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Thread: Trumps seeing the Light

  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    Let's be fair. Trump was in New York raising a family and working. He wasn't in politics then.
    Uhh Trump has ran for president multiple times before going back to '87, he's not a newbie, he's not an outsider.

    Timeline From http://www.tvguide.com/news/donald-t...aign-timeline/


    1987-1988: Trump considers a run for president, while simultaneously juggling large debts stemming from his purchase of the Taj Mahal casino.

    2000: Trump enters the presidential race as a Reform Party candidate and receives more than 15,000 votes in the party's California primary.

    2003-2004: Trump begins hosting the reality show The Apprentice on NBC, which he also executive-produces. He again mulls a run for president, but ultimately decides not to join the race.

    March 2011: A Wall Street Journal/NBC News poll shows Trump leading all presidential contenders, including Mitt Romney.

    April 2011: Amid more research polls indicating that he would be the preferred Republican presidential candidate among voters, Trump repeatedly calls for President Obama to release his long-form birth certificate, questioning whether Obama was actually born in the United States. (Obama eventually complies and releases the birth certificate.)

    May 2011: Trump officially announces that he will not run for president.

    February 2012: Trump endorses Republican candidate Mitt Romney for president.

    2013: Trump forms a presidential exploratory committee and, despite a strong backing from Republican voters, announces that he has no interest in running for governor of New York in 2014.

    February 2015: Trump decides not to renew his Apprentice contract, fueling speculation that he's mulling a run for president.

    June 2015: Trump formally announces that he's running for president in a speech delivered from Trump Tower in New York City. Almost immediately, corporations and individuals that have partnerships with Trump - including Macy's, NBC and Univision - begin to sever ties with the mogul because of disparaging comments he made about Mexicans in the speech announcing his candidacy.
    “…let us teach them that all who draw breath are of equal worth, and that those who seek to press heel upon the throat of liberty, will fall to the cry of FREEDOM!!!” – Spartacus, War of the Damned

    BTC: 1AFbCLYU3G1dkbsSJnk3spWeEwpqYVC2Pq



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  3. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    Please stop making these threads....
    But why? he has gained 2 green bars on his rep bar just after starting this thread yesterday. From the response also, it seems like he has many members that support his posting. You cannot argue with success.

  4. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by juleswin View Post
    But why? he has gained 2 green bars on his rep bar just after starting this thread yesterday. From the response also, it seems like he has many members that support his posting. You cannot argue with success.
    Good point. Ideally, reputation should correlate with support for the site mission. When the people who work to advance the site mission get driven away and those who oppose it run rampant and see their rep bars go up, that dissonance should probably be corrected.

  5. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by kpitcher View Post
    Uhh Trump has ran for president multiple times before going back to '87, he's not a newbie, he's not an outsider.

    Timeline From http://www.tvguide.com/news/donald-t...aign-timeline/


    1987-1988: Trump considers a run for president, while simultaneously juggling large debts stemming from his purchase of the Taj Mahal casino.

    2000: Trump enters the presidential race as a Reform Party candidate and receives more than 15,000 votes in the party's California primary.

    2003-2004: Trump begins hosting the reality show The Apprentice on NBC, which he also executive-produces. He again mulls a run for president, but ultimately decides not to join the race.

    March 2011: A Wall Street Journal/NBC News poll shows Trump leading all presidential contenders, including Mitt Romney.

    April 2011: Amid more research polls indicating that he would be the preferred Republican presidential candidate among voters, Trump repeatedly calls for President Obama to release his long-form birth certificate, questioning whether Obama was actually born in the United States. (Obama eventually complies and releases the birth certificate.)

    May 2011: Trump officially announces that he will not run for president.

    February 2012: Trump endorses Republican candidate Mitt Romney for president.

    2013: Trump forms a presidential exploratory committee and, despite a strong backing from Republican voters, announces that he has no interest in running for governor of New York in 2014.

    February 2015: Trump decides not to renew his Apprentice contract, fueling speculation that he's mulling a run for president.

    June 2015: Trump formally announces that he's running for president in a speech delivered from Trump Tower in New York City. Almost immediately, corporations and individuals that have partnerships with Trump - including Macy's, NBC and Univision - begin to sever ties with the mogul because of disparaging comments he made about Mexicans in the speech announcing his candidacy.
    2011. Threatens to run third party if Ron Paul wins nomination. http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...nominee-(2011)
    Last edited by phill4paul; 10-18-2016 at 04:53 PM.



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  7. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Peace&Freedom View Post
    The point is to achieve political success for the liberty movement, not to one-dimensionally deify the Pauls, while demonizing others. The total formula is to 1) run candidates with coherent liberty principles, who 2) actively confront and defeat that establishment, while 3) building a winning coalition of voters outside the liberty base. Paul had point one, Trump points two and three, while being pro-liberty on several major fronts.

    Those three points have to be addressed going forward, whether the candidate is Paul, Trump, or somebody else, in order for the liberty candidate to win. So criticizing Ron for not being as politically successful as Trump remains an ESSENTIAL part of winning future elections, because having the right positions alone has been proven to be inadequate without also effectively executing the strategic aspects. Dismissing the latter, by simplistically characterizing Trump's positions, is the type of non-analysis that gets us nowhere.
    Where is Trump demonstrably pro liberty? The man who is *sometimes* anti intervention is the same man who claims he respects women; a claim we all knew to be false from the time we all came to know who Trump was, decades ago. Thats why the 'pussygate' issue is actually important. It's just another example of Trump claiming to hold a belief, but in reality he practices the exact opposite. This is the man who is anti intervention, yet wants to "bomb the ****" out of ISIS, supported Iraq and Libya before he became a candidate, and wants to murder terrorists' relatives.


    The point of the liberty movement is to promote liberty, I thought. Trump is the exact opposite of that. He uses liberty-sounding rhetoric when convenient to drive him into office, just as he'll use barbaric and militaristic rhetoric when convenient.
    The more prohibitions you have,
    the less virtuous people will be.
    The more weapons you have,
    the less secure people will be.
    The more subsidies you have,
    the less self-reliant people will be.

    Therefore the Master says:
    I let go of the law,
    and people become honest.
    I let go of economics,
    and people become prosperous.
    I let go of religion,
    and people become serene.
    I let go of all desire for the common good,
    and the good becomes common as grass.

    -Tao Te Ching, Section 57

  8. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    Ideally, reputation should correlate with support for the site mission.
    It's just a circle-jerk.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Pinochet is the model
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Liberty preserving authoritarianism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Enforced internal open borders was one of the worst elements of the Constitution.

  9. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    A. Trump is not pro-liberty on any front.

    B. There is no value whatsoever in satisfying conditions #2 and #3 without satisfying condition #1.
    You have not established your absolutist contention that "Trump is not pro-liberty on any front," as has been repeatedly pointed out, thus continuing to blow off conditions 2 and 3 is retarded. Your approach is actually a prescription for only pursuing one losing educational liberty campaign after another to the end of time, that never gets to satisfy conditions 2 and 3, plain and simple.
    -----Peace & Freedom, John Clifton-----
    Blog: https://electclifton.wordpress.com/2...back-backlash/

  10. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Jesse James View Post
    he wants Ron to endorse Trump.
    In post #2 he says Rand.

  11. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Peace&Freedom View Post
    You have not established your absolutist contention that "Trump is not pro-liberty on any front,"
    It's been more than established. Stop burying your head in the sand. Trump is driven by an utter hatred of liberty. His whole reason for running is to make the federal government more powerful. His whole concept of American greatness is a strong regime that nobody dares disobey.

  12. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Superfluous Man View Post
    Good point. Ideally, reputation should correlate with support for the site mission. When the people who work to advance the site mission get driven away and those who oppose it run rampant and see their rep bars go up, that dissonance should probably be corrected.
    Agreed. And yes the owner and mods are responsible for this forum having less liberty supporters remaining than it does authoritarians and trolls.
    I am the spoon.

  13. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Peace&Freedom View Post
    Your approach is actually a prescription for only pursuing one losing educational liberty campaign after another...
    No, I don't need a 100% pure libertarian.

    I'm perfectly happy to accept a libertarian-ish candidate if he has the better odds of winning.

    But I need something more than 0%, which is what we have in Trump.

  14. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by John F Kennedy III View Post
    Agreed. And yes the owner and mods are responsible for this forum having less liberty supporters remaining than it does authoritarians and trolls.
    I think that the cause there is mostly the strong racist surge a couple of months back.

    And I don't envy them the balancing act of attempting to promote and encourage free speech, avoiding enabling an echo chamber, and preventing the forum from becoming Stormfront 2: Ron Paul Boogaloo. There's no way to win there.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Pinochet is the model
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Liberty preserving authoritarianism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Enforced internal open borders was one of the worst elements of the Constitution.



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  16. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by jonhowe View Post
    Did Ron miss a chance to influence Hillary's platform? If your answer is "no", you have no reason to be angry. Ron has as much in common with Trump as he does Clinton. Trump is NOT FIGHTING THE ESTABLISHMENT. He is fighting for himself and himself only. If you vote for him you symbolically rebuke nearly every principle Ron stood for.

    You pointed out that Ron got a lot of support for his smackdown of Rudy and US foreign policy. You're right. 100% right. AND RUDY IS TRUMP'S CLOSEST ADVISER! So you liked Ron for smacking down Rudy, and now you like Trump who hold essentially the same views as Rudy. Plus, the topic Ron owned Rudy on was blowback, 9/11, and Iraq. Trump is on the polar opposite side on these issues. He was for Iraq, Libya, intervention in Syria, etc, before he was against them. Plus, listen to his rhetoric; is that how a non interventionist talks?

    Trump has fooled you. Just because media heads are shocked by his behavior doesn't mean he's 'anti establishment'. The media hated Bush II, too.

    EDIT: Ron has said as much and is 100% correct: “In some places, Trump is worse than the establishment. He says he loves torture! Trump is very conventional. He has nothing new when it comes to serious ideas.”
    Great post

    Trump is "anti-Establishment" because he doesn't have to answer to "their" establishment. He will just establish his own version.
    The wisdom of Swordy:

    On bringing the troops home
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    They are coming home, all the naysayers said they would never leave Syria and then they said they were going to stay in Iraq forever.

    It won't take very long to get them home but it won't be overnight either but Iraq says they can't stay and they are coming home just like Trump said.

    On fighting corruption:
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Trump had to donate the "right way" and hang out with the "right people" in order to do business in NYC and Hollyweird and in order to investigate and expose them.
    Fascism Defined

  17. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Peace&Freedom View Post
    You have not established your absolutist contention that "Trump is not pro-liberty on any front," as has been repeatedly pointed out, thus continuing to blow off conditions 2 and 3 is retarded. Your approach is actually a prescription for only pursuing one losing educational liberty campaign after another to the end of time, that never gets to satisfy conditions 2 and 3, plain and simple.
    +1
    I remember in 2008 when many members left because the purists like all cultist sects purge people who don't exactly fit their point of view.

    Look at how they put my post down. Some are even neg repping some of my posts randomly. CPUd 2.0 even argues Mods should remove the reputation of members he as sole judge deems anti liberty. Yeah for free speech!

    Again, as I said in several previous posts. This forum is infested with Hillary CTR people. It is a fact since Rand Paul was deemed a high threat. They even buy Supporter Badges with Hillary money. Circle Jerking their reputation.

    Stay Strong. For Liberty!

  18. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Todd View Post
    Great post

    Trump is "anti-Establishment" because he doesn't have to answer to "their" establishment. He will just establish his own version.
    like the Purist Establishment that some have established over here?

  19. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    Again, as I said in several previous posts. This forum is infested with Hillary CTR people. It is a fact since Rand Paul was deemed a high threat. They even buy Supporter Badges with Hillary money. Circle Jerking their reputation.
    Like most allegations of shilling, this doesn't make any sense. Even if Rand Paul were deemed a high threat, he stopped being at all a threat in the very early days of the primary. Given the level of traffic on the forum, I find it very hard to believe that anyone is spending money shilling on this forum. Someplace with more eyeballs, like reddit, you'd have a slightly better (but still ad hominem) argument.

    Instead, what is actually happening is that you're so firmly entrenched in your political bubble that you find it unbelievable that people could genuinely disagree with you.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Pinochet is the model
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Liberty preserving authoritarianism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Enforced internal open borders was one of the worst elements of the Constitution.

  20. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Like most allegations of shilling, this doesn't make any sense. Even if Rand Paul were deemed a high threat, he stopped being at all a threat in the very early days of the primary. Given the level of traffic on the forum, I find it very hard to believe that anyone is spending money shilling on this forum. Someplace with more eyeballs, like reddit, you'd have a slightly better (but still ad hominem) argument.

    Instead, what is actually happening is that you're so firmly entrenched in your political bubble that you find it unbelievable that people could genuinely disagree with you.
    I am a strategic guy. I smell shills too. You are not a shill Count. You are a smart ass. But I have high confidence that a few members I identified are shilling for Hillary covertly, a few remaining here for the fun of it.

    It is very easy for a few smart people to brigade a forum. They could also just be honing their skills. If Trump loses, Rand might become a threat again.

  21. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Like most allegations of shilling, this doesn't make any sense. Even if Rand Paul were deemed a high threat, he stopped being at all a threat in the very early days of the primary. Given the level of traffic on the forum, I find it very hard to believe that anyone is spending money shilling on this forum. Someplace with more eyeballs, like reddit, you'd have a slightly better (but still ad hominem) argument.

    Instead, what is actually happening is that you're so firmly entrenched in your political bubble that you find it unbelievable that people could genuinely disagree with you.
    Someone please check this member for PED, he has been making a lot of sense today.

  22. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    +1

    Again, as I said in several previous posts. This forum is infested with Hillary CTR people. It is a fact since Rand Paul was deemed a high threat. They even buy Supporter Badges with Hillary money. Circle Jerking their reputation.
    I wouldn't be surprised if they had some folks here during the primary. But now? Rand is an afterthought, you think they're still paying people to mess with him?


    And for the record, I have had at least a half dozen accusations leveled at me of being CTR, Israeli Intelligence, a troll, etc, just for having slightly more moderate opinions than many others here. As far as I know, though, I am not a paid shill.
    The more prohibitions you have,
    the less virtuous people will be.
    The more weapons you have,
    the less secure people will be.
    The more subsidies you have,
    the less self-reliant people will be.

    Therefore the Master says:
    I let go of the law,
    and people become honest.
    I let go of economics,
    and people become prosperous.
    I let go of religion,
    and people become serene.
    I let go of all desire for the common good,
    and the good becomes common as grass.

    -Tao Te Ching, Section 57

  23. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Peace&Freedom View Post
    You have not established your absolutist contention that "Trump is not pro-liberty on any front," as has been repeatedly pointed out, thus continuing to blow off conditions 2 and 3 is retarded. Your approach is actually a prescription for only pursuing one losing educational liberty campaign after another to the end of time, that never gets to satisfy conditions 2 and 3, plain and simple.
    You forget that Rev3 advocates world government.
    ================
    Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.

    Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America

    The Property Basis of Rights



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  25. #81
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...086_story.html
    Washington Post
    The Latest: Trump pledges to stand with law enforcement

    Donald Trump is pledging to “stand with” the men and women of law enforcement, saying they “have not been appreciated” by the current administration.

    Trump addressed about two dozen law enforcement and rescue officers Monday at the sheriff’s office in St. Johns County, Florida.

    The Republican nominee said that while “every profession has a bad person,” too much was made of isolated incidents of police misconduct.

    Trump suggested that “you could have 100,000 wonderful events” but the press “would only write” about mistakes.

    Trump vowed to empower the law enforcement officers with whatever support they needed.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  26. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    If Rand doesn't come out in support of Trump,

    Rand can kiss his career good bye. It is too easy to come out when the sun shines, good weather calculating politician.

    How can ANYBODY accept what Hillary Campaign did??????? It is an OUTRAGE!!!! And the press is silent. Every single repubs should be talking about the Okeefe video in support of Trump.
    Rand already endorsed Trump and has not walked back that endorsement. What the hell else do you want? Sheesh. Rand deserves better than the "support" he gets on this forum sometimes. Trump never should have been the nominee in the first place.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  27. #83
    Banned


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    Quote Originally Posted by Spikender View Post
    Ron Paul was a lone voice many times in the House fighting packs of wolves and media whores his entire decades-long career, and you have the gall to be angry at him? If not for him, most of us wouldn't even be on this site or we wouldn't have been "red-pilled".

    Whether you support Trump or not, there's no need to bash Ron Paul on a site named after him. Granted, I am open to criticism of anyone, including Ron Paul, but you need to take a step back and look at what Ron Paul did during his career. Sure, he didn't make a lot of headway, but many times he was a lone wolf trying his best to educate the masses. Trump is a different man with a different strategy. No need to $#@! on Ron at all.
    Nobody bashed Ron Paul.

  28. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    You forget that Rev3 advocates world government.
    You mean Trump advocates world government?

    "We will have to leave borders behind and go for global unity when it comes to financial stability."

  29. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    You mean Trump advocates world government?
    Trump doesn't.

    You are probably CTR with a perfect join date of 2015 and circle jerking Reputation. Bryan should investigate who gave you that rep. Because I don't see much facts and see much Trump bashing from the books of those worms living in /r/politics

  30. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    Trump doesn't.

    You are probably CTR with a perfect join date of 2015 and circle jerking Reputation. Bryan should investigate who gave you that rep. Because I don't see much facts and see much Trump bashing from the books of those worms living in /r/politics
    Yes please report, I've already reported you for schilling for Trump but maybe if I get banned I won't have to report people who schill for Trump anymore.

  31. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Yes please report, I've already reported you for schilling for Trump but maybe if I get banned I won't have to report people who schill for Trump anymore.
    I am shilling for the rule of law.

  32. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    I am shilling for the rule of law.
    If RPF is going to advocate for authoritarians who advocate for stop and frisk then I hope I do get banned.

    “Basically, they will, if they see — you know, they are proactive and if they see a person possibly with a gun or they think may have a gun, they will see the person, and they will look, and they will take the gun away,” Trump said in an interview with "Fox and Friends."“They will stop, they will frisk, and they will take the gun away, and they don’t have anything to shoot with.”



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  34. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    If RPF is going to advocate for authoritarians who advocate for stop and frisk then I hope I do get banned.
    This was discussed at length already. Nobody is advocating anything like that.

    Keep showing CTR behavior. Deflect and obfuscate.

  35. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordan View Post
    If its creaks like a frog, it probably is a frog



    Tell me. All that political capital Ron Paul accumulated over the years. He lost it when quitting the GOP. I am enraged at him.. feels like yelling at him while he was caving to the GOP corrupted ways. Trump IS new to politics. He learns like we were red pilled one at a time.
    You can always tell the Trumpets by their complete ignorance of liberty and the Constitution.

    Lobbying is a constitutional right. As per the First Amendment to the US Constitution:

    "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

    Lobbyists just petition government on behalf of their employers. They are not evil. On the other hand proposing a law that would effectively trample the right to petition and prohibiting people from speaking freely because of a job they held? That is certainly evil. You know what Jefferson had to say about people like that, right?

    From the Declaration of Independence:

    "In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Prince, whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people."

    Violating the right to petition government is the characteristic of a tyrant and makes you unfit to lead a free people.
    Last edited by PierzStyx; 10-25-2016 at 12:04 PM.

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