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Thread: When will libertarianism rise again?

  1. #1

    Default When will libertarianism rise again?

    In 2007 and again in 2011 it felt like we were on the cusp of success. In 2015 we thought maybe moderate Rand Paul could be the compromise candidate that lead our cause. Now it seems like alt-right nationalism has totally co-opted our movement.

    On the positive we've gained a few great congessmen like Massie, Walter Jones, and Amash. But on the negative our entire movement has been taken over by Trumptards.

    When will we rise again? I'm a decade older than when I first joined but still standing by for the Revolution.
    Last edited by brandon; 05-12-2017 at 10:59 PM.
    "christians, take your children out of the synagogues of satan. " - 19/M/Neckbeard



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  3. #2

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    I think you may have seen the peak until the next downturn . I also do not think it is trump you lost future members to but more like Sanders .
    Support CalExit . Danke Do Something

  4. #3

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    I feel like the only other Ron Paul tier candidate we have in the pipeline is Massie, and he still needs another decade or more in congress before he's ready to lead the charge. We need to fill the pipeline with more good honest libertarians. Why are they so hard to find? In any case, I'm ready to print a million Massie Revolution banners when he runs for president.
    "christians, take your children out of the synagogues of satan. " - 19/M/Neckbeard

  5. #4

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    As long as we can continue to get 3-4 house reps and 1 senator every 10 years, we'll have 6-8 house reps and 2 senators in no time, and then theres no stopping us
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  6. #5

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    It will rise from the ashes of empires.
    Last edited by Nolan; 05-20-2017 at 11:58 PM.

  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by brandon View Post
    In 2007 and again in 2011 it felt like we were on the cusp of success. In 2015 we thought maybe moderate Rand Paul could be the compromise candidate that lead our cause. Now it seems like alt-right nationalism has totally co-opted our movement.

    On the positive we've gained a few great congessmen like Massie, Walter Jones, and Amash. But on the negative our entire movement has been taken over by Trumptards.

    When will we rise again? I'm a decade older than when I first joined but still standing by for the Revolution.
    Think of the Trump candidacy as a stepping stone to the liberty movement rising again.

    It would have likely been hopeless for a very long time if Hillary had been elected.. but with Trump, we actually have someone in the Oval office battling the deep state.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    CAUTION!! The following members openly support George Soros propaganda: CPUd, TheCount, ZippyJuan, undergroundrr, twomp

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  8. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by brandon View Post
    In 2007 and again in 2011 it felt like we were on the cusp of success. In 2015 we thought maybe moderate Rand Paul could be the compromise candidate that lead our cause. Now it seems like alt-right nationalism has totally co-opted our movement.

    On the positive we've gained a few great congessmen like Massie, Walter Jones, and Amash. But on the negative our entire movement has been taken over by Trumptards.

    When will we rise again? I'm a decade older than when I first joined but still standing by for the Revolution.
    Although it's certainly not as exciting as seeing a libertarian run for President, I think the movement starts at home. Start in your house. Live your philosophy the best way you can and set an example. Then get out in your community, meet people and spread ideas.

    One quote that keeps me from losing hope.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by brandon View Post
    Why are they so hard to find?
    They are hard to find because freedom is not popular.

    Poll after poll indicates utter disgust with the fedgov machine.

    And once you dig a little bit into the poll's questions and answers, you find that the reason for that disgust and disapproval is uniformly because the fedgov is either:

    A) Not handing out enough benefits, dole and "freebies".

    B) Not visiting enough violence on on the enemy du jour in the poll taker's mind.

    Liberty belongs to brave minority who are willing to take, by any means necessary, what is rightfully theirs, seize it from the clutches of the authoritarians of whatever stripe and the rest of the addlepated masses be damned.

    We, the fringe minority, lack the will to do that.

    So here we sit, and will continue to sit.

  10. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Think of the Trump candidacy as a stepping stone to the liberty movement rising again.

    It would have likely been hopeless for a very long time if Hillary had been elected.. but with Trump, we actually have someone in the Oval office battling the deep state.
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    Yeah, I like cops. They keep the streets safe. Get over it.

    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    The Fed is NOT safe from audit, Trump has said he wants to audit the fed and we may have some bills coming up soon.

    Trump is helping Rand pass his healthcare plan, if you think Trump actually supported RyanCare then you are foolish and you need to go read the threads where I addressed this topic. Rand was talking to Trump 2-3 times a week, and Rand told Trump straight up it wasn't going to pass, it didn't have the votes. Trump knew it wasn't going to pass, so he supported it to make sure it was all Paul Ryan's failure and none of it could be blamed on him. Trump hates Paul Ryan.

    Trump is going to help save Syria, with Russia's help.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    It is not about brainwashing. You can support Trump for practical reasons. I think Danno is right about the Syria missile strikes helping Trump politically in the US. The media stopped talking about the sickening russian narrative. Proof again it was just a hoax to manipulate the public opinion.

    Trump made a good call as a politician. Libertarian souls can bitch all they want about principles and being conned. Trump is going to disappointed again. I have enough hairchest.

    Just answer the question. Which game is Trump playing?

  11. #10

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    Libertarianism isn't properly equipped to take on globalism at this juncture. It's too taciturn and compromised. Nationalism is the perfect transitional solution in the interim. First the invaders (including the Davos crowd) have to be repelled.
    Last edited by AuH20; 05-13-2017 at 07:55 AM.
    “Force the normies into taking sides. At the moment they are just like "meh, I am minding my own business" retreating culturally into their private bubbles and "safe-spaces" since they don't understand what is going on. When the actual "us vs them" starts, they will be forced to fight or they'll die.” - Anonymous Poster

  12. #11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Think of the Trump candidacy as a stepping stone to the liberty movement rising again.

    It would have likely been hopeless for a very long time if Hillary had been elected.. but with Trump, we actually have someone in the Oval office battling the deep state.
    Nationalism is the only thing at the moment that's keeping us from being fully merged into a more hellish relationship on an international scale.
    Last edited by AuH20; 05-13-2017 at 08:50 AM.
    “Force the normies into taking sides. At the moment they are just like "meh, I am minding my own business" retreating culturally into their private bubbles and "safe-spaces" since they don't understand what is going on. When the actual "us vs them" starts, they will be forced to fight or they'll die.” - Anonymous Poster

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    Nationalism is the only thing at the moment that's keeping us from being merged into a more hellish relationship on an international scale.
    As far as I can tell it aint doing $#@!.
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    Yeah, I like cops. They keep the streets safe. Get over it.

    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    The Fed is NOT safe from audit, Trump has said he wants to audit the fed and we may have some bills coming up soon.

    Trump is helping Rand pass his healthcare plan, if you think Trump actually supported RyanCare then you are foolish and you need to go read the threads where I addressed this topic. Rand was talking to Trump 2-3 times a week, and Rand told Trump straight up it wasn't going to pass, it didn't have the votes. Trump knew it wasn't going to pass, so he supported it to make sure it was all Paul Ryan's failure and none of it could be blamed on him. Trump hates Paul Ryan.

    Trump is going to help save Syria, with Russia's help.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    It is not about brainwashing. You can support Trump for practical reasons. I think Danno is right about the Syria missile strikes helping Trump politically in the US. The media stopped talking about the sickening russian narrative. Proof again it was just a hoax to manipulate the public opinion.

    Trump made a good call as a politician. Libertarian souls can bitch all they want about principles and being conned. Trump is going to disappointed again. I have enough hairchest.

    Just answer the question. Which game is Trump playing?

  14. #13

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    As far as I can tell it aint doing $#@!.
    It's summoned great numbers in the coming fight. Even TPP was stopped to a sudden halt.

    Seducing someone with the flag and redirecting their nationalistic tendencies is a whole lot easier than converting them fully to Mises. We need bodies to throw into the gears of the machine.

    Whomever wants to bring the fight to the international bodies that control the world, I'm on their side.
    Last edited by AuH20; 05-13-2017 at 08:07 AM.
    “Force the normies into taking sides. At the moment they are just like "meh, I am minding my own business" retreating culturally into their private bubbles and "safe-spaces" since they don't understand what is going on. When the actual "us vs them" starts, they will be forced to fight or they'll die.” - Anonymous Poster

  15. #14

    Default

    As a viable political movement, I don't think you will ever see it happen. Libertarians can't unify around a set of core principles. They will never be any kind of force in the political arena until that happens.

    And the Libertarian label is beyond redemption thanks to 2016 and Gary Johnson.
    "There are two freedoms - the false, where a man is free to do what he likes; the true, where he is free to do what he ought."~~Charles Kingsley

  16. #15

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    They are hard to find because freedom is not popular.

    Poll after poll indicates utter disgust with the fedgov machine.

    And once you dig a little bit into the poll's questions and answers, you find that the reason for that disgust and disapproval is uniformly because the fedgov is either:

    A) Not handing out enough benefits, dole and "freebies".

    B) Not visiting enough violence on on the enemy du jour in the poll taker's mind.

    Liberty belongs to brave minority who are willing to take, by any means necessary, what is rightfully theirs, seize it from the clutches of the authoritarians of whatever stripe and the rest of the addlepated masses be damned.

    We, the fringe minority, lack the will to do that.

    So here we sit, and will continue to sit.

    A sobering truth...
    "Nobody wins in a Dairy Challenge" —Kenny Rogers


    "When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken, or cease to be honest." ~ anonymous


    I wish that for just one time, You could stand inside my shoes, And just for that one moment I could be you.
    Yes, I wish that for just one time You could stand inside my shoes, You'd know what a drag it is to see you.
    ~ Bob Dylan

  17. #16

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Suzanimal View Post
    Although it's certainly not as exciting as seeing a libertarian run for President, I think the movement starts at home. Start in your house. Live your philosophy the best way you can and set an example. Then get out in your community, meet people and spread ideas.

    One quote that keeps me from losing hope.


    This is one of our bests shots achieving our common goal...
    "Nobody wins in a Dairy Challenge" —Kenny Rogers


    "When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken, or cease to be honest." ~ anonymous


    I wish that for just one time, You could stand inside my shoes, And just for that one moment I could be you.
    Yes, I wish that for just one time You could stand inside my shoes, You'd know what a drag it is to see you.
    ~ Bob Dylan

  18. #17

    Default

    I enjoy more liberty every day than 99.99 % of the population born after 1912 ever will, but I carve it out for myself. Which as an individual is your only shot. You have to find the right place to work , right place to live that allows you to steal the maximum liberty allowed .
    Support CalExit . Danke Do Something

  19. #18

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    Oh yeah ,and AF is right , most people who do not like the govt . ? It is because they want more " free" $#@! .
    Support CalExit . Danke Do Something

  20. #19

    Default

    Don't blame it on liberals. Blame it on yourselves and the people you put forward as your leaders. Gary Johnson was never a libertarian of any kind. As president he would use the full force of government to defy the inalienable rights of citizens. But because cannibis he was libertarian.

    And don't keep saying it's to educate people. If we were educating people, we would have a discernable identity. We don't. The people who scream the loudest on this forum about rights are the very first ones to shout down any legitimate libertarian argument when it comes down to liberty issues.

    The cake is one example. Cannabis is another. Until libertarians carve out some sort of liberty identity, they will continue to fail.
    Last edited by euphemia; 05-13-2017 at 09:16 AM.
    "There are two freedoms - the false, where a man is free to do what he likes; the true, where he is free to do what he ought."~~Charles Kingsley

  21. #20

    Default

    Oh don't worry, you sourpusses! Things are fine. We're stronger and better positioned than ever before. Our ideas have become well-known and, among the native American population, well-respected, even if not entirely shared.

    One thing to realize is that libertarianism is a part of the right. It is a right-wing ideology. The American nation, and in fact Europe, too, is in the midst of a major right-wing shift. Is it all about Libertarianism specifically? Of course not. There are other right wing ideologies, and even more right wing people who are not ideological at all. So we can bellyache about this, or we can realize that our side, broadly speaking, is ascendant.

    Now, will the right actually get anything we want? That remains to be seen. That, if it is to happen, will require some serious, historic-caliber motion and action. For now, the Left is still in total control, as they have been for the past hundred years, though they are getting a bit worried.
    The rebel of the 21st Century will be old-fashioned.

    No enemies to the right

  22. #21

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    Don't blame it on liberals. Blame it on yourselves and the people you put forward as your leaders. Gary Johnson was never a libertarian of any kind. As president he would use the full force of government to defy the inalienable rights of citizens. But because cannibis he was libertarian.

    And don't keep saying it's to educate people. If we were educating people, we would have a discernable identity. We don't. The people who scream the loudest on this forum about rights are the very first ones to shout down any legitimate libertarian argument when it comes down to liberty issues.

    The cake is one example. Cannabis is another. Until libertarians carve out some sort of liberty identity, they will continue to fail.
    OK mom.
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    Yeah, I like cops. They keep the streets safe. Get over it.

    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    The Fed is NOT safe from audit, Trump has said he wants to audit the fed and we may have some bills coming up soon.

    Trump is helping Rand pass his healthcare plan, if you think Trump actually supported RyanCare then you are foolish and you need to go read the threads where I addressed this topic. Rand was talking to Trump 2-3 times a week, and Rand told Trump straight up it wasn't going to pass, it didn't have the votes. Trump knew it wasn't going to pass, so he supported it to make sure it was all Paul Ryan's failure and none of it could be blamed on him. Trump hates Paul Ryan.

    Trump is going to help save Syria, with Russia's help.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    It is not about brainwashing. You can support Trump for practical reasons. I think Danno is right about the Syria missile strikes helping Trump politically in the US. The media stopped talking about the sickening russian narrative. Proof again it was just a hoax to manipulate the public opinion.

    Trump made a good call as a politician. Libertarian souls can bitch all they want about principles and being conned. Trump is going to disappointed again. I have enough hairchest.

    Just answer the question. Which game is Trump playing?

  23. #22

    Default

    Don't wait for the political environment to change. Pick a single pro-liberty issue that also meshes well with other mainstream views (guns, taxation, etc) and get out there on your local level and push it.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  24. #23

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    That's kind of what I keep saying, but people here do not want to do it. The low profile identity of libertarianism isn't for lack of talking. Plenty of preaching to the choir here. It's for lack of principle. Ron Paul is a very principled man. That gets lost in muh weed.
    "There are two freedoms - the false, where a man is free to do what he likes; the true, where he is free to do what he ought."~~Charles Kingsley

  25. #24

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    They are hard to find because freedom is not popular.

    Poll after poll indicates utter disgust with the fedgov machine.

    And once you dig a little bit into the poll's questions and answers, you find that the reason for that disgust and disapproval is uniformly because the fedgov is either:

    A) Not handing out enough benefits, dole and "freebies".

    B) Not visiting enough violence on on the enemy du jour in the poll taker's mind.

    Liberty belongs to brave minority who are willing to take, by any means necessary, what is rightfully theirs, seize it from the clutches of the authoritarians of whatever stripe and the rest of the addlepated masses be damned.

    We, the fringe minority, lack the will to do that.

    So here we sit, and will continue to sit.
    Addlepated is a new word for me. Also I am stealing this and posting it on fedbook.
    * Enforce Border Security – America should be guarding her own borders and enforcing her own laws instead of policing the world and implementing UN mandates.

    * No Amnesty - The Obama Administration’s endorsement of so-called “Comprehensive Immigration Reform,” granting amnesty to millions of illegal immigrants, will only encourage more law-breaking.

    * Abolish the Welfare State – Taxpayers cannot continue to pay the high costs to sustain this powerful incentive for illegal immigration. As Milton Friedman famously said, you can’t have open borders and a welfare state.

    * End Birthright Citizenship – As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be granted U.S. citizenship, we’ll never be able to control our immigration problem.




    Reprinted from http://www.ronpaul2012.com/the-issues/immigration/ [Nov. 29, 2011]

  26. #25

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by helmuth_hubener View Post
    Oh don't worry, you sourpusses! Things are fine. We're stronger and better positioned than ever before. Our ideas have become well-known and, among the native American population, well-respected, even if not entirely shared.

    One thing to realize is that libertarianism is a part of the right. It is a right-wing ideology. The American nation, and in fact Europe, too, is in the midst of a major right-wing shift. Is it all about Libertarianism specifically? Of course not. There are other right wing ideologies, and even more right wing people who are not ideological at all. So we can bellyache about this, or we can realize that our side, broadly speaking, is ascendant.

    Now, will the right actually get anything we want? That remains to be seen. That, if it is to happen, will require some serious, historic-caliber motion and action. For now, the Left is still in total control, as they have been for the past hundred years, though they are getting a bit worried.
    Country is roughly 1/4th cuckoo liberal by raw individual numbers, but liberal ideas still dominate the mainstream.
    Last edited by AuH20; 05-13-2017 at 11:01 AM.
    “Force the normies into taking sides. At the moment they are just like "meh, I am minding my own business" retreating culturally into their private bubbles and "safe-spaces" since they don't understand what is going on. When the actual "us vs them" starts, they will be forced to fight or they'll die.” - Anonymous Poster

  27. #26

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by brandon View Post
    In 2007 and again in 2011 it felt like we were on the cusp of success. In 2015 we thought maybe moderate Rand Paul could be the compromise candidate that lead our cause. Now it seems like alt-right nationalism has totally co-opted our movement.

    On the positive we've gained a few great congessmen like Massie, Walter Jones, and Amash. But on the negative our entire movement has been taken over by Trumptards.

    When will we rise again? I'm a decade older than when I first joined but still standing by for the Revolution.
    Are you still out there in the city of brotherly love ?
    Support CalExit . Danke Do Something

  28. #27

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    Country is roughly 1/4th cuckoo liberal, but liberal ideas dominate the mainstream.
    My guess is the tipping point of 50 - 60 percent is arriving and has been in the past decade .
    Support CalExit . Danke Do Something

  29. #28

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by oyarde View Post
    My guess is the tipping point of 50 - 60 percent is arriving and has been in the past decade .
    Yes and we're literally feeding & housing this next wave of despicable ingrates. We're going to need a massive disruption to stop the engineered population shift. Maybe it will take the form of a Venezuelan type crisis to organize and mobilize. Things being overly comfortable doesn't portend to any winning equation going forward. See my sig quote for emphasis.
    Last edited by AuH20; 05-13-2017 at 11:25 AM.
    “Force the normies into taking sides. At the moment they are just like "meh, I am minding my own business" retreating culturally into their private bubbles and "safe-spaces" since they don't understand what is going on. When the actual "us vs them" starts, they will be forced to fight or they'll die.” - Anonymous Poster

  30. #29

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post


    Originally Posted by euphemia

    Don't blame it on liberals. Blame it on yourselves and the people you put forward as your leaders. Gary Johnson was never a libertarian of any kind. As president he would use the full force of government to defy the inalienable rights of citizens. But because cannibis he was libertarian.

    And don't keep saying it's to educate people. If we were educating people, we would have a discernable identity. We don't. The people who scream the loudest on this forum about rights are the very first ones to shout down any legitimate libertarian argument when it comes down to liberty issues.
    The cake is one example. Cannabis is another. Until libertarians carve out some sort of liberty identity, they will continue to fail.OK mom.

    Yeah, but she's right, though. It's quickly grown into a libertine movement. And libertine is not libertarian. In fact, libertine patently contradicts the most fundamental aspect of libertarianism which is its primary foundation for moral code.
    Last edited by Natural Citizen; 05-13-2017 at 11:43 AM.
    Carpe Diem!

  31. #30

    Default

    I think that my greatest fear about this stuff is that one day we're going to have the clutural Marxists redefining a 'libertarian' movement. I think we're going to see 'libertarians' help that to happen, too. And we're sure heading there if we're paying attention to the moral decline of 'libertarian' philosophy from within the so called movement. Live your own philosophy, as was mentioned. libertarianism is gradually being redefined as Individual Liberty's primary foundation for moral code is increasingly removed from the education of the philosophy as well as society as a whole. Liberty requires public morality or virtue. The erosion of public morality is, in my view, the most unrecognized threat to liberty today.

    Youth sure is wasted on the young. It's true. Whatever, though. I can plant seeds and live in the woods and be just dandy.
    Last edited by Natural Citizen; 05-13-2017 at 11:42 AM.
    Carpe Diem!

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