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Thread: Oregon Couple Loses Children due to “Low IQ”

  1. #1

    Default Oregon Couple Loses Children due to “Low IQ”

    Earlier this year (May, 2017) we covered the story of Amy Fabbrini and Eric Ziegler of Bend, Oregon, who have been fighting to prevent Oregon Department of Human Services’ Child Protection Services from terminating their parental rights to their children for nearly four years.

    The agency has deemed the couple “incapable” of parenting. CPS claims that the couple cannot provide for their children because they are believed to be intellectually limited. Two of their children were removed shortly after birth, before the couple even had a chance to parent them.

    This label of “incapable” placed on Amy and Eric comes as a shock to those who know the couple, given that both of the parents graduated from high school with a standard diploma, and both ranked in the middle of their graduating class.

    See our original story:

    Oregon Couple Labeled “Incapable” Parents by Social Workers – 2 Day Old Baby Kidnapped

    Outrage over Amy and Eric’s Story Reaches Other Media Sources

    Since we have published Amy and Eric’s story, it has gained the attention of other media sources.

    The Oregonian published an article on the couple in July:

    IQ costs Oregon parents their kids, but is that fair?

    Glenn Beck interviewed Amy and their advocate Sherrene Hagenbach on his show yesterday (August 1, 2017).

    Heartbreaking: Glenn Sheds Tears With Mother Whose Children Were Taken by the State

    While we are happy anytime this problem of child kidnapping by state Child “Protection” Services gains media attention, the public needs to understand that these problems are systemic and are an epidemic – they are not isolated cases. They represent a very well-funded (many billions of dollars) state-sponsored system designed for only one purpose: to remove children from families.

    Once one understands the reasons why these stories happen, it will easily be seen that this is a very corrupt system, and we are justified in referring to the actions as “kidnapping,” and to the system overall as a “child trafficking” system.

    We are not choosing to use emotional language to highlight a few egregious cases. We are accurately describing what is happening all across the United States, every single day.

    Who Gets to Decide Who is a Good Parent?

    We cannot expect to solve this problem if we do not accurately identify the problem first.

    The first step in identifying the problem, is to understand that the vast majority of children being taken out of their families are NOT because the children are being abused in their homes.

    Social worker whistleblowers have told us that only about 5% of the cases where children are removed from their homes were for reasons of abuse.

    Earlier this year ABC TV6 in Indiana reported on an investigation into the Indiana Department of Child Services (DCS), interviewing Indianapolis attorneys who represent families in cases involving DCS. They claim that only 15% of children taken away from their parents are ever substantiated for abuse or neglect. See:

    85% of Reports to Indiana Child Protective Services Unsubstantiated – Families Destroyed Needlessly

    During the last Texas legislative session, Meagan Corser of the Texas Home School Coalition published an article about the status of Child Protective Services (CPS) in Texas regarding the evidence required to terminate parental rights. She reported:

    in 75 percent of cases they lack sufficient evidence to support the accusations they made against the parent
    See:

    75% of Children Taken by Texas CPS are Based on Unfounded Accusations

    The vast majority of children being taken away from parents, such as this couple in Oregon that is now getting so much media exposure, is because the government wants to determine who is a good parent and who is not.

    Is this the proper role of government?

    Does the State Ever Have a “Right” to Remove Children from a Home?

    Most people will answer this question in the affirmative. The problem with answering the question, Does the state ever have a right to remove children from their home, in the affirmative, is that now the government has to define under what circumstances, and it will always come back to determining who is a good parent, and who is not.

    Are there any perfect parents?

    “But what about cases of real abuse where the child is in danger?!” many will scream out.

    What about them?

    Should the child, who is the victim in such cases, be the one incarcerated by being removed from their home? Statistics very clearly show that children removed from their home and put into foster care, face far more abuse and do much worse, than even if they were left in a “troubled” home.

    We just recently published a story out of Arizona, perhaps the most horrific story we have ever published here on MedicalKidnap.com, that so clearly illustrates this injustice:

    Arizona Child Removed from Loving Family and Placed into Foster Care Where She was Repeatedly Raped – then 80% of Body Burned

    A parent who is truly guilty of abusive crimes against their child, is the one who should be removed from the home and the family; and the criminal justice system is set up to do that, with full due process of law as provided by the Constitution of the United States.

    Sure, if that happens and a parent or parents are the ones removed from the home and incarcerated, then a solution is needed for the victims that remain behind, the children.

    But we can definitely say that the solution in those rare cases is NOT government funded Child Protective Services.

    For more on this topic see my article:

    Does the State Ever Have a “Right” to Remove Children from a Home?
    Uncensored Health Freedom News:
    http://healthimpactnews.com/

    Yes, I believe the science of vaccines is settled - Zippyjuan Team



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  3. #2

    Default



    Oregon says this couple is too stupid to raise kids, so they took their kids away.
    Uncensored Health Freedom News:
    http://healthimpactnews.com/

    Yes, I believe the science of vaccines is settled - Zippyjuan Team

  4. #3

  5. #4

    Default

    Anybody who thinks its wrong for stupid people to rear their own progeny can get the hell out.
    1. Don't lie.
    2. Don't cheat.
    3. Don't steal.
    4. Don't kill.
    5. Don't commit adultery.
    6. Don't covet what your neighbor has, especially his wife.
    7. Honor your father and mother.
    8. Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy.
    9. Don’t use your Higher Power's name in vain, or anyone else's.
    10. Do unto others as you would have them do to you.

    "For the love of money is the root of all evil..." -- I Timothy 6:10, KJV

  6. #5

    Default

    Does the state ever have a right to remove children from a home?

    Yes

    Is this one of those cases?

    By everything in the OP, clearly not.
    "The program of liberalism, ...if condensed into a single word, would have to read: property..."

    -Ludwig von Mises

    "Patriotism, not nationalism, should inspire the citizen. The ethnic nationalist who wants a linguistically and culturally uniform nation is akin to the racist who is intolerant toward those who look (and behave) differently. The patriot is a "diversitarian"; he is pleased, indeed proud of the variety within the borders of his country; he looks for loyalty from all citizens. And he looks up and down, not left and right."

    -Erik Maria Ritter von Kuehnelt-Leddihn

    "The monarch is a responsible person. The fact that a monarch is responsible "to God alone," rather than to an assembly or a popular majority, is rather shocking to an agnostic mind; but while God cannot be fooled, the masses can. While it is perhaps true that "one cannot fool all the people all the time," it seems one can fool millions for centuries."

    -Ibid.

  7. #6

    Default

    This smacks of Hitler. Literally. This is the stuff the Nazis did.
    Freedom index

    ~Resident Badgiraffe





  8. #7

    Default



    New York, New York, 1915
    "The program of liberalism, ...if condensed into a single word, would have to read: property..."

    -Ludwig von Mises

    "Patriotism, not nationalism, should inspire the citizen. The ethnic nationalist who wants a linguistically and culturally uniform nation is akin to the racist who is intolerant toward those who look (and behave) differently. The patriot is a "diversitarian"; he is pleased, indeed proud of the variety within the borders of his country; he looks for loyalty from all citizens. And he looks up and down, not left and right."

    -Erik Maria Ritter von Kuehnelt-Leddihn

    "The monarch is a responsible person. The fact that a monarch is responsible "to God alone," rather than to an assembly or a popular majority, is rather shocking to an agnostic mind; but while God cannot be fooled, the masses can. While it is perhaps true that "one cannot fool all the people all the time," it seems one can fool millions for centuries."

    -Ibid.

  9. #8

  10. #9

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Does the state ever have a right to remove children from a home?
    No.

    1. The state doesn't have "rights." It has delegated powers.

    2. It doesn't have the power to seize children from parents. The whole idea that the state can better raise your children than you is insane. The whole thing is corrupt.






    Also, the whole concept of an "intelligence quotient" is pseudo-scientific bullcrap. At best they test your ability to take a test. Nothing more. Taking a child from its parents because of their supposed IQ? That is horrendous. It is modern day slavery with the state claiming it owns the child and gets to decide who cares for the child on a whim.
    Last edited by PierzStyx; 08-11-2017 at 02:50 PM.
    “Maybe I forgot to mention something to you: I don’t believe in queens. You think freedom is something you can give and take on a whim. But to your people, freedom is as essential as air. And without it, there is no life. There is only darkness.” -Zaheer

    "A man chooses. A slave obeys."-Andrew Ryan

    "There are three things the parasite hates: free markets, free will, and free men."-Andrew Ryan

  11. #10

    Default

    If the government can 'test' people to decide arbitrarily that they are unfit to be parents, then the world is getting dangerously close to totalitarianism.
    There are only two things we should fight for. One is the defense of our homes and the other is the Bill of Rights. War for any other reason is simply a racket.
    -Major General Smedley Butler, USMC,
    Two-Time Congressional Medal of Honor Winner
    Author of, War is a Racket!

    It is not that I am mad, it is only that my head is different from yours.
    - Diogenes of Sinope

  12. #11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Does the state ever have a right to remove children from a home?

    Yes

    Is this one of those cases?

    By everything in the OP, clearly not.

    It sounds like this couple was diagnosed retarded.


  13. #12

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    It sounds like this couple was diagnosed retarded.

    Sans evidence of their IQ test, I remain unconvinced.

    You, Krugmonster, prove to me you're not retarded.

    ....certificates absolving you of donkey brains?

    "The program of liberalism, ...if condensed into a single word, would have to read: property..."

    -Ludwig von Mises

    "Patriotism, not nationalism, should inspire the citizen. The ethnic nationalist who wants a linguistically and culturally uniform nation is akin to the racist who is intolerant toward those who look (and behave) differently. The patriot is a "diversitarian"; he is pleased, indeed proud of the variety within the borders of his country; he looks for loyalty from all citizens. And he looks up and down, not left and right."

    -Erik Maria Ritter von Kuehnelt-Leddihn

    "The monarch is a responsible person. The fact that a monarch is responsible "to God alone," rather than to an assembly or a popular majority, is rather shocking to an agnostic mind; but while God cannot be fooled, the masses can. While it is perhaps true that "one cannot fool all the people all the time," it seems one can fool millions for centuries."

    -Ibid.

  14. #13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PierzStyx View Post
    No.

    1. The state doesn't have "rights." It has delegated powers.

    2. It doesn't have the power to seize children from parents. The whole idea that the state can better raise your children than you is insane. The whole thing is corrupt.
    Are there no circumstances in which parents, viciously beating their children, should be denied custody?

    Patria potestas?

    Also, the whole concept of an "intelligence quotient" is pseudo-scientific bullcrap. At best they test your ability to take a test. Nothing more. Taking a child from its parents because of their supposed IQ? That is horrendous. It is modern day slavery with the state claiming it owns the child and gets to decide who cares for the child on a whim.
    ...Did you get a low score?

    No, I don't think you did.

    IQ isn't perfect but it's the best metric we have.
    "The program of liberalism, ...if condensed into a single word, would have to read: property..."

    -Ludwig von Mises

    "Patriotism, not nationalism, should inspire the citizen. The ethnic nationalist who wants a linguistically and culturally uniform nation is akin to the racist who is intolerant toward those who look (and behave) differently. The patriot is a "diversitarian"; he is pleased, indeed proud of the variety within the borders of his country; he looks for loyalty from all citizens. And he looks up and down, not left and right."

    -Erik Maria Ritter von Kuehnelt-Leddihn

    "The monarch is a responsible person. The fact that a monarch is responsible "to God alone," rather than to an assembly or a popular majority, is rather shocking to an agnostic mind; but while God cannot be fooled, the masses can. While it is perhaps true that "one cannot fool all the people all the time," it seems one can fool millions for centuries."

    -Ibid.

  15. #14

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Sans evidence of their IQ test, I remain unconvinced.

    You, Krugmonster, prove to me you're not retarded.

    ....certificates absolving you of donkey brains?
    I was clearly not serious.

  16. #15

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    I was clearly not serious.
    "The program of liberalism, ...if condensed into a single word, would have to read: property..."

    -Ludwig von Mises

    "Patriotism, not nationalism, should inspire the citizen. The ethnic nationalist who wants a linguistically and culturally uniform nation is akin to the racist who is intolerant toward those who look (and behave) differently. The patriot is a "diversitarian"; he is pleased, indeed proud of the variety within the borders of his country; he looks for loyalty from all citizens. And he looks up and down, not left and right."

    -Erik Maria Ritter von Kuehnelt-Leddihn

    "The monarch is a responsible person. The fact that a monarch is responsible "to God alone," rather than to an assembly or a popular majority, is rather shocking to an agnostic mind; but while God cannot be fooled, the masses can. While it is perhaps true that "one cannot fool all the people all the time," it seems one can fool millions for centuries."

    -Ibid.

  17. #16

    Default

    Can a congress person lose their seat due to a low IQ?
    The essential English leadership secret does not depend on particular intelligence. Rather, it depends on a remarkably stupid thick-headedness. The English follow the principle that when one lies, one should lie big, and stick to it. They keep up their lies, even at the risk of looking ridiculous.

  18. #17

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    Can a congress person lose their seat due to a low IQ?
    Can the ocean stop having tides?
    "The program of liberalism, ...if condensed into a single word, would have to read: property..."

    -Ludwig von Mises

    "Patriotism, not nationalism, should inspire the citizen. The ethnic nationalist who wants a linguistically and culturally uniform nation is akin to the racist who is intolerant toward those who look (and behave) differently. The patriot is a "diversitarian"; he is pleased, indeed proud of the variety within the borders of his country; he looks for loyalty from all citizens. And he looks up and down, not left and right."

    -Erik Maria Ritter von Kuehnelt-Leddihn

    "The monarch is a responsible person. The fact that a monarch is responsible "to God alone," rather than to an assembly or a popular majority, is rather shocking to an agnostic mind; but while God cannot be fooled, the masses can. While it is perhaps true that "one cannot fool all the people all the time," it seems one can fool millions for centuries."

    -Ibid.






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