The Cashless Society (Official Thread)

[jllundqu]

The dangers of a cashless society cannot be overstated. Leaving the entirety of the world's money in bits and 1's and 0's to be controlled by governments is THE most dangerous future I can foresee. Many countries are headed that way and it seems to be accelerating. Please use this thread to post examples and discuss the implications.

India had removed 86% of its currency in circulation causing chaos:

http://www.economist.com/news/financ...bad-idea-badly

South Korea to kill the Coin:

http://www.cnbc.com/2016/12/01/south...s-society.html

Sweden may go cashless:

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/20...cashless-world

Zimbabwe may go cashless:

http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/18/africa...hless-society/

Hell even jackals in the US are pushing for a Cashless Society where the banks control literally everything:

http://time.com/money/4226174/kill-1...uro-phase-out/

[kfarnan]

This has been discussed before. It depends. What does cashless society mean? Fiat controlled currency = bad. Any currency that is created by the Fed causes problems, green dollar bills or digits. It is not the medium that matters. The only solution is decentralized money.

[PierzStyx]

This has been discussed before. It depends. What does cashless society mean? Fiat controlled currency = bad. Any currency that is created by the Fed causes problems, green dollar bills or digits. It is not the medium that matters. The only solution is decentralized money.

Well said. And digital currency may offer the means for the public to decentralize money at will.

[Anti Federalist]

This has been discussed before. It depends. What does cashless society mean? Fiat controlled currency = bad. Any currency that is created by the Fed causes problems, green dollar bills or digits. It is not the medium that matters. The only solution is decentralized money.

Negative.

The medium most certainly does matter.

Cash is anonymous, good anywhere, and not dependent on an electric/electronic grid or network.

Digital "cash" leaves a trail of every purchase, can be shut off remotely, can be shut off to deny "unapproved" purchases of goods and services that the powers that be do not wish you to have and is dependent on a network that be shut down in its entirety.

[DaninPA]

Well said. And digital currency may offer the means for the public to decentralize money at will.

That may be true, but it would need to be ridiculously easy for the average American idiot to use in order to realize widespread use.

I bought some Bitcoin a while ago at the urging of a coworker, and without doing some research/reading I don't know how to use it or even sell it. And I'm an above average American idiot

[DaninPA]

Negative.

The medium most certainly does matter.

Cash is anonymous, good anywhere, and not dependent on an electric/electronic grid or network.

Digital "cash" leaves a trail of every purchase, can be shut off remotely, can be shut off to deny "unapproved" purchases of goods and services that the powers that be do not wish you to have and is dependent on a network that be shut down in its entirety.

Also, what he said. ^^^

[kfarnan]

Negative.

The medium most certainly does matter.

Cash is anonymous, good anywhere, and not dependent on an electric/electronic grid or network.

Digital "cash" leaves a trail of every purchase, can be shut off remotely, can be shut off to deny "unapproved" purchases of goods and services that the powers that be do not wish you to have and is dependent on a network that be shut down in its entirety.

There are many solutions to each question. The least of which is the shut down of the entire internet, that would be necessary to stop us. Before that, would be much larger issues than what money is being changed.

Would you prefer the fed phony currency?

you are the resistance

[kfarnan]

The world is moving to decentralized money. The bankers are making the choice very easy.

[angelatc]

Negative.

The medium most certainly does matter.

Cash is anonymous, good anywhere, and not dependent on an electric/electronic grid or network.

Digital "cash" leaves a trail of every purchase, can be shut off remotely, can be shut off to deny "unapproved" purchases of goods and services that the powers that be do not wish you to have and is dependent on a network that be shut down in its entirety.

And it's fiat.

[Suzanimal]

Negative.

The medium most certainly does matter.

Cash is anonymous, good anywhere, and not dependent on an electric/electronic grid or network.

Digital "cash" leaves a trail of every purchase, can be shut off remotely, can be shut off to deny "unapproved" purchases of goods and services that the powers that be do not wish you to have and is dependent on a network that be shut down in its entirety.

I agree. I'm enjoying playing around with Bitcoin but it's only a matter of time until this is the norm.

[Anti Federalist]

The world is moving to decentralized money. The bankers are making the choice very easy.

The world is moving cashless because of the bankers.

The bankers make billions every year off the electronic transaction grid.

To answer your question: yes, if given a choice of only one or the other, I'd take fiat fed over digital fiat bankster credits any day.

[Anti Federalist]

There are many solutions to each question. The least of which is the shut down of the entire internet, that would be necessary to stop us. Before that, would be much larger issues than what money is being changed.

Would you prefer the fed phony currency?

you are the resistance

Let's pick one:

What is the solution to digital "currency" being tracked and monitored by government?

[Danke]

How will the CIA get its funding if there is a record of the drug sales, etc?

[Anti Federalist]

How will the CIA get its funding if there is a record of the drug sales, etc?

Good question...no river of off the books cash to fund their global network of "dirty tricks".

Maybe there's some upside to this...

[Origanalist]

Good question...no river of off the books cash to fund their global network of "dirty tricks".

Maybe there's some upside to this...

Ya, no. Don't think for a second that if they control all exchanges they couldn't hide whatever the hell "they" wanted too.

[Anti Federalist]

Ya, no. Don't think for a second that if they control all exchanges they couldn't hide whatever the hell "they" wanted too.

Yer right...comment withdrawn.

[kfarnan]

Let's pick one:

What is the solution to digital "currency" being tracked and monitored by government?

Maybe i wasn't clear. I am talking about Peer 2 peer decentralized, not fiat currency. Yes, crypto is already anonymous.

[FSP-Rebel]

That may be true, but it would need to be ridiculously easy for the average American idiot to use in order to realize widespread use.

I bought some Bitcoin a while ago at the urging of a coworker, and without doing some research/reading I don't know how to use it or even sell it. And I'm an above average American idiot

Most people that have bitcoin use them for speculation and future price discovery since it's the same dynamics of these central bankers that are creating the future demand for bitcoin via capital controls. From its inception, bitcoin has been the best investment (pick your terms) on earth and it still has a small market cap. That's why bitcoin's future will be in the many thousands per coin. The stronger the price becomes, the more attractive it becomes to institutional investors and believe me they are taking notice around the world. Its store of value is being proven over time as it has risen to the top of the charts of new asset classes. Not to mention, the daily mined coins halved back in July and the 50% reduction in supply via miners has taken its time to price this factor into the market as financial meltdowns are occurring around the world. The writing is on wall and decentralized money that can be sent in any amount, to anywhere in the world, in the seeming blink of an eye, for next to nothing is worth way more than a $12 bill market cap. The only issue right now is the scaling debate, which will decide the block size going forward and whether the new Segwit protocol or the Lightning Network come sooner or later.

In the future and as the financial markets continue their death spiral, hedge funds, public/private pensions, 401Ks, etc will be looking to gain btc exposure be it through ETFs or otherwise and this will cause explosive growth the likes of which very few have seen in their lifetimes, let alone be enough of a visionary to be able to be in on the ground floor in any significant way. There's only so much btc to go around over time and each passing day makes one's value in btc rarer.

It may all seem a like a major technical headache to understand the ecosystem in full but it all boils down to having a wallet, encrypting the private key, then buying, selling or trading it for another object of your value. In order to sell it, just get another wallet on an exchange (deposit coins there from other address, sell for currency of choice, then wire it to your bank account) or at Coinbase (which you link to your checking account where you can buy from or sell into). Bitcoin is also the perfect tool to use to gtfo and become an international person if needed. You can use stealth alt coins for super privacy or mixer services to obscure your coins - not that I've ever felt the need for that but they're out there.

If the shtf, the internet is gone permanently and we go Amish, then you'll truly need the bullets, metals and storable foods to reach the flip side. Until then, bitcoin and decentralized money is the best way to opt out of a system you don't consent to and get wealthy while doing so.

[DamianTV]

The world is moving to decentralized money. The bankers are making the choice very easy.

People are never given the choice between what is right and wrong, they are given the choice between what is right and what is easy.

Currency, in what ever form it may take, needs to retain its value for those who possess it. Its value comes its fungibility. (ability to be spent and exchanged for goods and services). With a fiat currency, whether it is worthless paper or digital, the value bleeds out over time as more money is created. Ron Paul defined inflation as "an increase in the money supply", which causes the value of each individual part of that currency to be devalued. The problem is that with a fully digital currency, the speed at which currency can be printed is increased exponentially. The additional threat is that what each person spends their money on will become a new means by which to deprive the ordinary citizen of what little currency they possess. Do you live in Federal Housing and you spent your currency on cigarettes? You will be fined for such a behavior. That is only the tip of the iceberg where every single action you take ends up costing you more money. Digital currency, as planned by central bankers will be FULLY trackable, which opens up all those doors for governments and corporations having a financial incentive to find fault in what a person spends their money on.

Digital currency is a very dangerous double edged sword, and is more dangerous to freedom than even fiat paper currency, which in and of itself is more dangerous to nations than standing armies.

[kfarnan]

Most people that have bitcoin use them for speculation and future price discovery since it's the same dynamics of these central bankers that are creating the future demand for bitcoin via capital controls. From its inception, bitcoin has been the best investment (pick your terms) on earth and it still has a small market cap. That's why bitcoin's future will be in the many thousands per coin. The stronger the price becomes, the more attractive it becomes to institutional investors and believe me they are taking notice around the world. Its store of value is being proven over time as it has risen to the top of the charts of new asset classes. Not to mention, the daily mined coins halved back in July and the 50% reduction in supply via miners has taken its time to price this factor into the market as financial meltdowns are occurring around the world. The writing is on wall and decentralized money that can be sent in any amount, to anywhere in the world, in the seeming blink of an eye, for next to nothing is worth way more than a $12 bill market cap. The only issue right now is the scaling debate, which will decide the block size going forward and whether the new Segwit protocol or the Lightning Network come sooner or later.

In the future and as the financial markets continue their death spiral, hedge funds, public/private pensions, 401Ks, etc will be looking to gain btc exposure be it through ETFs or otherwise and this will cause explosive growth the likes of which very few have seen in their lifetimes, let alone be enough of a visionary to be able to be in on the ground floor in any significant way. There's only so much btc to go around over time and each passing day makes one's value in btc rarer.

It may all seem a like a major technical headache to understand the ecosystem in full but it all boils down to having a wallet, encrypting the private key, then buying, selling or trading it for another object of your value. In order to sell it, just get another wallet on an exchange (deposit coins there from other address, sell for currency of choice, then wire it to your bank account) or at Coinbase (which you link to your checking account where you can buy from or sell into). Bitcoin is also the perfect tool to use to gtfo and become an international person if needed. You can use stealth alt coins for super privacy or mixer services to obscure your coins - not that I've ever felt the need for that but they're out there.

If the shtf, the internet is gone permanently and we go Amish, then you'll truly need the bullets, metals and storable foods to reach the flip side. Until then, bitcoin and decentralized money is the best way to opt out of a system you don't consent to and get wealthy while doing so.

THIS.

[kfarnan]

People are never given the choice between what is right and wrong, they are given the choice between what is right and what is easy.

Currency, in what ever form it may take, needs to retain its value for those who possess it. Its value comes its fungibility. (ability to be spent and exchanged for goods and services). With a fiat currency, whether it is worthless paper or digital, the value bleeds out over time as more money is created. Ron Paul defined inflation as "an increase in the money supply", which causes the value of each individual part of that currency to be devalued. The problem is that with a fully digital currency, the speed at which currency can be printed is increased exponentially. The additional threat is that what each person spends their money on will become a new means by which to deprive the ordinary citizen of what little currency they possess. Do you live in Federal Housing and you spent your currency on cigarettes? You will be fined for such a behavior. That is only the tip of the iceberg where every single action you take ends up costing you more money. Digital currency, as planned by central bankers will be FULLY trackable, which opens up all those doors for governments and corporations having a financial incentive to find fault in what a person spends their money on.

Digital currency is a very dangerous double edged sword, and is more dangerous to freedom than even fiat paper currency, which in and of itself is more dangerous to nations than standing armies.

You're talking about fiat currency, not decentralized money.

[DamianTV]

You're talking about fiat currency, not decentralized money.

Then maybe we need to look at Legal Tender laws? Start by changing or repealing those?

[jllundqu]

Negative.

The medium most certainly does matter.

Cash is anonymous, good anywhere, and not dependent on an electric/electronic grid or network.

Digital "cash" leaves a trail of every purchase, can be shut off remotely, can be shut off to deny "unapproved" purchases of goods and services that the powers that be do not wish you to have and is dependent on a network that be shut down in its entirety.

This is my fear. Not in good standing with the State? Sorry no bread for you. Owe back taxes? Sorry no water for you. Made a negative post about the government? Sorry, no car repair for you. Massive economic crisis? sorry population, we need your money and we will lend it back to you for $.10 on the dollar.

[kfarnan]

This is my fear. Not in good standing with the State? Sorry no bread for you. Owe back taxes? Sorry no water for you. Made a negative post about the government? Sorry, no car repair for you. Massive economic crisis? sorry population, we need your money and we will lend it back to you for $.10 on the dollar.

Decentralized economics would make the middle man irrelevant. When you own the bank, they can't stop you. When nobody monopolizes the currency, the economy thrives.

Then you're free to tell the state to $#@! off.

[devil21]

And there's that little part where it's simply not real.

Gold is the money of kings. Silver is the money of gentlemen. Paper is the money of slaves. Imaginary digits is the money of cattle.

I took out some vietnamese food the other night. The owner, who personally greets every customer, said to me in strong vietnamese accent "I like you! You pay real money!" Even though she was referring to cash, it reminded that some people still recognize real from imaginary. Shame it had to be from someone that grew up in a third world war torn country.