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Thread: Oklahoma's use of card readers to freeze, seize funds comes under fire

  1. #1

    Default Oklahoma's use of card readers to freeze, seize funds comes under fire

    Police in Oklahoma are using scanners that can identify phony credit cards, but critics warn the devices could also allow cops to empty the bank accounts of law-abiding citizens with one swipe.

    Authorities in the state are using the new devices during traffic stops to freeze and seize money loaded onto prepaid debit cards by alleged drug traffickers, with the potential to net up to $8,000 per portable scanner. Supporters of the program, which has only been in the field for about six weeks, say it's an important tool for law enforcement agencies to interrupt the flow of illegal drugs into Oklahoma.

    Critics, however, are blasting the machines as a disturbing extension of civil forfeiture laws, with the potential for abuse by police and prosecutors. Opponents say such devices are an infringement on Fourth Amendment prohibitions of unreasonable search and seizure -- and that police departments are in turn stuffing their wallets with the cash from innocent civilians.

    "We believe it’s blatantly unconstitutional," Nick Sibillia, of the Institute for Justice, told FoxNews.com. "The Fourth Amendment is unfortunately in tatters in this day and age."

    The Oklahoma Department of Public Safety signed a contract with Texas-based ERAD Group Inc., to use the devices, which work on "open loop" prepaid debit cards, like those provided by American Express and Visa. But "debit cards attached to a valid checking account or valid credit cards cannot be processed" by ERAD, which stands for Electronic Recovery and Access to Data.

    The company that manufactures the devices is also promised 7.7 percent of all money forfeited using the machines, according to one contract obtained by Oklahoma Watch.

    "It's just absolutely appalling that a private company can profit from this forfeited property," said Sibillia.

    ...

    In the case of the ERAD system, the Oklahoma Highway Patrol says the machines are important in fighting identity theft and credit card fraud.

    In an interview with FoxNews.com, Capt. Paul Timmons sought to clarify "misinformation" he said has made people panic.

    "This is a tool for our troopers to use when they suspect there’s criminal activity," he said. "We don’t have access to anyone’s personal banking activity -- that’s all protected information."

    On Monday, Oklahoma authorities also held a press conference to dispel rumors about the devices.

    “We can do nothing with someone’s bank account. We can do nothing with someone’s debit card,” said Oklahoma Highway Patrol chief Col. Ricky Adams. “What we can tell is if it is yours, if the information on the back of a gift card is your personal credit card information.”

    Oklahoma State Sen. Kyle Loveless, however, said he has major concerns over the system's use and the potential for abuse.

    "The manufacturer in its patent and promotional videos said it can get information from any card with a magnetic strip," Loveless told FoxNews.com. "The issue is if it can take money from one card, it can take money from any card."

    Loveless, a Republican, said many legitimate business use the cards targeted by ERAD machines. He also noted that prepaid cards are the only source of banking for many lower-income and young people and that unemployment, disability and other government assistance programs give money using prepaid cards.

    ...
    http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2016/06/...nder-fire.html
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.



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  3. #2

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    What we can tell is if it is yours, if the information on the back of a gift card is your personal credit card information.
    So if my Mom buys me a gift card.....
    * Enforce Border Security – America should be guarding her own borders and enforcing her own laws instead of policing the world and implementing UN mandates.

    * No Amnesty - The Obama Administration’s endorsement of so-called “Comprehensive Immigration Reform,” granting amnesty to millions of illegal immigrants, will only encourage more law-breaking.

    * Abolish the Welfare State – Taxpayers cannot continue to pay the high costs to sustain this powerful incentive for illegal immigration. As Milton Friedman famously said, you can’t have open borders and a welfare state.

    * End Birthright Citizenship – As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be granted U.S. citizenship, we’ll never be able to control our immigration problem.




    Reprinted from http://www.ronpaul2012.com/the-issues/immigration/ [Nov. 29, 2011]

  4. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    So if my Mom buys me a gift card.....
    Obviously you're a thief and it must be forfeited. Cops gotta eat, too.

    In 2012, 70 percent of all forfeiture expenditures in Oklahoma funded salaries for law enforcement, according to data obtained by The Institute for Justice.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.

  5. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Suzanimal View Post
    Obviously you're a thief and it must be forfeited. Cops gotta eat, too.
    Yeah. It's a lose/lose situation. If the CC info is your personal info, you're obviously laundering money and using the card to conceal cash. If the CC has someone else's info, you're obviously laundering money and using the card to conceal cash.
    * Enforce Border Security – America should be guarding her own borders and enforcing her own laws instead of policing the world and implementing UN mandates.

    * No Amnesty - The Obama Administration’s endorsement of so-called “Comprehensive Immigration Reform,” granting amnesty to millions of illegal immigrants, will only encourage more law-breaking.

    * Abolish the Welfare State – Taxpayers cannot continue to pay the high costs to sustain this powerful incentive for illegal immigration. As Milton Friedman famously said, you can’t have open borders and a welfare state.

    * End Birthright Citizenship – As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be granted U.S. citizenship, we’ll never be able to control our immigration problem.




    Reprinted from http://www.ronpaul2012.com/the-issues/immigration/ [Nov. 29, 2011]

  6. #5

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    What ever happened to due process of law?

  7. #6

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    Your money or your info.
    "There are two freedoms - the false, where a man is free to do what he likes; the true, where he is free to do what he ought."~~Charles Kingsley

  8. #7

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    But do you have to pay by card?
    "There are two freedoms - the false, where a man is free to do what he likes; the true, where he is free to do what he ought."~~Charles Kingsley

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    But do you have to pay by card?
    No but if you're carrying too much (no firm number on what constitutes too much) cash, they can take that too. Damned if ya do...
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.

  10. #9

    Default

    I guess the moral of the story is don't get stopped for anything.

    I wonder if they take PayPal?
    "There are two freedoms - the false, where a man is free to do what he likes; the true, where he is free to do what he ought."~~Charles Kingsley






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