Trump is in trouble. The Logan Act.

[timosman]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan_Act

[69360]

The guy is going to be president in 5 days. Nobody even the most hardcore liberal democrats are going to try to bring him up on Logan act charges. This is a stupid post.

[AngryCanadian]

Based on what evidence? if anyone should be in trouble with the Logan Act what all the former presidents whom were doing deals with the Israeli gov?

[timosman]

Russia.

[Ender]

Based on what evidence? if anyone should be in trouble with the Logan Act what all the former presidents whom were doing deals with the Israeli gov?

Israel is not a "foreign government having a dispute with the U.S."

Just sayin'.

[dannno]

The act appears to give the President, and only the President, the ability to freely negotiate. The outcome of the negotiation has to be confirmed by the senate.

[Cleaner44]

I think Trump has hit his ceiling. No way he can be president.

[thoughtomator]

This thread is a testament to the credibility of RPF having dropped to the level of the corporate media.

It just doesn't feel like it's populated with the same people who went through the Ron Paul campaigns in 2008 and 2012. Those people knew better than than this, without a doubt.

Who are you people? Some names are familiar, but I don't recognize any of you.

[angelatc]

This thread is a testament to the credibility of RPF haforving dropped to the level of the corporate media.

It just doesn't feel like it's populated with the same people who went through the Ron Paul campaigns in 2008 and 2012. Those people knew better than than this, without a doubt.

Who are you people? Some names are familiar, but I don't recognize any of you.

You mean, you think the government should get involved here? Or not? Like you, I can't tell people apart now.

[thoughtomator]

You mean, you think the government should get involved here? Or not? Like you, I can't tell people apart now.

Gives me some small comfort to know you're still the same strawman-slinging troll as ever

That's one sign of normalcy, I suppose.

[angelatc]

Gives me some small comfort to know you're still the same strawman-slinging troll as ever

That's one sign of normalcy, I suppose.

^^triggered^

It was a serious question. Sorry if that confused you into attacking me instead of simply answering it.

[thoughtomator]

^^triggered^

It was a serious question. Sorry if that confused you into attacking me instead of simply answering it.

I of course didn't mention government at all, so if it was a serious question then perhaps some reading skills or psychiatric therapy is in order.

Amazed to see that someone is finally wrecking the tyrannical establishment, and alleged libertarians line up on the side of the tyrants.

When the far left does it, I almost don't blame them because I didn't expect any common sense in their ranks.

To see it here, it's beyond sad.

[ChristianAnarchist]

I'm still here... although I feel a bit like a lost puppy (I have a dirty mind - I first spelled that with "ss" instead of "pp") since we have no campaign to be involved in and certainly there will never again be anything like the Ron Paul R3volution! At best now the only thing I can do is try to educate people about the utter nonsense of invoking a boogieman (the goonerment) to solve all the worlds problems. When a significant number of "the people" realize that a fiction cannot "save" us my work will be done (looks like I have a long way to go...)

[osan]

I think Trump has hit his ceiling. No way he can be president.

Lets see how that ends up having worked out in just under one more week.

This Logan Act nonsense is just that. But don't take my word for it. Let us examine the relevant text:

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of theUnited States of America in Congress assembled, That if any person,being a citizen of the United States, whether he be actually resident, or abiding within the United States, or in any foreign country, shall,without the permission or authority of the government of the UnitedStates, directly or indirectly, commence, or carry on, any verbal or written correspondence or intercourse with any foreign government, or an officer or agent thereof, with an intent to influence the measures or conduct of any foreign government, or of any officer or agent thereof, inrelation to any disputes or controversies with the United States, or defeatthe measures of the government of the United States ; or if any person,being a citizen of, or resident within the United States, and not dulyauthorized, shall counsel, advise, aid or assist in any such correspondence, with intent, as aforesaid, he or they shall be deemed guilty of ahigh misdemeanor, and on conviction before any court of the UnitedStates having jurisdiction thereof, shall be punished by a fine not exceed-ing five thousand dollars, and by imprisonment during a term not lessthan six months, nor exceeding three years:Provided always, thatnothing in this act contained shall be construed to abridge the rightof individual citizens of the United States to apply, by themselves, ortheir lawful agents, to any foreign government, or the agents thereof,for the redress of any injuries in relation to person or property whichsuch individuals may have sustained from such government, or any ofits agents, citizens or subjects .

Key terms highlighted. This is YASWS (Yet Another $#@!tily Written Statute). For one thing, proving intent is damned near impossible and inferring intent based upon action is fraught with risk to justice even in the best cases.

The statute clearly states that the attempted influence must not only have been applied to officials of a state with which we are in "dispute[] or controvers[y]", but that the interference must relate directly to said disputes or controversies. Has Trump done this? And even if he has, he is the incoming president. Standing upon some technicality such as his not yet having taken his oath would likely backfire on anyone attempting a swag at him with this stupid and poorly formulated jewel from the litter box of our illustrious and much esteemed Fifth Congress.

Not only would I deem this statute as failing to attain the status of Law, I would consider its passage a prima facie act of treason.

Next, "disputes or controversies" appears to remain unspecified as to precise meaning.

The statute is pure feces. That does not mean some sub-douche prosecutor would not try to use it (when was the last time we saw one of these prosecutions?), unfortunately. But as someone else has already pointed out, which of the Democrat sub-douches parked out behind me here do we think is going to step up in hot pursuit of such a charge against Trump? I suspect he or they would be crushed under legal foot in very short order, possibly opening themselves up to charges of malfeasance, dereliction of duty, filing false charges, and so on down what I suspect could become a long and rather creative list of responses designed to show them whose is bigger.

'Tis usually best to choose one's battles with a bit more care than this.

[jmdrake]

Okay. I'm not a Trump fan. I get attacked routinely by the most rabid Trump fans. But if the reports are true that Donald Trump plans to meet Vladimir Putin sometime after being inagurated, how is that a violation of the Logan Act?

[ChristianAnarchist]

Okay. I'm not a Trump fan. I get attacked routinely by the most rabid Trump fans. But if the reports are true that Donald Trump plans to meet Vladimir Putin sometime after being inagurated, how is that a violation of the Logan Act?

Because it wasn't until Logan ran that the whole house of cards came tumbling down and everyone finally became free from their oppressors...

[goldenequity]

Because it wasn't until Logan ran that the whole house of cards came tumbling down and everyone finally became free from their oppressors...

That was a pretty elliptical comment.

[timosman]

Trump is doing Logan's Run.

[angelatc]

I of course didn't mention government at all, so if it was a serious question then perhaps some reading skills or psychiatric therapy is in order.

The topic of the thread is the Logan act, so...

Amazed to see that someone is finally wrecking the tyrannical establishment, and alleged libertarians line up on the side of the tyrants.

d.

So you think Trump is wrecking the tyrannical establishment? I hope you're right, but I'm not convinced. If he would just end some wars I'd call it a win, I guess.

[Philmanoman]

I think that was actually the whole problem here at RPF

People come in here and exclaim how trump has done all these great things.
That's fine.But it's as if he's god himself the way people talk.Trump is perfeCT in his supporters eyes.

He ended the media
He stoped corruption
He ended globalism
He ended the democrats

If people would stop hanging off trumps nuts,they might realize it's better to wait till he's actually done something.Because if he doesnt deliver the goods...its going to be as good as the salty SJW tears.

[AngryCanadian]

Israel is not a "foreign government having a dispute with the U.S."

Just sayin'.

Last time i checked Israel is a foreign government in the middle east that wants all Arabs gone how is that not a dispute?

[Cleaner44]

Why is it that we have people on this forum that think the law still matters?

There is no rule of law.

People in D.C. do whatever they want without repercussions.

[Ender]

Last time i checked Israel is a foreign government in the middle east that wants all Arabs gone how is that not a dispute?

You think the US gov disputes that? You a funny man, Mr. AngryCanadian.

[donnay]

The people who have completely ignored the Logan Act are people who attend Bilderberg Conferences.

[ChristianAnarchist]

Why is it that we have people on this forum that think the law still matters?

There is no rule of law.

People in D.C. do whatever they want without repercussions.

Bingo!! We live in anarchy and most people don't know it. Those at the top know it that's why they have ZERO respect for "law" and do whatever they please. They know the secret that most of us sheeple do not know... THERE IS NO GOVERMENT OR LAW!! Only the appearance of government and law. They are fictions that only exist in the minds of the "believers". It is nothing more than a cult. They have their priests (judges), pope (president), and officers (goons).

[parocks]

Because it wasn't until Logan ran that the whole house of cards came tumbling down and everyone finally became free from their oppressors...

They should've just raised the age to 35.

[dannno]

The people who have completely ignored the Logan Act are people who attend Bilderberg Conferences.

Yes, the Logan Act was to prevent people who are NOT the President from negotiating on behalf of the US. That will be Trump's job.

[ChristianAnarchist]

They should've just raised the age to 35.

Mission creep... Next thing you know those pesky people would be asking for 37!!

[timosman]

Bingo!! We live in anarchy and most people don't know it. Those at the top know it that's why they have ZERO respect for "law" and do whatever they please. They know the secret that most of us sheeple do not know... THERE IS NO GOVERMENT OR LAW!! Only the appearance of government and law. They are fictions that only exist in the minds of the "believers". It is nothing more than a cult. They have their priests (judges), pope (president), and officers (goons).

You might be onto something.