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Thread: Trump Has Killed More Civilians with Illegal Drone Strikes in 9 Months Than Obama Did in 8 Yea

  1. #1

    Default Trump Has Killed More Civilians with Illegal Drone Strikes in 9 Months Than Obama Did in 8 Yea

    From last October. I'm Quite certain things haven't improved since.

    Trump Has Killed More Civilians with Illegal Drone Strikes in 9 Months Than Obama Did in 8 Years

    By Rachel Blevins

    While the mainstream media focuses on anything but the current state of U.S. intervention in the Middle East, the Trump Administration is breaking records by accumulating a horrific number of civilian deaths.

    Former President Obama earned the nickname of “Drone King” when he dramatically escalated the use of drone strikes, while also downplaying the number of innocent civilians who became “collateral damage.” In the two years that his administration devoted to publicly spending millions of taxpayer dollars to fight the Islamic State group, the estimated civilian death toll ranged from 2,300 to 3,400, according to Airwars, an organization tracking deaths in the war against ISIS.

    Trump Has Killed More Civilians with Illegal Drone Strikes in 9 Months Than Obama Did in 8 Years
    10/18/2017

    Picture
    By Rachel Blevins

    While the mainstream media focuses on anything but the current state of U.S. intervention in the Middle East, the Trump Administration is breaking records by accumulating a horrific number of civilian deaths.

    Former President Obama earned the nickname of “Drone King” when he dramatically escalated the use of drone strikes, while also downplaying the number of innocent civilians who became “collateral damage.” In the two years that his administration devoted to publicly spending millions of taxpayer dollars to fight the Islamic State group, the estimated civilian death toll ranged from 2,300 to 3,400, according to Airwars, an organization tracking deaths in the war against ISIS.
    22 Aug

    Airwars
    @airwars
    Our minimum estimate of civilians likely killed by Coalition since 2014 is now 5,117 - with 55% of deaths occuring under Trump's leadership pic.twitter.com/H8S5Ihwuzb


    Airwars
    @airwars
    During @BarackObama's 29 months at helm of ISIS war we tracked 855 alleged civilian casualty events which likely killed 2298-3398 civilians pic.twitter.com/RUVvcy5zX9

    10:40 AM - Aug 22, 2017
    View image on Twitter
    2 2 Replies 36 36 Retweets 11 11 likes
    Twitter Ads info and privacy

    President Trump has been in office for just 9 months, and he has already surpassed Obama’s murderous record with estimated numbers as high as 4,500 civilian deaths.

    ...
    Read the rest here:

    http://www.ronpaullibertyreport.com/...did-in-8-years
    Chris

    "Justice will not be served until those who are unaffected are as outraged as those who are." — Benjamin Franklin

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    I was a minarchist, but I ran out of excuses.



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  3. #2

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    meanwhile local trumptards are focused exclusively on sjw liberal lunatics. the IPB managed to be way worse than obama in the way that matters most

  4. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    In b4 dannno says it's all soros propaganda.
    Airwars IS Soros propaganda, is there even any question about that??
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  6. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Airwars IS Soros propaganda, is there even any question about that??
    Financing doesn't negate their figures.
    * Enforce Border Security – America should be guarding her own borders and enforcing her own laws instead of policing the world and implementing UN mandates.

    * No Amnesty - The Obama Administration’s endorsement of so-called “Comprehensive Immigration Reform,” granting amnesty to millions of illegal immigrants, will only encourage more law-breaking.

    * Abolish the Welfare State – Taxpayers cannot continue to pay the high costs to sustain this powerful incentive for illegal immigration. As Milton Friedman famously said, you can’t have open borders and a welfare state.

    * End Birthright Citizenship – As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be granted U.S. citizenship, we’ll never be able to control our immigration problem.




    Reprinted from http://www.ronpaul2012.com/the-issues/immigration/ [Nov. 29, 2011]

  8. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    Financing doesn't negate their figures.
    How do you know?

    I'm not saying I know, nobody here knows, people just pretend to know. There is no way for any one person to possibly know what the actual figures are.

    I'm not saying don't cite the figures, I'm not saying don't put pressure on Trump to end the violence, I'm just saying don't go around pretending these numbers are 100% reliable.

    If they aren't accurate it could be anything from padded slightly to extremely exaggerated.
    Last edited by dannno; 02-01-2018 at 11:39 AM.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    Financing doesn't negate their figures.
    Fake news, military spending is all a hoax in order to fabricate an allusion of an economy that doesn't exist by propping up American corporations and buying politicians around the world. Everything else is just movie tricks and special effects. /s

  10. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Airwars IS Soros propaganda, is there even any question about that??
    So you're saying this is not accurate and RP liberty report and the Free Thought Project are just repeating Soros propaganda?
    "The Patriarch"

  11. #10

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    Anyone who kills from afar is no friend of freedom.

    Trump is the worst thing that could have happened to America. Now people cheer and wave flags and read his tweets and think that everything he does is nothing short of glorious.
    No - No - No - No
    2016

  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    How do you know?

    I'm not saying I know, nobody here knows, people just pretend to know. There is no way for any one person to possibly know what the actual figures are.

    I'm not saying don't cite the figures, I'm not saying don't put pressure on Trump to end the violence, I'm just saying don't go around pretending these numbers are 100% reliable.
    What incentive is there to fake those numbers anyways? Most people in this country dont give a $#@! if 10 people are killed or 10,000.

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    How do you know?

    I'm not saying I know, nobody here knows, people just pretend to know. There is no way for any one person to possibly know what the actual figures are.

    I'm not saying don't cite the figures, I'm not saying don't put pressure on Trump to end the violence, I'm just saying don't go around pretending these numbers are 100% reliable.

    If they aren't accurate it could be anything from padded slightly to extremely exaggerated.
    Just 1 person killed could get you or me life in prison for premeditated murder.

    The numbers “could be padded” so it’s ok? Yea let’s just blow it off.

    The first person killed in the name of “freedom” should be reason enough to have trump hanged.

    Do you believe it’s ok to kill others who have done nothing to you?
    No - No - No - No
    2016

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    This article claims that one study showed 95% of Airwars casualties were non-credible:

    In response, the commander of the Combined Joint Task Force Operation Inherent Resolve Stephen Townsendtook to Foreign Policyto criticise advocacy groups and the media for a lack of intellectual rigour in assessing their sources before making claims of civilian casualties. He noted that, of the 270 allegations made by Airwars that had been assessed, 258 (more than 95%) had been found to be non-credible.


    https://www.realcleardefense.com/art...es_112395.html


    Here is a prequel to that article:

    https://www.lowyinstitute.org/the-in...ties-and-media
    Last edited by dannno; 02-01-2018 at 11:52 AM.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    How do you know?

    I'm not saying I know, nobody here knows, people just pretend to know. There is no way for any one person to possibly know what the actual figures are.

    I'm not saying don't cite the figures, I'm not saying don't put pressure on Trump to end the violence, I'm just saying don't go around pretending these numbers are 100% reliable.

    If they aren't accurate it could be anything from padded slightly to extremely exaggerated.
    "The Patriarch"

  16. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by asurfaholic View Post
    Just 1 person killed could get you or me life in prison for premeditated murder.

    The numbers “could be padded” so it’s ok? Yea let’s just blow it off.

    The first person killed in the name of “freedom” should be reason enough to have trump hanged.

    Do you believe it’s ok to kill others who have done nothing to you?
    What the $#@! are you talking about??

    No, I don't believe any of our foreign policy is "ok"..

    But am I going to ruin our chances at letting Rand have influence over the President and his policies because of some fake made up data, just so we can go back to some neo-con puppet like Hillary and cause even more damage and destruction and death and socialism?? No, that's $#@!ing stupid...
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Influenza View Post
    What incentive is there to fake those numbers anyways? Most people in this country dont give a $#@! if 10 people are killed or 10,000.
    The incentive to fake the numbers derives from their method of figuring out the number. The way they determine how many die is by calculating it by the number of terrorists that are created as a result (blowback). Why do you think the "fake news" is saying that taliban has more control then ever?

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post

    It has been claimed that 95% of Airwars claims of civilian casualties are non-credible, so claims like what are being made in the OP don't necessarily have much merit. Obama was a Soros puppet, you think he would have inflated his numbers?
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    This article claims that one study showed 95% of Airwars casualties were non-credible:



    https://www.realcleardefense.com/art...es_112395.html


    Here is a prequel to that article:

    https://www.lowyinstitute.org/the-in...ties-and-media
    Nice, citing neo con think tanks..
    "The Patriarch"

  20. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    Nice, citing neo con think tanks..
    Uhhhh, you're citing George Soros...

    What I'm saying is I don't know, and I don't pretend to know.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Uhhhh, you're citing George Soros...

    What I'm saying is I don't know, and I don't pretend to know.
    Uh, I'm citing RP institute and The Free Thought Project, you're the one who injected Soros.
    "The Patriarch"

  22. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    Uh, I'm citing RP institute and The Free Thought Project, you're the one who injected Soros.
    No, you're citing data that came funded from George Soros, so did they, and they should probably reconsider whether this data is accurate as well.

    It doesn't change the message much from a principled non-interventionist standpoint - bring the troops home - pretty simple - but when you say things like Trump killed more civilians in 9 months than Obama did in 8 years and it turns out 95% of the figures may be falsified, then that's not very good if we end up with somebody even worse as President in 2020.... who WON'T listen to Rand at all, and will end up getting us into more quagmires.
    Last edited by dannno; 02-01-2018 at 12:01 PM.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  23. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Uhhhh, you're citing George Soros...

    What I'm saying is I don't know, and I don't pretend to know.
    Really Plato??
    I seem, then, in just this little thing to be wiser than this man at any rate, that what I do not know I do not think I know either.

  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    No, you're citing data that came funded from George Soros, so did they, and they should probably reconsider whether this data is accurate as well.
    This is hardly a new revelation, it been known for a while now Trump's been on a pace to leave Obama in the dust as related to civilian deaths. Your protestations just make you seem foolish.
    "The Patriarch"

  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    This is hardly a new revelation, it been known for a while now Trump's been on a pace to leave Obama in the dust as related to civilian deaths. Your protestations just make you seem foolish.

    WTF are you talking about?? If 95% of the civilian casualties are in fact non-credible, then he was NEVER on pace to leave Obama in the dust..
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  26. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Really Plato??
    Yes, Socrates...
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  27. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    Uh, I'm citing RP institute and The Free Thought Project, you're the one who injected Soros.

    Obviously purveyors of Soros propaganda. Clearly Ron Paul is no longer to be trusted. Screw that decades long g record of accuracy and trustworthyness.

    This is pathetic. No wonder so many good posters have disappeared from this place never to be heard from again. Place has become a sick parody of what it once was.
    Chris

    "Justice will not be served until those who are unaffected are as outraged as those who are." — Benjamin Franklin

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    I was a minarchist, but I ran out of excuses.

  28. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    Obviously purveyors of Soros propaganda. Clearly Ron Paul is no longer to be trusted. Screw that decades long g record of accuracy and trustworthyness.

    This is pathetic. No wonder so many good posters have disappeared from this place never to be heard from again. Place has become a sick parody of what it once was.
    Ron Paul is right that we should bring the troops home, that's the important thing to trust him on. It is unfortunate that he may or may not be caught up in presenting falsified data regarding civilian casualties from George Soros.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  29. #28

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    Dannno, maybe this will cheer you up: Via Justin Rainmondo:

    One year into the Trump administration and we have, on the foreign policy front, one major development: unlike practically every US President in modern times – excepting Harding, Coolidge, Hoover, and (I think) Ford — Trump hasn’t started any major new wars. That might seem like some pretty thin gruel to feast on, and yet it does represent a not insignificant change in the pattern of presidential behavior. He campaigned as an “isolationist” whose “first instinct” would not be to call out the troops, and it’s fair to say he’s stuck to the spirit if not the strict letter of his “America First” doctrine.
    * Enforce Border Security – America should be guarding her own borders and enforcing her own laws instead of policing the world and implementing UN mandates.

    * No Amnesty - The Obama Administration’s endorsement of so-called “Comprehensive Immigration Reform,” granting amnesty to millions of illegal immigrants, will only encourage more law-breaking.

    * Abolish the Welfare State – Taxpayers cannot continue to pay the high costs to sustain this powerful incentive for illegal immigration. As Milton Friedman famously said, you can’t have open borders and a welfare state.

    * End Birthright Citizenship – As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be granted U.S. citizenship, we’ll never be able to control our immigration problem.




    Reprinted from http://www.ronpaul2012.com/the-issues/immigration/ [Nov. 29, 2011]

  30. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Ron Paul is right that we should bring the troops home, that's the important thing to trust him on. It is unfortunate that he may or may not be caught up in presenting falsified data regarding civilian casualties from George Soros.
    FFS. Either present some data that indicates the data is flawed or STFU about it being false. For pete's sake, he RAN on a platform of bombing the literal life out of ISIS.
    * Enforce Border Security – America should be guarding her own borders and enforcing her own laws instead of policing the world and implementing UN mandates.

    * No Amnesty - The Obama Administration’s endorsement of so-called “Comprehensive Immigration Reform,” granting amnesty to millions of illegal immigrants, will only encourage more law-breaking.

    * Abolish the Welfare State – Taxpayers cannot continue to pay the high costs to sustain this powerful incentive for illegal immigration. As Milton Friedman famously said, you can’t have open borders and a welfare state.

    * End Birthright Citizenship – As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be granted U.S. citizenship, we’ll never be able to control our immigration problem.




    Reprinted from http://www.ronpaul2012.com/the-issues/immigration/ [Nov. 29, 2011]

  31. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    FFS. Either present some data that indicates the data is flawed or STFU about it being false. For pete's sake, he RAN on a platform of bombing the literal life out of ISIS.
    I already did, one study indicated that 95% of the civilian casualties were non-verifiable.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

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