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Thread: The US Has Screwed Up in the Muslim World for 36 Years

  1. #1

    The US Has Screwed Up in the Muslim World for 36 Years

    Beginning with the Carter Doctrine, the US has aggressively injected itself into the Muslim world but with little to show for it besides a record of misunderstanding, hubris, and failure.

    In America’s War for the Greater Middle East, Andrew J. Bacevich, one of our most eloquent and incisive students of American foreign policy, military history, and the often-vexed nexus between the two, makes a startling claim: For the last 36 years, the United States has been engaged in an ill-advised, counterproductive struggle to shape the destiny of the Muslim world—not only in the Middle East proper, but in Southwest Asia, North and East Africa, and the Balkans as well.

    Like Vietnam, this has been an undeclared war that started off small, and escalated in fits and starts into a major conflict. Like Vietnam, it has been poorly understood by policymakers, senior military officers, and the American public.

    And like Vietnam, it is a doomed undertaking, with tragic implications.

    Since the early ’80s, in “almost imperceptible increments,” the American military’s center of gravity has shifted from the plains of Europe, where it was deployed to fend off a Soviet attack against Western Europe, to the Middle East. After the 9/11 attacks, the conflict expanded exponentially, driven by invidious delusions about the efficacy of American military power, and a hubristic belief that the world’s only “indispensable nation” has both the right and the obligation to remake the region over in our own image.

    Trouble is, millions of people in the Islamic world have rejected out of hand Western multiculturalism and the values of democracy and rule of law we see as universal, and seek to impose on them. They have come to see the United States not as an ally seeking to help them liberate themselves from repressive strongmen, economic dysfunction, and chronic instability, but as an imperialist purveyor of wantonness and materialism, bent on world hegemony.

    Despite having been heavily engaged in the region’s geopolitics for 35 years, we remain deplorably ignorant of the region’s peoples and cultures, and continue to pursue political policies and military strategies in the region that exacerbate rather than diminish the region’s myriad difficulties. And we squander precious American lives and resources that should be devoted to far more urgent concerns here at home.
    Bacevich’s book, in addition to providing a thought-provoking and penetrating account of the evolution of an ultimately futile conflict, is also a passionate plea to a self-absorbed American public to awake from their slumber, reflect seriously on what their leaders are doing in their name in the Islamic world, and force them to bring an end to the project.
    Read more: http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...-36-years.html



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  3. #2
    36 years?

    I think it is closer to 70 years.
    Long before Mr Carter.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  4. #3
    And some people think that after our thrashing their countries, killing their families, making them homeless, they'll move here and be happy Americans

  5. #4
    Much longer than that.

  6. #5
    Yep and Islam have been screwing up the Muslim world for 1000's
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it."
    James Madison

    "It does not take a majority to prevail ... but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." - Samuel Adams



    Μολὼν λάβε
    Dum Spiro, Pugno
    Tu ne cede malis sed contra audentior ito

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    36 years?

    I think it is closer to 70 years.
    Long before Mr Carter.
    In 1953 we helped overthrow Iran's democratically elected PM.

    We were also helping the UK & France in messing with the ME and Africa long before that.
    There is no spoon.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by puppetmaster View Post
    Yep and Islam have been screwing up the Muslim world for 1000's

    So did the crusades.

    People have been screwing since the fall.
    The most important element of a free society, where individual rights are held in the highest esteem, is the rejection of the initiation of violence.

    RON PAUL







  9. #8
    Conflict goes back centuries.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Conflict goes back centuries.
    Nope..
    It goes back to 1948,, and the creation of the State of Israel. (even further if you count Zionist aggression and terrorism).
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Nope..
    It goes back to 1948,, and the creation of the State of Israel. (even further if you count Zionist aggression and terrorism).
    Balfour Declaration - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balfour_Declaration

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    In 1953 we helped overthrow Iran's democratically elected PM.

    We were also helping the UK & France in messing with the ME and Africa long before that.

    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Nope..
    It goes back to 1948,, and the creation of the State of Israel. (even further if you count Zionist aggression and terrorism).
    Good points.


    Photo Essay: Crash course on origins of Al Qaeda

    Afghanistan in 1970s before the US intervention with Saudi/Israeli help:


    Click here to view the original image of 800x507px.







    And then came the trainers of Jihadi freedom fighters :

    USA prints textbooks to support Jihad in Afghanistan and Pakistan




    http://supportdanielboyd.wordpress.c...-and-pakistan/



    Click here to view the original image of 979x731px.



    US/Saudi/Israeli backed Afghani Jihadis with help from foreign fighters like OBL defeat invading Russian "infidels" triggering collapse of Russian economy and eventual collapse of USSR. Israel was second largest supplier of weapons to Jihadi "freedom fighters" in Afghanistan. Saudis helped with funding of the great Afghan Jihad and by flooding the market with cheap oil (prices dropped from over $100 p/b to $20 p/b) to hit Russian economy at the same time.


    1980s/90s:
    With collapse of USSR following "success" of Afghan Jihad, Soviet Jewish immigration to Israel/Palestinian territories and settlements growth explodes

    Palestinians and Arab street angered by new settlers influx and continuous settlements expansion

    Jewsih Immigration from Former Soviet Union to Israeli


    Total Immigrants to Israel Immigrants from F.S.U.
    Total
    3,108,678
    1,223,723



    2007
    18,131
    6,643
    2006
    19,269
    7,469
    2005
    21,183
    9,431
    2004
    20,899
    10,130
    2003
    23,273
    12,383
    2002
    33,570
    18,508
    2001
    43,473
    33,601



    2000
    60,201
    50,817
    1999
    76,766
    66,848
    1998
    56,730
    46,032
    1997
    66,221
    54,621
    1996
    70,919
    59,048
    1995
    76,361
    64,848
    1994
    79,844
    68,079
    1993
    76,805
    66,145
    1992
    77,057
    65,093
    1991
    176,100
    147,839
    1990
    199,516
    185,227
    1989
    24,050
    12,932
    1988
    13,034
    2,283



    1983
    16,906
    399
    1982
    13,723
    782
    1981
    12,599
    1,770




    2001:







    Aftermath

    2003:







    2008:

    Rothschild owned Leftist French daily Libération prints shortest headline "YES!"





    Bin Laden: Palestinian Cause Prompted 9/11 - CBS News
    May 16, 2008

  14. #12

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Nope..
    It goes back to 1948,, and the creation of the State of Israel. (even further if you count Zionist aggression and terrorism).
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_fundamentalism

    Extremism within Islam goes back to the 7th century to the Kharijites. From their essentially political position, they developed extreme doctrines that set them apart from both mainstream Sunni and Shia Muslims. The Kharijites were particularly noted for adopting a radical approach to Takfir, whereby they declared other Muslims to be unbelievers and therefore deemed them worthy of death.[29][30][31]

    The modern Islamic fundamentalist movements have their origins in the late 19th century.[32] The Wahhabi movement, an Arabian fundamentalist movement that began in the 18th century, gained traction and spread during the 19th and 20th centuries.[33] During the Cold War following World War II, some NATO governments, particularly those of the United States and the United Kingdom, launched covert and overt campaigns to encourage and strengthen fundamentalist groups in the Middle East and southern Asia. These groups were seen as a hedge against potential expansion by the Soviet Union, and as a means to prevent the growth of nationalistic movements that were not necessarily favorable toward the interests of the Western nations.[34] By the 1970s the Islamists had become important allies in supporting governments, such as Egypt, which were friendly to U.S. interests. By the late 1970s, however, some fundamentalist groups had become militaristic leading to threats and changes to existing regimes. The overthrow of the Shah in Iran and rise of the Ayatollah Khomeini was one of the most significant signs of this shift.[35] Subsequently fundamentalist forces in Algeria caused a civil war, caused a near-civil war in Egypt, and caused the downfall of the Soviet occupation in Afghanistan.[36] In many cases the military wings of these groups were supplied with money and arms by the U.S. and U.K.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    ://en.wikipedia.org
    wiki


    did you write that yourself?
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom



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