Should President Trump open McCain Vietnam files . . . (?)

[Jan2017]

For example . . .
How about 29 July 1967 . . .
I'll bet the President doesn't really know the most accurate account for history and posterity sake of the nation . . . yet.

Meet US Navy pilot John McCain "center stage" . . .
as brought to you by the USS Foresstal control tower camera(s) - except the footage now is apparently out of public domain - wtf?

[Danke]

"Songbird McCain"

[Jan2017]

The 6:00 pm CBS Evening News for 29 July 1967 . . . Walter Cronkite reporting . . .

[Jan2017]

It is without doubt that pilot John McCain was cinematographically "center-stage" from the git-go . . .
it is unrefutable actually.

"The Forrestal class was the first completed class of "supercarriers" of the Navy, so called because of their then-extraordinarily high tonnage (75,000 tons, 25% larger than the post-World War II-era Midway class), full integration of the angled deck, very large island, and most importantly their extremely strong air wing (80–100 jet aircraft, compared to 65–75 for the Midway class and fewer than 50 for the Essex class). Source: Wikipedia

The first aircraft carrier camera accounts do not lie . . .

It was an extremely busy time aboard the USS Forrestal in July 1967 . . .
they had just loaded on to the deck replacement tonnage of a lower-grade ammunition for the aircraft the previous day
as they had used up the premium grade ammo with the President Johnson/Defense Secretary Westmoreland bombardment campaign.

The first footage that the President should see is that of the first plane about to take off on 29 July 1967
from the top camera of the aircraft carrier control tower . . .

(roll camera . . . )

What does one watch (in utter disbelief) you may ask while watching the uncensored United States Navy footage
of the USS Forrestal on 29 July 1967 . . .
(set the mood)








The "Seaman"/deck crew (position depicted above in stock Forrestal still jpg) is shown above . . .
and in the 29Jul67 footage from the USS Forrestal shows . . . as the first plane is soon - but never quite gets to -
(it would have NEVER been able to return to the destroyed deck IF it had taken off)
the final clearance/ok to take off . . .
from the camera on the USS Forrestal carrier control tower main cameraman . . .
instead of the above, the Navy seaman turns around and points out stretched arm to stage left (his right)
and there is - unbelievably - to my retinas burned with the imagery . . .
knowing the camera is trained on him and the plane about to takeoff and start the sorties . . .
the point at John McCain's plane.

From a legal standpoint - in a court of law - it is evidence.

There is no doubt . . . center-stage . . . aboard CV-59 - the first "super-carrier" of the US Navy -
before the big explosions . . .

in fact you could watch the missile caught on film as it errantly three foot off the aircraft carrier deck wizzes/flutters
past McCain's plane . . . watch from the main control tower camera vantage point straight above McCain in his plane
freaking out at the missile that just misses him.

The lower camera stays on McCain in his jet - with a clear view of him in the cockpit.
What the hell is McCain doing here at that time . . . is he in his cockpit still trying to start the aircraft and do what exactly . . . takeoff ?

Why ? Why the cinematographic emphasis on McCain from the very start of the enormous naval catastrophe ?

[Jan2017]

"Songbird McCain"

Fact is, yes, McCain was one of the (using his own language, btw) one of "the slippery. the slimey, and the sleazy" -
all collaborators" who were released in 1968, all except Delgado according to Rep. Dornan.
"Hero" McCain stayed with the VC.

1992 US Senate Select Committee on POW-MIAs, from the transcripts, an account by Congressman Dornan of a POW who said
"Oh my God, is that Admiral McCain's son (?) Is that Johnny (?)"

POWs could not see their own transcripts of their own de-briefings because of McCain blocking them getting all classified.
Make things classified so that no one knows.

A 401-0 vote in the House . . . with every single Republican co-sponsoring it . . .
and then, in the United States Senate . . .
"but on the Senate side we had one person standing in the way . . . and that person was John McCain."

1992 US Senate Select Committee on POW-MIAs needs to be looked at by President Trump, imho.

[euphemia]

What would be the point?

[RonZeplin]

[Jan2017]

What would be the point?

Really (?) - I'll give ya' the benefit of doubt that ya' jus' wanted to bump the thread

[Jan2017]

What would be the point?

fwiw, unexplicably it seemed - but understandable now -
Marines would helicopter in to a zone/area/village . . .

. . . only to be ambushed.

Your son (?) your brother (?) your cousin (?) . . . hundreds -hundreds of US GI bodybags per week is a fact.

[jkr]

What would be the point?

ACCOUNTABILITY

[Jan2017]

The camera footage of McCain in his plane still trying to get his aircraft powered up is consistent with what McCain reveals here in an interview . . .



That other - and now "restricted" footage does show McCain . . . after an eternity it seems of trying to power up the jet turbines . . .
finally gives up and (and in my version) finally "recognizes the "jet fuel gauge is now empty" . . .
He is seen - from the control tower camera trained on him - as he then gets out of the cockpit, and McCain slides over the nose of the aircraft -
then drops flat to the deck tarmac.
McCain is not on fire . . . but the pilot next to him . . . the pilot who left his aircraft
and was down slope on the sloped aircraft carrier deck - is doused in jet fuel and on fire.

[TBC]

[euphemia]

My father did two tours over there that we remember, plus shorter missions, so please remind me what it's like to have a dad gone to war for most of my childhood. There were times when almost every dad on our block was off to war.

There is no point to opening the McCain files. Most of the people who went over there are dead or almost so. Nobody will ever be held accountable for the obscenity of it all.

Move on. There is obscenity going on all over the world today. This is something we can stop if we hold people accountable for what is happening now.

[acptulsa]

But it still rankles to have the spoiled son of an admiral do a "wet start" just to be obnoxious to the guys behind him, start a fire, and then get in such a hurry to get out of there that he dumps his drop tank in the middle of the fire and turns it into an inferno.

It rankles even more to have a cock-and-bull story concocted to cover up his culpability in the death of so many men.

It's beyond the pale to have said spoiled son of an admiral go on to reap millions in bribes while repeatedly getting himself reelected--despite his obvious crookedness--because the media keeps insisting he's a war hero. Hell, he killed more of our sailors than the whole of the North Vietnamese forces did!

And I hate the censorship that sees all copies of the footage shot from the ship's control tower pulled from youtube just within the last decade. It's even getting hard to find diagrams of the internal layout of the A-4 Skyhawk, because the location of their fuel tanks contradicts the concocted story. I don't appreciate Memory Holes.

No, I don't agree with you that this should stay buried. Even if he's so far gone with brain cancer that he doesn't even realize what's going on, I'd dearly love to see the $#@! discredited while he still lives.

I'm sick of this sacred cow.

Trump went halfway around the world and pretended to talk to Kim about nukes just to get a bunch of bones that have been in the ground 65 years. And now they're spending, what, millions? on DNA tests so families of soldiers can have 'closure'. So why can't the veterans of the U.S.S. Forest Fire who lost good friends, and the families of those lost souls, hear just once the DoD and the MSM say out loud what they already know?

[Jan2017]

My father did two tours over there that we remember, plus shorter missions, so please remind me what it's like to have a dad gone to war for most of my childhood. There were times when almost every dad on our block was off to war.

There is no point to opening the McCain files. Most of the people who went over there are dead or almost so. Nobody will ever be held accountable for the obscenity of it all.

Move on. There is obscenity going on all over the world today. This is something we can stop if we hold people accountable for what is happening now.

LOL - turn a blind eye to hold people accountable . . . so live and enjoy the lie forever.
Do whatever you need to . . . ignore all facts to keep you happy if that works.
I choose to "never forget"

The prior McCain accidents can give a clue to what happened aboard the Forrestal and in particular one could start with
his first near fatal crash short of the runway into Corpus Christi Naval Air Station.
[TBC]

[Jan2017]

The prior McCain accidents can give a clue to what happened aboard the Forrestal and in particular one could start with
his first near fatal crash short of the runway into Corpus Christi Naval Air Station.

Johnny did not "like" math or engineering . . .
How did he even graduate from the US Naval Academy in the first place, with the "misconduct" remarks ?
Johnny's 1958 USN class rank was a solid #894 out of a class of 899 (?)

Meet John McCain US Naval Academy - future USA President-hopeful though foreign-born in Panama -
"a solid 2.0 GPA . . . right in that meaty part of the curve - not showing off, not falling behind "






May 3, 2018 The Washington Post
John McCain rebelled at the Naval Academy — and as a POW — long before he was a Senate maverick

Before his captivity, McCain honed the art of insubordination at a place created to pulverize individualism into obedience.

“I was really rebellious,” McCain said of his time as a midshipman at the Naval Academy, class of 1958. “I mean, really rebellious.”
Years later, he said he resented the Academy and hazing rituals that haunted him and his father.

His father, John S. McCain Jr., was an undersized but scrappy “middie” who himself earned poor marks at the Academy before he commanded all forces in Vietnam during his son’s captivity.

John S. McCain III quickly took up that mantle. He developed a reputation for partying and defying authority as he struggled to reconcile how much a career in the Navy was by his own design.

A group of rabble-rouser middies, the “Bad Bunch,” coalesced around McCain. To be around McCain away from school grounds, one classmate said, “was like being in a train wreck,” biographer Robert Timberg wrote in “John McCain: An American Odyssey.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.3e7349c18933

[euphemia]

LOL - turn a blind eye to hold people accountable . . . so live and enjoy the lie forever.
Do whatever you need to . . . ignore all facts to keep you happy if that works.
I choose to "never forget"

The prior McCain accidents can give a clue to what happened aboard the Forrestal and in particular one could start with
his first near fatal crash short of the runway into Corpus Christi Naval Air Station.
[TBC]

What do you want to do to people who are now no longer here? What kind of accountability is that? Hold people accountable to day for the atrocities committed today. McCain is terminally ill. What can you hope to change by raking over the past. Stop the obscenity happening now.

[tod evans]

"Songbird McCain"

$#@!ing rat-bastard.

[Jan2017]

What do you want to do to people who are now no longer here? What kind of accountability is that? Hold people accountable to day for the atrocities committed today. McCain is terminally ill. What can you hope to change by raking over the past. Stop the obscenity happening now.

Ignore the atrocities of the past . . . and that is the history that gets to repeat itself toady.

[acptulsa]

What do you want to do to people who are now no longer here? What kind of accountability is that? Hold people accountable to day for the atrocities committed today. McCain is terminally ill. What can you hope to change by raking over the past. Stop the obscenity happening now.

The military will spend billions to allow families of fallen service people closure, but won't sacrifice a single sacred cow for the same goal. Sad!

[Jan2017]

The military will spend billions to allow families of fallen service people closure, but won't sacrifice a single sacred cow for the same goal. Sad!

To "never leave behind a fallen soldier" is mostly an American tradition . . . ('cept for McCain's ethics)
it was not really even possible to remove the dead as much until the whirlybirds of 'Nam,
although the concept is not unknown in European military code.
https://www.phrases.org.uk/bulletin_...sages/907.html

A 401-0 vote in the House . . . with every single Republican co-sponsoring it . . .
and then, in the United States Senate . . .
"but on the Senate side we had one person standing in the way . . . and that person was John McCain."

1992 US Senate Select Committee on POW-MIAs needs to be looked at by President Trump, imho.

[Ender]

Ignore the atrocities of the past . . . and that is the history that gets to repeat itself toady.

True.

How about we open up a serious investigation on unconstitutional wars and hold the whole government at fault for every war from at least WWII?

[euphemia]

True.

How about we open up a serious investigation on unconstitutional wars and hold the whole government at fault for every war from at least WWII?

Starting with now and working backwards. I want to know where we are involved now, and why, and insist it be brought to an end.

[Jan2017]

Starting with now and working backwards. I want to know where we are involved now, and why, and insist it be brought to an end.

Now, about 39,000 USA troops stationed in Japan, with some 20,000 in South Korea and over 9,000 in Afghanistan.

I'd think - if anywhere - we really could use about 70,000 USA troops in Mexico instead!

[euphemia]

Nigeria—well, most of Africa. The Philippines. And why are we in Italy? Poland?

Supposedly this is counterterrorism. Link

[Ender]

Nigeria. The Philippines. And why are we in Italy?

And why do have have bases surrounding Iran? Why are we in the ME? Africa? S America?

[Swordsmyth]

What do you want to do to people who are now no longer here? What kind of accountability is that? Hold people accountable to day for the atrocities committed today. McCain is terminally ill. What can you hope to change by raking over the past. Stop the obscenity happening now.

The Truth Shall Set You Free.

All truth is important.

[Swordsmyth]

True.

How about we open up a serious investigation on unconstitutional wars and hold the whole government at fault for every war from at least WWII?

Starting with now and working backwards. I want to know where we are involved now, and why, and insist it be brought to an end.

If we can't even get the truth about the past we will never get the truth about the present with its much greater consequences.

[Jan2017]

My father did two tours over there that we remember, plus shorter missions, so please remind me what it's like to have a dad gone to war for most of my childhood. There were times when almost every dad on our block was off to war.

There is no point to opening the McCain files. Most of the people who went over there are dead or almost so. Nobody will ever be held accountable for the obscenity of it all.

Move on. There is obscenity going on all over the world today. This is something we can stop if we hold people accountable for what is happening now.

I am empathetic that it can be/is a wound that for some/many might be better not opened.

But McCain story is much, much more than that. For the USS Forrestal, history has been re-written - it is pure propaganda.

Anyone . . . say a junior high school kid wants to write a history paper and looks up the USS Forestal disaster . . .
he/she goes to the internet, does a google search, and comes back with how a missile went off and started the catastrophe.
It is selectively fed to us - maybe page 50 of the google search has something written in Swedish or something that no one even gets to.

I would love to ask McCain one simple yes/no question on what he said in the interview. . . actually a right/left question altho it could be phrased as a simple yes/no . . . "Was that the right side of your aircraft Lt. McCain ? it would seal the deal.

It is not catching him in a direct "lie" . . .

but I say his acknowledgement of the pilot adjacent to him (first that he saw) was on fire from jet fuel was a potential incriminating tidbit for the whole story, imho.
I'd already believe I know the answer by "how" he landed on the tarmac off the front nose of his plane (the left side, and facing mostly right while prone on the ground.
He would have to think a few steps ahead at what I was getting at . . . very doubtful.
But he may say like Hillary did so many times, that "he "doesn't recall"

And Lt. Caffey could handle the questioning as well . . .

[pcosmar]

The Truth Shall Set You Free.

All truth is important.

The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. And he said to him, “I will give you all their authority and splendor; it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. If you worship me, it will all be yours.”

You can't handle the Truth.

McCain is Wholly Understandable. The Warmongers and Thieves are wholly understandable.
They serve the master of this world..

It is the reason Ron Paul could never be elected to power.. he failed the Luke 4 Challenge. He did not bow down.

[Jan2017]

#1 May 12, 1960 - McCain first loss of aircraft

This took place while McCain, a young, unmarried officer not long out of the very bottom-of-his-class Naval Academy graduation,
was in advanced flight training at Corpus Christi, Texas.

"John McCain was training in his AD-6 Skyraider on an overcast Texas morning in 1960 when he slammed into Corpus Christi Bay and sheared the skin off his plane's wings."

McCain's explanation continues to be inconsistent with Navy determinations of the cause of his Corpus Christi aircraft
landing on the bottom of the bay. So, the McCain lie has got to be ON - he is going into politics to rule us.
A 2008 investigative piece by The Los Angeles Times uncovers that the official Navy investigation blamed the aircraft loss
and near loss of his life was due to "inattention to altitude".

An intriguing clue perhaps for the Forrestal is by his own admission McCain
I "had not read the flight manual procedure" for how to eject from this aircraft . . .
So, is Johnny McCain the first pilot who gets to eject from an aircraft that had to blow off the cockpit clear canopy
from underneath the water while the aircraft is sinking (?)

#2 December 1961 - McCain plane over Iberian Pennisula causing property damage

Disturbing because same McCain flying problem, low altitude flying at too slow airspeed, aircraft is not totalled and gets repaired -
so NOT a loss of aircraft, though.

By his own admission McCain "had cut off electricity to a great many Spanish homes and created a small international incident."

The L.A. Times, which interviewed others who were in McCain's squadron at the time, reports in 2008 that
McCain returned to the carrier "with 10 feet of power line trailing from his plane, and with a severed oil line."

#3 November 28, 1965 - McCain loss of aircraft

Another loss of aircraft, and again on a descent for landing in tidal beach areas near Chesapeake Bay -
this aircraft ends up in trees along near the beach after McCain ejects at 1000 ft

"McCain had just begun his descent over unpopulated" (Thank God !)"... tidal terrain when the engine stalled out.
He went through the standard "relight" procedure three times - FAIL.

The Navy classified it as a "routine ejection" with McCain "on a deserted beach moments before the aircraft slams into a clump of trees."

In a report dated January 18, 1966, Navy says "it could not corroborate McCain's account and after a close examination of
the aircraft engines found "no discrepancies which would have caused or contributed to engine failure or malfunction."

But that report gets re-written later.

#4 July 29, 1967 - McCain loss of aircraft aboard USS Forrestal naval catastrophe

11:20am
- The Forrestal reports a major fire on the flight deck and all ships on "Yankee Station" move to give assistance.

11:32am -

- The USS Oriskany (CVA-34) sends medical helicopter as it steams toward Forrestal and moves it's planes
if any landings are needed aboard it. (No flights had taken off from the Forrestal but they didn't know that.)





An injured crewman from the burning U.S. Navy aircraft carrier USS Forrestal (CVA-59) is carried from U.S. Air Force Sikorsky HH-3E
Jolly Green Giant to the sick bay of USS Oriskany (CVA-34) off Vietnam, on 29 July 1967. Official U.S. Navy photo 1125494


McCain’s plane was fifth in line behind the jet blast deflector of catapult #3 aboard the Forrestal.
It was loaded with 400 gallons of jet fuel . . . but interviewed McCain said it was 200 gallons - wtf ? (the consistent mental defect relapse)
OR -
queue TopGun and the flight manual theory -gfgacts

McCain one week later on August 5, 1967 :
"When I saw LCDR Hope on the hangar deck, and I believe you can ask him about this, the first thing I said to him was,
‘Herb, I thought I had killed you.’
So I must have believed that it was from my aircraft at that time.
Then I heard so many other stories as to what happened, I didn’t believe it was my aircraft.
But at the time, I think, I believed that it was my aircraft or the one right next to it."


USN : "The first responders were Repair Party 8, led by Chief Petty Officer Gerald Farrier, who can be seen in the plat tapes
running toward McCain's Skyhawk."

This initial jet fuel fire was fought but ALL perished as the jet fuel seeped down to the hangars for two decks below and set off the explosions.

{insert USN jpg 21`1267593

The rest of the crew aboard the Forrestal would have to tackle this catastrophe without any firefighting training.


Film evidence certainly seems to refute a McCain account regarding the Zuni missile . . .
However, this story line by McCain does confirms he actually is IN the cockpit as missile goes by.

Flight operations were already stopped . . . main aircraft top control tower camera is already on McCain's aircraft.
the Zuni did not cause anything that they are saying.
Easily gonna be proved now that the whole final line can easily be shown to be a false narrative.

(get ready Johnny - hanging is SOON)











#5 October 26, 1967 - McCain loss of aircraft over Hanoi, North Vietnam /and in enemy hands