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Thread: Will Rand cave on the Gina Haspel confirmation too?

  1. #1

    Question Will Rand cave on the Gina Haspel confirmation too?

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  3. #2

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    No
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  4. #3

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    More interesting question would be how many calls to Trump and Haspel he will make before he flips.
    What is the punishment for the attempted murder of freedom on earth? 👁👁

  5. #4

  6. #5

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    I highly doubt he will.
    “Force the normies into taking sides. At the moment they are just like "meh, I am minding my own business" retreating culturally into their private bubbles and "safe-spaces" since they don't understand what is going on. When the actual "us vs them" starts, they will be forced to fight or they'll die.” - Anonymous Poster

  7. #6

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    “Force the normies into taking sides. At the moment they are just like "meh, I am minding my own business" retreating culturally into their private bubbles and "safe-spaces" since they don't understand what is going on. When the actual "us vs them" starts, they will be forced to fight or they'll die.” - Anonymous Poster

  8. #7

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    yes he will. He read a fake news story about how she participated in torture and destroyed tapes. Both claims have been retracted.
    I just want objectivity on this forum and will point out flawed sources or points of view at my leisure.

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  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by spudea View Post
    yes he will. He read a fake news story about how she participated in torture and destroyed tapes. Both claims have been retracted.
    Who was spreading these fake news?
    What is the punishment for the attempted murder of freedom on earth? 👁👁

  10. #9

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    Zero percent chance he votes for her and I am sure Matt knows this.

  11. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    Who was spreading these fake news?
    Gina Haspel dindunuffin
    In sorrow, we must go, but not in despair. Behold! We are not bound forever to the circles of the world, and beyond them is more than memory. Farewell!

  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Globalist View Post
    Better not.
    Yep

    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Zero percent chance he votes for her and I am sure Matt knows this.
    I would have said the same about Pompeo right up to the minute it happened.

    Now, I wouldn't be surprised either way, which is itself a sad state of affairs.

  13. #12

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    If it follows some other recent votes he'll talk to her, she'll promise never to do it again, and that will be enough.

    Oh she already has said that "Gina Haspel Vows She Won’t Allow Torture if She’s Confirmed to Run the C.I.A."

    I think he'll vote for her
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  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by kpitcher View Post
    If it follows some other recent votes he'll talk to her, she'll promise never to do it again, and that will be enough.

    Oh she already has said that "Gina Haspel Vows She Won’t Allow Torture if She’s Confirmed to Run the C.I.A."

    I think he'll vote for her
    It's kind of odd that our standard for acceptable politicians has become: will you imprison and torture people without trial?

    ...maybe it's just me.

    "Oh, so you won't mercilessly beat puppies? ..You're hired!"

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Zero percent chance he votes for her and I am sure Matt knows this.
    3 weeks ago I would have said he will never vote for Pompeo...


    Quote Originally Posted by kpitcher View Post
    If it follows some other recent votes he'll talk to her, she'll promise never to do it again, and that will be enough.

    Oh she already has said that "Gina Haspel Vows She Won’t Allow Torture if She’s Confirmed to Run the C.I.A."

    I think he'll vote for her
    Exactly my point.
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  16. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    It's kind of odd that our standard for acceptable politicians has become: will you imprison and torture people without trial?

    ...maybe it's just me.

    "Oh, so you won't mercilessly beat puppies? ..You're hired!"
    With all the sensitivity training on the rise maybe it is time we did one for congress. "The supreme law of the land aka. The Constitution" and "Why $#@!ing Your Fellow Citizens Is A Bad Idea"
    What is the punishment for the attempted murder of freedom on earth? 👁👁

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    With all the sensitivity training on the rise maybe it is time we did one for congress. "The supreme law of the land aka. The Constitution" and "Why $#@!ing Your Fellow Citizens Is A Bad Idea"
    It would be better to just dismiss them (they aren't really up to the task).

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    It would be better to just dismiss them (they aren't really up to the task).
    Sure, but we would have to make sure the future talent knows about these rules as well.
    What is the punishment for the attempted murder of freedom on earth? 👁👁

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    3 weeks ago I would have said he will never vote for Pompeo...

    Exactly my point.
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Yep

    I would have said the same about Pompeo right up to the minute it happened.

    Now, I wouldn't be surprised either way, which is itself a sad state of affairs.

    In wasn't clear to me at all that he would vote against Pompeo despite what he was saying publicly. Here is what I said (in a thread you made about Rand) five days before the vote when Rand was making the rounds in the press. There were a lot of political reasons to vote for Pompeo with no basically no political upside in voting against him. Haspel is a much easier no and that vote is actually close.

    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    I think Rand is a clear no on running in any future Presidential election...............

    More interesting is if he votes no on Pompeo. Voting no will be a huge deal. If he votes no, I wouldn't be surprised if he is at least considering not running again for Senate

  20. #19

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    Just like Pompeo - if they need his vote, they will offer him something to get his vote.

    We'll never know what it was with Pompeo, but I'm sure there was something that Rand was given. Not a personal thing, but some assurance that something he wants would get through.


    I doubt they'd offer very much for Haspel - so I'm saying Rand is a "no" vote. Unfortunately, Rand is a double-edged sword. Unlike his father, Rand is willing to bend his principles on one matter if can get a return on another matter. That's a bad thing and a good thing, depending on how you look at it.
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  21. #20

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    This will be used to try to convince Rand...

    Rand Paul Explains His Surprise Vote For Chuck Hagel
    "The president gets to choose political appointees," Paul says.
    February 26, 2013

    WASHINGTON — Kentucky Senator Rand Paul said his support for a filibuster against Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel never meant that he would vote against Hagel's confirmation.

    "I voted no because I wanted more information and I think that part of what the Senate does is try to get information about the nominees," Paul told reporters in the basement of the Capitol after Hagel's confirmation Tuesday. "I've said all along that I give the president some prerogative in choosing his political appointees."

    "There are many things I disagree with Chuck Hagel on, there are many things I disagree with John Kerry on, there are very few things I agree with the president on, but the president gets to choose political appointees," Paul said.
    ...
    https://www.buzzfeed.com/rosiegray/r...or-chuck-hagel
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  22. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    Just like Pompeo - if they need his vote, they will offer him something to get his vote.

    We'll never know what it was with Pompeo, but I'm sure there was something that Rand was given.
    They didn't need the vote on Pompeo. That was one of the easier confirms that Trump has had. They actually didn't even need it in committee. I think completely opposite. Had they needed his vote Rand would have almost certainly voted against Pompeo.

    I doubt he was given anything. I think it was a simple as Trump made an issue of it in the press and really wanted Rand's vote. He didn't want the embarrassment of the guy having to bypass going through committee. Rand didn't want to be on the outs with Trump with only an inconsequential vote that no one will appreciate to show for it.
    Last edited by Krugminator2; 05-10-2018 at 06:22 PM.

  23. #22

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    I say there is an 80% chance Rand will vote no. It should be 100% though.

    I didn't really care if Rand voted for Pompeo; my problem was the spectacle he made over it. Rand is increasingly being seen as someone who pulls stunts instead of standing on principles. So relatively speaking, it wasn't that big of a deal even though I didn't like it.

    In this case though, I don't see how Rand can justify it just listening to her testimony. It will fundamentally change my opinion of him if he votes to confirm her.
    Last edited by EBounding; 05-10-2018 at 01:02 PM.
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  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post


    I'd let Gina Haspel torture those cops. $#@!ing bastards.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
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  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
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  26. #25

  27. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    In wasn't clear to me at all that he would vote against Pompeo despite what he was saying publicly. Here is what I said (in a thread you made about Rand) five days before the vote when Rand was making the rounds in the press. There were a lot of political reasons to vote for Pompeo with no basically no political upside in voting against him. Haspel is a much easier no and that vote is actually close.
    What were those?

    As I saw it, the major effect of the vote was to inform Rand's friends and foes that he's unreliable and easily conned.

  28. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    Just like Pompeo - if they need his vote, they will offer him something to get his vote.

    We'll never know what it was with Pompeo, but I'm sure there was something that Rand was given. Not a personal thing, but some assurance that something he wants would get through.
    Rand failed politics 101: private promises mean nothing.
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  29. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Rand failed politics 101: private promises mean nothing.
    Actually, Matt... Rand passed politics 101 with flying colors. And that's the problem.
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  30. #29

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    What is the punishment for the attempted murder of freedom on earth? 👁👁

  31. #30

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    It would be very shocking to me if Rand votes to confirm.

    Why Isn’t Gina Haspel Coming Clean About Torture?

    Why Isn’t Gina Haspel Coming Clean About Torture?
    By SEN. RAND PAUL
    May 11, 2018


    We know that in the early 2000s, Gina Haspel’s CIA was rendering accused terrorists to unfathomable torture in Syria, as well as Egypt and Jordan. And we know that in 2005, Haspel herself was busy ordering the destruction of evidence of her involvement in the waterboarding of prisoners.

    What we don’t know is if she was involved in sending Maher Arar, a Canadian engineer, to Syria, where he was tortured by Bashar Assad—the same Assad now condemned for gassing his own people; the same Assad the CIA has been trying to depose for the past six years.

    Did Haspel participate or even order Arar and others to be sent to Syria to be tortured? We will likely never know: Haspel, whose nomination for director of the CIA is currently being considered by the Senate, refuses to declassify the dark underbelly of her involvement in extreme rendition and torture-by-proxy.

    Jane Mayer recounted Arar’s story in 2005 after interviewing him for The New Yorker:

    Ten hours after landing in Jordan, Arar … was driven to Syria, where interrogators … “just began beating on me.” They whipped his hands repeatedly with two-inch-thick electrical cables, and kept him in a windowless underground cell that he likened to a grave. “Not even animals could withstand it,” he said. Although he initially tried to assert his innocence, he eventually confessed to anything his tormentors wanted him to say. “You just give up, he said. “You become like an animal.”

    A year later, in October, 2003, Arar was released without charges. … Imad Moustapha, the Syrian Ambassador in Washington, announced that his country had found no links between Arar and terrorism. Arar, it turned out, had been sent to Syria on orders from the U.S. government, under a secretive program known as “extraordinary rendition.” This program had been devised as a means of extraditing terrorism suspects from one foreign state to another for interrogation and prosecution. Critics contend that the unstated purpose of such renditions is to subject the suspects to aggressive methods of persuasion that are illegal in America—including torture.

    Was Haspel simply a loyal dupe, unable to protest an accused man being sent to certain barbaric torture? Or was she an eager participant in this dark chapter in our history?

    If she had any criticisms at the time, Haspel, who is currently the acting head of the CIA, has the power to declassify them. And yet all we’ve gotten are select records that don’t address her participation in extraordinary rendition.

    Know this: That fact alone should be enough to cause the Senate to reject her nomination.
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