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Thread: Forced Takeover of Catalan Government Institutions by Spanish Police

  1. #1

    Forced Takeover of Catalan Government Institutions by Spanish Police

    Breaking: Forced Takeover of Catalan Government Institutions by Spanish Police Ahead of Oct. 1 Vote

    Thomas Harrington Posted on September 20, 2017

    I just got of the phone with Josep Maria Sole Sabatť, my friend and a leading Catalan historian and public intellectual. He was nothing short of breathless as he described the helicopters flying overhead stated flatly that he was in the the midst of a coup being carried out by the Spanish State.

    He wanted to get in touch with me and others "out there" because he was not sure how much longer free communication would be available to him and other out in the street protesting against he Spanish central governmentís arrest of members of the Catalan Autonomous government.

    As of this writing at least six agencies of the Catalan Government have been the object of forced police searches and thirteen, mostly mid-level members of the Catalan government have been arrested.

    The homes of two the leading architects of the incipient Catalan state, Carles Viver Pi i Sunyer and ex Spanish judge Santi Vidal, have been searched by police. The headquarters of the far-left CUP, part of the pro-vote coalition in the Catalan Parliament, has been surrounded by police.


    The leader of the Catalan National Congress Jordi Sanchez and the head of Omnium, a major Catalan cultural organization, Jordi Cuixart, has called Catalans to come into the streets and they have responded with a massive presence.

    The mayor of Barcelona Ada Colau, who has been highly ambivalent regarding the referendum that is scheduled too take place on October 1st, has now come out firmly for the referendum and against the crackdown taking place. Albano Dante Fachin, head of the Podemos branch in Catalonia, which has been similarly ambivalent, is now off the fence fully supporting the right to decree and denouncing the aggression of the Spanish State

    continued...https://www.antiwar.com/blog/2017/09...of-oct-1-vote/
    "The Patriarch"

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post

    Not going to happen.
    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    The man did not think clearly. It was almost as if he had brain cancer of something.



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  3. #2
    They are asking for this:

    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  4. #3
    evening falls in Catalonia...


  5. #4
    Like Scotland, Catalonia wants independence because they think the central government isn't socialistic enough.

    So, I'm rooting for Madrid.

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Like Scotland, Catalonia wants independence because they think the central government isn't socialistic enough.

    So, I'm rooting for Madrid.
    Madrid should let them go before they poison the minds of the rest of the voters, both sides will be better off without the other.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Madrid should let them go before they poison the minds of the rest of the voters, both sides will be better off without the other.
    That's plausible, but I don't buy it.

    Absent Catalonia, I expect Spain would continue more or less as before, while the Catalans would print up little red books.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    That's plausible, but I don't buy it.

    Absent Catalonia, I expect Spain would continue more or less as before, while the Catalans would print up little red books.
    So you don't think Catalonia has any effect on Spain's politics?

    I see this as Spain's CALExit, I don't expect Spain to become a libertarian paradise but losing all those communists can't be anything but good, and the civil war that will result if they don't let them go will be ruinous.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  9. #8
    Spain struck by the wave of protests in the support of referendum
    about 40 protests ongoing in support of Catalonia.



    http://www.publico.es/pages/mapa-con...neralitat.html


    Last edited by goldenequity; 09-20-2017 at 03:24 PM.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    So you don't think Catalonia has any effect on Spain's politics?

    I see this as Spain's CALExit, I don't expect Spain to become a libertarian paradise but losing all those communists can't be anything but good, and the civil war that will result if they don't let them go will be ruinous.
    That's a pretty good analogy.

    Now, if California's Senators and Congressmen departed DC, would anything really change?

    Sure, the GOP would get a larger majority and...do nothing with it.

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Like Scotland, Catalonia wants independence because they think the central government isn't socialistic enough.
    Fine, let them try it with their own money and maybe one day Spain will let them back in.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  13. #11

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    That's a pretty good analogy.

    Now, if California's Senators and Congressmen departed DC, would anything really change?

    Sure, the GOP would get a larger majority and...do nothing with it.
    They would lose their biggest excuse to do nothing and the voters might start to replace them with better men, there would no longer be the "lesser of two evils" argument.

    And the Dems would never again be able to inflict the abominations that they alone are willing to propose.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by goldenequity View Post
    I can't see the tweet, can you provide the link?
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I can't see the tweet, can you provide the link?
    A lot of times you have to F5/refresh and it will 'appear'
    but here is the link: https://twitter.com/xoldi

  17. #15

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by enhanced_deficit View Post
    If referendun had been banned by supreme authorities, why was people still trying to exercise their voting rights?
    That is asking for trouble.


    Spanish police raid Catalan government to halt banned referendum
    Reuters 9h ago
    Revolutionaries don't ask for permission, King George III didn't agree to the continental congress.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  20. #17
    To Prevent Rebellion, Spain Docks Cruise Ship Housing 16,000 Riot Police In Barcelona Port
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-0...tensions-mount

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by goldenequity View Post
    To Prevent Rebellion, Spain Docks Cruise Ship Housing 16,000 Riot Police In Barcelona Port
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-0...tensions-mount
    Just a small precautionary measure. Maybe rev will donate to the cause.
    "The Patriarch"

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post

    Not going to happen.
    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    The man did not think clearly. It was almost as if he had brain cancer of something.

  22. #19
    why isnt infowars covering this

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by goldenequity View Post
    To Prevent Rebellion, Spain Docks Cruise Ship Housing 16,000 Riot Police In Barcelona Port
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-0...tensions-mount
    It would be a real shame if it somehow sank.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by goldenequity View Post
    To Prevent Rebellion, Spain Docks Cruise Ship Housing 16,000 Riot Police In Barcelona Port
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-0...tensions-mount
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Dr. Ron Paul. "Stand up for what you believe in, even if you are standing alone." - Sophie Magdalena Scholl
    "War is the health of the State." - Randolph Bourne "Freedom is the answer. ... Now, what's the question?" - Ernie Hancock.

  25. #22
    From ArmstrongEconomics September 21, 2017:

    "Spain has invaded Barcelona sending in an army of 16,500 as pretend riot police to effectively suppress and intimidate the people. Armed police have seized almost 10 million ballots Ö showing the entire world that Spain is still fascist Ö The Spanish police have beaten citizens as if this were some third world dictatorship ...

    The Spanish police have raided several print works and newspaper offices in Catalonia hunting for voting papers, ballot boxes and leaflets to be used in an October 1st independence Ö Madrid has revealed its true nature to the entire world on center stage and this is starting to show up in our models for Europe. Ö

    Thousands have taken to the streets in protest of what is clearly a full blown restoration of Spanish fascism. Ö shorting Spanish bonds has been outlawed. The free markets have been utterly destroyed. The ECB is buying all Spanish debt trying to pretend that confidence in Spain is strong. ...
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Dr. Ron Paul. "Stand up for what you believe in, even if you are standing alone." - Sophie Magdalena Scholl
    "War is the health of the State." - Randolph Bourne "Freedom is the answer. ... Now, what's the question?" - Ernie Hancock.

  26. #23
    https://www.thelocal.es/20170916/the...nce-referendum

    Nine key Pitfalls of Catalan Referendum.

    Catalan authorities are racing to stage an independence referendum slated for October 1st which Spain's central government has vowed to stop.
    The following are the key pitfalls of the planned plebiscite:

    1. Electoral authority

    According to the Venice Commission -- a panel of experts who advise the Council of Europe on constitutional law -- a referendum must be organised by an "impartial body".

    While Catalonia's referendum law created an electoral commission composed of five members, they all have links with the separatists.

    2. Polling stations

    The Catalan government wants the referendum to be similar to a regional election. During the last regional election in September 2015 a total of 8,177 polling stations were set up across the region.

    Of Catalonia's 948 municipalities, over 700 mainly smaller ones have pledged to provide locations for polling stations. Several large cities have refused.

    Spain's central government has warned Catalan mayors that it is their duty to "prevent or block any initiative related to the organisation of the referendum".

    3. Election material

    The production of ballots for the referendum has been a headache for Catalan officials, who complain police have searched companies suspected of producing them.

    Despite the difficulties, Catalan President Carles Puigdemont announced at the end of August that his government had over 6,000 boxes ready for the referendum but would not say where they were being kept, fearing Spanish authorities would seize them.

    4. Voter registration

    Catalonia's recently approved electoral law specifies that the census of people who are entitled to take part in the poll include "voters resident in Catalonia and outside residents".

    It closed its voter registration on March 30th but has not revealed how it obtained its list of eligible voters.

    Spain's central government argues it has the exclusive authority to carry out an electoral census, which means the Catalan government may have violated Spain's data protection laws. Electoral lists must be transparent and public.

    Some 5.5 million Catalans were eligible to vote in Catalonia's last regional election in 2015, including 200,000 who lived abroad.

    5. Staffing

    Each polling station must have a president and two assistants who are chosen in a draw from the list of names on the electoral census. This means at least 24,000 people will be needed to carry out the referendum. The regional government is also seeking thousands of volunteers to help it stage the vote.

    Spain's central government has warned that Catalan officials and civil servants could face sanctions, and even criminal charges, if they help organise the vote in any way but it has remained unclear about if volunteers could face trouble as well.

    6. Security

    The Catalan government is counting on its regional police force, the Mossos d'Esquadra, to provide security on the referendum day. But Spain's Constitutional Court has asked police forces not to participate in the organisation of the vote.

    7. The campaign

    The referendum law stipulates the official campaign will be held September 15th - 29th.

    All political parties with representation in the regional assembly are allowed free airtime on television and radio to make their case to voters. But there are doubts that parties that oppose Catalan independence, and are calling for voters to abstain from taking part in the referendum, will use their airtime, giving the vote less legitimacy.

    8. Observers

    The Catalan referendum law calls for the participation of international observers.

    So far only one name has been unveiled, that of Daan Everts, a Dutch expert on Kosovo. He is expected to lead an observation mission made up of people from the United States, France, Britain and Poland. Their identity has not yet been disclosed.

    9. The results

    The election commission must guarantee that the referendum respects voting rules, deal with appeals and announce the result. But since its members are all from the separatist camp, its decisions will undoubtebly be contested.
    - SUPPORT FREE TRADE, SMUGGLE -

    2 + 2 = 5.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    https://www.thelocal.es/20170916/the...nce-referendum

    Nine key Pitfalls of Catalan Referendum.

    Catalan authorities are racing to stage an independence referendum slated for October 1st which Spain's central government has vowed to stop.
    The following are the key pitfalls of the planned plebiscite:

    1. Electoral authority

    According to the Venice Commission -- a panel of experts who advise the Council of Europe on constitutional law -- a referendum must be organised by an "impartial body".

    While Catalonia's referendum law created an electoral commission composed of five members, they all have links with the separatists.

    2. Polling stations

    The Catalan government wants the referendum to be similar to a regional election. During the last regional election in September 2015 a total of 8,177 polling stations were set up across the region.

    Of Catalonia's 948 municipalities, over 700 mainly smaller ones have pledged to provide locations for polling stations. Several large cities have refused.

    Spain's central government has warned Catalan mayors that it is their duty to "prevent or block any initiative related to the organisation of the referendum".

    3. Election material

    The production of ballots for the referendum has been a headache for Catalan officials, who complain police have searched companies suspected of producing them.

    Despite the difficulties, Catalan President Carles Puigdemont announced at the end of August that his government had over 6,000 boxes ready for the referendum but would not say where they were being kept, fearing Spanish authorities would seize them.

    4. Voter registration

    Catalonia's recently approved electoral law specifies that the census of people who are entitled to take part in the poll include "voters resident in Catalonia and outside residents".

    It closed its voter registration on March 30th but has not revealed how it obtained its list of eligible voters.

    Spain's central government argues it has the exclusive authority to carry out an electoral census, which means the Catalan government may have violated Spain's data protection laws. Electoral lists must be transparent and public.

    Some 5.5 million Catalans were eligible to vote in Catalonia's last regional election in 2015, including 200,000 who lived abroad.

    5. Staffing

    Each polling station must have a president and two assistants who are chosen in a draw from the list of names on the electoral census. This means at least 24,000 people will be needed to carry out the referendum. The regional government is also seeking thousands of volunteers to help it stage the vote.

    Spain's central government has warned that Catalan officials and civil servants could face sanctions, and even criminal charges, if they help organise the vote in any way but it has remained unclear about if volunteers could face trouble as well.

    6. Security

    The Catalan government is counting on its regional police force, the Mossos d'Esquadra, to provide security on the referendum day. But Spain's Constitutional Court has asked police forces not to participate in the organisation of the vote.

    7. The campaign

    The referendum law stipulates the official campaign will be held September 15th - 29th.

    All political parties with representation in the regional assembly are allowed free airtime on television and radio to make their case to voters. But there are doubts that parties that oppose Catalan independence, and are calling for voters to abstain from taking part in the referendum, will use their airtime, giving the vote less legitimacy.

    8. Observers

    The Catalan referendum law calls for the participation of international observers.

    So far only one name has been unveiled, that of Daan Everts, a Dutch expert on Kosovo. He is expected to lead an observation mission made up of people from the United States, France, Britain and Poland. Their identity has not yet been disclosed.

    9. The results

    The election commission must guarantee that the referendum respects voting rules, deal with appeals and announce the result. But since its members are all from the separatist camp, its decisions will undoubtebly be contested.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Revolutionaries don't ask for permission, King George III didn't agree to the continental congress.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    They are asking for this:

    ...
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



  28. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  29. #25
    As much as I'm all for self determination, Catalan would need external support from somewhere. If it got violent it would be very asymmetrical. i.e I don't think Catalonia has an air force or tanks.
    - SUPPORT FREE TRADE, SMUGGLE -

    2 + 2 = 5.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    As much as I'm all for self determination, Catalan would need external support from somewhere. If it got violent it would be very asymmetrical. i.e I don't think Catalonia has an air force or tanks.
    If they go IRA they will find a sponsor, there are plenty of people who would love to see Spain and the EU set on fire.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  31. #27
    'murika shouldn't sit on the sidelines after those terrrrrists in Katilonistan attacked us on 9/11.
    "Every post is about Hillary and pedophilia. I love them both soooo much!!!!!!!" Zippyjuan

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    If they go IRA they will find a sponsor, there are plenty of people who would love to see Spain and the EU set on fire.
    Spain has already been down this path with the ETA and Basque Separatist.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ETA_%2...atist_group%29

    ETA (Basque: [eta], Spanish: [ˈeta]), an acronym for Euskadi Ta Askatasuna (Basque: [eus̺kaūi ta as̺katas̺una]; "Basque Homeland and Liberty"),[1] is a formerly armed leftist Basque nationalist and separatist organization in the Basque Country (in northern Spain and southwestern France). The group was founded in 1959 and later evolved from a group promoting traditional Basque culture to a paramilitary group engaged in a violent campaign of bombing, assassinations and kidnappings in the Southern Basque Country and throughout Spanish territory. Its goal was gaining independence for the Basque Country.[2][3] ETA is the main group within the Basque National Liberation Movement and is the most important Basque participant in the Basque conflict.

    Since 1968, it has killed over 820 people (including 340 civilians) and injured thousands more.[4][5][6][7] ETA is proscribed as a terrorist group by Spain, France,[8] the United Kingdom,[9] the United States,[10] and the European Union.[11] This convention is followed by a plurality of domestic and international media, which also refer to the group as "terrorists".[12][13][14][15] There are more than 300 imprisoned members of the group in Spain, France, and other countries.[16]

    ETA declared ceasefires in 1989, 1996, 1998 and 2006. On 5 September 2010, ETA declared a new ceasefire[17] that is still in force, and on 20 October 2011, ETA announced a "definitive cessation of its armed activity".[18] On 24 November 2012, it was reported that the group was ready to negotiate a "definitive end" to its operations and disband completely.[19] The group announced on 7 April 2017 that it had given up all its weapons and explosives and would be officially a disarmed organization as of the following day.[20]


    I suppose Catalan may go down a similar road.
    - SUPPORT FREE TRADE, SMUGGLE -

    2 + 2 = 5.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    Spain has already been down this path with the ETA and Basque Separatist.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ETA_%2...atist_group%29

    ETA (Basque: [eta], Spanish: [ˈeta]), an acronym for Euskadi Ta Askatasuna (Basque: [eus̺kaūi ta as̺katas̺una]; "Basque Homeland and Liberty"),[1] is a formerly armed leftist Basque nationalist and separatist organization in the Basque Country (in northern Spain and southwestern France). The group was founded in 1959 and later evolved from a group promoting traditional Basque culture to a paramilitary group engaged in a violent campaign of bombing, assassinations and kidnappings in the Southern Basque Country and throughout Spanish territory. Its goal was gaining independence for the Basque Country.[2][3] ETA is the main group within the Basque National Liberation Movement and is the most important Basque participant in the Basque conflict.

    Since 1968, it has killed over 820 people (including 340 civilians) and injured thousands more.[4][5][6][7] ETA is proscribed as a terrorist group by Spain, France,[8] the United Kingdom,[9] the United States,[10] and the European Union.[11] This convention is followed by a plurality of domestic and international media, which also refer to the group as "terrorists".[12][13][14][15] There are more than 300 imprisoned members of the group in Spain, France, and other countries.[16]

    ETA declared ceasefires in 1989, 1996, 1998 and 2006. On 5 September 2010, ETA declared a new ceasefire[17] that is still in force, and on 20 October 2011, ETA announced a "definitive cessation of its armed activity".[18] On 24 November 2012, it was reported that the group was ready to negotiate a "definitive end" to its operations and disband completely.[19] The group announced on 7 April 2017 that it had given up all its weapons and explosives and would be officially a disarmed organization as of the following day.[20]


    I suppose Catalan may go down a similar road.
    We shall see, the world is getting more brittle by the day, and the current powers that be are getting ever weaker.

    If Ireland could do it so could Catalonia.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  34. #30
    Just FYI... Catalonia pre-dates Spain by some 500 years
    but that kind of talk is just....
    feudal.

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