Ron Paul R3volution falls victim to Trump and frustration
Sadly, an accurate write-up....
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news...tration-donal/
__________________________________________________ ________________
"A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst
Victim? So far it's the best thing that has happened.. that may be a a little unfortunate, but it's not negative...
This $#@! isn't going to turn around over night.
Last edited by dannno; 08-16-2018 at 12:53 PM.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
“Maybe Donald Trump is the guy who can break up the deep state so someone like Ron or Rand can get in and legislate to make the changes we want.“After all,” he said, “to make changes you have to cut the dragon’s head off.”
Ya
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
Every single one of the complainers' quotes are basically complete bull$#@! - every one, without exception. And that is typical of Paulers who haven't hopped on board the Trump train, they are reacting illogically, emotionally, and are more butthurt than rational.
A lot of sour grapes from a lot of people who really should know better.
Ya, Trump isn't anywhere close to a perfect libertarian, but when you start talking about partisanship and saying things like Trump is no better than Obama, that is just ignorant..Originally Posted by thoughtomator
The whole issue with partisanship was that Bush and Gore, Bush and Kerry, Dole and Clinton, Obama and McCain, Romney - these people are all evil - they are all deep staters. It was no better to support one over the other. Trump is not in the same category as these people. He may be on some issues, and may not be as passionate about some issues as we are, but he is not working for the deep state. He even has some deep state folks in his cabinet, but that is to further his goals - he does not have the same goals as the deep state, in fact they are quite opposed to each other.
Ron Paul even brought some Green Party folks in to semi-endorse in one election. They are socialists.. But they aren't part of the deep state. I think some people just don't "get it". Or they think Trump is a deep state guy cause he is really rich or something.
Last edited by dannno; 08-16-2018 at 01:11 PM.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
Also when they talk about Trump's tariff policy as if some free market existed that the tariffs were disrupting, that tells me that these people either have financial vested interests they are not disclosing, or are amazingly ill-informed about the reality of just how bad US international trade arrangements have been.
None of these are serious people, and that renders the article itself non-serious. The article also makes an additional claim, without quote or attribution, that some are upset about Trump lying - which to me is a red flag that the author is a Communist, as that is one of their signature lines.
Glass is half empty and beltway libertarian lamentations.
"Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
"Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
"Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
"Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
Proponent of real science.
The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.
Sorry, guys - this article is right. Look around in here. Just because you have been conned into the Trump bandwagon doesn't mean "most" of us have.
Most of us have abandoned this place and returned to apathy. That's the fact.
Hell, I almost would have preferred a Hillary win at this point. At least then, we'd be united in opposition to the growing State. But alas, many of you are now cheering for it. If you can't see what Trump has done to the Ron Paul R3VOLution, then you are indeed blind.
Admittedly, Trump has done some good things, but the damage done to the principles of true liberty will probably never be repaired in my lifetime.“Ron Paul, if he taught us one thing, it was right from wrong and not partisanship,” said Jane Aitken, co-founder the New Hampshire Tea Party Coalition and taxpayer advocate. “I am finding that people have forgotten that they are all of a sudden very partisan.”
“We saw it with the Obamabots; we are seeing it with Trump now,” she said. “People put all their eggs in one basket with one person. It goes against common sense.”
She has become jaded when it comes to national politics and has decided she can do more at the state and local levels.
"And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat
"It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire
They haven't hopped on the Trump bandwagon for the same reason Ron Paul hasn't, I'll wait until his second term (which I believe he'll get), before I make any solid judgements. But so far he's way too much of a copsucker, way too much of a cheerleader for the police state/surveillance state/ military industrial complex to give him much support in my opinion. Put those aside and he has a couple redeeming qualities, but I can't/won't put them aside.
"The Patriarch"
Even if you were right that would just mean that most libertarians don't know how to win, they would rather complain about not getting perfection than appreciate the progress that is being made and they would rather go to hell in a handbasket than make incremental improvements.
We have no chance at this point to see our entire agenda enacted all at once but we can move the mainstream our direction so that one day we might be able to.
Fortunately I don't believe you that the losertarians are the majority of the movement, I think that you are just the loudest fraction.
Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Robert Heinlein
Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler
Groucho Marx
I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.
Linus, from the Peanuts comic
You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith
Alexis de Torqueville
Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it
A Zero Hedge comment
More ditched this place when a certain someone was allowed to run a Stalinist purge of anyone who had anything neutral or better to say about Trump.
Trump, meanwhile, has turned out to be the most libertarian President in living memory, taking cue after cue after cue from Rand Paul, and future prospects for enactment of libertarian policy are as bright as they have been in ages. Which leaves alleged libertarians who grasp for weak excuses to be anti-Trump with an unbridgable credibility chasm.
Losertarians? $#@!ing really? Are you Micheal Medved? Curious minds want to know, because that would explain a lot.
"The Patriarch"
I stand with Rand, I will support Trump in everything he does right and against his enemies that are worse than him until I have a better option to replace him with.
Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Robert Heinlein
Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler
Groucho Marx
I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.
Linus, from the Peanuts comic
You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith
Alexis de Torqueville
Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it
A Zero Hedge comment
Concern trolling.
"The Patriarch"
If you read carefully Uncle Joe you will see that that is my name for a sub-faction of libertarians that would rather lose than accept imperfect results, they are very good at losing but they haven't the faintest idea how to win.
Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Robert Heinlein
Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler
Groucho Marx
I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.
Linus, from the Peanuts comic
You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith
Alexis de Torqueville
Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it
A Zero Hedge comment
Uh huh, I guess we'll see how much 'winning' we've done by the end of his second term. From a libertarian perspective.
"The Patriarch"
This is my biggest problem with Trump.
On many other fronts, he is moving the ball forward in positive ways.
Overall, after two years now of watching this, we are in better shape than if Hillary had been appointed, and that's a plain fact.
Ya, there's no denying that. 8 years of that evil crone after 8 of Obama may have been more than the planet could handle, much less me.
"The Patriarch"
Ron Paul has not jumped on the Trump train, and he has not come down with Trump Derangment Syndrome. He is just doing his usual reasoned analysis, pointing out the good, pointing out the bad, supporting the good, opposing the bad. And yes, the worse thing Trump does is his support of the bloated warfare/surveillance state, even though it is fun to see them go into fits every time he deviates from their propaganda talking points.
For some reason it appears that many don’t pay attention to Ron any more, even on this forum. Maybe because he hasn’t taken sides, and also because some people here only agreed with Ron on certain issues, maybe even just a couple.
He is not running for office now, which is also a huge factor. The article does significantly leave out the Freedom Caucus, which for the most part evolved from the Tea Party movement. There are good members of Congress that came from the Ron Paul moment, such as Thomas Massie, Justin Amash and several others that did not tie themselves to Ron Paul directly.
"Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
"Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
"Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
"Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
Proponent of real science.
The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.
Hear hear...granted, before anybody breathes fire down the back of my neck, that's not to excuse any of the chowder headed things Trump has or may do.
Just pointing it, on the overall "freedom front" we have had some gains.
That's really the only place anyone should be. I've made it pretty plain I'm not a supporter but there is no denying he's not 100% bad.
"The Patriarch"
All the liberty movement has to do is get a bunch of alpha males that believe in freedom and liberty and run their campaigns the same way that Trump did. Ron, Rand, Amash, and Massie are all great guys but they're not exactly alpha. If we did that in the past, I guarantee the country would have been taken back decades ago.
Last edited by Anti Globalist; 08-16-2018 at 04:32 PM.
"Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."
Calvin Coolidge
It might be nice if Trump funded a Ron Paul campaign! Or even put Ron Paul in a high position in power.
I think most of us still genuinely believe in liberty, and Trump is more of a distraction from Ron Paul. We all should be able to recognize that it isnt just about Ron Paul, but the fundamental ideas he carries. Trump does not carry those ideas well enough for me. We are still alive, but quite disorganized without a strong figurehead to carry that proverbial torch. With the outright attacks on Free Speech now being authorized, we have a very big problem if we have no place we can organize and discuss problems and solutions.
1776 > 1984
The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.
The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide
Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled
Yep.
Nope.Hell, I almost would have preferred a Hillary win at this point. At least then, we'd be united in opposition to the growing State.
I think Obama took the wind out of our sails long before Trump showed up. We couldn't even unite behind Rand.
The R3volution is doing as good as can be expected. It's had gains. Rand, Massie, Amash, and others in the Freedom Caucus. And of course Ron just hasn't faded away. He's still there dispensing wisdom. I don't necessarily think this war between the parties, exacerbated by Trump, and the status-quo political hacks which inhabit both, is a bad thing. It keeps their eye off off liberty candidates.
That part of the article was accurate.“If we got Ron Paul elected, would he do what Donald Trump did? Maybe not,” Mr. Bunce said. “Maybe Donald Trump is the guy who can break up the deep state so someone like Ron or Rand can get in and legislate to make the changes we want.
“After all,” he said, “to make changes you have to cut the dragon’s head off.”
I don't think it's accurate.
What has yet to happen is organization around principles instead of candidates. The movement has no organizational substance outside of cult of personality allegiance and leftover moneybomb aftershocks.
The whole history is an amazing lesson to me that insight, talent, money, ideas, don't necessarily translate into action.
For all our indignation, as a movement, we're still Neo in Oracle's kitchen munching on a cookie, waiting for an omen.
When a trumpet sounds in a city, do not the people tremble?
When disaster comes to a city, has not the Lord caused it? Amos 3:6
Trump is doing it his way. At least he’s doing it.
#NashvilleStrong
“I’m a doctor. That’s a baby.”~~~Dr. Manny Sethi
How much more out of the blue and unexpected does the Trump phenomenon have to have been in order for people to realize it was precisely the omen "libertarian Neos" were looking for? Suddenly handed the perfect tool to defeat Agent Smith, so many decided to instead worry about the integrity of the Matrix.
Doing what?! Growing government and getting former liberty folks to cheer him on?! Yay.
At least if it was Hillary doing this stuff, people would be up in arms in opposition. Trump grows spending and the response is pathetic.
"And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat
"It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire
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