Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 31 to 60 of 68

Thread: So Iím Told Trade Deficits Are Good

  1. #31



  2. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  3. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    The only reason anyone would take a dollar in return for goods is to ultimately have a claim on something produced in the U.S. Thatís unless you believe that foreigners just love to keep and look at the pictures of our former presidents on tiny slips of paper.

    So under this theory, all the dollars Americans send abroad in trade eventually return to the United States to buy goods or services from Americans, unless foreigners are foolish enough to keep those little colored pieces of paper instead of redeeming them for American products. Either way, Americans win.
    This person has no idea what they're talking about.

    In nearly every country in the world, bank accounts and similar investments denominated in dollars pay a higher rate of return than those denominated in the local currency. Why do you suppose that is?

    Why do you suppose it is that when I go to Egypt, they will only permit me to purchase an Egyptian visa from Egyptians in dollars or euros?



  4. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  5. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post



    Bahrain is 16% larger today than it was 30 years ago. The island that I'm on right now is entirely man made.
    That is not feasible most places, and it is probably not economically viable there.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  6. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    This person has no idea what they're talking about.

    In nearly every country in the world, bank accounts and similar investments denominated in dollars pay a higher rate of return than those denominated in the local currency. Why do you suppose that is?

    Why do you suppose it is that when I go to Egypt, they will only permit me to purchase an Egyptian visa from Egyptians in dollars or euros?
    Thank you for helping undermine the argument that trade deficits are always good.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  7. #35

  8. #36

  9. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Thank you for demonstrating your outstanding reading comprehension.
    You are the one with a problem in that area, you helped disprove the argument that the dollars will always return home to purchase American production and that therefore there is really no such thing as a trade deficit.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  10. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You are the one with a problem in that area, you helped disprove the argument that the dollars will always return home to purchase American production and that therefore there is really no such thing as a trade deficit.
    Again, reading comprehension.

    Even in your article, there is no argument that dollars will always return home to purchase American production. Two possibilities are given:

    So under this theory, all the dollars Americans send abroad in trade eventually return to the United States to buy goods or services from Americans, unless foreigners are foolish enough to keep those little colored pieces of paper instead of redeeming them for American products. Either way, Americans win.
    What do you suppose the 'either' in 'either way' means there? Either one of two options, perhaps?

    Not all dollars return to the US to purchase goods and services, because foreigners do keep dollars.


    The rest of the article is nonsense; the author is mistaking correlation for causation. Just because trade deficits and currency collapses happened at the same time does not prove that one caused the other, and even if it did, how would you know which way that causation goes? Why is it assumed that trade deficits cause hyperinflation and not the other way around? The author is just relating a bunch of facts amidst a narrative that fits their worldview without any proof whatever that those facts support the conclusions that they are making.

  11. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Again, reading comprehension.

    Even in your article, there is no argument that dollars will always return home to purchase American production. Two possibilities are given:



    What do you suppose the 'either' in 'either way' means there? Either one of two options, perhaps?

    Not all dollars return to the US to purchase goods and services, because foreigners do keep dollars.


    The rest of the article is nonsense; the author is mistaking correlation for causation. Just because trade deficits and currency collapses happened at the same time does not prove that one caused the other, and even if it did, how would you know which way that causation goes? Why is it assumed that trade deficits cause hyperinflation and not the other way around? The author is just relating a bunch of facts amidst a narrative that fits their worldview without any proof whatever that those facts support the conclusions that they are making.
    You assume I agree totally with the article, Americans don't win if the dollars don't come home, the industries move overseas and Americans lose the ability to produce things of value, eventually our money becomes worthless as we print more to send overseas and then we can't afford to buy things and we can't make them.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  12. #40
    The difference between "good" and "bad" is Subjective.

    Look at this from the true rulers point of view. You have a national economy whose GDP (and just sayin') is 1000 dollars. You run up a Trade Deficit of 100 dollars. Then, you devalue both the currency and the debt by printing money, and have a GDP of 10000 with no actual increase in production. That 100 Trade Deficit is now 1% rather than 10% of your GDP. Thus, for those that benefit by money manipulation, debasing the currency and having a Trade Deficit is a "good" thing. From the point of view of the public, who now either has to work 10 times as hard to stay where they are at, this is a "bad" thing. Understanding the perspective of those who intend to do you harm enables you to see who truly benefits.

    Those that truly benefit will always use multiple tactics to prevent logical conclusions from being drawn. Sometimes it is easiest to list methods they use. For example, pointing out contradictory information using baked numbers, like Zippy, discrediting the person saying it and not the idea, "moving the goalpost", humor to distract and redirect focus, but rarely will they ever actually try to attack the ideas drawn by logical conclusions as it is a battle that can not be won. This isnt a comprehensive list as there are many other tactics used to evade their bull$#@! ideas being shot down by logic. Now, go back and take a look at pretty much anything the Zippy acct posts in regards to Economics and you'll see a pattern and a series of supporting bogus ideas with purposeful application of various methods. Why would he do such a thing? Consider all possibilities. One is he genuinely does not understand, despite having intelligence enough to understand it. The other possibility is that he / they benefit at your expense and the goal is to discredit honest economics, if there even is such a thing.
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintian an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    You are Ron Paul's Media!

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.



  13. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  14. #41
    I don't know why you're clamoring for all of these dollars to come home. The inflation would be catastrophic. The trade deficit and cheap foreign goods are what have funded the government for the last 40 years. If we weren't exporting our inflation, we would be starving to death here.

    Which incidentally, is another good reason why this idea that tariffs will fix our problem is so ridiculous. First of all, you are slapping an extra tax on imports, squeezing consumers. If that has your desired effect of slowing the export of dollars, prices of everything will skyrocket here, once again bankrupting the middle class and putting 'Murican manufacturing out of business.

    People weren't always this economically illiterate and short sighted here. It's a shame.

  15. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gold Standard View Post
    I don't know why you're clamoring for all of these dollars to come home. The inflation would be catastrophic. The trade deficit and cheap foreign goods are what have funded the government for the last 40 years. If we weren't exporting our inflation, we would be starving to death here.

    Which incidentally, is another good reason why this idea that tariffs will fix our problem is so ridiculous. First of all, you are slapping an extra tax on imports, squeezing consumers. If that has your desired effect of slowing the export of dollars, prices of everything will skyrocket here, once again bankrupting the middle class and putting 'Murican manufacturing out of business.

    People weren't always this economically illiterate and short sighted here. It's a shame.
    Wise words.

    Yes, the level of economic literacy has dropped precipitously over the last few years. Indeed, the level of literacy dropped considerably when the alt-right and Bolton's paid Trumptrolls invaded, much less the economic literacy. That said, many here don't feel particularly invested in the system you describe. Many would as soon toss a monkey wrench in it. The amusing thing is, the ones screeching the loudest for the tariff are very probably the ones most invested in defending the current system. Another of a few thousand delicious ironies they have brought to the board with their collectivism and their love of our new Big Orange Brother.

    Nonetheless, your lesson in Petrodollar Management 101 was obviously sorely needed, and remarkably clear and concise. Thank you for the timely lesson.

    Supply and demand determines the value of the FRN. And that demand has many sources.
    Last edited by acptulsa; 03-13-2018 at 07:39 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Ron is wrong...
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Amash is wrong...

  16. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Wise words.

    Yes, the level of economic literacy has dropped precipitously over the last few years. Indeed, the level of literacy dropped considerably when the alt-right and Bolton's paid Trumptrolls invaded, much less the economic literacy. That said, many here don't feel particularly invested in the system you describe. Many would as soon toss a monkey wrench in it. The amusing thing is, the ones screeching the loudest for the tariff are very probably the ones most invested in defending the current system. Another of a few thousand delicious ironies they have brought to the board with their collectivism and their love of our new Big Orange Brother.

    Nonetheless, your lesson in Petrodollar Management 101 was obviously sorely needed, and remarkably clear and concise. Thank you for the timely lesson.
    Can't rep you. I guess I don't give much rep anymore. Anyway, I'm not saying the solution to our problems is to keep printing money and then exporting it to countries that want to make products for us for nothing to keep the CPI at bay. But the part I have a problem with is the monetary policy to begin with, not with trade policies. If countries want to continue to make cheap goods for us, we should be allowed to buy them without the government taking a cut.

    Honestly, some hefty tariffs on all goods would probably be a good thing, because it would blow this whole system up. Maybe people would fight back if they need a wheelbarrow full of dollars to buy something to eat.

  17. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gold Standard View Post
    Can't rep you. I guess I don't give much rep anymore. Anyway, I'm not saying the solution to our problems is to keep printing money and then exporting it to countries that want to make products for us for nothing to keep the CPI at bay. But the part I have a problem with is the monetary policy to begin with, not with trade policies. If countries want to continue to make cheap goods for us, we should be allowed to buy them without the government taking a cut.

    Honestly, some hefty tariffs on all goods would probably be a good thing, because it would blow this whole system up. Maybe people would fight back if they need a wheelbarrow full of dollars to buy something to eat.
    As they used to say in the Confederacy during the Civil War, 'We used to carry our money to the market in our pockets, and carry our groceries home in baskets. Now we carry our money to market in baskets, and carry our groceries home in our pockets.'
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Ron is wrong...
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Amash is wrong...

  18. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The destruction of the middle class and expansion of the welfare state are real problems. The causes and solutions (if any) are the question. Platitudes do not help, and often make the political situation worse. Thus we now have generations that believe socialism is the answer, and capitalism is evil.
    How to help the middle and working class? In 2007, Ron Paul said that taming the Federal Reserve and cutting Federal spending were possible solutions (Ron also advocated a low, flat tariff to replace income tax). The exact opposite was done instead...

    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  19. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We have a trade deficit because other countries have subsidized their industries and blocked ours with tariffs while we have done nothing or in many cases we actually subsidized foreign industries at the expense of our own.

    The longer we allow the status quo the closer we will get to being broke and unable to provide for ourselves.
    It's not because of tariffs. Back in the 1950s we had the highest paid workers on the planet and had no trade deficit. That's because the cost of government was much lower and we had a much more free market economy. We need to shrink government. That's the answer, not more government taxes and regulations.


    From Peter Schiff:

    "A Tale of Two Farmers

    Farmer Chang only grows oranges. Farmer Jones only grows apples. Each grows only the fruit that he produces most efficiently, trading the surplus for the fruit grown by the other. Both farmers benefit from comparative advantage and free trade. The sole reason that Farmer Chang ďexportsĒ oranges is to ďimportĒ apples, and vise-versa.

    Suppose that one year a frost wipes out farmer Jonesí apple crop. Not having any fruit to trade, but hungry nevertheless, he proposes to trade apple IOUs for farmer Changís oranges. Since Farmer Chang cannot eat all of the oranges he grew anyway, and since farmer Jonesí IOUs will pay 10% interest (in extra apples of course) he agrees.

    Farmer Chang only accepts farmer Jonesí offer because of the apples that Farmer Jonesí IOUs promise to pay. By themselves, the IOUs have no intrinsic value. Farmer Chang cannot eat them. It is only the promise to pay apples that gives them value. Actual payment will not occur until Farmer Jones redeems his IOUs with real apples.

    Now suppose that the following year farmer Jonesí crop is again destroyed, this time by a flood. He and Farmer Chang once again make the same deal, with Farmer Jones getting more of Farmer Changís oranges, and Farmer Chang accepting more of Farmer Jonesí IOUs.

    Further suppose that similar natural disasters continue to besiege Farmer Jones for several more years, with Farmer Chang continuing to accept Farmer Jonesí interest-bearing apple IOUs in exchange for his oranges. Eventually it dawns on Farmer Jones that he is eating pretty well, without actually farming. He therefore decides to turn his apple orchard into a golf course, and simply play golf all day while enjoying Farmer Changís oranges. In other words, Farmer Jones now operates a ďservice economy.Ē

    Farmer Chang on the other hand is so busy growing all those oranges that he never gets a chance to play Farmer Jonesí course. In fact, he has been accepting farmer Jonesís IOUs for so long that he no longer remembers his original reason for doing so. He forgot about his original desire to actually eat the real apples Farmer Jones had promised to deliver. Instead, he now counts his wealth based solely on his accumulation of apple IOUs.

    In fact, Farmer Jones had such a good reputation within the farming community that Farmer Chang was actually able to trade some of Farmer Jonesí IOUs for goods and services provided by other farmers and local merchants. Apparently no one bothered to notice that Farmer Jonesí apple orchard had become a golf course, and that his IOUs were therefore worthless, as he no longer possessed the ability to redeem them with actual apples.

    Some might argue that the entire community now depends on Farmer Jones and his worthless IOUs and that everyone will accept them indifferently rather than acknowledging the reality of their folly. Of course, were these revelations to occur, any unfortunate holders of Farmer Jonesí IOUs would officially be forced to realize their losses. However, their true financial situations would improve, as any further accumulation of worthless IOUs would end. As for Farmer Chang, he would literally once again enjoy all of the fruits of his labor.

    The real loser of course would be Farmer Jones, for without a viable apple orchard or the ability to buy oranges on credit, he would starve. It would take years to transform his golf course back into an orchard, regain his lost knowledge of farming, and replace his obsolete or dilapidated farming equipment (provided he hadn't already traded it in for golf carts and titanium clubs). In the end, his only alternative might be to sell his golf course to farmer Chang and take a job picking fruit in his orange grove."

    http://www.europac.com/commentaries/tale_two_farmers

  20. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    It's not because of tariffs. Back in the 1950s we had the highest paid workers on the planet and had no trade deficit. That's because the cost of government was much lower and we had a much more free market economy. We need to shrink government. That's the answer, not more government taxes and regulations.


    From Peter Schiff:

    "A Tale of Two Farmers

    Farmer Chang only grows oranges. Farmer Jones only grows apples. Each grows only the fruit that he produces most efficiently, trading the surplus for the fruit grown by the other. Both farmers benefit from comparative advantage and free trade. The sole reason that Farmer Chang “exports” oranges is to “import” apples, and vise-versa.

    Suppose that one year a frost wipes out farmer Jones’ apple crop. Not having any fruit to trade, but hungry nevertheless, he proposes to trade apple IOUs for farmer Chang’s oranges. Since Farmer Chang cannot eat all of the oranges he grew anyway, and since farmer Jones’ IOUs will pay 10% interest (in extra apples of course) he agrees.

    Farmer Chang only accepts farmer Jones’ offer because of the apples that Farmer Jones’ IOUs promise to pay. By themselves, the IOUs have no intrinsic value. Farmer Chang cannot eat them. It is only the promise to pay apples that gives them value. Actual payment will not occur until Farmer Jones redeems his IOUs with real apples.

    Now suppose that the following year farmer Jones’ crop is again destroyed, this time by a flood. He and Farmer Chang once again make the same deal, with Farmer Jones getting more of Farmer Chang’s oranges, and Farmer Chang accepting more of Farmer Jones’ IOUs.

    Further suppose that similar natural disasters continue to besiege Farmer Jones for several more years, with Farmer Chang continuing to accept Farmer Jones’ interest-bearing apple IOUs in exchange for his oranges. Eventually it dawns on Farmer Jones that he is eating pretty well, without actually farming. He therefore decides to turn his apple orchard into a golf course, and simply play golf all day while enjoying Farmer Chang’s oranges. In other words, Farmer Jones now operates a “service economy.”

    Farmer Chang on the other hand is so busy growing all those oranges that he never gets a chance to play Farmer Jones’ course. In fact, he has been accepting farmer Jones’s IOUs for so long that he no longer remembers his original reason for doing so. He forgot about his original desire to actually eat the real apples Farmer Jones had promised to deliver. Instead, he now counts his wealth based solely on his accumulation of apple IOUs.

    In fact, Farmer Jones had such a good reputation within the farming community that Farmer Chang was actually able to trade some of Farmer Jones’ IOUs for goods and services provided by other farmers and local merchants. Apparently no one bothered to notice that Farmer Jones’ apple orchard had become a golf course, and that his IOUs were therefore worthless, as he no longer possessed the ability to redeem them with actual apples.

    Some might argue that the entire community now depends on Farmer Jones and his worthless IOUs and that everyone will accept them indifferently rather than acknowledging the reality of their folly. Of course, were these revelations to occur, any unfortunate holders of Farmer Jones’ IOUs would officially be forced to realize their losses. However, their true financial situations would improve, as any further accumulation of worthless IOUs would end. As for Farmer Chang, he would literally once again enjoy all of the fruits of his labor.

    The real loser of course would be Farmer Jones, for without a viable apple orchard or the ability to buy oranges on credit, he would starve. It would take years to transform his golf course back into an orchard, regain his lost knowledge of farming, and replace his obsolete or dilapidated farming equipment (provided he hadn't already traded it in for golf carts and titanium clubs). In the end, his only alternative might be to sell his golf course to farmer Chang and take a job picking fruit in his orange grove."

    http://www.europac.com/commentaries/tale_two_farmers
    I'm sorry but I'm not about to let the ChiComs take over America because our leaders destroyed us by both destructive government intervention and collaboration with the ChiComs trade war.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  21. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by The Gold Standard View Post
    I don't know why you're clamoring for all of these dollars to come home. The inflation would be catastrophic. The trade deficit and cheap foreign goods are what have funded the government for the last 40 years. If we weren't exporting our inflation, we would be starving to death here.
    I've wondered if it's possible that we could get hyper hyperinflation when that happens, since it is so easy to unload dollars electronically. Imagine you're the bank of China and you see the dollars you're holding suddenly losing value. You be looking to dump those dollars as fast as you could and buy real stuff. You could do it all over the internet, just buy real estate and stocks. The only problem, from China's perspective, is that I think they mostly own treasuries, not dollars, so I'm assuming they'd have to sell those first for dollars and then buy stuff. And that would collapse the price of treasuries, wouldn't it? Not sure exactly how that works.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Gold Standard View Post
    Which incidentally, is another good reason why this idea that tariffs will fix our problem is so ridiculous. First of all, you are slapping an extra tax on imports, squeezing consumers. If that has your desired effect of slowing the export of dollars, prices of everything will skyrocket here, once again bankrupting the middle class and putting 'Murican manufacturing out of business.

    People weren't always this economically illiterate and short sighted here. It's a shame.

    I agree. Why is our first instinct to ADD government? Shouldn't we try smaller government/capitalism first? Then let's see if we can compete internationally. I'm betting we can.



  22. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  23. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I'm sorry but I'm not about to let the ChiComs take over America because our leaders destroyed us by both destructive government intervention and collaboration with the ChiComs trade war.
    You don't have much faith in free markets.

  24. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    From Peter Schiff:
    ...
    The real loser of course would be Farmer Jones, for without a viable apple orchard or the ability to buy oranges on credit, he would starve. It would take years to transform his golf course back into an orchard, regain his lost knowledge of farming, and replace his obsolete or dilapidated farming equipment (provided he hadn't already traded it in for golf carts and titanium clubs). In the end, his only alternative might be to sell his golf course to farmer Chang and take a job picking fruit in his orange grove."

    http://www.europac.com/commentaries/tale_two_farmers
    Great allegory, because it illustrates the role of the Federal Reserve, which seems to be missing in most discussions on the trade issue.

    It could be said that Farmer Jones is already selling his golf course piece by piece to Farmer Chang, and Chang is paying with those same IOUs instead of oranges. Who is the sucker now?

    So in reality, ignoring the advantage to the person with the printing press who benefits via inflation, the actual trade here was oranges for real estate. Farmer Jones got oranges, Farmer Chang got Farmer Jones' farm.
    Last edited by Brian4Liberty; 03-14-2018 at 04:26 PM.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  25. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    You don't have much faith in free markets.
    Not when dealing with COMMUNIST foreign governments.

    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  26. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Great allegory, because it illustrates the role of the Federal Reserve, which seems to be missing in most discussions on the trade issue.

    It could be said that Farmer Jones is already selling his golf course piece by piece to Farmer Chang, and Chang is paying with those same IOUs instead of oranges. Who is the sucker now?
    Yeah, I was thinking it's not even possible to have a "trade deficit" if you are using real money, is it? What if we were paying with actual gold? I don't think that would be a trade deficit, I think you need paper(IOUs) for that to happen.

  27. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    You don't have much faith in free markets.
    Its fairly well established Swordsmyth detests free markets, free will, and free men. If it isn't centrally organized by the State SS isn't interested.
    ďMaybe I forgot to mention something to you: I donít believe in queens. You think freedom is something you can give and take on a whim. But to your people, freedom is as essential as air. And without it, there is no life. There is only darkness.Ē -Zaheer

    "A man chooses. A slave obeys."-Andrew Ryan

    "There are three things the parasite hates: free markets, free will, and free men."-Andrew Ryan

  28. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I'm sorry but I'm not about to let the ChiComs take over America because our leaders destroyed us by both destructive government intervention and collaboration with the ChiComs trade war.
    The irony of course being that the Chinese Communists have more honest to goodness free markets in their Special Economic Zones than the USA has had in the last 50 years. The result of which has been an explosion of wealth for the nation and people.
    ďMaybe I forgot to mention something to you: I donít believe in queens. You think freedom is something you can give and take on a whim. But to your people, freedom is as essential as air. And without it, there is no life. There is only darkness.Ē -Zaheer

    "A man chooses. A slave obeys."-Andrew Ryan

    "There are three things the parasite hates: free markets, free will, and free men."-Andrew Ryan

  29. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    Yeah, I was thinking it's not even possible to have a "trade deficit" if you are using real money, is it? What if we were paying with actual gold? I don't think that would be a trade deficit, I think you need paper(IOUs) for that to happen.
    Or credit...which is a just form of IOU. But credit has come in very handy for the purposes of the global economic hitmen, who then destroy (or fully control) the entity buying on credit.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  30. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by PierzStyx View Post
    Its fairly well established Swordsmyth detests free markets, free will, and free men. If it isn't centrally organized by the State SS isn't interested.
    You say that about anyone who isn't an Anarchist.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



  31. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  32. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    This person has no idea what they're talking about.

    In nearly every country in the world, bank accounts and similar investments denominated in dollars pay a higher rate of return than those denominated in the local currency. Why do you suppose that is?

    Why do you suppose it is that when I go to Egypt, they will only permit me to purchase an Egyptian visa from Egyptians in dollars or euros?
    Even when foreign nations keep our dollars it does us good. Not just as Gold Standard lays out but from an economic perspective. America's currency has stayed afloat because it is the world reserve currency. Crashing it would destroy the economies of most major nations on the planet. So having a place tie their economic wealth and health directly to the value of the US dollar only grants us greater security.
    ďMaybe I forgot to mention something to you: I donít believe in queens. You think freedom is something you can give and take on a whim. But to your people, freedom is as essential as air. And without it, there is no life. There is only darkness.Ē -Zaheer

    "A man chooses. A slave obeys."-Andrew Ryan

    "There are three things the parasite hates: free markets, free will, and free men."-Andrew Ryan

  33. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You say that about anyone who isn't an Anarchist.
    No, just about Fascists and Socialists.
    ďMaybe I forgot to mention something to you: I donít believe in queens. You think freedom is something you can give and take on a whim. But to your people, freedom is as essential as air. And without it, there is no life. There is only darkness.Ē -Zaheer

    "A man chooses. A slave obeys."-Andrew Ryan

    "There are three things the parasite hates: free markets, free will, and free men."-Andrew Ryan

  34. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by PierzStyx View Post
    No, just about Fascists and Socialists.
    You say that about anyone who isn't an Anarchist.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  35. #60
    The best way to figure out if trade deficits are good is for the government to do nothing at all to interfere with trade. And if a trade deficit obtains in that situation, then that means it's good, because it's what results from people doing what they want with their own property.

    If all countries practiced totally free trade, then obviously some would have trade deficits, and others trade surpluses, and whatever the case was for any country, that would be what was best for both them and their trading partners.

    The test Trump should try out here is to give us 0% tariffs and lift all other trade restrictions with all nations and see what happens. If we end up with a trade deficit by doing that, then that means it's good for us to have a trade deficit.

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast


Similar Threads

  1. Trade Deficits: Will Protectionism Help?
    By jct74 in forum Ron Paul Forum
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 03-26-2016, 06:18 PM
  2. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 10-04-2013, 07:56 PM
  3. Aren't trillion dollar deficits a good thing??
    By socialize_me in forum Grassroots Central
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 01-19-2009, 10:51 PM
  4. Replies: 10
    Last Post: 01-07-2009, 06:20 PM
  5. Trade Deficits, Peter Schiff, and protectionism
    By Andrew-Austin in forum Economy & Markets
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 12-05-2008, 08:29 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •