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Successful movements do or have the following things:
1. Clear hierarchy
2. Effective leadership
3. Tangible goals
4. Good strategy
5. A willingness to make alliances to accomplish said goals
6. Unity
Libertarians don't have any of those things, they fail on account of it. The alt-right actually ticked a lot of those boxes on twitter. Their leaders were people like Ricky Vaughn, their goal was to elect Trump and their strategy was memetics. It worked well, and their influence was felt outside their rather low numbers
However, since moving to the real world, they've revealed they lack all of those things outside of the online realm. All eyes were on Richard Spencer and the NPI, and what did they do? They do a speech where he says "hail Trump" and in response, a bunch of people do the Nazi salute which he later calls "ironic". Now, I understand that the media was never going to treat Spencer fairly, but he basically gave them all they needed to discredit him wrapped in a little bow. At least make them work for it, for God's sake. Groups like the NPI have said that they want to emerge from the shadows and function like a real lobby. If that's the case, Spencer needs to get about 1000% better immediately, or they need to replace him with an actually competent representative.
Moreover, with Trump's election, the infighting in the alt-right is starting to put libertarians to shame.
-Vox Day splits the movement into the "alt-right", "alt-lite" and "alt-west". People come out and accuse him of being an entryist who's watering down the movement.
-Milo Yiannopolous gives the alt-right an exceedingly fair (if a little rose-tinted and moderate) hearing on Breitbart, and has never actually called himself alt-right. The thanks he gets are accusations of being a degenerate, miscegenating "false flagger" who's bad for the movement. With friends like these, who needs enemies?
-The actual neo-Nazis in the movement claim that the alt-right is a Nazi movement and anyone who claims otherwise is a Johnny-come-lately posers.
Infighting like this destroys a movement and so does the desire to insulate oneself from allies in order to be "edgy".
The lack of libertarian success is the failure.More over Libertarians have never succeed to begin with, so how can they have failed?
I largely agree with the alt-right on IQ, immigration and race (though many over-emphasize the importance).Also the Libertarians deny the impact of cultural, values, genes, IQ and immigration, the Alt right does not deny the, in fact we understand, accept, and have them as hallmarks of policy.
NeoReactionary. American High Tory.
The counter-revolution will not be televised.
I completely understand and sympathize with the alt right when it comes to immigration policy and I think their message is very important in these times. But, what I don't understand is the need for controlling immigration in a libertarian society. I think that when there are no public schools, no subsidized health care, no welfare state, no anti-discrimination laws, e.t.c. there is no need for controlling immigration, because if you look at it from a libertarian perspective, a restriction on immigration is a restriction on people's liberties to live where they want as long as they aren't violating other people's property rights.
Last edited by kocbftn; 12-02-2016 at 09:20 PM.
The alt-right is negative image of the Tumblrina. Most of them are kids who can't even vote.
Trump won because Hillary sucks. 99.9% of them have no idea what the alt-right even is.
The best thing about the alt right is they're not afraid to $#@! on Israel in the mainstream.
Last edited by sylcfh; 12-03-2016 at 05:04 AM.
We are hitting well above our weight class...
However, since moving to the real world, they've revealed they lack all of those things outside of the online realm. All eyes were on Richard Spencer and the NPI, and what did they do? They do a speech where he says "hail Trump" and in response, a bunch of people do the Nazi salute which he later calls "ironic". Now, I understand that the media was never going to treat Spencer fairly, but he basically gave them all they needed to discredit him wrapped in a little bow. At least make them work for it, for God's sake. Groups like the NPI have said that they want to emerge from the shadows and function like a real lobby. If that's the case, Spencer needs to get about 1000% better immediately, or they need to replace him with an actually competent representative.
The media was never/is never going to treat anyone fairly.
Keep in mind the media has less and less credibility day by day. Spencer? He could have said anything and they would paint him as a Nazi.
Spencer learned a lesson, do not go too big to fast, scale up in stages.
Moreover, with Trump's election, the infighting in the alt-right is starting to put libertarians to shame.
-Vox Day splits the movement into the "alt-right", "alt-lite" and "alt-west". People come out and accuse him of being an entryist who's watering down the movement.
-Milo Yiannopolous gives the alt-right an exceedingly fair (if a little rose-tinted and moderate) hearing on Breitbart, and has never actually called himself alt-right. The thanks he gets are accusations of being a degenerate, miscegenating "false flagger" who's bad for the movement. With friends like these, who needs enemies?
-The actual neo-Nazis in the movement claim that the alt-right is a Nazi movement and anyone who claims otherwise is a Johnny-come-lately posers.
Infighting like this destroys a movement and so does the desire to insulate oneself from allies in order to be "edgy".
Everyone movement has this, we are trying to fight against half the GOP and the entire DNC, so it goes without saying many people have other ideas, tactics, methods on how to do this, achieve our goals, etc.
I thought it was the fact they are reality detached loons who think allowing in people who vote against them, dis/replace them is some how not a threat because they view all of humanity from a single view point?The lack of libertarian success is the failure.
Good to know..I largely agree with the alt-right on IQ, immigration and race (though many over-emphasize the importance).
Because if you do not control it it will be used to import voters by and for your political enemies as a means to import voters, to capitalize politically on the chaos they produce.
American had No such things in the beginning, we allowed in hordes of people who supported such ideas and voted them into law.
Well mass immigration effects wages, cost of living, crime, terrorism, voting/elections, etc in the REAL WORLD (where we live).
True, we go for blood, lies, hypocrisy, double standards, etc.
[QUOTEsylcfh;6376243]Because none of those things have to do with the state, or the role of government(except immigration).[/QUOTE]
Wrong, it does. What happens when you import low IQ Somalian into a nation with a mean IQ of 100?
Do you have proof Somalis have low IQs? They seem pretty smart learning and networking to maximize aid from our welfare system.
Last edited by Danke; 12-04-2016 at 11:13 PM.
Pfizer Macht Frei!
Openly Straight Man, Danke, Awarded Top Rated Influencer. Community Standards Enforcer.
Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!
Short Income Tax Video
The Income Tax Is An Excise, And Excise Taxes Are Privilege Taxes
The Federalist Papers, No. 15:
Except as to the rule of appointment, the United States have an indefinite discretion to make requisitions for men and money; but they have no authority to raise either by regulations extending to the individual citizens of America.
Pfizer Macht Frei!
Openly Straight Man, Danke, Awarded Top Rated Influencer. Community Standards Enforcer.
Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!
Short Income Tax Video
The Income Tax Is An Excise, And Excise Taxes Are Privilege Taxes
The Federalist Papers, No. 15:
Except as to the rule of appointment, the United States have an indefinite discretion to make requisitions for men and money; but they have no authority to raise either by regulations extending to the individual citizens of America.
https://iq-research.info/en/page/ave...try/so-somalia
Thank you for proving my point, why import people who will need welfare their entire lives? More over how is being a parasite a sign of intelligence?
Wrong.
It is the mark of limited Government. Remember the system of the Founders setup for voting?
But hey scream "racist" or "fascist", its not a leftist tactic at all right? But its not like you can make the case about letting in people who will vote against you, right?
What's the most popular alt-right forum? Anyone know?
Surely The_Donald, by a couple orders of magnitude.
https://www.reddit.com/r/The_Donald
It's just a meme!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5uVnwA5zuM
Stop believing stupid things
Not for much longer, if you''re not careful.
I agree.The media was never/is never going to treat anyone fairly.
That's true, but that's all the more reason why you shouldn't make it so damn easy for them. Become undeniable. If you're being watched by your enemies don't give them exactly what they want. It ain't rocket science. Nazism is memetic cancer.Keep in mind the media has less and less credibility day by day. Spencer? He could have said anything and they would paint him as a Nazi.
Some people (Cernovich) are saying Spencer is an agent sent to destroy the alt-right. I don't buy this, but if he were, I can't think of one single thing he should have done differently, other than throwing the salute back.
>"We want to be a mainstream lobbying organization."
>"The media aren't people, but soulless golems."
>"Hail Trump!"
>*Audience Heils Trump*
>"It's the Roman Salute!"
>"It's ironic!"
>"It was Jews!"
Good, God, man. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot before the race even starts. It doesn't take the legacy media to put thoughts of brown shirts in people's heads, with guys like this. That's to say nothing about having degenerate MySpace sluts like Tila Tequila at a group meeting that is supposedly a serious political lobby with a bright future.
Has he, though? He had a chance to bring the alt-right into the mainstream and failed hard. You don't get a do-over at an opportunity like that. Mike Cernovich and the like are thinking long term, whereas Spencer has high-time-preference and an apparent ravenous desire for fame and notoriety.Spencer learned a lesson, do not go too big to fast, scale up in stages.
The alt-right needs to decide what kind of movement it's going to be. Do you want to be a memetically savvy right-populist movement that actually gets things accomplished, or do you want to be a movement of edgelords and $#@!posters on Reddit and Twitter? As I've said, the alt-right understands memetics, particularly online. That's a huge boon. No right wing movement before this has come close to this kind of memetic understanding. But the nature of the internet is to adapt quickly and have a very short memory. The alt-right is currently a novelty in the mainstream, and they're attracting a sort of shock-jock, "Did he say that? What'll he say next?" kind of audience. If you want Twitter followers or YouTube views, that's great. If you want to be successful in demotist society, it's not enough.Everyone movement has this, we are trying to fight against half the GOP and the entire DNC, so it goes without saying many people have other ideas, tactics, methods on how to do this, achieve our goals, etc.
No, that's not why libertarians failed. Being detached from reality never hurt any political movement. There are still Marxist/Leninists to this day. These people haven't even gotten around to post-Marxism FFS.I thought it was the fact they are reality detached loons who think allowing in people who vote against them, dis/replace them is some how not a threat because they view all of humanity from a single view point?
Libertarians failed because of a lack of leadership, a lack of realistic goals and infighting. "We don't need leaders, maaaaan! Leaders are for statists!" Lack of thede-awareness hurt libertarians, but the problems are far larger than that.
NeoReactionary. American High Tory.
The counter-revolution will not be televised.
The exclamations of Spencer would be PR failures if he was trying to break through positively within the legacy media, since he chose not to neuter himself with MSM cameras running. But we're at a point in media history where failing in the legacy media doesn't matter, because the MSM's influence is in eclipse. It's the self-defined mainstream that has been neutered, such that the alternative media can ignore the MSM to almost the same extent that it was ignored by them for years.
The new media no longer has to fail or succeed in making it in the legacy media, or meet it's approval, because it has passed it by. If the average CNN national audience at any given time is around 300,000, while Breitbart has over 30 million subscribers, exactly how does CNN get to control how Spencer et al get characterized? At this time, what that site reports about you is literally 100 times more crucial or influential than whatever Anderson Cooper says.
The same goes for "$#@!posters on Reddit and Twitter"---acknowledging and engaging other voices in the new media IS a key part of how the movement gets things done. Trump is President in large part because he became an edgelord, and banged out all those tweets. Many of the meme victories came from those comment exchanges, where the new narrative was won on a digital battlefield, in hand-to-hand/mouse-to-mouse combat. The infowar fight is now on a grassroots dominated playing field, not the elite dominated communications. The alt media simply does not have to 'clean up' its image to keep growing a era where it is the old media that is relatively untrusted and unlistened to.
Last edited by Peace&Freedom; 12-08-2016 at 03:01 PM.
-----Peace & Freedom, John Clifton-----
Blog: https://electclifton.wordpress.com/2...back-backlash/
I'm pretty sure this is 100% incorrect.
My view is that Trump won because WWC - who don't spend much time online at all - finally jettisoned the MSM narratives and went for the one guy who they (wrongly) perceived to be an "outsider". Trump won in rural rustbelt counties that had previously gone Blue. Those folks don't give a damn about "memetics", or tweets, or "infowars". They are tired of being portrayed as racist because they agree with the (elementary) notion of a national border. They are tired of being portrayed as bigoted because they don't like the idea of a man dressing up as a woman and using the women's restroom. And they bought what the snake oil salesman with the audacious blonde comb-over sold them.
Frankly, the alt-right had little to do with it, from my view. And that's a good thing, because those folks are gross.
True, we must play things smart but not hesitate, hesitation equals a headshot.
Great, so lets smash them, maybe limit their power via slander laws.I agree.
If anything positive can come out, we got tens of millions of dollars of free coverage, then again the media has been screaming "The Nazis are coming, The Nazis are coming!" for so long it just might be another nail in the coffin.That's true, but that's all the more reason why you shouldn't make it so damn easy for them. Become undeniable. If you're being watched by your enemies don't give them exactly what they want. It ain't rocket science. Nazism is memetic cancer.
Some people (Cernovich) are saying Spencer is an agent sent to destroy the alt-right. I don't buy this, but if he were, I can't think of one single thing he should have done differently, other than throwing the salute back.
>"We want to be a mainstream lobbying organization."
>"The media aren't people, but soulless golems."
>"Hail Trump!"
>*Audience Heils Trump*
>"It's the Roman Salute!"
>"It's ironic!"
>"It was Jews!"
Good, God, man. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot before the race even starts. It doesn't take the legacy media to put thoughts of brown shirts in people's heads, with guys like this. That's to say nothing about having degenerate MySpace sluts like Tila Tequila at a group meeting that is supposedly a serious political lobby with a bright future.
It was a laps in judgement, the idea this one act is not going to sink us. If anything the "mainstreaming" will happen sooner as the cucksertivies will try and stop/slow down Trump.Has he, though? He had a chance to bring the alt-right into the mainstream and failed hard. You don't get a do-over at an opportunity like that. Mike Cernovich and the like are thinking long term, whereas Spencer has high-time-preference and an apparent ravenous desire for fame and notoriety.
Factor in the total melt down of the DNC (whites fleeing (not just working class but more and more middle/upper middle class), "radicals" like Eilson driving out the Zionists, in fighting (gays vs Muslim, Whites vs non Whites, Blacks vs Hispanics, etc)) and we will look better and better as we have a better message of a bright future...
1) The social contract, institutions and culture in White countries is breaking down. We are the only ones who are willing to restore it even if that means doing so by methods that "upset" or "offend" others.
2) The economic situation globally and in White Countries is heading for an ugly reset.
3) It is growing because people more intelligent and with more common sense than you can see these problems. The key is we can now see the people we thought we could trust blocking even discussion of these problems let alone their solutions.
Alot of people, indoctrinated in left wing ideology and multi-culti since a child are rejecting it as soon as we get into the real world (outside school and college). That's what happens when we realise we are the target.
4) Through the rapid expansion of competing ideas and analysis on the Alt-Right it will become the only group that is capable of offering solutions to the first two problems. We are also the only group that will follow through in implementing these solutions.
5) We only need to win once
Any tips, advice?The alt-right needs to decide what kind of movement it's going to be. Do you want to be a memetically savvy right-populist movement that actually gets things accomplished, or do you want to be a movement of edgelords and $#@!posters on Reddit and Twitter? As I've said, the alt-right understands memetics, particularly online. That's a huge boon. No right wing movement before this has come close to this kind of memetic understanding. But the nature of the internet is to adapt quickly and have a very short memory. The alt-right is currently a novelty in the mainstream, and they're attracting a sort of shock-jock, "Did he say that? What'll he say next?" kind of audience. If you want Twitter followers or YouTube views, that's great. If you want to be successful in demotist society, it's not enough.
Considering we are making decades worth of gains, actions, effects in just a few years, we are making up for lost time, and having to fight a muti pronged war. Against the entire Democartic Party, Half of the GOP (cucks, Establishment, Neo cons, etc). The media is dying fast so that is a plus.
We are having some growth pains, this is normal and was going to happen no matter what.
It was Libertarians that did them in, also the idea that allowing in people to the nation to vote against them clearly did not/will never help them.No, that's not why libertarians failed. Being detached from reality never hurt any political movement. There are still Marxist/Leninists to this day. These people haven't even gotten around to post-Marxism FFS.
Libertarians failed because of a lack of leadership, a lack of realistic goals and infighting. "We don't need leaders, maaaaan! Leaders are for statists!" Lack of thede-awareness hurt libertarians, but the problems are far larger than that.
You left out Entryism by the left as a reason why they failed. They had some leadership Rothbard/Hoppe, etc but they were pushed out by entryist leftists.
Bravo....The media demonizing us does not effect it, if anything it proves us right in the context of "if they hate us, me must be the good guys".
They have some pull, but a smaller and smaller effect..
Who would have thought calling people "racist, bigot, homophobic, Islamophobic, backwards, "poor educated" w outsourcing their jobs, dumping hordes of 3rd worlders around them, taxing them more and more, and working to disarm them would result in them voting against you?
Really? Not even in office and you know this? So what are the Powerball Numbers?
Really? How are we "gross"? Because we understand that not everyone values the same things and does not have the same potential.
Uh, I was disputing this notion:
I thought that would have been obvious since - you know - I quoted it.Trump is President in large part because he became an edgelord, and banged out all those tweets. Many of the meme victories came from those comment exchanges, where the new narrative was won on a digital battlefield, in hand-to-hand/mouse-to-mouse combat.
Correct. You're detestable because you peddle in identity politics. Bear in mind, I don't particularly care if one holds such views independently. Where it becomes a problem is when people activate those views politically.Really? How are we "gross"? Because we understand that not everyone values the same things and does not have the same potential.
This is what the seven alt-right accounts have been up to:
@FashyGoyMemes
Praise Kek! [insert meme]
@DethtooCUCKS
thisis unifar! i hav 2 go scool when TRUMP becoms prsiednt, my mom wont let me stay ohme
@EdgyGoyim
[insert picture of Pepe holding a Jude star]
@WhiteGirlsRMagic
[insert picture of white woman with MAGA hat]
@ AlphaMale88
Im not grounded anymore, now I can live tweet the Trump inoguratian!!!
@ProudNorseman
i will avenge Richard Spencer! Here is my hammer!
@AryanGirl
[insert picture of herself dressed in a revealing women's Nazi uniform (made in Japan)]
Stop believing stupid things
If I wanted to I could make a post just like your's with Ron Paul supporters and their pathetic tweets.
Nah, nevermind tweets.
Ken Sorenson, paid to support Ron Paul, sentenced to 15 months in prison. $25,000 of our donations were given to him to switch from Bachmann to Paul.
Maybe that doesn't bother you.
Kent Sorenson, the best Ron Paul money can buy, not only wanted welfare recipients to pass drug tests, he also opposed letting medical marijuana even reach the floor in Iowa to be voted on. Of course, he was arrested for marijuana when younger. Of course he failed drug tests 3 times for marijuana after being found guilty for taking Ron Paul's payoff. He'll do 15 months in prison and probably take any weed smuggled to him along with prison hooch but remember, he did not support legalizing marijuana even for medical use.
http://www.desmoinesregister.com/sto...risy/19088101/
$25,000 down the drain and nothing to show for it. Especially no principles.
The alt right memed trump into the presidency and we did jack $#@!.
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