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Thread: Survey: Roughly half of Americans in favor of UBI welfare

  1. #1

    Exclamation Survey: Roughly half of Americans in favor of UBI welfare

    More Americans now support a universal basic income

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/26/roug...ic-income.html

    •Forty-eight percent of Americans support a universal basic income.
    •Longtime advocates say we're closer than ever to adopting the program.

    Annie Nova Published 8 Hours Ago | Updated 7 Hours Ago CNBC.com

    Political philosopher and economist Karl Widerquist, an associate professor at Georgetown University in Qatar, remembers a poll from 10 years ago that showed just 12 percent of Americans approved of a universal basic income.

    That's changed — and quickly. Today, 48 percent of Americans support it, according to a new Northeastern University/Gallup survey of more than 3,000 U.S. adults.

    "It represents an enormous increase in support," said Widerquist, who is a well-known advocate for a universal basic income. "It's really promising."

    Proposals for universal basic income programs vary, but the most common one is a system in which the federal government sends out regular checks to everyone, regardless of their earnings or employment.

    Pilots of such programs are underway in Finland and Canada. In rural Kenya, a basic income is managed by nonprofit GiveDirectly. India — with a population of more than 1.3 billion residents — is considering establishing a universal basic income.

    "People are saying, 'Look we cannot let inequality continue to grow because the political consequences could be a disaster.'" -Guy Standing, co-founder of the Basic Income Earth Network

    Some projects are happening closer to the U.S.

    Y Combinator Research, based in Oakland, California, started a test of a basic income last year, and is raising funds to expand the research project. This year in Stockton, California, Mayor Michael Tubbs's Stockton Economic Empowerment Demonstration will give several dozen low-income families $500 each month in a study of basic income. And for decades, Alaska residents have each received around $2,000 a year from the Alaska Permanent Fund.

    These examples are an opportunity to debunk many of the myths about a universal basic income, said Guy Standing, co-founder of the Basic Income Earth Network. He recently spoke at the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland, on the subject.

    "The claim is often made that if you give people a basic income, they'll become lazy and stop doing work," Standing said. "It's an insult to the human condition. Basic incomes tend to increase people's work rather than reduce it."

    That's because research has shown that a basic income can improve people's mental and physical health, Standing said, as well as encourage them to pursue employment for reasons more meaningful than just a need to put food on the table.

    Rising inequality, and its vast effects, have triggered a "perfect storm" for basic income, Standing said.

    "People are saying, 'Look we cannot let inequality continue to grow, because the political consequences could be a disaster'," Standing said, pointing to the recent rise of more authoritarian figures.

    Even amid a booming economy, wage-growth has been sluggish. At the same time, the list of jobs robots are able to fill is growing more impressive (and perhaps worrisome). The Northeastern University/Gallup survey showed that three quarters of Americans believe machines will take away more jobs than they'll generate.

    "We don't need to threaten people with homelessness and poverty to get them to work," Widerquist said. "It's capitalism where income doesn't start at zero."

    Still, the survey found that 52 percent of Americans do not support a basic income. The idea is more popular with certain groups.

    For example, 65 percent of Democrats want to see a universal basic income, and 54 percent of people between the ages of 18 and 35 do. In comparison, just 28 percent of Republicans support universal basic income.

    "Anything that sounds like welfare gets a much more negative reaction from Republicans," said Frank Newport, editor-in-chief of Gallup.

    Newport said he found it interesting that the public doesn't necessarily want the government to pay for the universal basic income. Instead, 80 percent of supporters say that the companies that benefit from artificial intelligence should pay the higher taxes to fund a basic income.

    Standing said Americans might be receiving those checks sooner than previously thought, thanks to the realization of what could follow if they never came.

    "You can't have a free market economy if people are constantly insecure," Standing said. "You can't expect them to be rational."
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11



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  3. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    More Americans now support a universal basic income

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/26/roug...ic-income.html

    •Forty-eight percent of Americans support a universal basic income.
    •Longtime advocates say we're closer than ever to adopting the program.

    Annie Nova Published 8 Hours Ago | Updated 7 Hours Ago CNBC.com

    Political philosopher and economist Karl Widerquist, an associate professor at Georgetown University in Qatar, remembers a poll from 10 years ago that showed just 12 percent of Americans approved of a universal basic income.

    That's changed — and quickly. Today, 48 percent of Americans support it, according to a new Northeastern University/Gallup survey of more than 3,000 U.S. adults.

    "It represents an enormous increase in support," said Widerquist, who is a well-known advocate for a universal basic income. "It's really promising."

    Proposals for universal basic income programs vary, but the most common one is a system in which the federal government sends out regular checks to everyone, regardless of their earnings or employment.

    Pilots of such programs are underway in Finland and Canada. In rural Kenya, a basic income is managed by nonprofit GiveDirectly. India — with a population of more than 1.3 billion residents — is considering establishing a universal basic income.

    "People are saying, 'Look we cannot let inequality continue to grow because the political consequences could be a disaster.'" -Guy Standing, co-founder of the Basic Income Earth Network

    Some projects are happening closer to the U.S.

    Y Combinator Research, based in Oakland, California, started a test of a basic income last year, and is raising funds to expand the research project. This year in Stockton, California, Mayor Michael Tubbs's Stockton Economic Empowerment Demonstration will give several dozen low-income families $500 each month in a study of basic income. And for decades, Alaska residents have each received around $2,000 a year from the Alaska Permanent Fund.

    These examples are an opportunity to debunk many of the myths about a universal basic income, said Guy Standing, co-founder of the Basic Income Earth Network. He recently spoke at the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland, on the subject.

    "The claim is often made that if you give people a basic income, they'll become lazy and stop doing work," Standing said. "It's an insult to the human condition. Basic incomes tend to increase people's work rather than reduce it."

    That's because research has shown that a basic income can improve people's mental and physical health, Standing said, as well as encourage them to pursue employment for reasons more meaningful than just a need to put food on the table.

    Rising inequality, and its vast effects, have triggered a "perfect storm" for basic income, Standing said.

    "People are saying, 'Look we cannot let inequality continue to grow, because the political consequences could be a disaster'," Standing said, pointing to the recent rise of more authoritarian figures.

    Even amid a booming economy, wage-growth has been sluggish. At the same time, the list of jobs robots are able to fill is growing more impressive (and perhaps worrisome). The Northeastern University/Gallup survey showed that three quarters of Americans believe machines will take away more jobs than they'll generate.

    "We don't need to threaten people with homelessness and poverty to get them to work," Widerquist said. "It's capitalism where income doesn't start at zero."

    Still, the survey found that 52 percent of Americans do not support a basic income. The idea is more popular with certain groups.

    For example, 65 percent of Democrats want to see a universal basic income, and 54 percent of people between the ages of 18 and 35 do. In comparison, just 28 percent of Republicans support universal basic income.

    "Anything that sounds like welfare gets a much more negative reaction from Republicans," said Frank Newport, editor-in-chief of Gallup.

    Newport said he found it interesting that the public doesn't necessarily want the government to pay for the universal basic income. Instead, 80 percent of supporters say that the companies that benefit from artificial intelligence should pay the higher taxes to fund a basic income.

    Standing said Americans might be receiving those checks sooner than previously thought, thanks to the realization of what could follow if they never came.

    "You can't have a free market economy if people are constantly insecure," Standing said. "You can't expect them to be rational."
    you know, what happens when somebody takes out a loan against his future income, and spends it all on something and loses it...what do you do then? let him die? this is why UBI can't work.

  4. #3
    That's because half of Americans have been on welfare and don't know any better.
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by donnay View Post
    That's because half of Americans have been on welfare and don't know any better.
    Over 50% "get a check"..

    SSI, disability, government "employee" or pensioner, and welfare too...

    Then throw in the businesses that only exist off of graft.......

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by tod evans View Post
    Over 50% "get a check"..

    SSI, disability, government "employee" or pensioner, and welfare too...

    Then throw in the businesses that only exist off of graft.......

    Yep, what better way to control people? It has always been the carrot and stick agenda.
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  7. #6
    Good thing we don't live in a democracy where majority rules.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  8. #7
    WTF . american greatness .

  9. #8
    Nobody asked me- Fake News.
    There is no spoon.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by tod evans View Post
    Over 50% "get a check"..

    SSI, disability, government "employee" or pensioner, and welfare too...

    Then throw in the businesses that only exist off of graft.......

    I guess those of us who aren't dependent upon government for our subsistence will just have to vote that much harder then.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Nobody asked me- Fake News.
    We have oversampled the useful idiot demo many times over to make sure your views are included.

  13. #11
    Proposals for universal basic income programs vary, but the most common one is a system in which the federal government sends out regular checks to everyone, regardless of their earnings or employment.
    We should send a check for $1,000,000 each year to every person on the planet. We are a rich nation. We can afford it.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    We should send a check for $1,000,000 each year to every person on the planet. We are a rich nation. We can afford it.
    Money's just clicks on a keyboard, so that should be easy.
    There is no spoon.

  15. #13
    I would not oppose the UBI if we are not going to have free markets as we are whittled down to a handful of monopolies and globalism that enslave us. You add automation putting the majority out of work and no abolition of anti-liberty property taxes so we can check out of the system to live freely on our own lands, then you would be a fool to oppose the UBI.

    I would go a step further say people should campaign for UBI in that case. Either oppose it or drag the Oligarchs out of the homes, dismantle the monopolies and confiscate all their wealth. Restore liberty and abolish taxes on private property thereafter.

  16. #14
    i am pro UBI... in a new crypto dollar managed by the FEDs.

    if idiots spend it all on booze.. my answer is go read Darwin.

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    i am pro UBI... in a new crypto dollar managed by the FEDs.

    if idiots spend it all on booze.. my answer is go read Darwin.
    E-currency, new credits, prepaid cards...it will be paid in some form of that.

    So that purchasing booze will be prohibited, along with many other things as well.

  18. #16
    The Land of Cockaigne (Bruegel)

    Fear of man will prove to be a snare, but whoever trusts in the LORD is kept safe. Proverbs 29:25
    "I think the propaganda machine is the biggest problem that we face today in trying to get the truth out to people."
    Ron Paul

    Please watch, subscribe, like, & share, Ron Paul Liberty Report
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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Good thing we don't live in a democracy where majority rules.
    "constitutional republic"

    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  21. #18
    It was the Republicans that first floated the UBI. Nixon's plan in 1969 would have given a poor family of four $1600 a year, equivalent to around $10,000 in today's dollars.

  22. #19

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    E-currency, new credits, prepaid cards...it will be paid in some form of that.

    So that purchasing booze will be prohibited, along with many other things as well.
    So I can't spend it at ammo.com? Well, there went my enthusiasm.

  24. #21
    I don't see how the math makes any sense. Let's say you make it 10K a year. There's about 320 million citizens, that's 3.2 trillion which is our entire revenue. That leaves no money for the military or court system or SS or Medicare. What about sick or disabled people who can't live on 10K? What about retired people?

    The problem is that if you make the payment small enough that we can afford it, it'll just be a small supplement, most people won't be able to live off it.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    I don't see how the math makes any sense. Let's say you make it 10K a year. There's about 320 million citizens, that's 3.2 trillion which is our entire revenue. That leaves no money for the military or court system or SS or Medicare. What about sick or disabled people who can't live on 10K? What about retired people?

    The problem is that if you make the payment small enough that we can afford it, it'll just be a small supplement, most people won't be able to live off it.
    There are some proposals where all existing programs are eliminated and replaced with an UBI that everyone receives..

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    I don't see how the math makes any sense. Let's say you make it 10K a year. There's about 320 million citizens, that's 3.2 trillion which is our entire revenue. That leaves no money for the military or court system or SS or Medicare. What about sick or disabled people who can't live on 10K? What about retired people?

    The problem is that if you make the payment small enough that we can afford it, it'll just be a small supplement, most people won't be able to live off it.
    Ctrl-P
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    I don't see how the math makes any sense. Let's say you make it 10K a year. There's about 320 million citizens, that's 3.2 trillion which is our entire revenue. That leaves no money for the military or court system or SS or Medicare. What about sick or disabled people who can't live on 10K? What about retired people?

    The problem is that if you make the payment small enough that we can afford it, it'll just be a small supplement, most people won't be able to live off it.
    Once we discover alien life maybe we can convince them to invest in our UBI scheme.



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  29. #25
    A tax increase on monopolies could make up for about 1.5T shortfall and would be a way to deal with them. Historically all the right wing media screaming about raising taxes on the rich would likely ensure the poor and middle class take the hit to pay for the UBI. Meanwhile someone like Bezo's and Amazon would again pay nothing.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by kahless View Post
    There are some proposals where all existing programs are eliminated and replaced with an UBI that everyone receives..
    There's lots of proposals out there. Karl Marx had one. That didn't mean it would work.

    You're not serious about this are you?

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by kahless View Post
    A tax increase on monopolies could make up for about 1.5T shortfall and would be a way to deal with them. Historically all the right wing media screaming about raising taxes on the rich would likely ensure the poor and middle class take the hit to pay for the UBI. Meanwhile someone like Bezo's and Amazon would again pay nothing.
    Two wrongs don't make a right.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Pilots of such programs are underway in Finland and Canada. In rural Kenya, a basic income is managed by nonprofit GiveDirectly. India — with a population of more than 1.3 billion residents — is considering establishing a universal basic income.
    Just to add to my previous post, all these "test" UBI programs work fine as long as it's a test on a teensy little group. The math blows up when you try to expand it to everyone. Hasn't any one of these idiots done some basic math? It's not hard, you take the number of citizens times the amount and you'll instantly discover it doesn't work. It's not quantum physics.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    There's lots of proposals out there. Karl Marx had one. That didn't mean it would work.

    You're not serious about this are you?
    No cliche responses from me posting here. Karl Marx is a huge leap since no one is talking about government ownership of means of production.

    So I am not proposing anything, it is just serious thinking about how they might justify it and where we are headed.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Two wrongs don't make a right.
    I do not want to take the hit on paying for it so for me it makes a right. Sick of being played for a fool while they promote such things and then make the rest of us pay for it.

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