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Thread: [Timeline v3.0] Las Vegas police change concert shooting timeline

  1. #1

    Default [Timeline v3.0] Las Vegas police change concert shooting timeline

    Las Vegas police change concert shooting timeline







    ----------------

    Update [Timeline v3.0]:

    Police Change Timeline Of Las Vegas Mass Shooting Again

    The Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department has once again changed its timeline of the tragic mass shooting carried out by Stephen Paddock from a corner suite at the Mandalay Bay Hotel and Casino on Oct. 1.

    Clark County Sheriff Joe Lombardo said during a Friday night press conference that Paddock shot at a hotel security guard around the same time he was firing on the music festival ― not six minutes before firing at the concert, as was previously believed.

    This is the second time this week that police announced a change to the timeline of events for the shooting.

    Lombardo had announced another revision on Monday that police believed that Paddock shot hotel security guard Jesus Campos at 9:59 p.m. and began shooting at the festival six minutes later at 10:05 p.m. That timeline replaced the original belief held soon after the shooting that Paddock stopped his attack on the festival because Campos approached the door to his 32nd-floor hotel suite.

    MGM Resorts International, Mandalay Bay’s parent company, publicly rejected Monday’s revised timeline, arguing that the police had based their revision on a report manually created by the hotel “after the fact without the benefit of information we now have.”

    MGM offered their own timeline on Thursday, saying that “shots were being fired at the festival lot at the same time, or within 40 seconds after” Campos first reported shots fired over the radio.

    Lombardo said on Friday that police investigators now agree with MGM’s timeline after reviewing additional information.

    “The information was obtained via security logs, Officer Campos himself, body worn cameras, hotel cameras...LVMPD dispatch, hotel and private cameras and interviews,” Lombardo said on Friday.

    Lombardo clarified on Friday that Campos had encountered a barricaded stairwell door near Paddock’s room at 9:59 p.m., but wasn’t shot, as police believed Monday. Sgt. Joshua Bitsko told CNN that the door had been intentionally screwed shut by Paddock.

    In order to gain access the 32nd floor, Campos had to go up the stairwell one more floor, then head back down one floor. He approached Paddock’s suite at about 10:05 p.m., which was when police believe Paddock shot Campos through the door. Paddock then fired at the festival for 10 minutes, according to Lombardo.

    Police reached Paddock’s suite at 10:17 p.m., 12 minutes after Campos was shot. According to MGM, Campos had been responding to an alarm set off by an open door that was on the same floor as Paddock.
    ...
    More: https://www.yahoo.com/news/police-ch...130031152.html
    Last edited by Brian4Liberty; 10-14-2017 at 12:54 PM.
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  3. #2

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    Bottom line: Initial reports by "officials" are often no more reliable than media reports, rumors and gossip. The top people speaking have no direct knowledge about what happened, they have what people have told them. On top of that, they have an agenda to make themselves and their organizations look good. They do spin. They are often acting as both PR people and politicians (neither role is particularly renowned for being up front and honest).
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
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  4. #3

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    What was he drilling in the room? (5:50 in Sheriff's press conference...)
    Last edited by Brian4Liberty; 10-10-2017 at 09:05 AM.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
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  5. #4

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    The "Significant change" was that the hotel security guard was shot shortly before- not after- the shooting.

    Also new: http://abc7ny.com/authorities-make-s...eline/2514155/

    On Monday, Lombardo said security guard Jesus Campos was in a hallway of the Mandalay Bay hotel responding to a report of an open door when he heard drilling from Stephen Craig Paddock's room.
    Authorities also said Monday that Paddock targeted aviation fuel tanks, stocked his car with explosives and had personal protection gear as part of an escape plan.

    Paddock had power tools and was attempting to drill a hole in an adjacent wall, perhaps to mount another camera or to point a rifle through, but he never completed the work, Lombardo said. He also drilled holes and bolted a metal bar to try to prevent the opening of an emergency exit stairwell door near the door of his room.
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 10-10-2017 at 12:16 PM.
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  6. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    The "Significant change" was that the hotel security guard was shot shortly before- not after- the shooting.

    Also new: http://abc7ny.com/authorities-make-s...eline/2514155/
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  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    The "Significant change" was that the hotel security guard was shot shortly before- not after- the shooting.

    Also new: http://abc7ny.com/authorities-make-s...eline/2514155/
    One of many changes in the official story since it started. Like the changing number of days that he was in the room.

    This one is potentially embarrassing to the Police, so was this a "fog of war" error, or an intentional fudging of info for the Police at some level to save face?

    The question is now being asked "once someone opens fire with a semi-automatic weapon in a hotel, how long does it take for the Police to respond?" The new timeline says that shots were fired 6 minutes before he started firing into the crowd. Did the hotel delay in notifying the Police? Were the Police delayed for some other reason? What was happening in those 6 minutes? Where was the breakdown?
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  8. #7

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    Good Guy with a Gun Could Have Stopped Stephen Paddock Before Mass Shooting

    http://www.breitbart.com/big-governm...mass-shooting/

    by AWR HAWKINS 10 Oct 2017

    Following Sheriff Joe Lombardo’s October 9 announcement that Mandalay Bay security guard Jesus Campos actually discovered Stephen Paddock six minutes before the attack began, it is only natural to wonder if Campos could have stopped the attack–had he been armed.

    But The Daily Beast (TDB) reports that Campos was not armed when he discovered Paddock. Therefore, he was at Paddock’s mercy and ended up shot and wounded.

    The day after the attack, Breitbart News reported Mandalay Bay’s 2012 guidelines for private security, which mandate that guards are banned from carrying “weapons of any kind.” The guidelines define weapons as “guns, knives, nightsticks, mace, pepper spray, stun guns etc.,” all of which are designated as “strictly prohibited on Mandalay Bay property.”

    What if the security guard who discovered Paddock six minutes before the attack had been armed?

    What if he had been carrying a Glock 19 with a 15-round magazine and had been well-trained in use of the firearm?’

    Many on the left argue against more good guys guns and even against the basic premise that a good guy with a gun is the only way to stop a bad guy with a gun. But such arguments are not logical.

    Consider the heinous attack on Sandy Hook Elementary, where there were no good guys with guns and the attacker had over nine minutes without any armed resistance. Contrast that with a shooting almost one year later to the day – a shooting in which Karl Halverson Pierson entered Denver, Colorado’s Arapahoe High School with a shotgun and was confronted by an armed guard.

    The Christian Science Monitor reported that the armed guard began running toward the sound of the shooter as soon as the first shots were fired. Arapahoe County Sheriff Grayson Robinson said that as a result of the guard’s action, “the heavily-armed shooter realized he was about to be confronted by an armed officer and took his own life.”

    Because of a good guy with a gun the Arapahoe High School shooting lasted 80 seconds and only took the life of one innocent. Quite a contrast with the Sandy Hook attack that lasted over nine minutes and took 26 lives.

    This begs the question, how many lives might have saved on October 1 if Paddock had been confronted by a good guy with a gun six minutes before the attack began?

  9. #8

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    What if the security guard who discovered Paddock six minutes before the attack had been armed?

    What if he had been carrying a Glock 19 with a 15-round magazine and had been well-trained in use of the firearm?’
    Would he have shot back through a door when somebody inside fired? (not knowing how many how well armed people might be inside and being by himself with one pistol?) Would you?

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-l...-idUSKBN1CF2YI

    Police were not aware Campos had been shot until they met him in the hallway at 10:18 p.m., three minutes after Paddock had stopped firing on the concert. Police blew open Paddock’s hotel room door 81 minutes after the shooting started.

    Protocol for Las Vegas hotels and casinos is to barricade the corridor where a shooting takes place and wait for police to arrive, said David Shepherd, a security expert who advises the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department and who ran the security team at The Venetian hotel on the Vegas Strip for eight years.

    Police are trained to wait and negotiate with a shooter, rather than storm the room immediately, he said. The initial reports that night of multiple shooters at several hotels would also have confused police, he added.

    “One of the biggest priorities is not to lose the life of a police officer,” Shepherd said by telephone. “So in those six minutes, it is highly unlikely police would have stormed that room.”
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 10-10-2017 at 05:07 PM.
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  10. #9

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    Apparently concerns for "Officer Safety" (cowardice) prevented the LVMPD from doing anything to stop the shooter before or during the act, but about 45 minutes after he stopped firing they blew the door and entered his hotel room. Such heroes! [NOT]

    Maybe they should fire the whole police department and replace it with Jesus Campos, and the maintenance worker who responded quickly?

    .
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  11. #10

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    Police were not aware Campos had been shot until they met him in the hallway at 10:18 p.m., three minutes after Paddock had stopped firing on the concert. Police blew open Paddock’s hotel room door 81 minutes after the shooting started.
    So, active shooter in a major hotel response time is ~20 minutes (9:59pm shots fired, arrive at scene 10:18pm).
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  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Would he have shot back through a door when somebody inside fired? (not knowing how many how well armed people might be inside and being by himself with one pistol?) Would you?

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-l...-idUSKBN1CF2YI
    If the shooter is continuing to shoot (after a short break) and it's obvious that the shots are not coming down the hall, the conclusion would be they are shooting at someone else. With only a pistol, it's a hard call, but a couple of shots through the door might distract the shooter until help arrives.

    And with all of the rifles that have gone into Police cruisers, it's hard to imagine that the first cop running to an active shooter wouldn't pull out an AR15, M16, MP5 or something similar.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
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  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by RonZeplin View Post
    Apparently concerns for "Officer Safety" (cowardice) prevented the LVMPD from doing anything to stop the shooter before or during the act, but about 45 minutes after he stopped firing they blew the door and entered his hotel room. Such heroes! [NOT]

    Maybe they should fire the whole police department and replace it with Jesus Campos, and the maintenance worker who responded quickly?

    .
    When I went through Basic law enf training ...8 or 9 years ago now... we had active shooter training. The one thing that was stressed more than anything based on what police had learned from prior shooting events is that in active shooter situations, particularly the first responders, you enter the building asap, with or without backup, to attempt to locate and stop or disrupt the shooter. Every second counted, each fired round meant another person could be dead.

    We were being trained to disregard our own safety in the event of an active shooting. training was done by local leaders in the local pd, sheriffs offices, and I remember it like yesterday. We didn't want a columbine in our schools and normal protocols were to be disregarded if there was an active shooting. other than book study and film study, we had field training as well in 2 locations. One was a local school, and one was a hotel / convention center. It was a full scale training.

    These police knowing that thousands of people were being fired upon should have disregarded their own safety to attempt to stop the active shooter - but they didn't. And that is very troubling to me.

    I don't hate on police and don't necessarily view all law enforcement agencies to be agents of evil. I think the conflict between freedom and law enforcement is a direct result of the people who crave the chains provided by the state. This leads to abuse of power and erosion of freedom, but I know many in local law enforcement who would gladly lay their lives down to stop an active shooter. I would do it myself, as well as most real men .

    The fact that they stood idly by for so long is troubling me. It goes against nature.
    Last edited by asurfaholic; 10-10-2017 at 07:48 PM.
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  14. #13

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    Shooting had ceased by the time the police met Campos.

    Police were not aware Campos had been shot until they met him in the hallway at 10:18 p.m., three minutes after Paddock had stopped firing on the concert.
    "The only thing we have to fear is.... fear itself!" Franklin Delano Roosevelt.
    "Be afwaid. Be berry afwaid" Donald Trump.

    The optimists built this country and made it great- not the fearful. Fear can only destroy.

    I am Zippy and I approve of this post. But you don't have to.

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by asurfaholic View Post
    When I went through Basic law enf training ...8 or 9 years ago now... we had active shooter training. The one thing that was stressed more than anything based on what police had learned from prior shooting events is that in active shooter situations, particularly the first responders, you enter the building asap, with or without backup, to attempt to locate and stop or disrupt the shooter. Every second counted, each fired round meant another person could be dead.

    We were being trained to disregard our own safety in the event of an active shooting. training was done by local leaders in the local pd, sheriffs offices, and I remember it like yesterday. We didn't want a columbine in our schools and normal protocols were to be disregarded if there was an active shooting. other than book study and film study, we had field training as well in 2 locations. One was a local school, and one was a hotel / convention center. It was a full scale training.

    These police knowing that thousands of people were being fired upon should have disregarded their own safety to attempt to stop the active shooter - but they didn't. And that is very troubling to me.

    I don't hate on police and don't necessarily view all law enforcement agencies to be agents of evil. I think the conflict between freedom and law enforcement is a direct result of the people who crave the chains provided by the state. This leads to abuse of power and erosion of freedom, but I know many in local law enforcement who would gladly lay their lives down to stop an active shooter. I would do it myself, as well as most real men .

    The fact that they stood idly by for so long is troubling me. It goes against nature.
    It makes me wonder if someone ordered them to wait for permission.
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  16. #15

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    I don't know what happened in Vegas and probably never will but I'm grateful for all the pauses in the shooting sequence. I don't know why the shooter (whoever he or they were) keep pausing for long times between bursts but of course those pauses resulted in lots of lives saved. Imagine if he did nothing but lay down continuous fire for those 10 minutes. There would have been hundreds dead, not 58. Makes you wonder if there was a "conflict" going on in that room between multiple people or maybe just multiple personalities...
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  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChristianAnarchist View Post
    I don't know what happened in Vegas and probably never will but I'm grateful for all the pauses in the shooting sequence. I don't know why the shooter (whoever he or they were) keep pausing for long times between bursts but of course those pauses resulted in lots of lives saved. Imagine if he did nothing but lay down continuous fire for those 10 minutes. There would have been hundreds dead, not 58. Makes you wonder if there was a "conflict" going on in that room between multiple people or maybe just multiple personalities...
    Guns hold a limited amount of ammo and he was using his at a rapid rate. Pauses were likely swapping guns.
    "The only thing we have to fear is.... fear itself!" Franklin Delano Roosevelt.
    "Be afwaid. Be berry afwaid" Donald Trump.

    The optimists built this country and made it great- not the fearful. Fear can only destroy.

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  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Guns hold a limited amount of ammo and he was using his at a rapid rate. Pauses were likely swapping guns.
    It doesn't take that long.
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  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Would he have shot back through a door when somebody inside fired? (not knowing how many how well armed people might be inside and being by himself with one pistol?) Would you?
    We'll never know, because he was disarmed by policy.

    Now, all we need to do is make sure that homicidal manics follow "policy" as well.
    Last edited by Anti Federalist; 10-10-2017 at 10:31 PM.

  20. #19

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    Police were not aware Campos had been shot until they met him in the hallway at 10:18 p.m., three minutes after Paddock had stopped firing on the concert. Police blew open Paddock’s hotel room door 81 minutes after the shooting started.

    Protocol for Las Vegas hotels and casinos is to barricade the corridor where a shooting takes place and wait for police to arrive, said David Shepherd, a security expert who advises the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department and who ran the security team at The Venetian hotel on the Vegas Strip for eight years.

    Police are trained to wait and negotiate with a shooter, rather than storm the room immediately, he said. The initial reports that night of multiple shooters at several hotels would also have confused police, he added.

    “One of the biggest priorities is not to lose the life of a police officer,” Shepherd said by telephone. “So in those six minutes, it is highly unlikely police would have stormed that room.”
    What BS is this now? This doesn't even make any sense, really.

    Police do not negotiate in an active shooter situation, this is not the primary goal at least; it is to clear the population, setup an outer perimeter with beat units, get an on-duty SRT (along with K9 units and air support) to establish an inner perimeter and then take a combination of actions while awaiting for SWAT to take over, including negotiating, taking out the shooters, distracting the shooters using various tactics (cutting power, making announcements, flash-banging, back-lighting, etc.), returning fire, etc.
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  21. #20

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    TWO VIDEOS THAT PROVE THE FBI IS LYING ABOUT THE VEGAS MASSACRE
    Alteration of event timeline brings entire narrative into question

    Infowars.com - OCTOBER 10, 2017
    The official story surrounding the Las Vegas mass shooting is crumbling.
    After Las Vegas Sheriff Joseph Lombardo dramatically altered the shooting timeline Monday, indicating a security guard was shot by alleged gunman Stephen Paddock before his assault on country music concertgoers, the entire narrative has been thrown into question.
    Watch these two videos for a recap of various inconsistencies that don’t add up.
    Below: Excerpts from the different press conferences held by LVPD and FBI show that their official story has more holes that Swiss cheese.



    Below: This is a compilation of two videos featuring Rene Downs, who was staying at the Bellagio hotel on Oct 1st and heard automatic fire, broken glass and stampeding crowds at the Petrossian Lounge. Her room was comped by Hotel staff who claimed no shooting was heard at that location. Rene Downs timestamped the sounds of automatic gunfire to just after 11pm, a full 45 minutes after shooting ended at the Mandalay Bay.

    https://www.infowars.com/two-videos-...egas-massacre/
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  22. #21
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  23. #22

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    Management was probably reluctant and wanted to weigh options before bursting into a high rollers suite. Had the mass shooting not occurred the employee might have been paid off and no one would have ever heard about the incident.

  24. #23

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    And here we go, it's time to play the blame game!

    This remains an ongoing investigation with a lot of moving parts. As evidenced by law enforcement briefings over the past week, many facts are still unverified and continue to change as events are under review," Debra DeShong, a spokeswoman for MGM Resorts International, said in a statement Tuesday. "We cannot be certain about the most recent timeline that has been communicated publically, and we believe what is currently being expressed may not be accurate."
    ...
    Judge Andrew Napolitano, Fox News’ senior judicial analyst, said on “Cavuto: Coast to Coast,” that the news from the new timeline is not that the security guard was shot earlier than previously stated, but that the news was "that the agent of the hotel who should have been carrying with him a recording device -- a device which would have allowed the head of security or somebody in security to listen in – was shot at 200 times by an automatic weapon.”

    He continued, “So Mandalay Bay knew of the existence and presence and workability of the automatic weapon six minutes before he started killing people. That should have triggered an enormous response,” he said, considering the argument lawyers could make to a jury, if it gets to that point.
    ...
    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/10/11...-shooting.html
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  25. #24

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    And now a different possibility comes to the forefront. Perhaps this was not the shooters plan at all and because of some kind of encounter with the security guy he had to improvise and start shooting out the window of his hotel. Perhaps he was planning for something else a day or two later and if things had gone according to that plan hundreds would have died. Perhaps when he encountered the security guard he had to quickly get out all of his equipment and break out the windows and start shooting at anything and anyone he could see.

    If that's the case then it would explain why it took an additional 6 minutes from the guard being shot at (and I doubt it was 200 rounds) and him shooting out the window. It might also explain the strange pauses in bursts of fire. Perhaps he was taking stuff out of suitcases and loading magazines during those pauses...

    And then maybe after 10 minutes of killing he started to be bothered by his conscience and decided to end it all.
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  26. #25

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    I want to know why no reports about the Bellagio and Aria Casino shootings in MSM?
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  27. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by donnay View Post
    I want to know why no reports about the Bellagio and Aria Casino shootings in MSM?
    Could be because every day there are shootings that are swept under the rug? Or to be fair, they would have a hard time reporting on every gunshot in a city.
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  28. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Could be because every day there are shootings that are swept under the rug? Or to be fair, they would have a hard time reporting on every gunshot in a city.
    It was on the same day as the concert tragedy.
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  29. #28

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    I don’t know it seems like there a ton of discrepancies with this timeline and chain of events:

    1. Are their police radios even capable of consistently broadcasting inside of these large structures?
    2. If the security guard informed their security center they were shot and their location and the police originally stated it was the information they had received from him as to how they were able get to the suspect to quickly, then why did officers go to the 31st floor instead of the 32nd floor?
    3. Was the security guard left there for nearly an hour with a rifle wound by police; and he had 200-rounds fired at him, but was struck only once in the leg and further no other guests were struck or bothered to call the 911 due to rounds being fired into their rooms?
    4. Why didn’t anybody else throughout the surrounding floors call 911, clearly the officers were able to hear the gunfire from at least the below floor, as well at least one other another guest that was interviewed by the media, and by the way who had stated that they merely stayed in his room the entire time looking out the window (also listening to the collection of evidence, walking around, etc.), but yet never called 911 to inform them the gunfire is coming from the suite above his, apparently.
    5. Why has the security guard yet to be interviewed, this hero?
    6. Why are the police and media not addressing the reports of gunfire from surrounding hotels?
    7. If officers knew of the suspect’s suite as stated by the security guard, why did it take them 25-minutes to get an entry team into place, meanwhile wasting their time clearing rooms farthest from the suspect’s known location?
    8. Remember, they security guard was right there near the suspect, police are claiming to have contacted the security guard within 2-minutes of the lasts shots being fired by the suspect from his suite, yet the police opt to waste 38-minutes searching other rooms.
    Last edited by Weston White; 10-11-2017 at 09:04 PM.
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  30. #29

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    The pieces of the puzzle will never fit because Paddock never fired a shot. He was the first one dead. I'm just convinced. It looks like everything was done to avoid security cameras, and there are some things that explain how other people might have reached the suite. I understand the security guard who was shot in the leg was up there to investigate a stuck fire door on the 32nd floor. That would have put him right across the hall from the hotel suite.
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  31. #30

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    Oh now there is a maintenance worker that was there with the security guard, they came up after the guard was shot, both had radios and at least one used a hotel phone to call down for help, all of this within six minutes; the security guard warned the maintenance worker of the danger from an alcove in the hallway--which why wouldn't the maintenance worker been advised of the danger already if they security guard had already used their radio to call for help being they had been shot and 200-rounds were flying all over the place. And again, where were all of their hotel guests, not a one called 911 to report gunfire, the injured security guard, to offer to bring the guard into their room for safety, nothing?
    The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding one’s self in the ranks of the insane.” — Marcus Aurelius


    Consilio et Animis de Oppresso Liber

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