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Thread: Politico: "Rand Paul has persuaded the president that we are not for regime change in Iran"

  1. #1

    Politico: "Rand Paul has persuaded the president that we are not for regime change in Iran"

    The Rand-Trump alliance bursts into view
    Enemies on the 2016 campaign trail, the Kentucky senator and the iconoclastic president have developed a quiet Washington friendship.

    By ELIANA JOHNSON
    08/08/2018

    He infuriates West Wing aides who have had to scramble to win his support for key votes, but Rand Paul has the ear, and the affection, of the most important person in the White House: President Donald Trump.

    Once bitter rivals on the Republican campaign trail, the Kentucky senator and the commander-in-chief have bonded over a shared delight in thumbing their noses at experts the president likes to deride as “foreign policy eggheads,” including those who work in his own administration.

    When Trump dismissed national security adviser H.R. McMaster in March, replacing him with John Bolton, he told McMaster, “Look, he’s a hawk, you’re hawk, I can handle you guys,” according to a White House aide. While Trump tolerates his hawkish advisers, the aide added, he shares a real bond with Paul: “He actually at gut level has the same instincts as Rand Paul.”

    Paul has quietly emerged as an influential sounding board and useful ally for the president, who frequently clashes with his top advisers on foreign policy. His relationship with Trump, developed via frequent cell phone calls and over rounds of golf at the president’s Virginia country club, became publicly apparent for the first time on Wednesday when the senator announced he had hand-delivered a letter to the Kremlin on Trump’s behalf.

    Both Paul and Trump routinely rail against foreign entanglements, foreign wars, and foreign aid – positions characterized as isolationist by critics and as “America First” by the president and his supporters.

    Even where they disagree, Paul has extracted small victories.

    Trump has drawn praise from the right-wing establishment for hammering the mullahs in Tehran, junking the Iran nuclear deal and responding to the regime’s saber rattling with aggressive rhetoric of his own, warning Iranian president Hassan Rouhani on Twitter last month in all caps that future threats would be met with “CONSEQUENCES THE LIKES OF WHICH FEW THROUGHOUT HISTORY HAVE EVER SUFFERED BEFORE.”

    But Trump has stopped short of calling for regime change even though Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, Secretary of Defense James Mattis, and Bolton support it, aligning with Paul instead, according to a GOP foreign policy expert in frequent contact with the White House. “Rand Paul has persuaded the president that we are not for regime change in Iran,” this person said, because adopting that position would instigate another war in the Middle East.

    ...
    read more:
    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...a-putin-768472



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    Who do u think has more influence on Trump? Bolton and Netanyaho who he appointed and loves 1000% or Rand Paul who at one time he asked the ppl of Kentucky to primary.

    I will like to see tangible victories like the reinstatement of the nuclear deal and end to sanctions.
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Who do u think has more influence on Trump? Bolton and Netanyaho who he appointed and loves 1000% or Rand Paul who at one time he asked the ppl of Kentucky to primary.

    I will like to see tangible victories like the reinstatement of the nuclear deal and end to sanctions.
    A good question, but I believe Trump's heart to be closer to Rand's worldview.
    “Force the normies into taking sides. At the moment they are just like "meh, I am minding my own business" retreating culturally into their private bubbles and "safe-spaces" since they don't understand what is going on. When the actual "us vs them" starts, they will be forced to fight or they'll die.” - Anonymous Poster

  5. #4
    Rand is making important inroads.

    Don't need a weather man to know which way the wind blows

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    A good question, but I believe Trump's heart to be closer to Rand's worldview.
    When u actually examine his actions, u will see that he is much closer to his neocon buddies than Rand. Look at policies cabinet appointees, judges etc and u will see what I am talking about.

    Actions speak louder than words.
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    When u actually examine his actions, u will see that he is much closer to his neocon buddies than Rand. Look at policies cabinet appointees, judges etc and u will see what I am talking about.

    Actions speak louder than words.
    A never happy commie.

  8. #7
    If Rand Paul runs for and wins a 3rd and then a 4th term as KY's senator,
    eventually he will be KY's SENIOR senator. Seniority = senatorial power

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    W Look at policies cabinet appointees, judges etc and u will see what I am talking about.

    Actions speak louder than words.
    His judges have been great. By all accounts from libertarians, his lower court appointees are about as good as they get. Gorsuch is great. We'll see with Kavanaugh. If you are complaining about his judge picks then you are just a perpetual whiner.



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  11. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Who do u think has more influence on Trump? Bolton and Netanyaho who he appointed and loves 1000% or Rand Paul who at one time he asked the ppl of Kentucky to primary.

    I will like to see tangible victories like the reinstatement of the nuclear deal and end to sanctions.
    I think you are wrong here. Trump doesn't hire people like H.R. McMaster and John Bolton because is loves them or their views. Trump hires all kinds of people with viewpoints that can be valuable. He has always done this. He hires people that have expertise in areas and he listens to their opinions and then makes his own decisions. Sometimes he takes their advice and other times to ignores them, because he trusts his own instincts and judgement over all others.

    Trump has for decades made a point to get so-called "expert opinions" and gather information from all sides. Then he makes his decisions. This is just part of his process that has helped him get to where he is today.

    I am no fan of McMaster or Bolton, but I can see how it would be valuable to get their input and understand where they are coming from. Being ignorant to that point of view does not make one stronger.
    Citizen of Arizona
    @cleaner4d4

    I am a libertarian. I am advocating everyone enjoy maximum freedom on both personal and economic issues as long as they do not bring violence unto others.

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    His judges have been great. By all accounts from libertarians, his lower court appointees are about as good as they get. Gorsuch is great. We'll see with Kavanaugh. If you are complaining about his judge picks then you are just a perpetual whiner.
    Judge Roberts was also fantastic conservative judge too until he sided with Obama care. They haven't been tested and from what I have read about his nominations, I doubt they would be any good.

    Perpetual whiner? More like perpetual pessimist. I see corrupt people every where in Washington and a president who I believe have let the swamp capture him. If the same advisers telling him to nominate ppl like Pompeo and to continue the economic warfare on Russia are the same ppl advising him on the judge candidates? Then I have no faith in those new judges.
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Cleaner44 View Post
    I think you are wrong here. Trump doesn't hire people like H.R. McMaster and John Bolton because is loves them or their views. Trump hires all kinds of people with viewpoints that can be valuable. He has always done this. He hires people that have expertise in areas and he listens to their opinions and then makes his own decisions. Sometimes he takes their advice and other times to ignores them, because he trusts his own instincts and judgement over all others.

    Trump has for decades made a point to get so-called "expert opinions" and gather information from all sides. Then he makes his decisions. This is just part of his process that has helped him get to where he is today.

    I am no fan of McMaster or Bolton, but I can see how it would be valuable to get their input and understand where they are coming from. Being ignorant to that point of view does not make one stronger.
    Lemme guess, u must be one of those people that also believed that GW Bush stacking his administration with 10 out of the 20 signatories to PNAC doc was also him hiring them for their opinion. Sorry not buying it.

    The neocon members of his administration dont just affect him but also cabinet members down the line. They affect people who collect and analyze intelligence report and for example with the case of Skripal make the wrong conclusion about the culprit.

    You are the company u keep and his company is filled with zionists and neocons.
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    You are the company u keep and his company is filled with zionists and neocons.
    And no amount of your whining will change that.

  15. #13
    The MAGA is strong in this thread.
    1. Don't lie.
    2. Don't cheat.
    3. Don't steal.
    4. Don't kill.
    5. Don't commit adultery.
    6. Don't covet what your neighbor has, especially his wife.
    7. Honor your father and mother.
    8. Remember the Sabbath and keep it Holy.
    9. Don’t use your Higher Power's name in vain, or anyone else's.
    10. Do unto others as you would have them do to you.

    "For the love of money is the root of all evil..." -- I Timothy 6:10, KJV

  16. #14
    Rand Paul Against the World
    A new report suggests the Kentucky senator is singlehandedly preventing war with Iran.

    By JACK HUNTER
    August 10, 2018

    Not long ago, Donald Trump’s national security advisor John Bolton was promising regime change in Iran by the end of this year. Uber-hawk Bolton has long wanted war with Tehran. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo isn’t much different, and has even advocated bombing Iran. Secretary of Defense James Mattis has previously recommend U.S. airstrikes against Iranian targets.

    Today, Bolton says the U.S. does not to seek regime change in Iran. So does Pompeo. So does Mattis.

    Why?

    President Trump has been known to be hawkish on Iran. Politico observed Wednesday: “Trump has drawn praise from the right-wing establishment for hammering the mullahs in Tehran, junking the Iran nuclear deal and responding to the regime’s saber rattling with aggressive rhetoric of his own….” There are also powerful factions in Congress and Washington with inroads to the president that have been itching for regime change for years. “The policy of the United States should be regime change in Iran,” says Senator Tom Cotton, once rumored to be Trump’s pick to head the CIA.

    So what, or who, is stopping the hawks?

    ...
    read more:
    https://www.theamericanconservative....nst-the-world/

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by jct74 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by jct74 View Post
    Good job Rand, if true the most significant foreign policy accomplishment by a Paul or the liberty movement.
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It's a balance between appeasing his supporters, appeasing the deep state and reaching his own goals.
    ~Resident Badgiraffe




  18. #16
    Trump/Paul 2020
    +
    'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ



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  20. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Lemme guess, u must be one of those people that also believed that GW Bush stacking his administration with 10 out of the 20 signatories to PNAC doc was also him hiring them for their opinion. Sorry not buying it.

    The neocon members of his administration dont just affect him but also cabinet members down the line. They affect people who collect and analyze intelligence report and for example with the case of Skripal make the wrong conclusion about the culprit.

    You are the company u keep and his company is filled with zionists and neocons.
    You are not a very good guesser it seems. Don't worry about buying anything that I am not selling, that no problem.

    Trump keeps all kinds of company, not just neocons. Trump keeps company with Rand Paul... does that make him a libertarian magically as well?

    Trump has an evangelical Vice President... does that make him a bible thumper too?

    Is Jim Mattis a neocon? Is Ben Carson a neocon?

    What I see is Trump hiring Republicans experienced at high level positions. I don't see him replicating Bush.

    Are you of the opinion that Trump is acting like neocon as President?
    Citizen of Arizona
    @cleaner4d4

    I am a libertarian. I am advocating everyone enjoy maximum freedom on both personal and economic issues as long as they do not bring violence unto others.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Rand Paul who at one time he asked the ppl of Kentucky to primary.
    Bullsh1t. Never happened.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Who do u think has more influence on Trump? Bolton and Netanyaho who he appointed and loves 1000% or Rand Paul who at one time he asked the ppl of Kentucky to primary.

    I will like to see tangible victories like the reinstatement of the nuclear deal and end to sanctions.
    Being able to buy insurance across state lines, in large associations and repealing the Obamacare mandate isn't tangible enough that Rand does in fact influence Trump on a policy level?

    I don't expect a win on every single libertarian issue, let's be realistic. Headlines like these would've been coveted at the height of this movement, suddenly, its just not enough and more tangible victories are needed.

    Lol, purist libertarianism is insufferable. We're lucky to have someone both idealistic and realistic like Rand.
    Last edited by eleganz; 08-10-2018 at 09:53 PM.
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  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Cleaner44 View Post
    I think you are wrong here. Trump doesn't hire people like H.R. McMaster and John Bolton because is loves them or their views. Trump hires all kinds of people with viewpoints that can be valuable. He has always done this. He hires people that have expertise in areas and he listens to their opinions and then makes his own decisions. Sometimes he takes their advice and other times to ignores them, because he trusts his own instincts and judgement over all others.
    I think you are being far too generous with this assessment. Trump hires people like McMaster and Bolton because the last time he hired a guy with views Trump actually supports the Deep State instigated an illegal spying operation against him and eventually had him removed from office. Just giving the Deep State their appointments is the path of least resistance. Trump can always ignore their advice.

    Trump clearly likes Rand. Whenever other Senators hold out or oppose him on something Trump goes in to attack mode but when Rand does it Trump lets it slide. They hang out all the time and Trump trusting Rand to deliver a letter to Putin is a huge sign of trust and respect.

    The other day Trump Tweeted that he is ready and willing to talk to the Mullahs whenever they want (about new nuclear deal). This is very much NOT something the Neocons would be pleased with. Their position is that Iran must be defeated (not just the government, but the county itself under any government) and that any talk or deals are futile.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by eleganz View Post
    Being able to buy insurance across state lines, in large associations and repealing the Obamacare mandate isn't tangible enough that Rand does in fact influence Trump on a policy level?

    I don't expect a win on every single libertarian issue, let's be realistic. Headlines like these would've been coveted at the height of this movement, suddenly, its just not enough and more tangible victories are needed.

    Lol, purist libertarianism is insufferable. We're lucky to have someone both idealistic and realistic like Rand.
    WTF man? the cool kids around here think I am a communist and you dare call me a libertarian and a purist at that.

    But no, my post was talking about foreign policy not domestic ones. But why am I not excited about those healthcare victories? for one, I think they are very small and/or bordering on insignificant ones. Obamacare was not repealed, the insurance companies are still forced to abide by many of the rules of Obamacare without benefiting from the many customers the mandate would naturally bring in. When they uphold their side of the bargain and the govt does not, they can easily win a lawsuit against the govt for breach of contract. Most likely it wouldn't even come to that, they would most likely to be bailed out with tax payers money. This is why I say the mandate repeal is a small deal.

    Again, talking about tangible foreign policy gains.
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by RonPaulGeorge&Ringo View Post
    Bullsh1t. Never happened.
    He said something like that during the elections.
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Cleaner44 View Post
    You are not a very good guesser it seems. Don't worry about buying anything that I am not selling, that no problem.

    Trump keeps all kinds of company, not just neocons. Trump keeps company with Rand Paul... does that make him a libertarian magically as well?

    Trump has an evangelical Vice President... does that make him a bible thumper too?

    Is Jim Mattis a neocon? Is Ben Carson a neocon?

    What I see is Trump hiring Republicans experienced at high level positions. I don't see him replicating Bush.

    Are you of the opinion that Trump is acting like neocon as President?
    Mike Pence is an evangelical neocon, and what about Ben Carson? The foreign policy guys he keeps company with are exclusively neocons zionists and war mongers. I am sure the Secretary of education or interior or labour etc are not necessarily neocon cos they do not have to. But with his foreign policy guys, his company is majority neocons.

    He talks to Rand every once in a while, I wouldn't consider that keeping company with Rand. Case in point, to date, Rand has yet to talk Trump out of any neocon actions.
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  27. #24

    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Mike Pence is an evangelical neocon, and what about Ben Carson? The foreign policy guys he keeps company with are exclusively neocons zionists and war mongers. I am sure the Secretary of education or interior or labour etc are not necessarily neocon cos they do not have to. But with his foreign policy guys, his company is majority neocons.

    He talks to Rand every once in a while, I wouldn't consider that keeping company with Rand. Case in point, to date, Rand has yet to talk Trump out of any neocon actions.
    There haven't been any new Middle East wars



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  29. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Mike Pence is an evangelical neocon, and what about Ben Carson? The foreign policy guys he keeps company with are exclusively neocons zionists and war mongers. I am sure the Secretary of education or interior or labour etc are not necessarily neocon cos they do not have to. But with his foreign policy guys, his company is majority neocons.

    He talks to Rand every once in a while, I wouldn't consider that keeping company with Rand. Case in point, to date, Rand has yet to talk Trump out of any neocon actions.
    So you are you of the opinion that Trump is acting like neocon as President?
    Citizen of Arizona
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  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Cleaner44 View Post
    So you are you of the opinion that Trump is acting like neocon as President?
    Yes, finally someone gets what I am have been saying for years now. Just like Obama and Bush, Trump's foreign is in line with the neocons.
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    There haven't been any new Middle East wars
    And?
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    He said something like that during the elections.
    Still bullsht. That never happened.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Yes, finally someone gets what I am have been saying for years now. Just like Obama and Bush, Trump's foreign is in line with the neocons.
    Why would the neocons hate a person with their foreign policy? Last I checked, he didn't do much with Syria. The sanctions from Russia were basically forced by a unanimous Congress vote. He is brokering peace in North Korea. He did break up the Iran Deal.

    Trump has generally good instincts on foreign policy and on balance isn't doing much wrong. Saying Trump's foreign policy is anything like Bush's is factually wrong. There is plenty to say about Trump but that he is like Bush on foreign policy is indisputably incorrect.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Yes, finally someone gets what I am have been saying for years now. Just like Obama and Bush, Trump's foreign is in line with the neocons.
    You would be wise to practice restraint when discussing the MAGA.
    1. Don't lie.
    2. Don't cheat.
    3. Don't steal.
    4. Don't kill.
    5. Don't commit adultery.
    6. Don't covet what your neighbor has, especially his wife.
    7. Honor your father and mother.
    8. Remember the Sabbath and keep it Holy.
    9. Don’t use your Higher Power's name in vain, or anyone else's.
    10. Do unto others as you would have them do to you.

    "For the love of money is the root of all evil..." -- I Timothy 6:10, KJV

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