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  1. #1

    Default Rand Paul Plan to Repeal and Replace Obamacare

    Paul, Trump upend GOP's Obamacare repeal plans

    By BURGESS EVERETT - 01/09/17

    After Rand Paul spent the last week urging the GOP not to repeal Obamacare without having a replacement plan ready, his phone rang on Friday night with a call from a new supporter: Donald Trump.

    “He called after seeing an interview that I had done [talking about] that we should vote on Obamacare replacement at the same time,” Paul said in an interview on Monday. “He said he was in complete agreement with that.”

    With Trump going out of his way to bless the Kentucky senator’s approach, Paul’s week-long campaign to hold a vote on replacing Obamacare alongside a simultaneous repeal measure has seemingly upended the GOP’s long-sought plans for a cathartic and immediate vote to gut the health care law. As news broke that Trump backed Paul's play, several other Senate Republicans were also beginning calls for a new strategy — threatening the trajectory of the party’s rush to repeal the law.

    Paul said he wasn’t trying to slow the process down, but instead said it’s a “matter of speeding up” the replacement efforts. He’s putting together an initial proposal containing the GOP’s best ideas and will ship them this afternoon to Trump’s administration after getting buy-in from the president-elect.

    ...
    read more:
    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/0...nd-paul-233351

    --------

    A Health-Care Plan the GOP Could Get Behind
    by Michael Tanner - January 11, 2017

    The GOP needs an alternative to Obamacare. Rand Paul’s plan is a good start.
    ...
    Paul wants to repeal Obamacare root and branch, of course, but he also wants Republicans to offer a replacement plan on day one. Democrats may block it, but then the political fallout will be on them.

    Paul’s proposal draws liberally from the best ideas in other Republican plans, while avoiding many of the pitfalls that make some of those plans unworkable. He would, for example, dramatically expand health savings accounts (HSAs). HSAs shift control of health-care spending from employers to employees. Paul’s expansion would allow much larger tax-free contributions to these accounts, and would allow them to be used for a wider variety of health-related expenses, including insurance premiums. That would mean that you — not your boss — would be able to choose your insurance plan. Expanded HSAs would also mean increased portability for health insurance. Because you could use your HSA to pay your premium, you wouldn’t be as likely to lose your insurance if you changed or lost your job.

    This would replace many of the subsidies in Obamacare without the dangers of government-designated insurance inherent in some of the tax-credit proposals that some Republicans have backed. (If the government offers a credit for insurance, it has to define what insurance qualifies for the credit.)

    Paul would also greatly expand competition and choice in the health-insurance market. He would expand association health plans and allow individuals to purchase health insurance through non-traditional groups, such as churches and civic associations. In theory, any person who wanted to purchase group insurance would have the opportunity to do so. And he would legalize the purchase of health insurance across state lines, challenging both the insurance cartels and overzealous state regulators, while allowing individuals to shop for the best price and quality they can find.

    Importantly, Paul avoids one of the most significant pitfalls of many Republican plans by not retaining Obamacare’s pre-existing-condition rules. These provisions, which prohibit insurers from denying coverage or charging more to people who are already sick, are among the few popular parts of Obamacare. Yet they are also the reason behind some of the most damaging and unpopular provisions, such as the individual mandate.

    Some Republicans are discussing ways to preserve the pre-existing-condition requirements as long as a person maintains continuous coverage, or creating an open-enrollment period during which the rules apply. But those proposals would still encourage people to game the system, jumping to more comprehensive plans or those with the best specialists after they become sick, knowing that insurers could not refuse them or increase their premiums. If Republicans simultaneously eliminate the mandate, this will only accelerate the adverse-selection death spiral that is already besetting Obamacare.

    Paul would eliminate the pre-existing-condition regulations altogether (after a transition period), while his other reforms would significantly reduce the number of people who genuinely cannot buy health insurance because of a pre-existing condition. For those who still need help, Paul envisions responsibility for covering them being shifted to the states, possibly in conjunction with proposals to block-grant Medicaid.

    This would give states the freedom to experiment with ways to cover people who are unable to buy their own insurance for whatever reason, whether pre-existing conditions or low income. Importantly, it prevents a small number of high-cost cases from distorting the rest of the insurance pool. It wouldn’t try to insure the uninsurable, but would provide their health care more directly. After all, it is health care that counts, not health insurance.
    ...
    More: http://www.nationalreview.com/articl...plan-rand-paul
    Last edited by Brian4Liberty; 01-11-2017 at 09:35 PM.



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  3. #2

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    Rand Paul is off to one hell of a start this new term.
    There are only two things we should fight for. One is the defense of our homes and the other is the Bill of Rights. War for any other reason is simply a racket.
    -Major General Smedley Butler, USMC,
    Two-Time Congressional Medal of Honor Winner
    Author of, War is a Racket!

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  4. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by jllundqu View Post
    Rand Paul is off to one hell of a start this new term.
    And it's really a plus to see the incoming President agreeing with him.
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    Yeah, I like cops. They keep the streets safe. Get over it.

    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    The Fed is NOT safe from audit, Trump has said he wants to audit the fed and we may have some bills coming up soon.

    Trump is helping Rand pass his healthcare plan, if you think Trump actually supported RyanCare then you are foolish and you need to go read the threads where I addressed this topic. Rand was talking to Trump 2-3 times a week, and Rand told Trump straight up it wasn't going to pass, it didn't have the votes. Trump knew it wasn't going to pass, so he supported it to make sure it was all Paul Ryan's failure and none of it could be blamed on him. Trump hates Paul Ryan.

    Trump is going to help save Syria, with Russia's help.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    It is not about brainwashing. You can support Trump for practical reasons. I think Danno is right about the Syria missile strikes helping Trump politically in the US. The media stopped talking about the sickening russian narrative. Proof again it was just a hoax to manipulate the public opinion.

    Trump made a good call as a politician. Libertarian souls can bitch all they want about principles and being conned. Trump is going to disappointed again. I have enough hairchest.

    Just answer the question. Which game is Trump playing?

  5. #4

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    nice.
    The bigger government gets, the smaller I wish it was.

  6. #5

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    Now the tough part, getting Rand's 'replacement' and not another doomed to failure intervention that will lead to public support fo Single Payer in 4-8 years.
    Freedom index

    ~Resident Badgiraffe





  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by William Tell View Post
    Now the tough part, getting Rand's 'replacement' and not another doomed to failure intervention that will lead to public support fo Single Payer in 4-8 years.
    I think this is where we finally see Rand's support of Mitch McConnell finally pay a dividend. If not now, I don't know when.

    XNN
    "They sell us the president the same way they sell us our clothes and our cars. They sell us every thing from youth to religion the same time they sell us our wars. I want to know who the men in the shadows are. I want to hear somebody asking them why. They can be counted on to tell us who our enemies are but theyre never the ones to fight or to die." - Jackson Browne Lives In The Balance

  8. #7

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    This is a good sign!
    +
    'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ

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    The best part would be if it turns out the call did not happen. Troll level: master.
    The essential English leadership secret does not depend on particular intelligence. Rather, it depends on a remarkably stupid thick-headedness. The English follow the principle that when one lies, one should lie big, and stick to it. They keep up their lies, even at the risk of looking ridiculous.

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    Paul said he wasn’t trying to slow the process down, but instead said it’s a “matter of speeding up” the replacement efforts. He’s putting together an initial proposal containing the GOP’s best ideas and will ship them this afternoon to Trump’s administration after getting buy-in from the president-elect.
    Nice.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
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    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  12. #11

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    Suddenly, nobody has a problem with the federal government being involved where it shouldn't be, because Rand.

    Isn't anyone here libertarian enough to wonder what Rand's justification for having a replacement is, when the Constitution could not be clearer that control over health care is not among the powers delegated to the federal government?

    Is there anything less libertarian than a federal government controlling the health care sector?

    (Don't bother to answer, all the people with integrity abandoned this place long ago, and I have zero respect for the legions of hypocrites left.)
    Oligarchy delenda est

    “If you love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.” - Samuel Adams

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by thoughtomator View Post
    Suddenly, nobody has a problem with the federal government being involved where it shouldn't be, because Rand.

    Isn't anyone here libertarian enough to wonder what Rand's justification for having a replacement is, when the Constitution could not be clearer that control over health care is not among the powers delegated to the federal government?

    Is there anything less libertarian than a federal government controlling the health care sector?

    (Don't bother to answer, all the people with integrity abandoned this place long ago, and I have zero respect for the legions of hypocrites left.)
    it's obviously going to have to be a political transition, not a full blown repeal and replace with nothing. This is a smart move for Rand to understand this and make sure he starts paving the way for competitive free market health care and not just another cobbled together special interest boondoggle.

    This puts libertarian ideas front and center in the public debate on what to do about healthcare.

    What is your problem anyways?

  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by newbitech View Post
    it's obviously going to have to be a political transition, not a full blown repeal and replace with nothing. This is a smart move for Rand to understand this and make sure he starts paving the way for competitive free market health care and not just another cobbled together special interest boondoggle.

    This puts libertarian ideas front and center in the public debate on what to do about healthcare.

    What is your problem anyways?
    The real libertarian solution to healthcare.


    “Maybe I forgot to mention something to you: I don’t believe in queens. You think freedom is something you can give and take on a whim. But to your people, freedom is as essential as air. And without it, there is no life. There is only darkness.” -Zaheer

    "A man chooses. A slave obeys."-Andrew Ryan

    "There are three things the parasite hates: free markets, free will, and free men."-Andrew Ryan

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by PierzStyx View Post
    The real libertarian solution to healthcare.


    that is such an obtuse comment. there is a difference between healthcare and heath insurance. the policy of government mandated health insurance is definitely a fire that needs to be put out. but it doesn't solve the problem of healthcare fire that has been raging long before obamacare.

    i think the more prudent path to healthcare reform is recognizing that health care insurance is not the same as healthcare. Insurance as a whole is a gamblers market place. Everyone is going to get sick, everyone is going to have a terminal illness. There is not a pool of money big enough in the world to cover the expense of keeping everyone alive as long as possible.

    The sooner we realize that, the sooner we'll put more focus on quality and affordable healthcare. Insurance is not the answer.

    Rand Paul's plan recognizes this. You can't replace healthcare with nothing.

  16. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by newbitech View Post
    there is a difference between healthcare and heath insurance.
    ...
    i think the more prudent path to healthcare reform is recognizing that health care insurance is not the same as healthcare. Insurance as a whole is a gamblers market place. Everyone is going to get sick, everyone is going to have a terminal illness. There is not a pool of money big enough in the world to cover the expense of keeping everyone alive as long as possible.

    The sooner we realize that, the sooner we'll put more focus on quality and affordable healthcare. Insurance is not the answer.

    Rand Paul's plan recognizes this. You can't replace healthcare with nothing.
    Exactly. One of the biggest frustrations is listening to pundits and politicians conflate insurance with health care. They are not the same thing!

    And that is the essential problem. The free market has a hard enough time working rapidly and efficiently in the first place. Evolution does not happen over night, but to insulate customers from the price eliminates free market competition on price entirely. You then have what we have today. The only motivations on price are for the providers to increase them as rapidly as possible. There is no true incentive for prices to be reduced.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by newbitech View Post
    that is such an obtuse comment. there is a difference between healthcare and heath insurance. the policy of government mandated health insurance is definitely a fire that needs to be put out. but it doesn't solve the problem of healthcare fire that has been raging long before obamacare.

    Rand Paul's plan recognizes this. You can't replace healthcare with nothing.
    Sure I dropped a word by accident. But in context it should be clear enough what I'm talking about.

    You repeal the ACA and replace it with nothing. This whole idea that you need to "replace" it with something is foolish. It is just another way to get the US government involved in the system when government involvement in the system IS the problem. It is why healthcare costs were crazy before the ACA and why they're crazy with the ACA and why they'll be crazy after the ACA.

    Rand's answer isn't really liberty, he doesn't think the government should be out of the system. he just thinks his way of manipulating the system would be better than Obamacare. Which it probably would be, I'll be fair there. but that doesn't solve the central reason we have Obamacare in the first place, which is that government regulators think they have a right to regulate and control healthcare costs. It was why healthcare coverage was such a mess before the ACA and why it only got worse with the ACA. And no matter how far back Rand thinks he can pull the tide, it will only surge forward again because his "solution" won't "fix" anything. You can't fix scarcity, illness, and death. There will always be problems and as long as government regulators think they can use government force to dream up a system that will "fix" the issues of mortality, and as long as they have the historical precedent telling them to try, they will do so. Which means that whatever Rand's "fix" is will only go the way of the dodo eventually.

    So the best you can do is mitigate the problem. And the way to best do that is to remove government distortion form the system in all its forms. Instead of government mandates and hand out and rules and regulations, you let the market function. Let people figure out for themselves the ways they can best serve one another.

    Repeal the ACA. Replace it with nothing. Then start on the next thing. And the next. And the next. That way instead of putting out fires in one place only to start them elsewhere, you douse all the fires and let people build their own firepits.
    “Maybe I forgot to mention something to you: I don’t believe in queens. You think freedom is something you can give and take on a whim. But to your people, freedom is as essential as air. And without it, there is no life. There is only darkness.” -Zaheer

    "A man chooses. A slave obeys."-Andrew Ryan

    "There are three things the parasite hates: free markets, free will, and free men."-Andrew Ryan

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by thoughtomator View Post
    Suddenly, nobody has a problem with the federal government being involved where it shouldn't be, because Rand.

    Isn't anyone here libertarian enough to wonder what Rand's justification for having a replacement is, when the Constitution could not be clearer that control over health care is not among the powers delegated to the federal government?

    Is there anything less libertarian than a federal government controlling the health care sector?

    (Don't bother to answer, all the people with integrity abandoned this place long ago, and I have zero respect for the legions of hypocrites left.)
    Have you read his replacement plan? If so, what is your issue with it?

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by thoughtomator View Post
    Suddenly, nobody has a problem with the federal government being involved where it shouldn't be, because Rand.

    Isn't anyone here libertarian enough to wonder what Rand's justification for having a replacement is, when the Constitution could not be clearer that control over health care is not among the powers delegated to the federal government?

    Is there anything less libertarian than a federal government controlling the health care sector?

    (Don't bother to answer, all the people with integrity abandoned this place long ago, and I have zero respect for the legions of hypocrites left.)
    No this is a very valid point.

    Knowing Rand I am willing to bet that his "replacement" is 98% free market or more. He is doing a piss poor job of communicating that, as usual though.

    And lots of the conservatives are starting to buy into the narrative that he is trying to actually delay replacement.

    Rand is getting flanked on both sides, from the conservatives that don't think it should be replaced, and from conservatives that think that he is trying to stall and delay repeal. His communication is lousy, but then again, this is the norm.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Knowing Rand I am willing to bet that his "replacement" is 98% free market or more. He is doing a piss poor job of communicating that
    Um, ya, that's the whole point. Know your audience.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    CAUTION!! The following members openly support George Soros propaganda: CPUd, TheCount, ZippyJuan, undergroundrr, twomp

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    No this is a very valid point.

    Knowing Rand I am willing to bet that his "replacement" is 98% free market or more. He is doing a piss poor job of communicating that, as usual though.

    And lots of the conservatives are starting to buy into the narrative that he is trying to actually delay replacement.

    Rand is getting flanked on both sides, from the conservatives that don't think it should be replaced, and from conservatives that think that he is trying to stall and delay repeal. His communication is lousy, but then again, this is the norm.
    He is improving though. He got rid of your ass.
    ================
    Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.

    Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America

    The Property Basis of Rights

  22. #21

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    I thought the whole point of his not supporting the current bill was about balancing the budget? I hope he brings that up as an ACTUAL OPTION during the press he'll likely get for this headline.
    The more prohibitions you have,
    the less virtuous people will be.
    The more weapons you have,
    the less secure people will be.
    The more subsidies you have,
    the less self-reliant people will be.

    Therefore the Master says:
    I let go of the law,
    and people become honest.
    I let go of economics,
    and people become prosperous.
    I let go of religion,
    and people become serene.
    I let go of all desire for the common good,
    and the good becomes common as grass.

    -Tao Te Ching, Section 57

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    Quote Originally Posted by jonhowe View Post
    I thought the whole point of his not supporting the current bill was about balancing the budget? I hope he brings that up as an ACTUAL OPTION during the press he'll likely get for this headline.
    The amendment he gave to the bill allows congress to repeal obamacare at a future date and balances the budget. He already has the bills that have free market reforms that he has outlined to replace obamacare as well, several have been put forward and have consensus.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    CAUTION!! The following members openly support George Soros propaganda: CPUd, TheCount, ZippyJuan, undergroundrr, twomp

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  24. #23

    Thumbs down

    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    He is improving though. He got rid of your ass.
    What the hell are you talking about? I never worked for his Senate office or the lousy 2016 PCC
    __________________________________________________ ________________
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  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    What the hell are you talking about? I never worked for his Senate office or the lousy 2016 PCC
    Yes, I know.
    ================
    Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.

    Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America

    The Property Basis of Rights

  26. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by thoughtomator View Post
    Suddenly, nobody has a problem with the federal government being involved where it shouldn't be, because Rand.

    Isn't anyone here libertarian enough to wonder what Rand's justification for having a replacement is, when the Constitution could not be clearer that control over health care is not among the powers delegated to the federal government?

    Is there anything less libertarian than a federal government controlling the health care sector?

    (Don't bother to answer, all the people with integrity abandoned this place long ago, and I have zero respect for the legions of hypocrites left.)
    Hah, you're being ridiculous. Rand is replacing it with some free market reforms. He can't go to congress and say, "hey let's repeal Obamacare and institute some free market reforms" if he wants any of those fools to take him seriously. He has to call the free market reforms a "replacement" so that it is palatable. It is the best strategy for instituting free market reforms in our healthcare system. If you had a better strategy, then we would be seeing some action happening from your corner. But instead you are playing armchair quarterback and doing a really bad job at least in this instance.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc


    CAUTION!! The following members openly support George Soros propaganda: CPUd, TheCount, ZippyJuan, undergroundrr, twomp

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  27. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by thoughtomator View Post
    Suddenly, nobody has a problem with the federal government being involved where it shouldn't be, because Rand.

    Isn't anyone here libertarian enough to wonder what Rand's justification for having a replacement is, when the Constitution could not be clearer that control over health care is not among the powers delegated to the federal government?

    Is there anything less libertarian than a federal government controlling the health care sector?

    (Don't bother to answer, all the people with integrity abandoned this place long ago, and I have zero respect for the legions of hypocrites left.)
    How the hell did you're obnoxious ass get back in here?
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    Yeah, I like cops. They keep the streets safe. Get over it.

    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    The Fed is NOT safe from audit, Trump has said he wants to audit the fed and we may have some bills coming up soon.

    Trump is helping Rand pass his healthcare plan, if you think Trump actually supported RyanCare then you are foolish and you need to go read the threads where I addressed this topic. Rand was talking to Trump 2-3 times a week, and Rand told Trump straight up it wasn't going to pass, it didn't have the votes. Trump knew it wasn't going to pass, so he supported it to make sure it was all Paul Ryan's failure and none of it could be blamed on him. Trump hates Paul Ryan.

    Trump is going to help save Syria, with Russia's help.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    It is not about brainwashing. You can support Trump for practical reasons. I think Danno is right about the Syria missile strikes helping Trump politically in the US. The media stopped talking about the sickening russian narrative. Proof again it was just a hoax to manipulate the public opinion.

    Trump made a good call as a politician. Libertarian souls can bitch all they want about principles and being conned. Trump is going to disappointed again. I have enough hairchest.

    Just answer the question. Which game is Trump playing?

  28. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by thoughtomator View Post
    Suddenly, nobody has a problem with the federal government being involved where it shouldn't be, because Rand.

    Isn't anyone here libertarian enough to wonder what Rand's justification for having a replacement is, when the Constitution could not be clearer that control over health care is not among the powers delegated to the federal government?

    Is there anything less libertarian than a federal government controlling the health care sector?

    (Don't bother to answer, all the people with integrity abandoned this place long ago, and I have zero respect for the legions of hypocrites left.)
    The one thing the federal government actually has a right to do under the commerce clause is to stop states from interfering with interstate commerce. State laws that bar insurance companies from competing across state lines do just that. Also the tax code should be changed (scrapped really, but that's a fight for another day) so that health care expenses are "above the line" deductible. In other words you should get a dollar for dollar reduction in your tax burden for every dollar spent on healthcare, whether that is for paying your deductible, paying your premium, or just simply paying your doctor outright. And yes, the mandate should be sh&^canned.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

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  29. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by thoughtomator View Post
    Suddenly, nobody has a problem with the federal government being involved where it shouldn't be, because Rand.

    Isn't anyone here libertarian enough to wonder what Rand's justification for having a replacement is, when the Constitution could not be clearer that control over health care is not among the powers delegated to the federal government?
    ...
    Yes, because Rand. Some of us have hope that Rand having influence here will result in a better outcome than other options that come from crony politicians and their lobbyist masters. On the surface, a no nonsense repeal sounds good, but this is also an opportunity to do things that open up competition.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rudeman View Post
    Have you read his replacement plan? If so, what is your issue with it?
    You have to pass it before you can see what is in it.

    I believe Rand is pushing for a more open process right now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    ...Knowing Rand I am willing to bet that his "replacement" is 98% free market or more.
    ...
    Which is why some of us see this as a step in the right direction.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  30. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Yes, because Rand. Some of us have hope that Rand having influence here will result in a better outcome than other options that come from crony politicians and their lobbyist masters.
    Well, even though Rand got a jump on them, the crony backroom establishment still tried to ram their RyanCare plan down our throats. At least Rand and the Freedom Caucus prevented that from happening.
    Twitter: B4Liberty@USAB4L
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  31. #30

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by thoughtomator View Post
    Suddenly, nobody has a problem with the federal government being involved where it shouldn't be, because Rand.
    Nobody who voted for Trump voted for replacing Obamacare, that's for sure. OTOH, I trust Rand. We're not going to get what I want, which is a total implosion of the entire system leaving millions of old sick people with no tax-funded coverage, so I'll simply have to settle for taking pleasure in seeing the Democrats lose.
    * Enforce Border Security – America should be guarding her own borders and enforcing her own laws instead of policing the world and implementing UN mandates.

    * No Amnesty - The Obama Administration’s endorsement of so-called “Comprehensive Immigration Reform,” granting amnesty to millions of illegal immigrants, will only encourage more law-breaking.

    * Abolish the Welfare State – Taxpayers cannot continue to pay the high costs to sustain this powerful incentive for illegal immigration. As Milton Friedman famously said, you can’t have open borders and a welfare state.

    * End Birthright Citizenship – As long as illegal immigrants know their children born here will be granted U.S. citizenship, we’ll never be able to control our immigration problem.




    Reprinted from http://www.ronpaul2012.com/the-issues/immigration/ [Nov. 29, 2011]

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