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Thread: Trump, Dems reach funding deal, disappointing Republicans

  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Looks like Trump is taking his marching orders from Chucky Schumer these days. Not really a surprise since Schumer is one the banker's top boys.

    A bill still has to be agreed between the House and Senate and signed to extend the "suspension" (CR) to December 15 (incidentally the same day as Charlottesville guy's court appearance). Last I saw it's not a formal debt ceiling increase, just another suspension. How they'll finagle that with Treasury cash dwindling already, I don't know. Launder some more Treasuries through shell companies probably...

    There was talk on CNBC earlier that the debt ceiling requirement will be repealed altogether. Big doin's underway!

    The truly weird gold story comes from the United States…

    Secretary of the Treasury Steve Mnuchin and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell just paid a visit to Fort Knox to see the U.S. gold supply. Mnuchin is only the third Treasury secretary in history ever to visit Fort Knox and this was the first official visit from Washington, D.C., since 1974.
    The U.S. government likes to ignore gold and not draw attention to it. Official visits to Fort Knox give gold some monetary credence that central banks would prefer it does not have.
    Why an impromptu visit by Mnuchin and McConnell? Why now?
    The answer may lie in the fact that the Treasury is running out of cash and could be broke by Sept. 29 if Congress does not increase the debt ceiling by then.
    But the Treasury could get $355 billion in cash from thin air without increasing the debt simply by revaluing U.S. gold to a market price. (U.S. gold is currently officially valued at $42.22 per ounce on the Treasury’s books versus a market price of $1,285 per ounce.)
    Once the Treasury revalues the gold, the Treasury can issue new “gold certificates” to the Fed and demand newly printed money in the Treasury’s account under the Gold Reserve Act of 1934. Since this money comes from gold revaluation, it does not increase the national debt and no debt ceiling legislation is required.
    This would be a way around the debt ceiling if Congress cannot increase it in a timely way. This weird gold trick was actually done by the Eisenhower administration in 1953.
    Maybe Mnuchin and McConnell just wanted to make sure the gold was there before they revalue it and issue new certificates.

    More at: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-0...happening-gold
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  3. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    There was talk on CNBC earlier that the debt ceiling requirement will be repealed altogether. Big doin's underway!
    Trump says he's open to eliminating the debt ceiling entirely
    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-s...ling-entirely/


    President Trump on Thursday indicated that he would be open to eliminating the debt ceiling entirely,
    after siding with Democrats over his own party on a debt limit extension deal Wednesday.

    Mr. Trump, asked in a meeting with cabinet officials if he was open to eliminating the debt limit completely,
    said there are many "good reasons" to do that.

    "It could be discussed," the president said, according to the White House press pool. "There are a lot of good reasons to do that."

    The president's remarks come a day after he stunned GOP leadership and even his own White House staff
    by making a spontaneous deal with Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer and House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi
    to extend the debt limit for three months instead of 18, like Republicans had wanted.




    Mr. Trump's latest comments toying with the idea of eliminating the debt ceiling
    entirely clash with earlier statements
    he has made attacking Congress and former President Barack Obama
    for extending the debt limit instead of curbing spending.

    In July 2011, Mr. Trump said Congress' problem is spending, not revenue,
    and the debt limit shouldn't be raised until Obama-era spending is "contained."





    -----------

    Wall Street Journal @WSJ
    The dollar’s slide Thursday may be a sign that even the staunchest bulls have lost faith in the U.S. currency
    http://archive.is/fmK3k
    Last edited by goldenequity; 09-07-2017 at 06:03 PM.

  4. #33

  5. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    This guy bashes Trump a lot, and he bashes the people who cry "5D chess" when Trump does something he disagrees with, but here he is coming around.

    https://www.pscp.tv/Cernovich/1YqxomgWXVZGv?
    Coming around you say..

    Mike Cernovich: I consider myself center-right. But these labels don’t really make much sense. I believe in some form of universal basic income. Well that isn’t a, quote unquote, conservative position because we have automation coming. What are you going to do?

    I’m pro single payer healthcare. Is that right-wing or is that left-wing anymore? Well, if you have a lot of people, a large swatch of the company, or country, are suffering, then I think that we owe it to all Americans to do right by them, and to help them out. So is that right-wing or is that let-wing? I don’t know.
    mediumDOTcom/@Cernovich/here-is-the-full-60-minutes-interview-transcript-with-mike-cernovich-a0cb58a80ba0
    "The program of liberalism, ...if condensed into a single word, would have to read: property..."

    -Ludwig von Mises

    "Patriotism, not nationalism, should inspire the citizen. The ethnic nationalist who wants a linguistically and culturally uniform nation is akin to the racist who is intolerant toward those who look (and behave) differently. The patriot is a "diversitarian"; he is pleased, indeed proud of the variety within the borders of his country; he looks for loyalty from all citizens. And he looks up and down, not left and right."

    -Erik Maria Ritter von Kuehnelt-Leddihn

    "All the odds are on the man who is, intrinsically, the most devious and mediocre ó the man who can most adeptly disperse the notion that his mind is a virtual vacuum. The Presidency tends, year by year, to go to such men. As democracy is perfected, the office represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. We move toward a lofty ideal. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last, and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron."

    -H. L. Mencken

  6. #35

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    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.81359261062a

    Trump, Schumer agree to pursue plan to repeal the debt ceiling

    President Trump and Senate Minority Leader Charles E. Schumer (D-N.Y.) have agreed to pursue a deal that would permanently remove the requirement that Congress repeatedly raise the debt ceiling, three people familiar with the decision said.

    Trump and Schumer discussed the idea Wednesday during an Oval Office meeting. The two, along with House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D–Calif.), agreed to work together over the next several months to try to finalize a plan, which would need to be approved by Congress.

    One of the people familiar described it as a “gentlemen’s agreement.”
    Another person familiar with the meeting said Vice President Pence is open to changes he considers in line with the “Gephardt Rule” — a parliamentary rule making it easier to tie raising the debt ceiling with Congress passing a budget. The rule is named after former House majority leader Richard A. Gephardt (D-Mo.).

    The deal comes after Trump sided with Democratic leaders Wednesday on a plan to temporarily raise the debt ceiling and fund hurricane relief, rejecting a Republican plan and vexing many in his party.

    House Speaker Paul D. Ryan (R-Wis.) said at a news conference Thursday that he opposes scrapping the debt-limit process.
    Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin has suggested scrapping the existing debt-limit process and replacing it with one that automatically lifts the borrowing limit every time Congress appropriates future spending.
    Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) was one of several Senate conservatives who said abandoning that power would be misguided.

    "I think the debt limit should be used to try to bring to reform in Congress," Paul said Thursday. "I think the debt limit is a good vote to have.
    "
    "The only thing we have to fear is.... fear itself!" Franklin Delano Roosevelt.
    "Be afwaid. Be berry afwaid" Donald Trump.

    The optimists built this country and made it great- not the fearful. Fear can only destroy.

    I am Zippy and I approve of this post. But you don't have to.

  7. #36

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    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKCN1BI249

    The Senate voted 80-17 to approve the deal Trump reached with Democrats on Wednesday, which would raise the federal debt limit and fund the government through Dec. 8. The legislation included $15.25 billion in aid for areas affected by Hurricane Harvey and other natural disasters.

    The bill now goes to the House for final congressional approval, where it faces opposition from conservatives who traditionally favor raising the ceiling while also cutting spending.
    But when was the last time conservatives actually cut things? They talk about it. Things have been pretty much running on "continuing resolutions" for spending- meaning gradual increases in everything.
    "The only thing we have to fear is.... fear itself!" Franklin Delano Roosevelt.
    "Be afwaid. Be berry afwaid" Donald Trump.

    The optimists built this country and made it great- not the fearful. Fear can only destroy.

    I am Zippy and I approve of this post. But you don't have to.

  8. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKCN1BI249



    But when was the last time conservatives actually cut things? They talk about it. Things have been pretty much running on "continuing resolutions" for spending- meaning gradual increases in everything.
    Zippy, your masters need to spend more time on personality development as it is completely non-existent at the moment. Your number one problem is overdoing things which casts suspicion on whatever you are posting and results in zero credibility. I know there was some time off recently but maybe it was not sufficient? Maybe you should go away for a longer period of time and see how things will look like then? Whatever you decide I am sure it will help you long term. It is just sad coming here and seeing you making an ass of yourself every time you post. Bestest.
    The essential English leadership secret does not depend on particular intelligence. Rather, it depends on a remarkably stupid thick-headedness. The English follow the principle that when one lies, one should lie big, and stick to it. They keep up their lies, even at the risk of looking ridiculous.

  9. #38

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    The truly weird gold story comes from the United States…

    Secretary of the Treasury Steve Mnuchin and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell just paid a visit to Fort Knox to see the U.S. gold supply. Mnuchin is only the third Treasury secretary in history ever to visit Fort Knox and this was the first official visit from Washington, D.C., since 1974.
    The U.S. government likes to ignore gold and not draw attention to it. Official visits to Fort Knox give gold some monetary credence that central banks would prefer it does not have.
    Why an impromptu visit by Mnuchin and McConnell? Why now?
    The answer may lie in the fact that the Treasury is running out of cash and could be broke by Sept. 29 if Congress does not increase the debt ceiling by then.
    But the Treasury could get $355 billion in cash from thin air without increasing the debt simply by revaluing U.S. gold to a market price. (U.S. gold is currently officially valued at $42.22 per ounce on the Treasury’s books versus a market price of $1,285 per ounce.)
    Once the Treasury revalues the gold, the Treasury can issue new “gold certificates” to the Fed and demand newly printed money in the Treasury’s account under the Gold Reserve Act of 1934. Since this money comes from gold revaluation, it does not increase the national debt and no debt ceiling legislation is required.
    This would be a way around the debt ceiling if Congress cannot increase it in a timely way. This weird gold trick was actually done by the Eisenhower administration in 1953.
    Maybe Mnuchin and McConnell just wanted to make sure the gold was there before they revalue it and issue new certificates.

    More at: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-0...happening-gold
    Ah yes, I forgot about that ZH item. Good post. Revaluing gold would, at the very least, set a new floor to the dollar denominated gold price.
    Last edited by devil21; 09-08-2017 at 01:13 AM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    Visiting the Outer Banks of NC?
    Outer Banks Fishing Boat Rentals

  10. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Coming around you say..



    mediumDOTcom/@Cernovich/here-is-the-full-60-minutes-interview-transcript-with-mike-cernovich-a0cb58a80ba0
    No one ever wonders how guys like Cernovich suddenly became a mouthpiece for swaths of people to follow. He's a sheepdog.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    Visiting the Outer Banks of NC?
    Outer Banks Fishing Boat Rentals

  11. #40

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Here are the senators who voted against the bill:

    Bob Corker (Tennessee)

    Steve Daines (Montana)

    Mike Enzi (Wyoming)

    Joni Ernst (Iowa)

    Deb Fischer (Nebraska)

    Jeff Flake (Arizona)

    Lindsey Graham (South Carolina)

    Chuck Grassley (Iowa)

    Ron Johnson (Wisconsin)

    James Lankford (Oklahoma)

    Mike Lee (Utah)

    John McCain (Arizona)

    Jerry Moran (Kansas)

    Rand Paul (Kentucky)

    James Risch (Idaho)

    Ben Sasse (Nebraska)

    Pat Toomey (Pennsylvania)
    Everyone's in good company with Graham and McSame.

  12. #41

    Default

    Trump, Dems reach funding deal, disappointing Republicans
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  13. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Ah yes, I forgot about that ZH item. Good post. Revaluing gold would, at the very least, set a new floor to the dollar denominated gold price.
    It would not impact the market price of gold unless the US sold it. Revaluing gold would be simply a bookkeeping change. It also would not impact the US debt situation again unless the US actually sold the gold to raise funds. Given that the debt ceiling was raised, that is not going to happen.
    "The only thing we have to fear is.... fear itself!" Franklin Delano Roosevelt.
    "Be afwaid. Be berry afwaid" Donald Trump.

    The optimists built this country and made it great- not the fearful. Fear can only destroy.

    I am Zippy and I approve of this post. But you don't have to.

  14. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Revaluing gold would be simply a bookkeeping change.
    Isn't most of this bookkeeping at this point in American history? Or, is it even worse than a ledger? More like smoke and mirrors.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    I do think that ID should be required for certain things like carrying a concealed weapon...




    Disrupt, Deny, Deflate. Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3): http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...eptive-members

  15. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    It would not impact the market price of gold unless the US sold it. Revaluing gold would be simply a bookkeeping change. It also would not impact the US debt situation again unless the US actually sold the gold to raise funds. Given that the debt ceiling was raised, that is not going to happen.
    I don't know why I bother replying to you any more. Your posts are 98% "pulled it outta the ass" disinfo these days. Zip used to actually post some decent info and arguments at times. Now it's all bull$#@!, all the time.

    Does the Fed hold Treasury gold certificates? If Treasury officially revalues gold, what happens to the dollar value of the gold certs, Zip?

    Unless I missed something, the debt ceiling was not raised. The continuing resolution "suspending" the debt ceiling was continued again. In effect, the debt ceiling has been ignored for most of the last TWO YEARS.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    Visiting the Outer Banks of NC?
    Outer Banks Fishing Boat Rentals

  16. #45

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    I don't know why I bother replying to you any more. Your posts are 98% "pulled it outta the ass" disinfo these days. Zip used to actually post some decent info and arguments at times. Now it's all bull$#@!, all the time.

    Does the Fed hold Treasury gold certificates? If Treasury officially revalues gold, what happens to the dollar value of the gold certs, Zip?

    Unless I missed something, the debt ceiling was not raised. The continuing resolution "suspending" the debt ceiling was continued again. In effect, the debt ceiling has been ignored for most of the last TWO YEARS.
    Some news outlets say the ceiling was suspended, some say it was raised.

    Here is what the Senate bill summary says: https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-...ext?format=txt

    To provide guidance and priorities for Federal Government obligations in the event that the debt limit is reached and to provide a limited and temporary authority to exceed the debt limit for priority obligations.
    so you would be right- it was a suspension.


    As for that gold thing:

    The Federal Reserve gold certificates are not being sold. Treasury gold is not being sold. There is no change in the supply of gold in the market so there will be no change in the price of gold. If they revalue the gold certificates to the market value of the gold, the only thing which will change will be the Fed balance sheet. They are basically receipts for the gold they transferred over to the US Treasury. The value of the receipts (certificates) was based on the amount paid at that time. If Best Buy changes the price on your receipt it does not change the item you bought or how much it cost you. It could mean a different amount if you requested a refund- but that is it. The Fed is not seeking to redeem their certificates (they aren't allowed to).

    https://www.federalreserve.gov/faqs/...-hold-gold.htm

    The Gold Reserve Act of 1934 required the Federal Reserve System to transfer ownership of all of its gold to the Department of the Treasury. In exchange, the Secretary of the Treasury issued gold certificates to the Federal Reserve for the amount of gold transferred at the then-applicable statutory price for gold held by the Treasury.

    Gold certificates are denominated in U.S. dollars. Their value is based on the statutory price for gold at the time the certificates are issued. Gold certificates do not give the Federal Reserve any right to redeem the certificates for gold.

    The statutory price of gold is set by law. It does not fluctuate with the market price of gold and has been constant at $42 2/9, or $42.2222, per fine troy ounce since 1973. The book value of the gold held by the Treasury is determined using the statutory price.
    Congress would have to change the valuation on the gold certificates.
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 09-09-2017 at 01:49 AM.
    "The only thing we have to fear is.... fear itself!" Franklin Delano Roosevelt.
    "Be afwaid. Be berry afwaid" Donald Trump.

    The optimists built this country and made it great- not the fearful. Fear can only destroy.

    I am Zippy and I approve of this post. But you don't have to.

  17. #46

    Default

    Senator Mitch McConnell thinks Democrats were a tad premature in exuberantly celebrating the surprise spending deal they struck last week with President Trump.“Let’s put it this way,” Mr. McConnell, the Kentucky Republican and majority leader, said Monday in an interview for The New York Times podcast “The New Washington.” “The deal is not quite as good as my counterpart thought it was.”
    The reason? Mr. McConnell said that he insisted the newly passed legislation preserve Treasury’s ability to apply “extraordinary measures” and shift money within government accounts to pay off debt and extend federal borrowing power.
    That will delay the need for another increase in the debt limit well beyond the December deadline that Democrats have been trumpeting as their big moment of leverage. And Mr. McConnell said he did so over the objections of Senator Chuck Schumer of New York, the Democratic leader and aforementioned counterpart.


    In fact, Mr. McConnell said, the debt limit will not have to be increased until well into 2018, taking that volatile subject off the table for the December spending talks, and eliminating the Democrats’ most dangerous bargaining chip in the first round of negotiations.

    More at: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/11/u...p-schumer.html
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

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