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Thread: Yet another SWATing

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by ChristianAnarchist View Post
    Now why not tell us how you really feel???
    Have I not made myself clear?



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  3. #32
    Innocent Man “Swatted” to Death by Kansas heroes…

    https://www.ericpetersautos.com/2017...kansas-heroes/

    By eric - December 30, 2017

    A prank call to “heroes” has resulted in an innocent man’s death at a home in Wichita, Kansas.

    Andrew Finch, 28, was shot and killed Thursday after police responded to an anonymous call about a shooting involving hostages.

    The caller claimed someone had an argument with their mother; that the woman’s husband was accidentally shot; and that a brother, a sister and the mother were being held hostage, according to head Wichita “hero” Troy Livingston

    “We learned through that call that the father was deceased, shot in the head. So that’s the information we were working off of,” Livingston said. “Our officers came here preparing for a hostage situation. Several got in position. A male came to the front door, and one of our officers discharged his weapon.

    Note that the anonymous caller’s assertions were taken as verbatim truth – “we learned through the call that the father was deceased ” a statement of fact that was anything but – and no effort was made to verify the actual truth.

    Instead, the “heroes” effectively judged-and-juried and carried out sentence. The baffled – and entirely innocent of any crime deceased victim – probably never knew what hit him.

    The “heroes” claim they shot Finch – a “hero” “discharged his weapon” – after they say he moved his hands to his waistline. Naturally, the “hero” who “discharged his weapon” – the clinical language is revelatory – “feared for his safety.”

    Which made Finch’s life forfeit. Which makes any of our lives forfeit.

    This is the state of things in America, the “post-911 reality” – as the “heroes” and their apologists themselves describe it. That reality being ordinary people must live in abject terror of the government, accepting outright murder for the sake of can’t be-too-careful.

    Livingston admitted Finch was not armed. But the most maddening thing is that Finch was in his own home, minding his own business.


    There was no evidence of anything amiss; no shouting, no signs of an actual disturbance. All of this was triggered by an anonymous phone call. On the basis of that alone, a gang of screaming, hut-hutting “heroes” fingering assault rifles – the real thing, capable of fully automatic fire – assaults Finch’s home. He is startled by the sudden ruckus and wonders what is going on and why; perhaps is not immediately supine and compliant. After all, he hasn’t done anything and is in his own home. He may have been irritated by the intrusion.

    He moves his hands ever so slightly.

    And so is made dead.

    “Three or four people from the home were taken to be interviewed,” according to news reports. No one was found dead at the home – other than Finch, of course.

    Livingston called the shooting “tragic and senseless.”

    Which it was, but not in the way Livingston means.

    “The irresponsible actions of a prankster (italics added) put people’s lives at risk,” he said Friday. “The incident is a nightmare for everyone involved, including the family and our police department. Due to the actions of a prankster, we have an innocent victim. If the false police call had not been made, we would not have been there.”

    A prankster?

    What about the “irresponsible actions” of the “heroes”?

    Who stormed an innocent man’s house and shot him dead in front of his family on the basis of a prank call – without even a cursory attempt at fact-checking the situation, something even hack reporters usually at least go through the motions of doing? And hack reporters can only murder the truth – while armed government workers – “heroes” – murder flesh and blood human beings.

    And get away with it.

    Will the “heroes” who murdered Finch be charged with any crime, even reckless endangerment? Of course not. The armed government worker who murdered Finch has been placed on paid administrative leave. Having murdered one taxpayer, he is now paid by other taxpayers to go home and watch TV while the “investigation” proceeds. It is extremely unlikely he or any of his fellow”heroes” will be charged with any crime.

    If Finch’s family successfully sues over this extremely wrongful death, it will be the taxpayers who pay – not the “heroes” who did the death-dealing.

    And who, accordingly, will continue to deal death while uluating that they “feared for their safety.”

    The fact that a man can be shot to death over an anonymous call ought to outrage Americans. But most Americans have become inured to such atrocities by the “post-911 reality.” Official barbarism is now par for the course – the new routine. It reaches to the highest levels – the president of the United States speaks like a street corner thug, braggadociously. That having been normalized by the thug from Texas who preceded him and who, more than any other single individual, created “the post 911 reality.”

    It now trickles down to every street corner in the country, like a raw sewage tsunami.

    And it will stop only when people demand that it be stopped. When “heroes” who murder innocent people on the basis of anonymous calls are treated as murderers.

    When armed government workers who murder people while claiming they “feared for their safety” are no longer thought of as “heroes.”

    Which doesn’t look like it’ll be anytime soon.



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  5. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Innocent Man “Swatted” to Death by Kansas heroes…

    https://www.ericpetersautos.com/2017...kansas-heroes/

    By eric - December 30, 2017

    A prank call to “heroes” has resulted in an innocent man’s death at a home in Wichita, Kansas.

    Andrew Finch, 28, was shot and killed Thursday after police responded to an anonymous call about a shooting involving hostages.

    The caller claimed someone had an argument with their mother; that the woman’s husband was accidentally shot; and that a brother, a sister and the mother were being held hostage, according to head Wichita “hero” Troy Livingston

    “We learned through that call that the father was deceased, shot in the head. So that’s the information we were working off of,” Livingston said. “Our officers came here preparing for a hostage situation. Several got in position. A male came to the front door, and one of our officers discharged his weapon.

    Note that the anonymous caller’s assertions were taken as verbatim truth – “we learned through the call that the father was deceased ” a statement of fact that was anything but – and no effort was made to verify the actual truth.

    Instead, the “heroes” effectively judged-and-juried and carried out sentence. The baffled – and entirely innocent of any crime deceased victim – probably never knew what hit him.

    The “heroes” claim they shot Finch – a “hero” “discharged his weapon” – after they say he moved his hands to his waistline. Naturally, the “hero” who “discharged his weapon” – the clinical language is revelatory – “feared for his safety.”

    Which made Finch’s life forfeit. Which makes any of our lives forfeit.

    This is the state of things in America, the “post-911 reality” – as the “heroes” and their apologists themselves describe it. That reality being ordinary people must live in abject terror of the government, accepting outright murder for the sake of can’t be-too-careful.

    Livingston admitted Finch was not armed. But the most maddening thing is that Finch was in his own home, minding his own business.


    There was no evidence of anything amiss; no shouting, no signs of an actual disturbance. All of this was triggered by an anonymous phone call. On the basis of that alone, a gang of screaming, hut-hutting “heroes” fingering assault rifles – the real thing, capable of fully automatic fire – assaults Finch’s home. He is startled by the sudden ruckus and wonders what is going on and why; perhaps is not immediately supine and compliant. After all, he hasn’t done anything and is in his own home. He may have been irritated by the intrusion.

    He moves his hands ever so slightly.

    And so is made dead.

    “Three or four people from the home were taken to be interviewed,” according to news reports. No one was found dead at the home – other than Finch, of course.

    Livingston called the shooting “tragic and senseless.”

    Which it was, but not in the way Livingston means.

    “The irresponsible actions of a prankster (italics added) put people’s lives at risk,” he said Friday. “The incident is a nightmare for everyone involved, including the family and our police department. Due to the actions of a prankster, we have an innocent victim. If the false police call had not been made, we would not have been there.”

    A prankster?

    What about the “irresponsible actions” of the “heroes”?

    Who stormed an innocent man’s house and shot him dead in front of his family on the basis of a prank call – without even a cursory attempt at fact-checking the situation, something even hack reporters usually at least go through the motions of doing? And hack reporters can only murder the truth – while armed government workers – “heroes” – murder flesh and blood human beings.

    And get away with it.

    Will the “heroes” who murdered Finch be charged with any crime, even reckless endangerment? Of course not. The armed government worker who murdered Finch has been placed on paid administrative leave. Having murdered one taxpayer, he is now paid by other taxpayers to go home and watch TV while the “investigation” proceeds. It is extremely unlikely he or any of his fellow”heroes” will be charged with any crime.

    If Finch’s family successfully sues over this extremely wrongful death, it will be the taxpayers who pay – not the “heroes” who did the death-dealing.

    And who, accordingly, will continue to deal death while uluating that they “feared for their safety.”

    The fact that a man can be shot to death over an anonymous call ought to outrage Americans. But most Americans have become inured to such atrocities by the “post-911 reality.” Official barbarism is now par for the course – the new routine. It reaches to the highest levels – the president of the United States speaks like a street corner thug, braggadociously. That having been normalized by the thug from Texas who preceded him and who, more than any other single individual, created “the post 911 reality.”

    It now trickles down to every street corner in the country, like a raw sewage tsunami.

    And it will stop only when people demand that it be stopped. When “heroes” who murder innocent people on the basis of anonymous calls are treated as murderers.

    When armed government workers who murder people while claiming they “feared for their safety” are no longer thought of as “heroes.”

    Which doesn’t look like it’ll be anytime soon.

    I've iften thought it would be appropriate to have a meme depicting a thug scrum of cops beating the $#@! out of some poor schmuck while the schmuck desperately clings to a blood spattered sign reading "thank you police." I think it would accurately portray the mindset of copsuckers everywhere.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  6. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    I've iften thought it would be appropriate to have a meme depicting a thug scrum of cops beating the $#@! out of some poor schmuck while the schmuck desperately clings to a blood spattered sign reading "thank you police." I think it would accurately portray the mindset of copsuckers everywhere.
    Make it and I will tweet it...
    BEWARE THE CULT OF "GOVERNMENT"

    Christian Anarchy - Our Only Hope For Liberty In Our Lifetime!
    Sonmi 451: Truth is singular. Its "versions" are mistruths.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:ChristianAnarchist

    Use an internet archive site like
    THIS ONE
    to archive the article and create the link to the article content instead.

  7. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by SeanTX View Post
    However, you'll never hear any congress critters or state legislators discussing this sort of thing, and the changes that need to be made.
    What could a state legislator propose that would stop this sort of thing from happening? I'm going to be running for the state legislature in Kansas starting tomorrow. I'd appreciate any suggestions on what reforms the legislature should make to stop these types of events from happening.

  8. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Brett85 View Post
    What could a state legislator propose that would stop this sort of thing from happening? I'm going to be running for the state legislature in Kansas starting tomorrow. I'd appreciate any suggestions on what reforms the legislature should make to stop these types of events from happening.
    1 - Prohibiting the Circular Force Continuum as a training tool.

    2 - Formation of an independent police oversight committee with political and legal power.

    3 - Tort reform that renders police personally liable for deaths and damages they inflict unjustly.

  9. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Brett85 View Post
    What could a state legislator propose that would stop this sort of thing from happening? I'm going to be running for the state legislature in Kansas starting tomorrow. I'd appreciate any suggestions on what reforms the legislature should make to stop these types of events from happening.
    In addition to AF's,

    De-fund and disband SWAT.

    Forbid the use of firearms by police except and until actually fired upon..
    Fear of nothing should not be a viable defense.

    Encourage Home Defense, and personal defense of the general public. with the goal of the elimination of police entirely as an allowable concept.

    and more immediately,,
    ELIMINATE 911 from all police calls.. Fire or Medical emergency only,, ambulance or Fire crews only.
    Last edited by pcosmar; 01-01-2018 at 11:35 PM.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  10. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    1 - Prohibiting the Circular Force Continuum as a training tool.

    2 - Formation of an independent police oversight committee with political and legal power.

    3 - Tort reform that renders police personally liable for deaths and damages they inflict unjustly.
    I would have to do more research on #1 to know what that means. At first glance #2 seems like the proposal that would be the most likely to be advanced in a state legislature.

  11. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Brett85 View Post
    I would have to do more research on #1 to know what that means. At first glance #2 seems like the proposal that would be the most likely to be advanced in a state legislature.
    so,, nothing really except create yet another branch of government.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  12. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Brett85 View Post
    I would have to do more research on #1 to know what that means. At first glance #2 seems like the proposal that would be the most likely to be advanced in a state legislature.
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...orce+Continuum



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  14. #41

  15. #42
    Lisa Finch, in the letter to the city, calls her son’s killing by police unjustified. The police chief, she wrote, came to her home three days after Andrew Finch’s death to talk, but said she left the meeting with questions.

    “My heart was not eased by the unannounced visit, neither was it eased by the empty hand extended and the questions left unanswered,” she said in the letter. She wrote that she wants more information about what happened, including:
    ▪ The names of the officer who shot and killed her son

    ▪ The names of the other officers who responded to her home that night

    ▪ Why officers handcuffed and interrogated her family and seized electronics from the house

    ▪ What protocol and training Wichita police have in place for responding to swatting calls

    ▪ Whether the Sedgwick County District Attorney’s Office is considering criminal charges against the officers
    Read more here: http://www.kansas.com/news/local/cri...#storylink=cpy
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  16. #43
    I do not understand how these family members can meet with these mouthpieces to accept their "apologies".
    "Every post is about Hillary and pedophilia. I love them both soooo much!!!!!!!" Zippyjuan

  17. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by sparebulb View Post
    I do not understand how these family members can meet with these mouthpieces to accept their "apologies".
    “My heart was not eased by the unannounced visit, neither was it eased by the empty hand extended and the questions left unanswered,”

    That seems pretty clear to me.
    It is also clear that integrity is wholly lacking,,

    Not only this but the same folks shot a little girl in the head,, while missing a dog..

    Killer Clowns from Space crossed with the Keystone Cops from hell.

    in a neighborhood near you.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  18. #45
    And the cops skate.

    Again.

    Justified.

    Now move the $#@! along.


    No Charges for Wichita Officer Who Killed Innocent, Unarmed Man in 'Swatting'

    http://reason.com/blog/2018/04/13/no...icer-who-kille

    It's considered "reasonable" for police to kill based on false information.

    Scott Shackford|Apr. 13, 2018 1:15 pm

    Wichita PoliceWichita Police body cameraA Kansas district attorney announced yesterday that a police officer who shot an unarmed man on his own porch will not face charges because the officer was operating under the impression that he was responding to a hostage situation.

    The fatal shooting of Andrew Finch in Wichita, Kansas, drew national attention in December, as it appeared to be the first case of a "Swatting" call turning deadly. "Swatting" is a particularly nasty prank in which someone calls 911 and falsely claims to be involved in a dangerous hostage situation, drawing a SWAT raid to somebody else's home and terrifying the targets.

    In this case, a Los Angeles man reportedly made the false call as a result of some video game dispute. Finch wasn't even involved in the dispute; the suspect, Tyler Barriss, was given Finch's address by the person he was arguing with. Barriss allegedly called 911 and claimed to have shot his own dad at Finch's address and to be holding a family hostage.

    Police arrived armed and prepared for a hostage situation. According to Finch's family, Finch saw the police lights outside and—not realizing that his own home was their target—went out on the front porch to see what was happening. Ten seconds later he was shot and killed by police.

    District Attorney Marc Bennett investigated the shooting. His conclusion:

    The officer believed Mr. Finch was the suspect who had shot his own father and had been holding his younger brother and mother hostage. This officer perceived these movements by Mr. Finch and believed the subject that he was looking at, Mr. Finch, was reaching for the gun that he would have used to shoot his father moments earlier. The officer believed he saw a gun come up in Mr. Finch's hands. The officer stated that he discharged his weapon, thinking that Mr. Finch presented an imminent risk to the officers.

    But Finch didn't have a gun, he wasn't an imminent risk, and there was no hostage situation. The police have been granted permission to shoot to kill on the basis of a prank call. The Wichita Eagle notes that because the officer isn't being charged, the police won't even release the cop's name. The family is suing in civil court as well, but the city (and the taxpayers) will be held accountable for a financial settlement, not the police department.

    This is a terrible decision for a couple of reasons. First, it reinforces a culture in which officers are permitted to shoot and kill anybody on the basis of their own fears and to believe the worst in any encounter. This law enforcement culture puts all of us at risk in every encounter with police. If a completely harmless man can be shot on his own porch and police can say they thought he was reaching for a weapon, that's a terrible way to protect public safety.

    And knowing that police can avoid responsibility for these shootings actually incentivizes "swatting" calls. If police knew they could face consequences for reacting rashly to such calls, they'd be more careful. If they're more careful, their responses to these calls won't cause the results the pranksters want.

    Instead, there's a push to increase the penalties for making these swatting calls. Barriss faces manslaughter charges, and various people want to increase the punishment he faces for his role in making this happen. And perhaps he should face tougher penalties. But shielding the police from punishment also shields them from pressure to make changes that would make such shootings less likely. The goal shouldn't just be to punish swatters. Police have to change the way they approach these calls in the first place, in order to make sure there is actually a hostage situation happening. California lawmakers, for example, are considering a bill to change the threshold for police to be permitted to use deadly force; the law would require that there be an imminent threat with no other reasonable alternatives.

  19. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    And the cops skate.

    Again.

    Justified.

    Now move the $#@! along.


    No Charges for Wichita Officer Who Killed Innocent, Unarmed Man in 'Swatting'

    http://reason.com/blog/2018/04/13/no...icer-who-kille

    It's considered "reasonable" for police to kill based on false information.

    Scott Shackford|Apr. 13, 2018 1:15 pm

    Wichita PoliceWichita Police body cameraA Kansas district attorney announced yesterday that a police officer who shot an unarmed man on his own porch will not face charges because the officer was operating under the impression that he was responding to a hostage situation.

    The fatal shooting of Andrew Finch in Wichita, Kansas, drew national attention in December, as it appeared to be the first case of a "Swatting" call turning deadly. "Swatting" is a particularly nasty prank in which someone calls 911 and falsely claims to be involved in a dangerous hostage situation, drawing a SWAT raid to somebody else's home and terrifying the targets.

    In this case, a Los Angeles man reportedly made the false call as a result of some video game dispute. Finch wasn't even involved in the dispute; the suspect, Tyler Barriss, was given Finch's address by the person he was arguing with. Barriss allegedly called 911 and claimed to have shot his own dad at Finch's address and to be holding a family hostage.

    Police arrived armed and prepared for a hostage situation. According to Finch's family, Finch saw the police lights outside and—not realizing that his own home was their target—went out on the front porch to see what was happening. Ten seconds later he was shot and killed by police.

    District Attorney Marc Bennett investigated the shooting. His conclusion:

    The officer believed Mr. Finch was the suspect who had shot his own father and had been holding his younger brother and mother hostage. This officer perceived these movements by Mr. Finch and believed the subject that he was looking at, Mr. Finch, was reaching for the gun that he would have used to shoot his father moments earlier. The officer believed he saw a gun come up in Mr. Finch's hands. The officer stated that he discharged his weapon, thinking that Mr. Finch presented an imminent risk to the officers.

    But Finch didn't have a gun, he wasn't an imminent risk, and there was no hostage situation. The police have been granted permission to shoot to kill on the basis of a prank call. The Wichita Eagle notes that because the officer isn't being charged, the police won't even release the cop's name. The family is suing in civil court as well, but the city (and the taxpayers) will be held accountable for a financial settlement, not the police department.

    This is a terrible decision for a couple of reasons. First, it reinforces a culture in which officers are permitted to shoot and kill anybody on the basis of their own fears and to believe the worst in any encounter. This law enforcement culture puts all of us at risk in every encounter with police. If a completely harmless man can be shot on his own porch and police can say they thought he was reaching for a weapon, that's a terrible way to protect public safety.

    And knowing that police can avoid responsibility for these shootings actually incentivizes "swatting" calls. If police knew they could face consequences for reacting rashly to such calls, they'd be more careful. If they're more careful, their responses to these calls won't cause the results the pranksters want.

    Instead, there's a push to increase the penalties for making these swatting calls. Barriss faces manslaughter charges, and various people want to increase the punishment he faces for his role in making this happen. And perhaps he should face tougher penalties. But shielding the police from punishment also shields them from pressure to make changes that would make such shootings less likely. The goal shouldn't just be to punish swatters. Police have to change the way they approach these calls in the first place, in order to make sure there is actually a hostage situation happening. California lawmakers, for example, are considering a bill to change the threshold for police to be permitted to use deadly force; the law would require that there be an imminent threat with no other reasonable alternatives.
    "Government Privilege..." Riots any day now.
    Theye have refused their Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

    Theye have erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance.

    Theye kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies

    Theye have combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution,

    For protecting them, by a mock Trial from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States:

    For cutting off our Trade with parts of the world:

    For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:

    For depriving us in many cases, of the benefit of Trial by Jury:

    Theye plundered and destroyed the lives of our people.

    Theye are at this time transporting Armies of Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation, and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & Perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy of a civilized nation.

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