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Thread: Should Libertarians support the G.I. Bill?

  1. #1

    Should Libertarians support the G.I. Bill?

    Should Libertarians support the concept of tax-payer funded vouchers to cover college tuition and housing in order to honor the brave men and women who serve in our military? I suspect that one Libertarian argument against the G.I. Bill would be that charities, churches, businesses, local school districts, and the like would hold say fundraisers in order to help facilitate the cost of attendance and living expenses for our veterans. In addition to that, they would simply have to get a job and apply for state/private loans and scholarships like everybody else.
    "I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just: that his justice cannot sleep for ever." - Founding Father Thomas Jefferson



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  3. #2
    Anything that helps the docile population feel the brunt of war is good long term. So far the war has been out of sight.

  4. #3
    Why do big-L "libertarians" and conservatives want the military to be a jobs and education program? Sounds like welfare to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RP Support me on Patreon here Ephesians 6:12

  5. #4
    Specific compensation packages for the troops may be debated on other factors but there is nothing inherently un-libertarian about them.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Specific compensation packages for the troops may be debated on other factors but there is nothing inherently un-libertarian about them.
    Let the troops negotiate the terms of the contract with uncle Sam. Might be a good business idea to advise on these contracts. Can we utilize AI on this?

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by uncharted View Post
    Should Libertarians support the concept of tax-payer funded vouchers to cover college tuition and housing in order to honor the brave men and women who serve in our military? I suspect that one Libertarian argument against the G.I. Bill would be that charities, churches, businesses, local school districts, and the like would hold say fundraisers in order to help facilitate the cost of attendance and living expenses for our veterans. In addition to that, they would simply have to get a job and apply for state/private loans and scholarships like everybody else.
    Barring conscription, soldiers have to be payed, and this is just a form of pay. If you eliminated these in-kind benefits, you'd have to increase the cash salary to attract the same number of volunteers. That said, it's not a wash; it actually would be preferable to convert the benefits of the GI bill into cash payments, for the same reason that it would make sense to convert in-kind welfare benefits (e.g. Medicare) into cash payouts (i.e. individuals will spend this money more intelligently than the state on their behalf).
    "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."

    -H. L. Mencken

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    Let the troops negotiate the terms of the contract with uncle Sam. Might be a good business idea to advise on these contracts. Can we utilize AI on this?
    Collective bargaining and government don't mix, Congress and the Pentagon should decide what to pay and adjust it based on how many people are joining and staying vs. the taxpayers' interests.
    Last edited by Swordsmyth; 03-02-2018 at 08:52 PM.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    soldiers have to be payed
    Payed, hm .... Am I the only one having trouble digesting this?



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Collective bargaining and government don't mix, Congress and the Pentagon should decide what to pay and adjust it based on how many people are joining and staying vs. the taxpayers interests.
    There is nothing collective about the negotiations I am proposing. You want me to put my ass in the line of fire for very dubious and possible shady reasons? Show me the money.


  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    There is nothing collective about the negotiations I am proposing. You want me to put my ass in the line of fire for very dubious and possible shady reasons? Show me the money.

    If you don't like the pay don't join, if enough people don't like the pay Congress can raise it.
    You could allow the military some limited ability to negotiate with recruits but unless you had special skills that other recruits didn't they would have little reason to.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    There is nothing collective about the negotiations I am proposing. You want me to put my ass in the line of fire for very dubious and possible shady reasons? Show me the money.

    Seems weird, but the military isn't supposed to be about profit. If you *want* to get into it, know that you're doing it for "patriotic" type reasons-serving yer country and all that jazz. It's not supposed to be a lucrative carrer. If you want that, get into private defense industry.
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RP Support me on Patreon here Ephesians 6:12

  14. #12
    I have had repairs done at a VA hospital,, and I am promised a hole in the ground and a flag.
    I spent the $2000 CASH BONUS I got for enlisting Combat Arms.
    The college benefits I never used,, as I saw no benefit.
    and the Home Loans would never cover anything I would buy.

    I don't expect anything.. but I may need repair again at some point.

    I think we are cool.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by heavenlyboy34 View Post
    Seems weird, but the military isn't supposed to be about profit. If you *want* to get into it, know that you're doing it for "patriotic" type reasons-serving yer country and all that jazz. It's not supposed to be a lucrative carrer. If you want that, get into private defense industry.
    Funny how that works - http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...Defense-Budget

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by uncharted View Post
    Should Libertarians support the concept of tax-payer funded vouchers to cover college tuition and housing in order to honor the brave men and women who serve in our military?
    How do you discern the brave from the cowardly or the sociopaths?
    All modern revolutions have ended in a reinforcement of the power of the State.
    -Albert Camus

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by otherone View Post
    How do you discern the brave from the cowardly or the sociopaths?
    You don't. That's the beauty of the system.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by uncharted View Post
    Should Libertarians support the concept of tax-payer funded (insert anything here)

    NO

    'We endorse the idea of voluntarism; self-responsibility: Family, friends, and churches to solve problems, rather than saying that some monolithic government is going to make you take care of yourself and be a better person. It's a preposterous notion: It never worked, it never will. The government can't make you a better person; it can't make you follow good habits.' - Ron Paul 1988

    Awareness is the Root of Liberation Revolution is Action upon Revelation

    'Resistance and Disobedience in Economic Activity is the Most Moral Human Action Possible' - SEK3

    Flectere si nequeo superos, Acheronta movebo.

    ...the familiar ritual of institutional self-absolution...
    ...for protecting them, by mock trial, from punishment...




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