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Thread: Obama Commutes Bulk of Chelsea Manning’s Sentence

  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by kpitcher View Post
    Could always use bitcoin, with some effort it can be anonymous.
    Yes, and it can still be seized, even from someone who is anonymous.
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  3. #32

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    5 minHá 5 minutos
    VP-ELECT PENCE SAYS COMMUTING MANNING SENTENCE A `MISTAKE': FOX

  4. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by goldenequity View Post
    5 minHá 5 minutos
    VP-ELECT PENCE SAYS COMMUTING MANNING SENTENCE A `MISTAKE': FOX
    I wonder if Trump will reverse the commutation. I wonder if that's within his power??
    BEWARE THE CULT OF "GOVERNMENT"

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  5. #34

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    Glenn Greenwald Talking Chelsea Manning on Anderson Cooper's Show



    Counters a lot of propaganda, such as that "people died" because of Manning leak.
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  6. #35

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    released today.



    https://twitter.com/xychelsea/status/864840675220754436
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul

  7. #36

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    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Dr. Ron Paul.
    "Stand up for what you believe in, even if you are standing alone." - Sophie Magdalena Scholl
    "War is the health of the State." - Randolph Bourne
    "Freedom is the answer. ... Now, what's the question?" - Ernie Hancock.

  8. #37

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    Glad Manning is out. Can't wait to read what she has to say...
    BEWARE THE CULT OF "GOVERNMENT"

    Christian Anarchy - Our Only Hope For Liberty In Our Lifetime!
    Sonmi 451: Truth is singular. Its "versions" are mistruths.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:ChristianAnarchist

    Use an internet archive site like
    THIS ONE
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  9. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChristianAnarchist View Post
    Glad Manning is out. Can't wait to read what she has to say...
    Maybe she'll pose in body paint for you.
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    You do know that you are a moron right?

    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    Just for the record, 99% of the time I say "In my country........" I am actually messing with you people because I know you guys have absolutely no idea what happens in my country.

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  10. #39

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    One of you lucky fellows may be able to get a date now .

  11. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by PierzStyx View Post
    Obama is a coward. If he had any balls Manning would never have spent a day in prison.
    Obama had the balls to commute Manning's sentence - and although I'd have preferred a full pardon (or better yet, no conviction at all), the simple fact is that Obama did not have to do even that much.

    I'm more than happy to piss on Obama for many things.

    But not for this.

    Quote Originally Posted by PierzStyx View Post
    This is just partisan posturing, [...]
    If so, then we could do with a hell of a lot more of such "partisan posturing."

    Quote Originally Posted by PierzStyx View Post
    [...] nothing more.
    I rather suspect that Manning would beg to differ ...

  12. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by Danke View Post
    Maybe she'll pose in body paint for you.
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    Yeah, I like cops. They keep the streets safe. Get over it.

    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    The Fed is NOT safe from audit, Trump has said he wants to audit the fed and we may have some bills coming up soon.

    Trump is helping Rand pass his healthcare plan, if you think Trump actually supported RyanCare then you are foolish and you need to go read the threads where I addressed this topic. Rand was talking to Trump 2-3 times a week, and Rand told Trump straight up it wasn't going to pass, it didn't have the votes. Trump knew it wasn't going to pass, so he supported it to make sure it was all Paul Ryan's failure and none of it could be blamed on him. Trump hates Paul Ryan.

    Trump is going to help save Syria, with Russia's help.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    It is not about brainwashing. You can support Trump for practical reasons. I think Danno is right about the Syria missile strikes helping Trump politically in the US. The media stopped talking about the sickening russian narrative. Proof again it was just a hoax to manipulate the public opinion.

    Trump made a good call as a politician. Libertarian souls can bitch all they want about principles and being conned. Trump is going to disappointed again. I have enough hairchest.

    Just answer the question. Which game is Trump playing?

  13. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Obama had the balls to commute Manning's sentence - and although I'd have preferred a full pardon (or better yet, no conviction at all), the simple fact is that Obama did not have to do even that much.

    I'm more than happy to piss on Obama for many things.

    But not for this.



    If so, then we could do with a hell of a lot more of such "partisan posturing."



    I rather suspect that Manning would beg to differ ...
    Agree on all points.
    There is no spoon.

  14. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Obama had the balls to commute Manning's sentence - and although I'd have preferred a full pardon (or better yet, no conviction at all), the simple fact is that Obama did not have to do even that much.

    I'm more than happy to piss on Obama for many things.

    But not for this.



    If so, then we could do with a hell of a lot more of such "partisan posturing."



    I rather suspect that Manning would beg to differ ...


    No, he did have to. But being the guy who is supposed to be a darling of the LGBTQ crowd, or at least seen as such by the Democratic Left, and also being the guy who didn't help the highest profile transsexual in prison, who is being abused and beaten for being such, means throwing the LGBTQ crowd a bone once in a while.

    If Obama had balls then he would've pardoned Manning completely as soon as the verdict came down. Waiting to do it the last minute stinks of either political opportunism or fear. I'm glad Manning is benefiting from it, but I'm not about the give Obama any accolades for it.
    “Maybe I forgot to mention something to you: I don’t believe in queens. You think freedom is something you can give and take on a whim. But to your people, freedom is as essential as air. And without it, there is no life. There is only darkness.” -Zaheer

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  15. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by ChristianAnarchist View Post
    Glad Manning is out. Can't wait to read what she has to say...
    He.
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    Yeah, I like cops. They keep the streets safe. Get over it.

    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    The Fed is NOT safe from audit, Trump has said he wants to audit the fed and we may have some bills coming up soon.

    Trump is helping Rand pass his healthcare plan, if you think Trump actually supported RyanCare then you are foolish and you need to go read the threads where I addressed this topic. Rand was talking to Trump 2-3 times a week, and Rand told Trump straight up it wasn't going to pass, it didn't have the votes. Trump knew it wasn't going to pass, so he supported it to make sure it was all Paul Ryan's failure and none of it could be blamed on him. Trump hates Paul Ryan.

    Trump is going to help save Syria, with Russia's help.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    It is not about brainwashing. You can support Trump for practical reasons. I think Danno is right about the Syria missile strikes helping Trump politically in the US. The media stopped talking about the sickening russian narrative. Proof again it was just a hoax to manipulate the public opinion.

    Trump made a good call as a politician. Libertarian souls can bitch all they want about principles and being conned. Trump is going to disappointed again. I have enough hairchest.

    Just answer the question. Which game is Trump playing?

  16. #45

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    Remember what Assange said?



    "The future is here, it's just not evenly distributed yet." - William Gibson

    I am Zippy and I approve of this post. But you don't have to. This post may include statements I don't personally agree with.

  17. #46

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    Do you call a biological male who pretends to be a girl, "she"? I don't.

  18. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by PierzStyx View Post
    No, he did have to. But being the guy who is supposed to be a darling of the LGBTQ crowd, or at least seen as such by the Democratic Left, and also being the guy who didn't help the highest profile transsexual in prison, who is being abused and beaten for being such, means throwing the LGBTQ crowd a bone once in a while.
    No, he did not have to. He could easily have left Manning to rot.

    And as for the LGBCDEFWHATEVER crowd: had they been given an either-or, "one but not the other" choice between the "bone" of seeing Manning set free or the "bone" of seeing the White House lit up in rainbow colors (to much ooohing and aaahing from an adoring media), I would not be at all surprised if many/most of them would have preferred the latter. Had Obama not released Manning, that fact would simply have afforded the LGBWHATEVERs the continuing opportunity to "make hay" against Trump (or whatever other politically convenient target) for not doing so.

    IOW: Obama's "legacy" in the eyes of that bunch is not in any danger for him to fear, regardless of whether he had done anything at all about Manning.

    Quote Originally Posted by PierzStyx View Post
    If Obama had balls then he would've pardoned Manning completely as soon as the verdict came down. Waiting to do it the last minute stinks of either political opportunism or fear. I'm glad Manning is benefiting from it, but I'm not about the give Obama any accolades for it.
    I haven't given Obama any accolades. I'm just not $#@!ting on him for doing this, whatever his motives.

    On my scales, the release of an exposer of perfidious malfeasances from the unjust doom of spending a lifetime in a brutal cage weighs far, far more in the balance than whatever transient "political opportunism" might have been involved in such a release.

  19. #48

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    Some people are too blinded by the Democrat vs Repub football game to credit anything good to a member of the other team.

  20. #49

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    I've got no love for h o m o 's or Obama but Bradley Manning deserves to be free and compensated for his bravery standing up to DC...

    If he chooses to take his compensation in a pair of tits and a name change that's his prerogative...
    Last edited by tod evans; 05-19-2017 at 02:27 AM.

  21. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by merkelstan View Post
    Some people are too blinded by the Democrat vs Repub football game to credit anything good to a member of the other team.
    It is a positive that Manning is released, but do not forget that it was under Obama's leadership and war against whistle-blowers that Manning was put in prison to begin with and sentenced to 35 years, placed in prolonged solitary confinement; and aside from the isolation, subjected to ridiculous sustained petty and abusive vindictive treatment such as to remain naked in the cell for extended periods, or to stand naked outside the cell for inspections, forbidden from growing hair, and worse.

    So while it is always positive when a heinous perpetrator finally releases his victim after seven years of abuse, it does not negate Obama's wickedness for targeting whistle-blowers and imprisoning Manning in the first place. One does not praise a perpetrator for ending their assault on a victim. Does one cheer a corrupt cop because he finally stops swinging the baton on a helpless victim? Does one praise a kidnapper because they release the victim after several years of abuse? Does one commend an arsonist because they throw water on the house they set ablaze?
    Last edited by AZJoe; 05-19-2017 at 02:54 PM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Dr. Ron Paul.
    "Stand up for what you believe in, even if you are standing alone." - Sophie Magdalena Scholl
    "War is the health of the State." - Randolph Bourne
    "Freedom is the answer. ... Now, what's the question?" - Ernie Hancock.

  22. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by tod evans View Post
    I've got no love for h o m o 's or Obama but Brian Manning deserves to be free and compensated for his bravery standing up to DC...

    If he chooses to take his compensation in a pair of tits and a name change that's his prerogative...
    Brian being Bradley's father? http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl...n-manning.html
    "The future is here, it's just not evenly distributed yet." - William Gibson

    I am Zippy and I approve of this post. But you don't have to. This post may include statements I don't personally agree with.

  23. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by AZJoe View Post
    It is a positive that Obama commuted his sentence, but do not forget that it was under Obama's leadership and war against whistle-blowers that Manning was put in prison to begin with and sentenced to 35 years, placed in prolonged solitary confinement; and aside from the isolation, subjected to ridiculous sustained petty and abusive vindictive treatment such as to remain naked in the cell for extended periods, or to stand naked outside the cell for inspections, forbidden from growing hair, and worse.

    So while it is always positive when a heinous perpetrator finally releases his victim after seven years of abuse, it does not negate Obama's wickedness for targeting whistle-blowers and imprisoning Manning in the first place.
    All this is true.

    But there is no reason to think that any of those things would not have happened under Trump or Bush - except for the commutation of Manning's sentence. There does not appear to be any reason to think that Trump or Bush would ever have done such a thing.

    There are myriad causes for which to denounce Obama (including the imprisonment and subsequent treatment of Manning in the first place) - but whatever his motives, and however "opportunistic" those motives might have been, the release of Manning is not among them.

  24. #53

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    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    But there is no reason to think that any of those things would not have happened under Trump or Bush ...
    OMG that is horrible reasoning. That is the most absurd fallacy. That is no reason to glorify Obama and whitewash him for all his evil misdeeds, his war on whistle blowers and imprisonment of Manning. That is like cheering a kidnapper who releases his victim after 7 years of abuse, because maybe some other kidnapper would not have. Trump or Bush is the wrong measuring stick. By that red team/blue team standard You can whitewash all of Bush's evils by comparing him to Obama and vice versa. By that standard nobody is ever responsible for their own misdeeds. Everybody gets a free pass. Try instead a more objective standard like doing the right thing. Obama is responsible for his own evils. He is responsible for his war on whistle-blowers, and his imprisonment of Manning, and all his other evils, regardless of what anyone else might have done. He does not give a free pass for what he did to Manning and his war on whistle-blowers because one may speculate Bush might have done the same thing. Likewise Bush does not get a free pass on Iraq or anything else because of Obama's warmongering.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Dr. Ron Paul.
    "Stand up for what you believe in, even if you are standing alone." - Sophie Magdalena Scholl
    "War is the health of the State." - Randolph Bourne
    "Freedom is the answer. ... Now, what's the question?" - Ernie Hancock.

  25. #54

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    Quote Originally Posted by AZJoe View Post
    OMG that is horrible reasoning. That is the most absurd fallacy. That is no reason to glorify Obama and whitewash him for all his evil misdeeds [snip remaining hysterics]


    What parts of "all this is true" (the very first sentence in my reply to your previous post) and "There are myriad causes for which to denounce Obama (including the imprisonment and subsequent treatment of Manning in the first place)" were you not able to understand?

    I did not in any way "glorify Obama and whitewash him for all his evil misdeeds."

    I defy you to indentify so much as a single instance in which I have done so.

    I have not given Obama any kind of "pass" for his evil deeds.

    But I am not going to $#@! on him for deeds that are not evil (such as letting Manning out of prison).

    If you really don't understand the difference, then I don't know what to tell you.

    Suppose I had replied to your previous post in the same manner in which you replied to mine - like so:
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana
    Quote Originally Posted by AZJoe View Post
    It is a positive that Obama commuted his sentence, but do not forget [bad stuff about Obama]
    OMG that is horrible reasoning. That is the most absurd fallacy. [Other stuff about how AZJoe is somehow glorifying Obama and whitewashing all his evil misdeeeds.]
    Do you see how fatuous it would have been if I had replied to you like this? So why are you doing it to me?

    Last edited by Occam's Banana; 05-19-2017 at 12:07 AM.

  26. #55

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Edited

  27. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    I defy you to indentify so much as a single instance in which I have done so.
    I have not given Obama any kind of "pass" for his evil deeds.
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    But there is no reason to think that any of those things would not have happened under Trump or Bush.
    Come now Occam. That is disingenuous. When it is pointed out that Obama made war on whistle-blowers, and targeted Manning, and imprisoned him for seven plus years, and subjected to petty abuse under his leadership, your response is to draw an irreverent hypothetical speculative comparison that "But there is no reason to think that any of those things would not have happened under Trump or Bush." To out of the blue bring up speculative hypothetical comparisons to say "yeah well these guys would have been bad too." As if that makes any difference to Obama's evils whatsoever. The only purpose of drawing such speculative hypothetical comparisons serve is a fallacious attempt to minimize, downplay, and sugar coat Obama's evil deeds - whitewash by hypothetical comparison. That is completely irreverent to Obama's deeds. No matter how bad anyone else might have been, it has absolutely no bearing or relevance whatsoever to Obama's culpability for his own misdeeds. It is a sophomoric fallacy to point and say "yeah Obama did bad, but hey others would have been bad too."
    Last edited by AZJoe; 05-19-2017 at 08:58 AM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Dr. Ron Paul.
    "Stand up for what you believe in, even if you are standing alone." - Sophie Magdalena Scholl
    "War is the health of the State." - Randolph Bourne
    "Freedom is the answer. ... Now, what's the question?" - Ernie Hancock.

  28. #57

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    Hope this isn't too much sideboob to show on here....
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    Why do you try to disprove actual real evidence by discussing the views of the person who compiled it? That doesn't make any logical sense.

  29. #58

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    Quote Originally Posted by AZJoe View Post
    Come now Occam. That is disingenuous. When it is pointed out that Obama made war on whistle-blowers, and targeted Manning, and imprisoned him for seven plus years, and subjected to petty abuse under his leadership, your response is to draw an irreverent hypothetical speculative comparison that "But there is no reason to think that any of those things would not have happened under Trump or Bush." To out of the blue bring up speculative hypothetical comparisons to say "yeah well these guys would have been bad too." As if that makes any difference to Obama's evils whatsoever. The only purpose of drawing such speculative hypothetical comparisons serve is a fallacious attempt to minimize, downplay, and sugar coat Obama's evil deeds - whitewash by hypothetical comparison. That is completely irreverent to Obama's deeds. No matter how bad anyone else might have been, it has absolutely no bearing or relevance whatsoever to Obama's culpability for his own misdeeds. It is a sophomoric fallacy to point and say "yeah Obama did bad, but hey others would have been bad too."
    I stand by every word I have said - including my remark regarding Trump & Bush (both of whom I mentioned only because they are the ones who happen to have "bookended" Obama, thus providing points of contrast vis-à-vis the commutation of Manning's sentence). I will gladly leave it to those readers who don't have a bug up their asses to judge whether I have "glorified Obama" or "whitewashed all his evil misdeeds."

    However, I am not going to waste time discussing the matter further with someone who bizarrely insists on trying to reify what I have clearly and simply stated into an elaborate rhetorical strawman, apparently for no reason other than to condescendingly sneer at me for being "disingenuous" and "sophomoric." IOW: Go malign someone else with your casuistries. I'm done here.
    Last edited by Occam's Banana; 05-19-2017 at 10:27 AM.

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