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Thread: Is the Adult Male Virgin Society’s Last Taboo?

  1. #1

    Is the Adult Male Virgin Society’s Last Taboo?

    https://goodmenproject.com/ethics-va...last-taboo-dg/

    January 18, 2016 by Harry Siva



    The words “adult virgin male” perhaps evoke the caricature of an overweight, socially awkward figure, heavy into gaming and confined to the solace of his mother’s basement.

    In what appears to be the obverse situation to “slut-shaming” females for high sexual activity, the heterosexual adult virgin male is seemingly mocked for his sexual inactivity. He’s definitely not cool.

    ◊♦◊

    According to a large study by the National Center for Health Statistics, the mean age at which someone in the US has sexual intercourse is about 17 years old. To reach a quarter of a century with one’s virginity still intact is to enter a domain shared by only two percent of other US males (and three percent of females.) This is an achievement that, within academic circles, sometimes attracts the moniker “adult virgin,” but within wider popular culture, often invites more disparaging terms.

    From countless teen movies to comments on online forums, the adult virgin male is branded as a bit of a loser. While female virginity may still retain some virtue in modern western society, male virginity certainly does not.

    Such stigma is likely entwined with unhelpful notions of masculinity, where a man’s worth is equated with his perceived “ability” to have sex. I use the term “ability” here, not in the sense of a person’s physical capacity to have sex. Rather, I am referring to having the perceived confidence, personality, looks, social nous and whatever other seemingly elusive factor that is necessary to attract a sexual partner in the first place. To have failed to have sex with a woman is an inability to embody these qualities, which in turn is a failure to be a man.

    ◊♦◊

    Indeed, the logic and vernacular of professional pick-up artists (PUAs) suggests that men who bed multiple women “demonstrate higher value.” They’re the sought-after “alpha males”[1] with something to offer society. They have high social status. Reasoned this way, the adult man who has not even slept with one woman, let alone multiple women, is the “beta male”. He has low social status. He is a male of little value.

    As social animals, sensitive to hierarchy, humans do not react well when devalued by society. The adult virgin male is no different.
    Such devaluation of the sexually inactive man (but not woman) is also plausibly a by-product of the gendered dynamics of dating. According to their “sexual economics theory”, psychologists Roy Baumeister and Kathleen Voh suggest sex is “essentially a female resource.” Men demand it; women supply it. In the resulting marketplace then, men will trade financial, social and emotional resources in exchange for sex.

    Fancy gifts, high social status, a shoulder to cry on – from an economic perspective, these are all offered by men in return for sexual gratification. But, a man unable to get laid is one who wields little power in the sexual economy. He’s been outbid for sex by his more valuable male opponents. Like the wistful entrepreneur with little cash, the adult virgin male is spurned by the free market of dating.

    ◊♦◊

    As social animals, sensitive to hierarchy, humans do not react well when devalued by society. The adult virgin male is no different. He may experience what psychologist Paul Gilbert dubs “defea”’: a sense of powerlessness, failed struggle and a perceived loss of social rank. Defeat has been linked to thoughts of suicide, a link that becomes apparent when perusing discussions in the online havens of adult virgin males.

    “I would rather die than have to be alone for another second” “I feel so unwanted” “Going to kill myself, cannot take this anymore”
    Countless threads with comparably sombre titles litter ForeverAlone – a subreddit where virginal males come to vent their frustration, lament their lack of intimacy with women and seek solace in their shared experience of loneliness.

    Similar online forums were frequented by Elliot Rodgers; the 22-year-old virgin shooter who killed six students in Isla Vista in what he claimed was “retribution” for the “injustice” of “girls (who) never desired (him) back.”

    Sexual frustration and loneliness quickly morph into self-loathing. They notice they’re different from the vast majority of other people their age, people who have had some sexual experience.
    Yet, where the misogynistic Rodgers displaced his ire onto innocent people around him, other adult virgin males turn inwards on themselves. Sexual frustration and loneliness quickly morph into self-loathing. They notice they’re different from the vast majority of other people their age, people who have had some sexual experience. They feel alienated and inferior to these “normies” – as they often designate this out-group of non-virginal, coupled-up people. Alas, dividing people in this way, based solely on sexual experience, only serves to heighten their sense of alienation and increase their self-loathing.

    The adult virgin male will naturally question why he’s different. Why does everyone else get laid and have relationships while he struggles? Several are quick to pin their prolonged virginity on immutable factors such as looks, height, or the apparent pickiness of women. Wilkes McDermid, a food blogger who leapt to his death citing his difficulties having romantic relationships, wrote the following in his final blog entry:

    “Height, power/money and race seem to be the determining factors in human attractiveness for women. I’ve lived with this for all my life, I am 37 right now so should I just suffer for another 37 years?”
    People like McDermid think they are resolutely fated to be, as the title of the subreddit suggests, forever alone.

    ◊♦◊

    That said, many adult virgin males do make a concerted effort to increase their likelihood of having sex. Online dating, bulking up at the gym, buying fashionable clothes, joining hobby groups – they’ll try them all. When none of these seem to lead to relationships or sex, however, the adult virgin male starts to despair.

    Again, to adopt the psychological lingo, he may feel a sense of entrapment: a perception that his circumstances are uncontrollable and impossible to change. As one ForeverAlone poster puts it,

    “I feel like I have so much to offer. But life just always kicks me in the ass. Why get back up again when I’ve been knocked down so many times? At some point I feel like it’s time to call it quits.”

    It is this perceived lack of contingency between one’s actions and their ability to have sex that leads many adult virgin males to define themselves as “involuntarily celibate” or “Incel.” Never having had sex is not the most depressing issue, per se. Rather, it’s the continued inability to access sex when one wants it.

    Ah, but doesn’t this reek of entitlement? Surely no one, man or woman, is entitled to sate the desire to have sex, whenever one wants, however one wants and with whomever one wants?

    On describing Elliot Rodgers, feminist commentators were quick to rightfully criticize his sense of entitlement to sex and male entitlement more broadly. It’s true; no one is owed sex.

    But now, vicariously at least, the adult virgin male finds himself lambasted from two fronts. On one side, pick-up artists denigrate his low value, lack of masculinity and inability to get laid. On the other side, feminists fault his sense of entitlement in wanting to get laid in the first place. Quite naturally, the adult virgin male internalizes these viewpoints and feels a profound sense of shame.

    Ironically, the sexual economics theory outlined earlier predicts that adult male virgins and feminists ought to be on the same page. According to this theory, greater gender parity leads to more sex for everyone (would-be adult virgin males included). Allow me to elaborate.

    Indeed studies show that people from more gender equal countries such as Sweden, Finland and Norway, have more sexual partners, more casual sex and lose their virginity earlier. Adult male virgins then, ought to be ardent feminists.
    Women, as suppliers under this theory, exchange sex in return for financial, political and social resources from men. By restricting men’s access to sex, they can command a greater price for it – marriage, long-term financial and emotional investment: in short, more resources. In a society where these resources are distributed equally between the sexes, however, women will rely less on sex in exchange for wealth, power, education etc.

    ◊♦◊

    Given that sex is enjoyable for both women and men, the former will be less incentivized to restrict access to sex. Put crudely, they will “put out” more easily. Indeed studies show that people from more gender equal countries such as Sweden, Finland and Norway, have more sexual partners, more casual sex and lose their virginity earlier. Adult male virgins then, ought to be ardent feminists.

    Alas, a cursory glance at their online refuges at first often reveals a breeding ground of misogyny and bitterness. But probe deeper and you’ll find that the adult virgin male is suffering from what Thomas Wolfe described as “the central and inevitable fact of human existence” – loneliness. The frustrated, suicidal and admittedly self-pitying posts of ForeverAlone are merely the distress signals of the lonely.

    Their species of loneliness is one that results from never having been kissed, never having had sex, never having sated a fundamental desire that has been hardwired by thousands of years of evolution. Like all of us, the adult virgin male craves intimacy and acceptance. So, while not entitled to sex, surely he’s entitled to some sympathy?






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  3. #2
    I don't think those stats are true
    __________________________________________________ ________________
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  4. #3
    I am proud of the fact that the only person I have ever have had sex with is my wife. I pity the rest of you.

  5. #4
    Most women seem to rather have sex with guys who are abusive or disloyal than a nice, responsible, yet somewhat socially awkward male.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by PierzStyx View Post
    I am proud of the fact that the only person I have ever have had sex with is my wife. I pity the rest of you.
    That's not what the article is about.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Most women seem to rather have sex with guys who are abusive or disloyal than a nice, responsible, yet somewhat socially awkward male.
    Who says this place is predictable?
    Genuine, willful, aggressive ignorance is the one sure way to tick me off. I wish I could say you were trolling. I know better, and it's just sad.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by MelissaWV View Post
    Who says this place is predictable?
    Well things haven't really changed on this front in the last 10-15 years.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Well things haven't really changed on this front in the last 10-15 years.
    Nor have the responses to your observation, honestly, so we should just pretend we already hashed it all out

    * * *

    As for the OP, the big excuse I hear a lot for grown people not in a relationship is a lack of time. They don't want to invest time in getting to know someone, or in spending time with someone. I'm not talking decades of deep philosophical discussion. I mean that they would rather just walk up to the woman of their choice and get a yes or no on the spot, which they could then instantly cash in. This goes for the other side of the coin, too. People want what they want and they want it instantly, with as little effort as possible. So when I hear someone who wants to be a non-virgin and still is one at 25-30, it screams that they do not want to put forth any effort at all. That's bad on a micro scale (do you want to have sex with someone who makes you do all the work?) all the way to a macro one (if you wind up married, good luck with someone who thought of getting to know you as a terrible chore).

    There IS a stigma... just like people wonder about you if you've had three failed marriages, or if you're grown and working in fast food, or if you were in jail for some time, or live with your parents, or dropped out of HS, etc.. It's not that they automatically make you a bad person on their own. It's that they send up caution flags.
    Genuine, willful, aggressive ignorance is the one sure way to tick me off. I wish I could say you were trolling. I know better, and it's just sad.



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  11. #9
    I think the intentional adult virgin male is someone to be admired. Being sexually active is something that requires a lot of maturity. It's a fact that men mature later than women.
    #NashvilleStrong

    “I’m a doctor. That’s a baby.”~~~Dr. Manny Sethi

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    That's not what the article is about.
    I would like for everyone to know I am OK without any pity.

  13. #11
    There was a reason in Orwell's 1984, sex was prohibited and propagandized against.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    There was a reason in Orwell's 1984, sex was prohibited and propagandized against.
    Ayn Rand's Anthem shared a similar view, where the men were taken to a Breeding House to mate once a year with fertile females. State's choice, naturally.


    As for the op's question:
    Is the Adult Male Virgin Society’s Last Taboo?
    I hope not.

  15. #13
    Men who have reached a quarter century ARE supposed to have had sex.
    They're also supposed to be married and have sired three children already.
    There are no crimes against people.
    There are only crimes against the state.
    And the state will never, ever choose to hold accountable its agents, because a thing can not commit a crime against itself.

  16. #14
    Pfizer Macht Frei!

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  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    Ayn Rand's Anthem shared a similar view, where the men were taken to a Breeding House to mate once a year with fertile females. State's choice, naturally.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  18. #16
    Lost me at taboo.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
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  20. #17
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    pick-up artists denigrate his low value, lack of masculinity and inability to get laid.
    They are trying to help these guys. That is why they denigrate them. Virgins need to denigrate themselves until they figure out their life is unacceptable, and they need to change, or die a depressed mess.

    And I say this as somebody who had girlfriends, but did not actually have sex with them until I was 24. Because I was STUPID. I was raised on a bunch of ideological BULL$#@! about love, sex, and women.

    It isn't society that makes men feel like they should be having sex. It is genetics, and it is a very powerful drive. So anybody trying to blame society or women or pick up artists for their feelings of inadequacy needs a wake up call. Like a drill sergeant, not like a coddling mommy.
    Last edited by UWDude; 10-13-2016 at 03:07 PM.

  21. #18

  22. #19
    @Danke - Video removed, got another?

    ---

    As social animals, sensitive to hierarchy, humans do not react well when devalued by society.
    That quote right there says why Men are having problems in ALL categories, not just sex, but also including Economic Status which usually extends itself to Jobs, Political, Community, Family, and other various organizations. We can't all be Alpha Males. I meet far too many Betas every day. They just bow their heads and let other people continue to $#@! on them, or if they get into any sort of position with the Illusion of Power, such as Manager at McDonalds, that power goes straight to their heads and they become abusive with that power. They have been $#@! on so much, they think it is expected of them to $#@! on others. This creates a Societal Behavior Loop which is learned and reinforced. Fixed Habit of Reaction to Authority, as stated by John Taylor Gatto. The end result is the men become literally Disposable, and the consequences on the fabric of society is that these men will call for others to protect them, but wont lift a finger to do the protecting. That leaves the entire country vulnerable.
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