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Thread: Doesn't a citizen have a right to education by the state?

  1. #1

    Question Doesn't a citizen have a right to education by the state?

    Hi,

    Doesn't a citizen have a right to education, under seventeen, that is the adult age in the states?



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  3. #2
    Rights don't have anything to do with citizenship. Government protects rights, it doesn't grant them, fund them or take some action that establishes them.

    Your question, properly asked is, "Do all human beings under the age of 17 have a right to education funded by some government through forcible acquision of resources from somebody?"

    Another related question is, "Does a human being under the age of 17 trapped alone on an island in the Pacific have a right to government administered education?"
    Partisan politics, misleading or emotional bill titles, and 4D chess theories are manifestations of the same lie—that the text of the Constitution, the text of legislation, and plain facts do not matter; what matters is what you want to believe. From this comes hypocrisy. And where hypocrisy thrives, virtue recedes. Without virtue, liberty dies. - Justin Amash, March 2018

  4. #3
    No.
    Theye have refused their Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

    Theye have erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance.

    Theye kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies

    Theye have combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution,

    For protecting them, by a mock Trial from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States:

    For cutting off our Trade with parts of the world:

    For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:

    For depriving us in many cases, of the benefit of Trial by Jury:

    Theye plundered and destroyed the lives of our people.

    Theye are at this time transporting Armies of Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation, and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & Perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy of a civilized nation.

  5. #4
    No.

    Edit, Phil beat me to it so I'll take it to the next level.

    Parents have a duty to educate their offspring.

  6. #5
    Nope, just ponies.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Republicanguy View Post
    Hi,

    Doesn't a citizen have a right to education, under seventeen, that is the adult age in the states?
    Sure. (The right to free speech ensures that knowledge to educate is accessible)

    What they don't have is a right to extort other people at the barrel of a government gun to pay for it.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Sure. (The right to free speech ensures that knowledge to educate is accessible)

    What they don't have is a right to extort other people at the barrel of a government gun to pay for it.
    Disagree, amigo. Education is a privilege. If I were to teach basic handy-man essentials, or you the basics of ocean navigation, it would be up to either of us who we might take under instruction. Neither you nor I should ever be required to teach another because of some perceived "right." Therefore, education is a privilege, not a right.
    Theye have refused their Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

    Theye have erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance.

    Theye kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies

    Theye have combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution,

    For protecting them, by a mock Trial from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States:

    For cutting off our Trade with parts of the world:

    For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:

    For depriving us in many cases, of the benefit of Trial by Jury:

    Theye plundered and destroyed the lives of our people.

    Theye are at this time transporting Armies of Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation, and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & Perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy of a civilized nation.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    Disagree, amigo. Education is a privilege. If I were to teach basic handy-man essentials, or you the basics of ocean navigation, it would be up to either of us who we might take under instruction. Neither you nor I should ever be required to teach another because of some perceived "right." Therefore, education is a privilege, not a right.
    I think he's just saying you have a right to be educated by voluntary means, and people can't prevent someone from educating you.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."



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  11. #9
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  12. #10
    You have a right to educate yourself.
    My website: https://www.theherbsofthefield.com/

    "No one is useless in this world who lightens the burdens of another.” ~ Charles Dickens

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    I think he's just saying you have a right to be educated by voluntary means, and people can't prevent someone from educating you.
    I'm sure he did. Little words mean something though. For example in your sentence craft I would prefer it stated...

    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    I think he's just saying you have a right to be educated seek education by voluntary means, and people can't prevent someone from educating you.
    Theye have refused their Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

    Theye have erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance.

    Theye kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies

    Theye have combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution,

    For protecting them, by a mock Trial from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States:

    For cutting off our Trade with parts of the world:

    For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:

    For depriving us in many cases, of the benefit of Trial by Jury:

    Theye plundered and destroyed the lives of our people.

    Theye are at this time transporting Armies of Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation, and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & Perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy of a civilized nation.

  14. #12
    I think it is reasonable to have a government provide services and education can be one of them.

    Calling it a 'Right' gets many people annoyed though because Rights are generally seen as something to do with individual human freedoms or Natural Law such as Free Speech, Freedom to Travel, the Right to Self Defense, or being Free from invasion of Privacy. When you think of Rights only as Human Rights, for many people it can't have anything to do with government providing education or things like social services.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    Disagree, amigo. Education is a privilege. If I were to teach basic handy-man essentials, or you the basics of ocean navigation, it would be up to either of us who we might take under instruction. Neither you nor I should ever be required to teach another because of some perceived "right." Therefore, education is a privilege, not a right.
    Oh, sure, if it required the services of another person to teach that skill.

    I guess what I was suggesting is that you have right to free speech, along with that you have a right to listen, and absorb that information, thus, educating yourself.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by VIDEODROME View Post
    I think it is reasonable to have a government provide services and education can be one of them.

    Calling it a 'Right' gets many people annoyed though because Rights are generally seen as something to do with individual human freedoms or Natural Law such as Free Speech, Freedom to Travel, the Right to Self Defense, or being Free from invasion of Privacy. When you think of Rights only as Human Rights, for many people it can't have anything to do with government providing education or things like social services.
    What if I don't want their "service"?

    Am I free to decline and not pay for something I do not want?

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    I think he's just saying you have a right to be educated by voluntary means, and people can't prevent someone from educating you.
    Yes, exactly, or from educating yourself.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    I'm sure he did. Little words mean something though. For example in your sentence craft I would prefer it stated...
    Agreed, it was worded in a clumsy fashion.



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  20. #17
    Why don't you think for yourself? Live in this self made Hell...
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    Newspapers
    What do they say? Not much I think
    When they want
    School kids to pray
    Getting some facts from
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    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Republicanguy View Post
    Hi,

    Doesn't a citizen have a right to education, under seventeen, that is the adult age in the states?
    A mans rights end where the equal rights of other men begin. Thus, a man can have NO expectation of entitlement which comes at the expense of forcing another man go give something up. This includes time and wages spent teaching. The expectation of having a "Right to Education" is nothing short of an infringement on the equal rights of other men. It would be no different than demanding that I claim I have a right to force you to spend 8 hours a day raising my children.

    Any "Rights of Entitlement" such as Education always come at the expense of Equal Rights of other men.

    (For any Feminists, the term "men" and "man" is intended as Human, not male.)
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Republicanguy View Post
    Hi,

    Doesn't a citizen have a right to education, under seventeen, that is the adult age in the states?
    In my state it is in the state constitution . I wish it was not . They do not pay for books though and buses are not always available so it really is not " free" for that individual . It comes at a great cost . Half of all state tax collected and all property tax is used to pay it . At about 10K per yr per kid , or twice the price of the avg kid in private school .The remainder of the state is pretty efficient . If it was removed from the state constitution and abolished I think property tax could be eliminated , state tax reduced by half . I doubt kids would be any dumber overall .
    Last edited by oyarde; 02-13-2018 at 06:18 PM.

  23. #20
    "Education".

    So, everyone's just going to let that go by, right?

    What part of my "education" involved skipping chemistry so I could sit in the gym and watch scantily clad teenage girls do cartwheels?

    What part of my "education" was it when I went hungry most lunches because there was literally nothing to eat but abject crap?

    What part of my "education" involved memorizing verifiably false statements?

    What part of my "education" involved being held prisoner for almost half of my waking hours?
    There are no crimes against people.
    There are only crimes against the state.
    And the state will never, ever choose to hold accountable its agents, because a thing can not commit a crime against itself.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by fisharmor View Post
    "Education".

    So, everyone's just going to let that go by, right?

    What part of my "education" involved skipping chemistry so I could sit in the gym and watch scantily clad teenage girls do cartwheels?

    What part of my "education" was it when I went hungry most lunches because there was literally nothing to eat but abject crap?

    What part of my "education" involved memorizing verifiably false statements?

    What part of my "education" involved being held prisoner for almost half of my waking hours?
    People need to understand how Public Education serves the Elite:



    School works better than ever, at least as far as the Elite are concerned. School does NOT serve the interests of those attending.

    John Taylor Gatto - The Purpose Of Schooling (in America)
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...g-(in-America)
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by fisharmor View Post
    "Education".

    So, everyone's just going to let that go by, right?

    What part of my "education" involved skipping chemistry so I could sit in the gym and watch scantily clad teenage girls do cartwheels?

    What part of my "education" was it when I went hungry most lunches because there was literally nothing to eat but abject crap?

    What part of my "education" involved memorizing verifiably false statements?

    What part of my "education" involved being held prisoner for almost half of my waking hours?
    You cannot give Reputation to the same post twice.
    Theye have refused their Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

    Theye have erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance.

    Theye kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies

    Theye have combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution,

    For protecting them, by a mock Trial from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States:

    For cutting off our Trade with parts of the world:

    For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:

    For depriving us in many cases, of the benefit of Trial by Jury:

    Theye plundered and destroyed the lives of our people.

    Theye are at this time transporting Armies of Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation, and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & Perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy of a civilized nation.

  26. #23
    I have never let my schooling interfere with my education.
    ~ Mark Twain
    My website: https://www.theherbsofthefield.com/

    "No one is useless in this world who lightens the burdens of another.” ~ Charles Dickens

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    What if I don't want their "service"?

    Am I free to decline and not pay for something I do not want?
    I'm not sure every government service can realistically be split up and you can be guaranteed to never pay for a service you're not using as a Tax Payer.

    I suppose the main tool we have is to complain to our Representatives or vote.



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