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Thread: Freedom has no hope...

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    As is all too common, you have read into my words that which is not there. We all do it, so no big deal - just setting you straight.

    We all have our moments.
    I've heard this rebuttal countless times on these forums.

    You don't know what I meant.
    You're reading into it.
    You don't know me.

    I choose NOT to be mysterious and abstract and beat around the bush, but rather post and question and debate towards actionable decisions and plans. That is the vector along which I post ESPECIALLY in grassroots central.

    So if you're ...feh... or ...meh... with regards to helping, or having faith in others, or hopeless in general, why post at all in this forum? Why not the vent or politics and philosophy?

    This is an all too common pattern:

    Disaffected Activist: Movement is dead.
    Motivated Activist: We can do this or even try this!
    Disaffected Activist: Won't work.
    Motivated Activist: You aren't trying, though, why not just commit to trying? Lead, follow or get out of the way.
    Disaffected Activist: You don't know me. You misunderstand me. I see what you're saying but we disagree.

    So what happens? Nothing. Because this medium requires no commitment. You aren't even a real person in any "accountable" sense. The same as 90% of this board. What will happen in ten years? IT'S BEEN TEN YEARS! My profile is 11 years old this May.

    Anyway, you're right I don't know you. And maybe I "read into" what people write. It's because I'm looking for substance. I don't care about people's life stories because I'm interested in the mission, not making friends and entertaining myself and others. Sure it's fun sometimes, and it's great if we make friends, but if that takes precedence over the mission, than we are a liability to the movement, not an asset.

    Nothing much is happening, that's true. But even this community existing, and still discussing liberty is more "happening" then whatever the left is up to.

    Ron had ideas, great ideas, but when we lost Ron, it seems the hope he inspired went with him. How to get people to have hope and enthusiasm while looking in the mirror instead of someone else to lead the way, that's the real challenge.

    The problem is our own apathy, once cured, now back with a vengeance.
    When a trumpet sounds in a city, do not the people tremble?
    When disaster comes to a city, has not the Lord caused it? Amos 3:6



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  3. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by wizardwatson View Post
    I've heard this rebuttal countless times on these forums.

    You don't know what I meant.
    You're reading into it.
    You don't know me.
    Meaning what, exactly?

    I choose NOT to be mysterious and abstract and beat around the bush, but rather post and question and debate towards actionable decisions and plans. That is the vector along which I post ESPECIALLY in grassroots central.
    Do you mean to suggest that I choose otherwise?

    So if you're ...feh... or ...meh... with regards to helping, or having faith in others, or hopeless in general, why post at all in this forum? Why not the vent or politics and philosophy?
    If you think I have any horse in the race of bullshittery or of trying to save face, then you are mistaken.

    So what happens? Nothing. Because this medium requires no commitment. You aren't even a real person in any "accountable" sense. The same as 90% of this board. What will happen in ten years? IT'S BEEN TEN YEARS! My profile is 11 years old this May.
    Tell us how you are accountable in the ways you claim the rest of us are not? I don't really even know what you mean. We discuss matters. We are human and have our moments. What's the big deal?

    I agree that nothing happens. I've watched "initiatives" start and promptly fizzle here. I have noted this publicly. So?

    Anyway, you're right I don't know you. And maybe I "read into" what people write.
    In the case in question, you did. Generally speaking, people have atrocious communications habits, especially in text-based media. The key is to ask questions where there is any room for doubt in the specifics of what has been expressed. Most don't do it, but are content to assume malice, stupidity, or what have you.

    It's because I'm looking for substance.
    I don't think anyone here can point to a place where I blow my own horn - it's not my way - but here I must protest if you mean to say that my posts are insubstantial. If that is your meaning, and correct me if I misperceive, onus rests with you to define the term that we may properly understand your meaning.

    I don't care about people's life stories because I'm interested in the mission, not making friends and entertaining myself and others. Sure it's fun sometimes, and it's great if we make friends, but if that takes precedence over the mission, than we are a liability to the movement, not an asset.
    Then what are YOU doing here, since "nothing" happens? I'm not claiming nor implying any special purpose. I'm learning, maybe teaching a little - trying to be helpful in any event - and still enjoying intellectual exchanges even if the timbre of the site is less vibrant than it was in 2009. I've noted the same problems long ago as you have here. I'm still here because there is still a payoff for me.

    Nothing much is happening, that's true. But even this community existing, and still discussing liberty is more "happening" then whatever the left is up to.
    Fair enough, though the "left" gets their asses out the door whereas we typically do not. That is why they succeed in their piecemeal encroachments upon the rest.

    Ron had ideas, great ideas, but when we lost Ron, it seems the hope he inspired went with him. How to get people to have hope and enthusiasm while looking in the mirror instead of someone else to lead the way, that's the real challenge.
    This is pure laziness combined with conditioning. People generally want someone to show them the way because it is easier. That way, they don't have to think for themselves. That is perhaps the greatest threat to the currently slim prospects for human freedom.

    The problem is our own apathy, once cured, now back with a vengeance.

    It was never cured. Had it been, it would not have come back. Freedom is tiring because it is difficult, unlike pretty slavery which demands so very little of the individual beyond blind obedience. A momentary spike of enthusiasm does not evidence "cure". The phenomenon underlying the strong support of Ron Paul is very much a close analog to that which underpinned the wide support of Adolph Hitler. People don't want to do the dirty work, but rather they want to leave it to someone else - a "hero". Hence, their slavery becomes unavoidable.
    freedomisobvious.blogspot.com

    There is only one correct way: freedom. All other solutions are non-solutions.

    It appears that artificial intelligence is at least slightly superior to natural stupidity.

    Our words make us the ghosts that we are.

    Convincing the world he didn't exist was the Devil's second greatest trick; the first was convincing us that God didn't exist.



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  5. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    Generally speaking, people have atrocious communications habits, especially in text-based media.
    Wow, 10 slices. I surrender.
    When a trumpet sounds in a city, do not the people tremble?
    When disaster comes to a city, has not the Lord caused it? Amos 3:6

  6. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by wizardwatson View Post
    Wow, 10 slices. I surrender.
    I have no idea what that is even supposed to mean.

    It seems as if you are treating this exchange as some sort of competition. Why? I thought most of us were here to have constructive discussions.

    As usual, it would appear my tiny, shriveled brain has failed me once more.
    freedomisobvious.blogspot.com

    There is only one correct way: freedom. All other solutions are non-solutions.

    It appears that artificial intelligence is at least slightly superior to natural stupidity.

    Our words make us the ghosts that we are.

    Convincing the world he didn't exist was the Devil's second greatest trick; the first was convincing us that God didn't exist.

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