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Thread: The New Ancestry.com Narrative?

  1. #1

    Default The New Ancestry.com Narrative?

    I don't know whether it was planned from the beginning, but I just saw an ad from ancestry.com that reeks the stench of progressivism.

    It speaks of the US Olympic hockey team, how they were the world champion amateurs. Then the money shot - how those boys came from "everywhere". DNA testing revealed they were Jews, Iranian, and so on down what I suspect was a very carefully contrived list.

    It will be interesting to see how this seemingly new direction devolves. Focus went from paper trails to define individual ancestry to DNA trails, now morphing away from the individual to the collective, the implications being that we are all the same. This appears to be textbook progressive world view being peddled like so much haggis to the dullard masses of Weakmen.
    Last edited by osan; 02-13-2018 at 09:27 AM.
    Through lives and lives shalt thou pay, O' king.

    Pray for reset.




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  3. #2

    Default

    Didn't we have a thread on this? The tests aren't terribly accurate, and they have been adding certain ancestries to people to "mess with them" and no doubt to attempt to push a political agenda.

    https://squawker.org/culture-wars/dn...-with-racists/
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  4. #3

    Default

    Are we talking abut the outfit that runs a commercial wherein a woman says, 'I thought I was mostly Hispanic. But my test came back one third Spanish and one third Native American! I'm so tickled to discover that I'm not two thirds Hispanic, but two thirds Spanish and Native American, that I'm trying really hard to deny that it's the same damned thing!'

    Yeah, I don't pay a hell of a lot of attention to those people any more. That was all I needed to know.
    'It ain't what we don't know that hurts us, it's what we "know" that ain't so.'--Will Rogers

    'I prefer someone who burns the flag and then wraps themselves up in the Constitution over someone who burns the Constitution and then wraps themselves up in the flag.'--Molly Ivins

  5. #4

    Default

    Essentially what they are doing is collecting a huge DNA database, giving you a genetic horoscope, playing politics and charging people to participate. It's a hell of a business model.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  6. #5

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Didn't we have a thread on this? The tests aren't terribly accurate, and they have been adding certain ancestries to people to "mess with them" and no doubt to attempt to push a political agenda.

    https://squawker.org/culture-wars/dn...-with-racists/
    fwiw, that is pretty much fake news. It stemmed from an anonymous source made to cracked.com in an article from a single company (unnamed).
    https://www.snopes.com/dna-testing-c...screw-racists/
    yeah, I know snopes, but whatever, its a matches up with what I found when I looked into it.
    Also has responses by the 2 big companies:

    Quote Originally Posted by ancestry.com
    We can state, definitively, that we have not, nor ever would, alter a customer’s DNA results. We believe in the power of science and our customers rely on us to provide as accurate a result as possible. We don’t know where this anonymous individual worked, but we are confident they did not work here, as their claims in no way reflect the scientific rigor and focus on quality that we apply to everything we do at Ancestry.
    Quote Originally Posted by 23andme.com
    Any allegations that we manipulate results are 100% false. Customer results are based purely on science, which we’ve documented extensively: https://www.23andme.com/ancestry-composition-guide/. Further, the author cites outdated research (a paper that came out the year we launched our first product, nearly 10 years ago) and misrepresents a test done by sets of triplets and quadruplets, whose results when viewed at our highest confidence threshold were nearly identical.

  7. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Didn't we have a thread on this? The tests aren't terribly accurate, and they have been adding certain ancestries to people to "mess with them" and no doubt to attempt to push a political agenda.

    https://squawker.org/culture-wars/dn...-with-racists/

    How Reliable Are Home DNA Ancestry Tests? Investigation Uses Triplets to Find Out


    http://www.insideedition.com/investi...ts-to-find-out

    The sisters were all 99 percent European but the test from 23andMe also showed some surprising differences.
    Nicole was 11 percent French and German but Erica was 22.3 percent. Their sister Jaclyn was in the middle at 18 percent.
    "I'm surprised," Nicole said. "I’m surprised because we came from the same egg and DNA. How are our ancestries different?"
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Drudge is a traitor to the Leader and the Revolution.



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  8. #7

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Essentially what they are doing is collecting a huge DNA database, giving you a genetic horoscope, playing politics and charging people to participate. It's a hell of a business model.
    Exactly. However they have been taking DNA from babies born when they started the PKU prick on the heel test.

    NEWBORN DNA BANKING
    https://www.aclu.org/other/newborn-dna-banking

  9. #8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Didn't we have a thread on this? The tests aren't terribly accurate, and they have been adding certain ancestries to people to "mess with them" and no doubt to attempt to push a political agenda.

    https://squawker.org/culture-wars/dn...-with-racists/
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...White-Profiles
    Truth is a social construct. 👁👁

  10. #9

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    fwiw, that is pretty much fake news. It stemmed from an anonymous source made to cracked.com in an article from a single company (unnamed).
    https://www.snopes.com/dna-testing-c...screw-racists/
    yeah, I know snopes, but whatever, its a matches up with what I found when I looked into it.
    Also has responses by the 2 big companies:
    Call me still skeptical of the whole thing, especially the methods themselves and the DNA collection aspect.

    Companies (and government) always issue denials. Who knows about the anonymous source, you never know (and granted, that would just be at one company). Note in the 23andme denial that they talk about the "highest confidence threshold", while the alleged whistleblower specifies that it is at the very lowest possible level where they have some fun:

    Morgan and his colleagues were caught between a rock and a really-want-to-mess-with-racists place. It would’ve been fun to throw a “10 percent West African” in there, but then they might have a pissed-off, dangerous person at their office, waving a gun. “Since we couldn’t do anything to the results (and we wanted to), what we did was add ‘< 1 percent’ to each African category of ethnicity. That way we weren’t lying, and they would both be wondering how much under a percentage point was. We always try to round to the nearest number because we sometimes hear about percentage points, but for them, we leave it open to whether it’s a one or a zero.”
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  11. #10

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Danke View Post
    How Reliable Are Home DNA Ancestry Tests? Investigation Uses Triplets to Find Out


    http://www.insideedition.com/investi...ts-to-find-out

    The sisters were all 99 percent European but the test from 23andMe also showed some surprising differences.
    Nicole was 11 percent French and German but Erica was 22.3 percent. Their sister Jaclyn was in the middle at 18 percent.
    "I'm surprised," Nicole said. "I’m surprised because we came from the same egg and DNA. How are our ancestries different?"
    To find out, Inside Edition enlisted the help of two sets of indistinguishable triplets and a set of indentical quadruplets to investigate the accuracy of the at-home tests.
    Well, maybe. "Indistinguishable" triplets? That's a new one to me. They wouldn't necessarily have the same DNA unless they are identical. But the identical triplets with different results indicates a very imperfect process.

    And I still question the root problem of what determines a German vs. a Franc vs. a Scandinavian. Are they assuming no intermixing over the past several millennia? That would be ludicrous.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  12. #11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Are we talking abut the outfit that runs a commercial wherein a woman says, 'I thought I was mostly Hispanic. But my test came back one third Spanish and one third Native American! I'm so tickled to discover that I'm not two thirds Hispanic, but two thirds Spanish and Native American, that I'm trying really hard to deny that it's the same damned thing!'

    Yeah, I don't pay a hell of a lot of attention to those people any more. That was all I needed to know.
    Those commercials are annoying. "People ask me all the time what nationality I am, and I didn't know what to tell them until now."
    Here's a clue: You're an AMERICAN, beyotch.
    All modern revolutions have ended in a reinforcement of the power of the State.
    -Albert Camus

  13. #12

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    And I still question the root problem of what determines a German vs. a Franc vs. a Scandinavian. Are they assuming no intermixing over the past several millennia? That would be ludicrous.
    23andme doesn't give it that precise (named by country) and they assume mixing. In fact with the report it will show you how your ancestors travelled.

    edit: I was wrong guess they updated it to have "countries" more specific since I last looked. when I got my report it really more just region based.
    eg:
    SpecsAreGood, your maternal haplogroup is H7a1.

    As our ancestors ventured out of eastern Africa, they branched off in diverse groups that crossed and recrossed the globe over tens of thousands of years. Some of their migrations can be traced through haplogroups, families of lineages that descend from a common ancestor. Your maternal haplogroup can reveal the path followed by the women of your maternal line.

    Migrations of Your Maternal Line

    Origin and Migrations of Haplogroup H7
    Haplogroup H7 is a younger branch of the widespread haplogroup H. Women carrying H likely first spread into Europe in the last stages of the Ice Age. However, a great peak of cold from about 24,000 years ago until nearly 18,000 years ago covered the interior of Europe and Eurasia with inhospitable tundra and mile-thick ice sheets. All this ice trapped much of the earth's water and changed climate patterns, causing deserts to expand in the Middle East. Human populations in Europe and western Eurasia clustered in refuges of temperate climate near the Mediterranean Sea, including in southeastern Europe and the Caucasus. This was the likely refuge of the ancestors of haplogroup H7.

    Members of H7 trace their maternal lines back to a woman who lived approximately 9,000 years ago, soon after the end of the Ice Age. A warmer and more stable climate era began, and human populations in the region began to flourish again. In this new setting, women carrying H7 migrated northwest into Europe and south into the Middle East, giving rise to new subgroups along the way.

    Today, haplogroup H7 can be found in the eastern Slavs, Slovaks, Balkarians, and Turks, as well as in populations in the Middle East and Central Asia.




    H7a1
    6,500 Years Ago
    Your maternal haplogroup, H7a1, traces back to a woman who lived approximately 6,500 years ago.

    That's nearly 260 generations ago! What happened between then and now? As researchers and citizen scientists discover more about your haplogroup, new details may be added to the story of your maternal line.

    H7a1
    Today

    H7a1 is relatively common among 23andMe customers.

    Today, you share your haplogroup with all the maternal-line descendants of the common ancestor of H7a1, including other 23andMe customers.
    1 in 410 23andMe customers share your haplogroup assignment
    Last edited by specsaregood; 02-13-2018 at 01:19 PM.

  14. #13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    the implications being that we are all the same.
    No,, It is proving by science what is already known. We are all related..

    Various family lines mixed by travel trade and conquest through the ages.

    There is no Pure Blood anything.(except human)
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  15. #14

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    And I still question the root problem of what determines a German vs. a Franc vs. a Scandinavian. Are they assuming no intermixing over the past several millennia? That would be ludicrous.
    BINGO. I believe the very premises upon which all this is based are highly questionable on the best of days.
    Through lives and lives shalt thou pay, O' king.

    Pray for reset.


  16. #15

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    No,, It is proving by science what is already known. We are all related..
    Even that is not proven. But the ad in question was clearly heading into the waters of universal sameness.
    Through lives and lives shalt thou pay, O' king.

    Pray for reset.


  17. #16

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Danke View Post
    How Reliable Are Home DNA Ancestry Tests? Investigation Uses Triplets to Find Out


    http://www.insideedition.com/investi...ts-to-find-out

    The sisters were all 99 percent European but the test from 23andMe also showed some surprising differences.
    Nicole was 11 percent French and German but Erica was 22.3 percent. Their sister Jaclyn was in the middle at 18 percent.
    "I'm surprised," Nicole said. "I’m surprised because we came from the same egg and DNA. How are our ancestries different?"
    Of course it is a scam . If they give me 20 FRN's I will tell them what they like .

  18. #17

    Default

    https://www.livescience.com/7384-gen...cientists.html

    Genetic Ancestry Tests Mostly Hype, Scientists Say

    By Ker Than, Contributing Writer | October 18, 2007 10:00am ET
    Several companies now claim that for as little as $100 and a swab of the inner cheek, they can reveal a person's family tree and ancestral homeland.

    But more than a dozen scientists from various backgrounds say such "recreational genetics" or "vanity tests" have significant scientific limitations and rely on misconceptions about race and genetics.

    "If a test-taker is just interested in finding out where there are some people in the world that share the same DNA as them, then these tests can certainly tell them that," said Deborah Bolnick of the University of Texas in Austin. "But they're not going to tell you every place or every group in the world where people share your DNA. Nor will they necessarily be able to tell you exactly where your ancestors lived or [what race or social group] they identified with."

    Bolnick and the other researchers expressed present their analysis in the Oct. 19 issue of the journal Science.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  19. #18

    Default

    100 ? Crap , I have been giving Danke his for free for years .

  20. #19

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by oyarde View Post
    100 ? Crap , I have been giving Danke his for free for years .
    Anything from your kind comes with a price.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Drudge is a traitor to the Leader and the Revolution.



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  21. #20

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    Even that is not proven. But the ad in question was clearly heading into the waters of universal sameness.
    It may..

    and it's purposes (danger/threat) may yet be unseen..

    I have no idea of the truth they are and are not telling.

    mine is on file with the relevant authorities.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  22. #21

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by oyarde View Post
    Of course it is a scam . If they give me 20 FRN's I will tell them what they like .
    So you think that I'm not really part injun after all like 23andme said?
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RPEphesians 6:12 (KJV)//I sell stuff here go buy nao!

  23. #22

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by heavenlyboy34 View Post
    So you think that I'm not really part injun after all like 23andme said?
    Shut up until after you get your BIA card and tribal license plates.
    'It ain't what we don't know that hurts us, it's what we "know" that ain't so.'--Will Rogers

    'I prefer someone who burns the flag and then wraps themselves up in the Constitution over someone who burns the Constitution and then wraps themselves up in the flag.'--Molly Ivins

  24. #23

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Shut up until after you get your BIA card and tribal license plates.
    Yessir.
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RPEphesians 6:12 (KJV)//I sell stuff here go buy nao!

  25. #24

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by heavenlyboy34 View Post
    So you think that I'm not really part injun after all like 23andme said?
    You probably are , they probably made something else up though .

  26. #25

    Default

    I've decided to return to my roots.



    People told me I was crazy. They told me I could never be happy. They told me cannibals are dangerous... Well, it's easier to eat people half your size.

  27. #26

    Default

    For those interested in this information yet also paranoid, how about submitting your cheek swab under a false name?

    Problem solved

    Quote Originally Posted by Raginfridus View Post
    I've decided to return to my roots.



    People told me I was crazy. They told me I could never be happy. They told me cannibals are dangerous... Well, it's easier to eat people half your size.

  28. #27

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    For those interested in this information yet also paranoid, how about submitting your cheek swab under a false name?
    Like the census?
    All modern revolutions have ended in a reinforcement of the power of the State.
    -Albert Camus

  29. #28

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by otherone View Post
    Like the census?
    I don't follow...

    IIRC, it's a crime to falsify the census; this a voluntary service, and I'm sure there's no consequence to submitting data under Pat McGroin.

  30. #29

    Default

    http://genetics.thetech.org/ask-a-ge...cestry-results

    Ancestry
    Back to Ancestry
    My twins each did a 23andMe DNA test and the results verified that they are identical; however, their ancestry composition is not!

    How is that possible if their genomes are identical?

    -A curious adult from New Jersey

    I can see why you’re confused. The same DNA should give the same ancestry results. And yet they haven’t.

    This is pretty common with DNA ancestry tests and it isn’t just a 23andMe thing. Companies like Ancestry.com or MyHeritage will give these sorts of results too.

    This does not mean these companies are doing shoddy work. They aren’t—they are doing outstanding, cutting edge science that brings DNA testing to many, many people.

    It is just that the analysis is complicated enough that it is incredibly difficult to get an exact result. There is some wiggle room.

    So don’t take percentages as exact numbers. As we talk about in a previous answer, they can vary by 10 or even 20% pretty easily and sometimes even a bit more. So two people might have the same amount of East European even if a DNA test says one has 20% and the other person has 40%.

    But even when the percentages are small, this kind of thing is a bit more unsettling when you get different results from the exact same DNA. These differences mostly come from how the computer algorithm splits up the DNA into thousands of windows, analyzing one window at a time. And how blank spots (or “no calls”) in the data affect how the DNA is interpreted and/or split up into those pieces.

    These no calls are an inevitable consequence of any test like the ones these companies run.

    23andMe reports that on average they get good reads on more than 98% of the markers they look at which is really very good. But it still means that each test has thousands and thousands of spots that could not be read.

    And importantly, the same markers do not come up as no calls in different tests. Each time someone’s DNA is read, you can end up with a different 2% being uninterpretable.

    These spots on the DNA that can’t be read in a particular assay can tip the ancestry scales one way or another. What might look English with a smattering of these missed reads, looks German with a different set of no calls.

    So in the first case a piece of one identical twins’ DNA might look English while the same or an overlapping piece of DNA will look German with the second identical twin. It wouldn’t take too many differences like this to shift enough DNA to make the two not look identical from an ancestry point of view.

    All of this is true even though when looked at with another test, the relatedness one, it is obvious these two people are identical twins. Even with the no calls the companies can see that the two have the same DNA.

    DNA Landmarks

    These companies use what is called reference DNA to figure out where your DNA came from. This reference DNA is the DNA of people whose families have stayed in a part of the world for a long time. Or who have very detailed family trees.

    The companies then compare your DNA to the DNA landmarks they found in these families. The parts that match that group of Germans is German, the parts that match that group of people from the British Isles is English and so on.

    Sounds easy enough but most people are not like the reference group. They have lots of different ancestral DNA scattered in chunks throughout their DNA. This is where things can get tricky.

    To get around this mixed DNA, the computer program analyzes small sections of the DNA at a time. These “windows” have around 100 or so DNA markers in them which translates to thousands of such windows.

    The no calls we talked about earlier can affect it so a window can be interpreted in different ways. If by chance the program interprets it as German for twin 1 and English for twin 2, then the two will appear to be a little bit different.
    One Piece of the Puzzle

    What I just described is certainly part of the reason for why the same DNA can end up with different results. But it is by no means the only way it can happen.

    Analyzing DNA for ancestry is very complicated for lots of reasons (check out this outstanding blog from 23andMe to get a feel for what they are up against). It is technically very challenging.

    Still, if there were a way to reduce the number of no calls it might at least make the results more consistent with the same DNA. The problem is that to reduce the no calls, you’d almost certainly need to spend more money for your test. Potentially a lot more money.

    So you have the push and pull of affordability versus absolute consistency. Well, not absolute as that would be impossible but near absolute.

    All of this shows why ancestry DNA results are really just one part of your genealogy puzzle. The part of the test that identifies relatives who share DNA can provide more of the pieces to fill in your puzzle. And of course good old fashioned family tree building using a variety of public documents is an important part too.

    All three together can give you a more complete picture of your ancestry compared to just one or two of the others.
    More at link.
    Quote Originally Posted by NorthCarolinaLiberty View Post

    Half the crap I write here is just to entertain myself.
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