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Thread: The new anti-gun position to throw shade on the use of SSRI's in mass shootings...

  1. #1

    The new anti-gun position to throw shade on the use of SSRI's in mass shootings...

    So there is a new position being foisted that has found foothold. "The myth of mental illness in mass shootings." It is finding foothold in the millions that are on SSRI's and, gosh darnit, are sick and tired of being scapegoated.

    It's being pushed by idiots such as this author who through assumptions and outright falsehoods mean to put this debate firmly back on anti-gun legislation ground.


    The Myth That Mental Illness Causes Mass Shootings

    A sick, demented man.” That was Donald Trump’s assessment of Stephen Paddock, who shot nearly 600 people, leaving 58 dead, during a concert in Las Vegas earlier this month. Echoing Trump’s rhetoric, House Speaker Paul Ryan said that “one of the things we’ve learned from these shootings is often underneath this is a diagnosis of mental illness.”

    Most Americans think that there is a strong link between mental illness and mass shooting, and shifting the national conversation to mental health reform carries the advantage of avoiding the more politically divisive gun-control debate. But what if Stephen Paddock had no diagnosable mental illness? And what if his mental state was the rule, not the exception?
    He goes on to talk about gun violence in general pointing to studies, BUT NOT the correlation in mass shootings.

    His agenda is certainly clear...

    Perpetuating the myth that mental illness is the cause of mass shootings only serves to stigmatize the mentally ill even further. In addition, it distracts from the more difficult conversation that must be had over gun-control in America.
    http://behavioralscientist.org/myth-...ass-shootings/

    It's not about mental illness or drugs don't you see? His assumptions and outright falsehoods prove it. Science!

    SMDH.



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  3. #2
    Yep. It's a propaganda campaign. See this on slate:

    http://www.slate.com/articles/health...h_all_dt_fb_ru

    Title: Mentally ill people aren’t killers. Angry people are.

  4. #3
    Big Pharma's tools ratcheting for tyranny.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    Yep. It's a propaganda campaign. See this on slate:

    http://www.slate.com/articles/health...h_all_dt_fb_ru

    Title: Mentally ill people aren’t killers. Angry people are.
    The cognitive dissonance of the author...

    Uncontrolled anger has become our No. 1 mental health issue. Though we have the understanding and the skills to treat the anger epidemic in this country, as a culture, we have been unwilling to accept the violence problem as one that belongs to each and every one of us. We have sought scapegoats in minority cultures, racial groups, and now the mentally ill.
    If an uncontrollable action is a mental health issue, then is it not a mental health disorder and as a disorder does that not make it an illness?

  6. #5
    Isn't it always about " gun control" (read that victim disarmament)?
    Last edited by CCTelander; 02-17-2018 at 03:19 PM.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  7. #6
    It has nothing to do with "Mental Illness".

    It is an issue of Mental Treatment..

    And a severe lack of ethical morality in the profession.

    And until serious discussion on the connection between the CIA and Mind Control Drugs it is a moot point..

    The root of the problem,, Mind Control.. The drugs and techniques
    and deliberate use of mind controlled subjects.

    and the Serious Consideration of the facts (That this is done) in investigations.

    Quit lynching the victim of Mind Control. and focus on the handler.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    The cognitive dissonance of the author...



    If an uncontrollable action is a mental health issue, then is it not a mental health disorder and as a disorder does that not make it an illness?
    Same thing in the article I posted.

    From the article:
    Anger disorders are a product of long-term anger mismanagement. They are a pathological misdirection of normal aggressive feelings.
    Definition of pathological: "involving, caused by, or of the nature of a physical or mental disease."

  9. #8
    minority cultures, racial groups, and now the mentally ill
    If the violent crimes committed by these groups were removed from the overall crime statistics, we'd have a violent crime rate similar to Belgium.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    Isn't it always about " gun control" (read that victim disarmament)?
    It's always about "control" of one sort or another.

    Every time something like this happens, the millions of us who haven't hurt anybody lose more freedom and get more "controlled".

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Every time something like this happens, the millions of us who haven't hurt anybody lose more freedom and get more "controlled".
    which makes such people have "mismanaged anger" some of whom decide to suddenly commit crimes... and the cycle repeats.

  13. #11
    Because everyone who decides to go on a mass killing spree is clear headed and mentally stable...
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  14. #12
    Another....

    Wake up USA: it’s not mental health problems that’s murdering your innocent children!

    Well, it’s easiest to say what it’s not: It isn’t immigrants; it isn’t Jihadists. It isn’t the simply the bonkers gun laws or the monstrous NRA, still projecting the insane idea that Americans need a militia in case Mad King George III wakes up and comes back to get them all. These unfortunately are just symptoms.

    And it isn’t — I am afraid to say — mental health problems, although the perpetrators were undoubtedly mad at the time of committing the crimes. It is about madness, though, I suggest. We have to, I venture, not only think psychologically but systemically about these things.
    https://medium.com/@nickduffell/wake...n-52360ac19716

    the psycho babble then goes on to promote his hypothesis regarding the "psychohistory" of the nation and that these mass shootings are just a symptom that can be stopped if we as a nation just atone for our sins.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    Another....



    https://medium.com/@nickduffell/wake...n-52360ac19716

    the psycho babble then goes on to promote his hypothesis regarding the "psychohistory" of the nation and that these mass shootings are just a symptom that can be stopped if we as a nation just atone for our sins.
    Ya' think a sane father might have straightened this lad out several years back?

    The mere idea of 'mental illness' fails to address the environment such maladies grow and mature within...

    I'm not talking about some sports-dad or a suit-n-tie, no time executive but an honest to goodness involved give a $#@! dad that cares about his kid....

  16. #14
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by donnay View Post

    Excellent. Donated.
    Pfizer Macht Frei!

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  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by tod evans View Post
    Ya' think a sane father might have straightened this lad out several years back?

    The mere idea of 'mental illness' fails to address the environment such maladies grow and mature within...

    I'm not talking about some sports-dad or a suit-n-tie, no time executive but an honest to goodness involved give a $#@! dad that cares about his kid....
    Yes, I think so.

    Removing troubled kids, especially boys, from the toxic environment of government screwls is the first step.

    I had a stepson that could have gone down the same path, (this was right after Columbine mind you, so the hysteria was as out of control as it is now) had we not removed him from the government institutions and finished his education through home schooling.



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  20. #17
    I quit cold turkey after finding pot. I was having trouble controlling myself, my thoughts, I had "psychotic episodes" which were just hallucinations, all that $#@!. Warfarin, adderall, cymbalta, maybe something else, but those were the ones I remember. Anyway, I quit cold turkey once, at my psychiatrist's ok, had a panic attack and went to ER, but nothing so awful happened as the $#@! I thought about while taking them. I remember sitting with my mother and constantly milling over the thought of killing her. I can't tell anybody to quit their pills, but I'm happy and grateful I did. I took them younger, but old enough that my body should have been done developing, so I don't know what stars need to align for these meds to work, but from my own experience I think they only "work" in the sense patients like me thought they did or wanted them to.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Raginfridus View Post
    I quit cold turkey after finding pot. I was having trouble controlling myself, my thoughts, I had "psychotic episodes" which were just hallucinations, all that $#@!. Warfarin, adderall, cymbalta, maybe something else, but those were the ones I remember. Anyway, I quit cold turkey once, at my psychiatrist's ok, had a panic attack and went to ER, but nothing so awful happened as the $#@! I thought about while taking them. I remember sitting with my mother and constantly milling over the thought of killing her. I can't tell anybody to quit their pills, but I'm happy and grateful I did. I took them younger, but old enough that my body should have been done developing, so I don't know what stars need to align for these meds to work, but from my own experience I think they only "work" in the sense patients like me thought they did or wanted them to.
    In my younger years kids weren't prescribed anything we stole Valium, Seconal and Dexedrine from our parents,,

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by tod evans View Post
    In my younger years kids weren't prescribed anything we stole Valium, Seconal and Dexedrine from our parents,,
    "Kids are different today, "
    I hear ev'ry mother say
    Mother needs something today to calm her down
    And though she's not really ill
    There's a little yellow pill
    She goes running for the shelter of a mother's little helper
    And it helps her on her way, gets her through her busy day

  23. #20
    Yeah, kids today might see a psychiatrist w/o a parent if they want. I dunno what the "rules" are. I was 22 or 23 when I started, quit for a year so I could try to enlist, started again. Finally quit for keeps when I was 27. Such a waste of $#@!ing money.

  24. #21
    @angelatc
    I found a school shooting that didn't involve SSRI's.

    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    If the violent crimes committed by these groups were removed from the overall crime statistics, we'd have a violent crime rate similar to Belgium.
    Probably. Eliminate gang bangers and suicides from gun death stats, and it's probably pretty low.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  26. #23
    WATCH: FOX News Cuts Off Reporter When She Links Psychotropic Drugs to Florida Shooter
    Illustrating his network's subservience to big pharma, FOX News' Sean Hannity blatantly cut off a reporter when she mentioned the fact that most mass shootings are linked to psychotropic drugs.

    By Matt Agorist - February 17, 2018



    Stephen Paddock, Omar Mateen, Gavin Long, Eric Harris, Dylan Klebold, James Holmes, and now, Nikolas Cruz all have one thing in common other than the mass murders they carried out. They were all reportedly taking prescription drugs which alter their state of mind and carry a host of negative side effects ranging from aggression and suicide to homicidal ideation.

    Suicide, birth defects, heart problems, hostility, violence, aggression, hallucinations, self-harm, delusional thinking, homicidal ideation, and death are just a few of the side effects caused by the medication taken by the monsters named above, some of which are known as SSRIs (selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors), or antidepressants.

    There have been 150 studies in 17 countries on antidepressant-induced side effects. There have been 134 drug regulatory agency warnings from 11 countries and the EU warning about the dangerous side effects of antidepressants.

    Despite this deadly laundry list of potential reactions to these medications, their use has skyrocketed by 400% since 1988. Coincidentally, as antidepressant use went up, so did mass shootings.

    The website SSRIstories.org has been documenting the link between selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) and violence. On the website is a collection of over 6,000 stories that have appeared in local media (newspapers, TV, scientific journals) in which prescription drugs were mentioned and in which the drugs may be linked to a variety of adverse outcomes including most of the mass shootings which have taken place on US soil.

    As the Citizens Commission on Human Rights notes, before the late nineteen-eighties, mass shootings and acts of senseless violence were relatively unheard of. Prozac, the most well known SSRI (selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor) antidepressant, was not yet on the market. When Prozac did arrive, it was marketed as a panacea for depression which resulted in huge profits for its manufacturer Eli Lilly. Of course other drug companies had to create their own cash cow and followed suit by marketing their own SSRI antidepressants.

    Subsequently, mass shootings and other violent incidents started to be reported. More often than not, the common denominator was that the shooters were on an antidepressant, or withdrawing from one. This is not about an isolated incident or two but numerous shootings.

    The issue of psychotropic medication playing a role in mass shootings is not some conspiracy theory. It is very real and the drug manufacturers list these potentially deadly side effects on the very inserts of every one of these drugs. But the mainstream media and the government continue to ignore or suppress this information. Why is that?

    In a clear example of how beholden mainstream media is to the pharmaceutical industries who manufacture and market these drugs, FOX News’ Sean Hannity was recorded this week, blatantly cutting off a reporter who dared mention Nikolas Cruz’s reported association with antidepressants.

    In a news segment this week, Hannity was interviewing radio talk show host, Gina Loudon who tried to bring up Cruz’s association with SSRIs.

    “I think we have to take a hard look at one thing we’re not talking about yet too, Sean, and that is psychotropic drugs,” Loudon says.

    “My guess is, we’ll find out like most of these shooters…..” she says, just before Hannity jumps in to silence her.

    Hannity then shuts up Loudon and moves to the doctor next to her. Just like that, all talk which was implicating big pharma in their role in mass shootings was effectively silenced.



    It is no secret that the pharmaceutical industry wields immense control over the government and the media. It is their control which keeps any negative press about their dangerous products from airing. However, most people likely do not know the scope of this control.

    As Mike Papantonio, attorney and host of the international television show America’s Lawyer, explains, with the exception of CBS, every major media outlet in the United States shares at least one board member with at least one pharmaceutical company. To put that into perspective: These board members wake up, go to a meeting at Merck or Pfizer, then they have their driver take them over to a meeting with NBC to decide what kind of programming that network is going to air.

    In the report below, Papantonio explains how the billions of dollars big pharma gives to mainstream media outlets every year is used to keep them subservient and complicit in covering up the slew of deadly side effects from their products.



    How much longer will we allow these billion-dollar drug companies to control the narrative and not let this conversation take place? How many more mass shootings will take place before Americans wake up to this reality?
    http://thefreethoughtproject.com/wat...zen.yandex.com
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  27. #24
    Frustration is mounting in the medical community as the Trump administration again points to mental illness in response to yet another mass shooting.

    "The concept that mental illness is a precursor to violent behavior is nonsense," said Dr. Louis Kraus, forensic psychiatry chief at Chicago's Rush University Medical College. "The vast majority of gun violence is not attributable to mental illness."
    Mental health professionals welcome more resources and attention, but they say the administration is ignoring the real problem — easy access to guns, particularly the kind of high-powered highly lethal assault weapons used in many of the most recent mass shootings.
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/doctors-b...-politics.html



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  29. #25
    "The concept that mental illness is a precursor to violent behavior is nonsense," said Dr. Louis Kraus, forensic psychiatry chief at Chicago's Rush University Medical College. "The vast majority of gun violence is not attributable to mental illness."
    Mental health professionals welcome more resources and attention, but they say the administration is ignoring the real problem — easy access to guns, particularly the kind of high-powered highly lethal assault weapons used in many of the most recent mass shootings.
    If you put an AR-15 with the black thingie that goes up in Sainte Mother Theresa's hands, she'll run right out to the nearest school and start mowing students down. They have the psycho enzyme built into their handles and no normal person can control themselves when they have that black thingie going up in their hands.

    That must be why it's the people who have an AR-15 and don't run out and mow down children with it who are the mentally ill ones!

    Q: How can you tell when corporations like Wal Mart have taken over the whole of society?

    A: When people who can control their impulses are considered mentally ill.

    He walked right past the soft pretzel booth without spending a dime! Put that straitjacket on him!
    Last edited by acptulsa; 02-19-2018 at 05:31 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    @<u><a href="http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?u=198" target="_blank">angelatc</a></u>
    I found a school shooting that didn't involve SSRI's.


    That one involved an even more powerful drug. Political power.


    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  31. #27

  32. #28
    From 2010...

    Five Reasons Not to Take SSRIs

    Now that SSRIs don't work for depression, don't take them!




    For the past five years, and in my recent book Obsession: A History, I have been questioning the effectiveness of Prozac-like drugs known as SSRIs. I've pointed out that when the drugs first came out in the early 1990's there was a wildly enthusiastic uptake in the prescribing of such drugs. Doctors were jubilantly claiming that the drugs were 80-90 per cent effective in treating depression and related conditions like OCD. In the last few years those success rates have been going down, with the NY Times pointing out that the initial numbers had been inflated by drug companies supressing the studies that were less encouraging. But few if any doctors or patients were willing to hear anything disparaging said about these "wonder" drugs.
    Now the tune has changed.
    Reason One: A study in the Journal of the American Medical Association (link is external)says that SSRI's like Paxil and Prozac are no more effective in treating depression than a placebo pill. That means they are 33 per cent effective, which is the percent of patients who will respond well to a sugar pill. The article goes on to say that although SSRI's are effective to some degree in treating severe depression they don't have any effect on the routine type of depressions they are most often used to treat. The take-home message is—don't take SSRI's if you have normal, mild, or routine depression. It's a waste of money, and the drugs have serious side-effects including loss of sexual drive.
    Reason Two: A January 4 article in MedPage Today (link is external) cites a study done at Columbia University and Johns Hopkins. The study says that doctors routinely prescribe not one but two or three SSRI's and other psychopharmological drugs in combination with few if any serious studies to back up the multiple usage. It's pretty obvious that the reason for these multiple prescriptions is that if one drug doesn't work, then perhaps two or three will. Doctors are in essence performing uncontrolled experiments on their patients, hoping that in some scattershot way they might hit on a solution. But of course drugs have dangerous interactions and most physicians are shooting in the dark with all the dangers that attend such bad marksmanship.
    Reason Three: More and more psychiatric disorders are appearing that might be called "lifestyle" diseases. What was called shyness, sadness, restlessness, shopping too much, high sex drive, low sex drive, and so on have increasingly been seen as diseases and many more will appear in the new DSM, the diagnostic manual of psychological and psychiatric disorders. Increasingly the criteria for inclusion in the DSM involves whether the disorder responds to a category of drugs. If, as we've just seen, one of the key class of drugs that for 20 years has been considered effective now fails, what does that say for this idea that if a disease responds to a particular drug, then it is a particular disease? We have to rethink the whole biological basis for lifestyle disorders.
    Reason Four: We're an over-medicated society, and the goal of drug companies and a compliant and harried medical establishment is ultimately to have some drug coursing through every individuals's bloodstream. It's a lot easier to quickly pop a pill or prescribe than it is to explore the reasons for a person's distress. Many of us remember the scenario in 1960's science fiction movies of a dystopic future or Soviet-style world with drugs used to control minds. Well, that future is here and the social control we dreaded is now accepted in the form of a pill.
    Reason Five: The whole serotonin hypothesis is challenged by these findings. What this new information shows is that there may be some help using SSRIs if there is a severe shortage of serotonin, but the average person's depression cannot simply be related to a "chemical imbalance." The human brain is too complicated and so are we to have a simple, quick explanation related to seratonin alone. We have no way of measuring serotonin the brain of a living person, short of cutting open the skull. We have not come up with what a normal level of serotonin should be and below which we can say that you would be depressed and above which we can say you will be happy. People with high serotonin levels can be depressed and those with low levels can be happy. Serotonin inducing drugs like ecstasy can make you feel very happy, but so can alcohol and heroin. We have to go back to the drawing boards on this one, so don't ever let anyone say "I've got a chemical imbalance" without asking them what they actually mean and where is the science to prove that statement.
    What Should You Do? Think twice, be skeptical, and question a simplistic diagnosis you might receive after discussing your condition for a short time with a rushed practitioner. If each person takes a stand, is willing to engage in therapies beyond drug-taking, we might actually have a responsible and informed public confronting an increasingly powerful medical-pharmalogical establishment. Drugs may not be the answer for you, and now it turns out that some drugs may not be the answer for almost anyone.
    https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...not-take-ssris
    Last edited by shakey1; 02-20-2018 at 01:33 PM.

    Don't need a weather man to know which way the wind blows

  33. #29
    Psych Meds Linked to 90% of School Shootings. MSM Never Covers this because it Messes with Big Pharma’s Cash Cow.

    December 9, 2018 by IWB

    by HibikiSS

    http://www.wnd.com/2012/12/psych-med...ool-shootings/

    Some 90 percent of school shootings over more than a decade have been linked to a widely prescribed type of antidepressant called selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors or SSRIs, according to British psychiatrist Dr. David Healy, a founder of RxISK.org, an independent website for researching and reporting on prescription drugs.

    www.cchrint.org/school-shooters/

    Fact: At least 36 school shootings and/or school-related acts of violence have been committed by those taking or withdrawing from psychiatric drugs resulting in 172 wounded and 80 killed (in other school shootings, information about their drug use was never made public—neither confirming or refuting if they were under the influence of prescribed drugs). The most important fact about this list, is that these are only cases where the information about their psychiatric drug use was made public.
    http://www.investmentwatchblog.com/p...as-cash-cow-2/
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner



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