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Thread: WAPO: Rand's influence on Trump

  1. #1

    WAPO: Rand's influence on Trump


    In private chat with senator, Trump hints at policy shift in Afghanistan — and a return to isolationism



    In the days leading up to a key vote last week over the fate of his nominee for secretary of state, President Trump found a way to win over one of the biggest skeptics in the Senate.

    Sen. Rand Paul (Ky.), a rare isolationist Republican, was signaling that he would oppose Trump’s pick, then-CIA Director Mike Pompeo, a hawkish former congressman who had backed the Iraq War.

    But the more Trump and Paul spoke, including three calls last Monday, the more assured Paul became that the president was moving back toward the non-interventionist world view that Trump had championed on the campaign trail. The conversations left Paul with a particularly enticing notion: that Trump was prepared to end the war in Afghanistan.

    “The president told me over and over again in general we’re getting the hell out of there,” Paul said in an interview Thursday in his Senate office. “I think the president’s instincts and inclination are to resolve the Afghan conflict.”
    The two men discussed no exit dates and did not strike a written agreement, as Trump urged Paul to meet one-on-one with Pompeo and ultimately secured the senator’s support ahead of a key Foreign Relations Committee vote that paved the way for confirmation...

    ...It is unclear just how much Trump’s private conversations signal a public shift in policy or, rather, if they are just maneuvering by a famously transactional leader who often says what he needs to say to make a deal and then reverses himself. The White House declined to comment for this story, but an official confirmed the outlines of the interactions that Paul described.

    Nonetheless, Trump’s talks with Paul reflect an area of growing tension between the president, whose instinct is to withdraw from overseas entanglements, and his military, whose leaders think that swift pullouts would spark dangerous instability. In Afghanistan, one indication of the military’s nervousness is its eagerness to open peace talks with the Taliban and try to negotiate an end the conflict...

    ...The Trump-Paul conversations also point to an effort by the dovish senator and former Trump rival, long treated by his party as a foreign policy gadfly, to assert influence over a president who chafes at being managed by his advisers and the Republican foreign policy establishment.
    Full Article:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.ca7cdfd7f9d5
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    H. L. Mencken said it best:


    “Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.”


    "As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron."



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  3. #2
    Arrggg blarg Isolationist garrrrrrffff
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  4. #3
    The question is whether Paul’s influence will persuade Trump to listen less to generals and more to his gut.
    “His true worldview, and I have heard him say this over and over, is that we have no business being anywhere over there and we look like fools,” said onelongtime friend, who has spoken to Trump repeatedly about the Middle East. “He is inclined to agree with Rand Paul.”

    “The other day when we were talking, he said it’s probably only he and I of the whole 16 that shared any of this vision of foreign policy that these wars had been a mistake,” Paul said. “That’s something. That’s an amazing opening for people like me who think we have made so many mistakes.”
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    The question is whether Paul’s influence will persuade Trump to listen less to generals and more to his gut.
    “His true worldview, and I have heard him say this over and over, is that we have no business being anywhere over there and we look like fools,” said onelongtime friend, who has spoken to Trump repeatedly about the Middle East. “He is inclined to agree with Rand Paul.”

    “The other day when we were talking, he said it’s probably only he and I of the whole 16 that shared any of this vision of foreign policy that these wars had been a mistake,” Paul said. “That’s something. That’s an amazing opening for people like me who think we have made so many mistakes.”
    Rand Paul is a master troll there have been a few articles out now about this same quote. They should have him come on the shows and talk about Trumps plan to end the war in Afghanistan

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Rand Paul is a master troll there have been a few articles out now about this same quote. They should have him come on the shows and talk about Trumps plan to end the war in Afghanistan
    Because Trump and Pompeo are unable to do it themselves?

  7. #6
    Keep your eyes on the ball people, I am smelling a head fake. Remember folks, the US is still in Germany, they mostly never leave if they have not been defeated (1st gulf war was a mistake that they have now rectified).
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    Because Trump and Pompeo are unable to do it themselves?
    Plus promises made to Rand in secret now has more weight than that made to the voters in public campaign rallies.

    Politicians have it so good with these group of voters. They would believe anything.
    You can maintain power over people, as long as you give them something. Rob a man of everything, and that man will no longer be in your power. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Trust principles; not people.
    My Che avatar is my unique way of giving a big middle finger to the, the neocons, the globalists, imperialists and most importantly to the left and right political establishment who hate his guts till this day. My admiration for him ends where his anti imperialist pro communism ideology starts.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Keep your eyes on the ball people, I am smelling a head fake. Remember folks, the US is still in Germany, they mostly never leave if they have not been defeated (1st gulf war was a mistake that they have now rectified).
    Not even a head fake. Simply Rand bumbling about as usual. Delusion of Grandeur.



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  11. #9
    At this afternoon's WH press conference, Huckleberry whore was asked about this; she denied any change of policy in Afghanistan.

    So, that leverage...


  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    At this afternoon's WH press conference, Huckleberry whore was asked about this; she denied any change of policy in Afghanistan.

    So, that leverage...

    We shall see.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  13. #11
    Trump may be on Rand's side, but it could mean very little. The president is held captive.
    “Force the normies into taking sides. At the moment they are just like "meh, I am minding my own business" retreating culturally into their private bubbles and "safe-spaces" since they don't understand what is going on. When the actual "us vs them" starts, they will be forced to fight or they'll die.” - Anonymous Poster

  14. #12
    Please break any links to articles that use the word "isolationism" to refer to Paul foreign policy. We can't do our enemy's work for them.
    Authoritarianism and neoconservatism cannot be made great again.
    Trump was an enemy of Ron Paul, before he was an enemy of Rand Paul, before he was an enemy of the Freedom Caucus.
    One thing that he has remained consistent in is his hate of liberty and those who promote it.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    The question is whether Paul’s influence will persuade Trump to listen less to generals and more to his gut.
    “His true worldview, and I have heard him say this over and over, is that we have no business being anywhere over there and we look like fools,” said onelongtime friend, who has spoken to Trump repeatedly about the Middle East. “He is inclined to agree with Rand Paul.”

    “The other day when we were talking, he said it’s probably only he and I of the whole 16 that shared any of this vision of foreign policy that these wars had been a mistake,” Paul said. “That’s something. That’s an amazing opening for people like me who think we have made so many mistakes.”
    Even if this is true, what good is it if he's too much of a spineless cowardly "betacuck" to do anything about it?
    Authoritarianism and neoconservatism cannot be made great again.
    Trump was an enemy of Ron Paul, before he was an enemy of Rand Paul, before he was an enemy of the Freedom Caucus.
    One thing that he has remained consistent in is his hate of liberty and those who promote it.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by francisco View Post
    Full Article:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.ca7cdfd7f9d5

    In private chat with senator, Trump hints at policy shift in Afghanistan — and a return to isolationism



    In the days leading up to a key vote last week over the fate of his nominee for secretary of state, President Trump found a way to win over one of the biggest skeptics in the Senate.

    Sen. Rand Paul (Ky.), a rare isolationist Republican, was signaling that he would oppose Trump’s pick, then-CIA Director Mike Pompeo, a hawkish former congressman who had backed the Iraq War.

    But the more Trump and Paul spoke, including three calls last Monday, the more assured Paul became that the president was moving back toward the non-interventionist world view that Trump had championed on the campaign trail. The conversations left Paul with a particularly enticing notion: that Trump was prepared to end the war in Afghanistan.
    Sometimes I wish I had a button that I could press and electrically shock anytime a reporter said something stupid like isolationism = non-interventionism.
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    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.



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