuliani has said the president never had a conversation with Comey about ending the FBI's investigation into Flynn. That contradicts a memo Comey wrote at the time, in which he said Trump asked him to let go of the Flynn matter.

    "Donald Trump says, 'I didn’t talk about Flynn with Comey,'" Giuliani said Sunday. "Comey says, 'You did talk about it,' so tell me what the truth is."

    Comey took to Twitter a few hours later with his response. "Truth exists and truth matters," he tweeted. "Truth has always been the touchstone of our country’s justice system and political life. People who lie are held accountable."
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 09-23-2018 at 07:06 PM.

  12. #10
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    Jones was right on top of this.

  13. #11
    Another drunk bimbo that can't remember exactly what happened but seems to recall something happened. And another case were others say "nope. Don't recall that."

    Kavanaugh should really quit the judicial and become a psychiatrist. He's got a knack for bringing out 35 yr. old suppressed memories.
    Last edited by phill4paul; 09-23-2018 at 07:37 PM.

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    It's Roy Moore all over again. Send as many feminazis into the wire as you can. Sure, some won't make it through but...

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    So Clinton should not have been impeached for lying about a tryst?
    No.

    He should have been impeached for authorizing the sale of missile guidance technology to the Red Chinese, which then almost immediately made it to North Korea.

    But even before that, he should have gone to jail for the murder of the Branch Davidians, carried out on his orders.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    No.

    He should have been impeached for authorizing the sale of missile guidance technology to the Red Chinese, which then almost immediately made it to North Korea.

    But even before that, he should have gone to jail for the murder of the Branch Davidians, carried out on his orders.
    You must spread some reputation around....
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    Another drunk bimbo that can't remember exactly what happened but seems to recall something happened. And another case were others say "nope. Don't recall that."

    Kavanaugh should really quit the judicial and become a psychiatrist. He's got a knack for bringing out 35 yr. old suppressed memories.
    There will twenty more by Thursday...

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    There will twenty more by Thursday...
    It's time for Grassley to say we are going to confirm him now and we can always impeach him if any of this turns out to be true.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  20. #17
    Brett Kavanaugh also molested me. Retaining the services of a long nose lawyer tomorrow and will be coming out to the media on Tuesday. You people do not know how this has affected my life

    This drama is getting ridiculous.

  21. #18
    The funny thing about the metoo movement is that after it's done, women will have even less credibility.

  22. #19
    Brett Kavanaugh rubbed his bare ass in my face at a @Danke house party in 1984.

    He violated my human dignity Mr. Wally. He treated me like a dog Mr. Wally.

  23. #20
    I got groped by the TSA. I think the FBI should investigate.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by aGameOfThrones View Post
    I got groped by the TSA. I think the FBI should investigate.
    No $#@!.

    I got a crotch fondling a few weeks ago, that had it lasted another 30 seconds, I'd have had to put a ring on that $#@!ing guy.

  25. #22
    This will only delay things- he will still get approved. I said before that the first case was totally irrelevant to his character since it was high school- whether or not it really happened. Kids do stupid things then.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Brett Kavanaugh rubbed his bare ass in my face at a @Danke house party in 1984.

    He violated my human dignity Mr. Wally. He treated me like a dog Mr. Wally.
    Well, you shouldn't have asked for it even though it was some initiation rite for a sailor to check off that box.

    Should have just hung out with us fighter pilots, we just have to eat discussion animals during initiation, like cold goat pancreas soup, before hatched birds, etc.
    Last edited by Danke; 09-24-2018 at 03:40 PM.
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  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Danke View Post
    Well, you shouldn't have asked for it even though it was some initiation rite for a sailor to check off that box.

    Should have just hanged out with us fighter pilots, we just have to eat discussion animals during initiation, like cold goat pancreas soup, before hatched birds, etc.
    It was your Chair Force graduation party...you should have kept him under control.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    It was your Chair Force graduation party...you should have kept him under control.
    I don't remember seeing you there, but I avoid men in drag.
    Pfizer Macht Frei!

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    Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!

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    The Income Tax Is An Excise, And Excise Taxes Are Privilege Taxes

    The Federalist Papers, No. 15:

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  30. #26
    There may also be a third accuser... Stormy's lawyer
    has a new client, and he seyz she is not Ms. Ramirez....

  31. #27
    She was at first hesitant to speak publicly, partly because her memories contained gaps because she had been drinking at the time of the alleged incident. In her initial conversations with The New Yorker, she was reluctant to characterize Kavanaugh’s role in the alleged incident with certainty. After six days of carefully assessing her memories and consulting with her attorney, Ramirez said that she felt confident enough of her recollections
    Seems legit.
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  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It's time for Grassley to say we are going to confirm him now and we can always impeach him if any of this turns out to be true.
    It is time for Grassley's accusers to step forward.

  33. #29
    If I had a penny for every time someone had a dildo pointed at their face and laughed at.
    THE SQUAD of RPF
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    @Ehanced_Deficit's real agenda on RPF =troll:

    Who spends this much time copy/pasting the same recycled links, photos/talking points.

    7 yrs/25k posts later RPF'ers still respond to this troll

  34. #30
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    The ferocity directed at this establishment judge candidate is rather shocking.

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