Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 66

Thread: Gary Johnson booed at 2016 LP convention.

  1. #1

    Gary Johnson booed at 2016 LP convention.

    Gary Johnson was booed at the unofficial presidential debate last night. Austin Petersen asked him why his VP pick Weld did not endorse ROn Paul or Gary in 2012, and noted that he endorsed McCain, Romney, and Kasich.

    Gary responded by saying that Weld was "the Original Libertarian."

    The boos came on hard.

    Couldn't find a youtube video so I will try to link this one on facebook.
    https://www.facebook.com/firefighter...c_location=ufi

    Note that this is not the official debate, that will take place on Saturday.
    The most important element of a free society, where individual rights are held in the highest esteem, is the rejection of the initiation of violence.

    RON PAUL









  2. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  3. #2
    YT video in case you can't use fedbook

    The most important element of a free society, where individual rights are held in the highest esteem, is the rejection of the initiation of violence.

    RON PAUL







  4. #3
    Gary is the favourite but if he doesn't clinch the nomination in the first round, he might end up losing. Anything can happen this weekend.

  5. #4
    Could the LP win a state seat if they pooled all their resources into one race?

    They should just pick McAfee since he's going to get the most attention.
    Support Justin Amash for Congress
    Michigan Congressional District 3

  6. #5
    “The more I listen to Ron Paul the more I think he actually despises this country” -Austin Petersen.

    WTF is AP yammering aboout?

  7. #6
    Gary's 2016 campaign slogan should be 'party over principle'
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It's a balance between appeasing his supporters, appeasing the deep state and reaching his own goals.
    ~Resident Badgiraffe




  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    “The more I listen to Ron Paul the more I think he actually despises this country” -Austin Petersen.

    WTF is AP yammering aboout?
    Yeah he's a clown.
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    It's a balance between appeasing his supporters, appeasing the deep state and reaching his own goals.
    ~Resident Badgiraffe




  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    Could the LP win a state seat if they pooled all their resources into one race?

    They should just pick McAfee since he's going to get the most attention.
    That's what Gary should have done in 2012, run for the Senate in NM under the LP. That would have made him the only LP in Congress. Instead he ran for POTUS as a GOP for about 5 minutes, then switched to LP. I don't see any 3rd party winning POTUS until they get some representation in Congress.
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul



  10. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    “The more I listen to Ron Paul the more I think he actually despises this country” -Austin Petersen.

    WTF is AP yammering aboout?
    Ya, $#@! that guy. I can't believe anybody here actually supports him.. Gary Johnson is not my favorite candidate for President, but he is my favorite candidate to win the Libertarian nomination because he will capture the most support and bring more people on the left into the liberty fold, or at least take votes from Hillary. If they choose Peterson, that will draw the most votes away from Republicans in the general, and he sucks.. I don't get the point.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    “The more I listen to Ron Paul the more I think he actually despises this country” -Austin Petersen.
    What video are you guys watching? I've been through this one twice and I don't hear that anywhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Ya, $#@! that guy. I can't believe anybody here actually supports him.. Gary Johnson is not my favorite candidate for President, but he is my favorite candidate to win the Libertarian nomination because he will capture the most support and bring more people on the left into the liberty fold
    Whereas I actually can believe that you're not capable of seeing past your nose here.
    You don't have a problem with forcing priests to perform gay marriages because you don't have a problem with gay marriage and you don't have a priest.
    I think maybe you need to step outside your bubble for a second and recognize that a $#@! ton of American voters have a gigantic problem with that.
    They simply aren't going to support a candidate who is on record saying that. And as a result, they will be TURNED AWAY from the liberty fold, because they're not going to listen to anything past "he wants to force priests to perform gay marriages".

    Also outside your bubble are the libertarians who actually believe in principles. Using the state to force a social agenda is not libertarian. This isn't a statement of opinion on my part.

    I know you're a reasonably intelligent guy, so can you seriously not see that Johnson is the absolute worst thing to happen to the liberty movement right now? He's not going to get the votes, he's not going to spread the message. All he's going to do is waste everyone's time.
    There are no crimes against people.
    There are only crimes against the state.
    And the state will never, ever choose to hold accountable its agents, because a thing can not commit a crime against itself.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by fisharmor View Post

    Also outside your bubble are the libertarians who actually believe in principles. Using the state to force a social agenda is not libertarian. This isn't a statement of opinion on my part.

    I know you're a reasonably intelligent guy, so can you seriously not see that Johnson is the absolute worst thing to happen to the liberty movement right now? He's not going to get the votes, he's not going to spread the message. All he's going to do is waste everyone's time.
    Its^ all rather amusing since GJ was attacking Randal last year and saying how he was not a libertarian at all. GJ burnt too many bridges and shouldn't deserve any consideration.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by fisharmor View Post
    What video are you guys watching? I've been through this one twice and I don't hear that anywhere.



    Whereas I actually can believe that you're not capable of seeing past your nose here.
    You don't have a problem with forcing priests to perform gay marriages because you don't have a problem with gay marriage and you don't have a priest.
    I think maybe you need to step outside your bubble for a second and recognize that a $#@! ton of American voters have a gigantic problem with that.
    They simply aren't going to support a candidate who is on record saying that. And as a result, they will be TURNED AWAY from the liberty fold, because they're not going to listen to anything past "he wants to force priests to perform gay marriages".

    Also outside your bubble are the libertarians who actually believe in principles. Using the state to force a social agenda is not libertarian. This isn't a statement of opinion on my part.

    I know you're a reasonably intelligent guy, so can you seriously not see that Johnson is the absolute worst thing to happen to the liberty movement right now? He's not going to get the votes, he's not going to spread the message. All he's going to do is waste everyone's time.
    TRUTH BOMBS
    This so many times, we have a real opportunity, let's not waste it on compromise that never works.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by fisharmor View Post
    Whereas I actually can believe that you're not capable of seeing past your nose here.
    You don't have a problem with forcing priests to perform gay marriages because you don't have a problem with gay marriage and you don't have a priest.
    I think maybe you need to step outside your bubble for a second and recognize that a $#@! ton of American voters have a gigantic problem with that.
    They simply aren't going to support a candidate who is on record saying that. And as a result, they will be TURNED AWAY from the liberty fold, because they're not going to listen to anything past "he wants to force priests to perform gay marriages".

    Also outside your bubble are the libertarians who actually believe in principles. Using the state to force a social agenda is not libertarian. This isn't a statement of opinion on my part.

    I know you're a reasonably intelligent guy, so can you seriously not see that Johnson is the absolute worst thing to happen to the liberty movement right now? He's not going to get the votes, he's not going to spread the message. All he's going to do is waste everyone's time.
    Dude, you are totally over-reacting.. I am all for businesses having the right to put up "No blacks allowed" signs or doing whatever or serving whoever they want on their property, I wouldn't patronize them, but they have every right to do it imo..

    We need to be realistic here, Gary Johnson is right - the discrimination issue is a black-hole issue at this point in time. He may even agree with you and I, but either way he knows it isn't a winning issue right now and will sink everything else we want to accomplish. I think Rand had balls to come out against the CRA, but it's probably one of the major reasons he isn't taken as seriously on the national stage (despite all the fantastic work he does in the senate). Anybody who thinks the way you or I do will not be able to win the general election right now. If people move in a more liberty oriented direction and we have more of these conversations with people it could happen, in time, but we aren't there right now.

    Gary Johnson said that every pro-gay legislation he ever signed or backed always stipulated that priests would not be forced to marry gay couples. He doesn't think that cake bakers should be forced to bake a penis shaped cake for a gay wedding, but if a gay couple comes into their business and orders something they should be treated equally. That doesn't mean the cake baker has to customize their cake any specific way that goes against their beliefs because he said that would be violating their first amendment rights.

    Religious freedom is pretty high on my priorities, despite the fact that religious $#@!ers are primarily the ones responsible for the war on drugs which takes away my freedom to perform my personal religion... And I have gay friends who I have told straight up that being pro-gay marriage is not something I actively support in most cases because it is being used to take the rights away from religious people.. But we have to be realistic here and see what areas are most important and where we can make the most headway and Gary Johnson is the person who has the best chance at reducing the size of government, ensuring our personal privacy, ending the war on drugs and reigning in our foreign empire.

    I respect purists like Ron Paul, and Ron Paul was great at being a purist and drawing in people from the left.. But I also respect people who can bring large swaths of people together to help tackle the most important issues of the day because in the end we need a multi-pronged attack at authoritarianism.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by fisharmor View Post
    What video are you guys watching? I've been through this one twice and I don't hear that anywhere.
    It's what AP said about Ron about his views on blow-back. I think it was in a pod-cast.

    Quote Originally Posted by fisharmor View Post
    Whereas I actually can believe that you're not capable of seeing past your nose here.
    You don't have a problem with forcing priests to perform gay marriages because you don't have a problem with gay marriage and you don't have a priest.
    I think maybe you need to step outside your bubble for a second and recognize that a $#@! ton of American voters have a gigantic problem with that.

    They simply aren't going to support a candidate who is on record saying that. And as a result, they will be TURNED AWAY from the liberty fold, because they're not going to listen to anything past "he wants to force priests to perform gay marriages".

    Also outside your bubble are the libertarians who actually believe in principles. Using the state to force a social agenda is not libertarian. This isn't a statement of opinion on my part.

    I know you're a reasonably intelligent guy, so can you seriously not see that Johnson is the absolute worst thing to happen to the liberty movement right now? He's not going to get the votes, he's not going to spread the message. All he's going to do is waste everyone's time.
    Except forcing priests to perform gay marriage is NOT GJ's position. So, there is that. Not that I personally care for GJ myself.
    Last edited by phill4paul; 05-27-2016 at 01:11 PM.

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    Could the LP win a state seat if they pooled all their resources into one race?

    They should just pick McAfee since he's going to get the most attention.
    It's possible- I just found this:


    https://alibertarianfuture.com/2016-...te-new-mexico/
    “I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    Except forcing priests to perform gay marriage is NOT GJ's position. So, there is that. Not that I personally care for GJ myself.
    It sounded like he was for forcing bakers to make gay wedding cakes, what is the difference?



  19. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    It sounded like he was for forcing bakers to make gay wedding cakes, what is the difference?
    There is a big difference. But, he is also not for forcing bakers to bake gay wedding cakes. A facebook post of his I think should clear it up.

    From his FB....

    In a nationally-televised debate among three of the Libertarian candidates for President (A debate that should, by the way, have been more inclusive of all the candidates.), a highly unlikely hypothetical question was raised about whether a Jewish baker has the right to refuse to serve a Nazi sympathizer asking for a “Nazi cake”. I responded to that question in the legal context of whether a public business has the right to refuse to serve a member of the public, as distasteful as it might be.

    The simple answer to that question is, whether all like it or not, U.S. law has recognized the principle of public accommodation for more than 100 years: The principle that, when a business opens its doors to the public, that business enters into an implied contract to serve ALL of the public. Further, when that business voluntarily opens its doors, the owners voluntarily agree to adhere to applicable laws and regulations -- whether they like those laws or not.

    To be clear, anti-discrimination laws do not, and cannot, abridge fundamental First Amendment rights. I know of no one who reasonably disagrees. In the highly unlikely event that a Nazi would demand that a Jewish baker decorate a cake with a Nazi symbol, the courts, common sense, and common decency -- not to mention the First Amendment -- all combine to protect that baker from having to do so. It’s not an issue, except when distorted for purposes of gotcha politics.

    Does a public bakery have to sell a cake to a Nazi? Probably so. Does that bakery have to draw a swastika on it? Absolutely not. And that’s the way it should be.

    Of course, we all know that this conversation is really “code” for the current, and far more real, conversation about society’s treatment of LGBT individuals. I have even heard some talk of a “right to discriminate”. And of course, we have states and municipalities today trying to create a real right to discriminate against the LGBT community on religious grounds -- the same kinds of “religious” grounds that were used to defend racial segregation, forbid interracial marriages and, yes, defend discrimination against Jews by businesses. That is not a slope Libertarians want to go down.

    Once again, my belief that discrimination on the basis of religion should not be allowed has been distorted by some to suggest that a legitimate church or its clergy should be “forced” to perform a same-sex marriage. That is absurd. The various ballot initiatives I supported across the country to repeal bans on same-sex marriage all had one provision in common: A specific provision making clear that no religious organization, priest or pastor could be required to perform any rite contrary to that organization’s or individual’s faith. That protection was supported almost universally by the LGBT community -- even though most legal scholars agreed that such a protection already exists in the Constitution. We just wanted to leave no doubt.
    https://www.facebook.com/govgaryjohn...53109454754364

    Note, I don't agree with him. I think businesses should be able to serve who they want. In other words, "the right to discriminate."
    Last edited by phill4paul; 05-27-2016 at 02:24 PM.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    It's what AP said about Ron about his views on blow-back. I think it was in a pod-cast.



    Except forcing priests to perform gay marriage is NOT GJ's position. So, there is that. Not that I personally care for GJ myself.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1B3UBvxlH8&t=63m14s

    Here is the entire question in context.
    Johnson's answer: "These religious freedom laws are just a way to discriminate against gay individuals."
    That is a direct quote.

    Here is the page for Virginia SB41:
    https://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/leg...e?161+sum+SB41

    Here is the summary as passed:

    Religious freedom; solemnization of marriage. Provides that no person shall be (i) required to participate in the solemnization of any marriage or (ii) subject to any penalty, any civil liability, or any other action by the Commonwealth, or its political subdivisions or representatives or agents, solely on account of such person's belief, speech, or action in accordance with a sincerely held religious belief or moral conviction that marriage is or should be recognized as the union of one man and one woman. The bill defines "person" as any (a) religious organization, (b) organization supervised or controlled by or operated in connection with a religious organization, (c) individual employed by a religious organization while acting in the scope of his paid or volunteer employment, (d) successor, representative, agent, agency, or instrumentality of any of the foregoing, or (e) clergy member or minister. The bill also defines "penalty."

    Here is the bit of Virginia's bill after the definitions section:

    B. No person shall be:
    1. Required to participate in the solemnization of any marriage; or
    2. Subject to any penalty, any civil liability, or any other action by the Commonwealth, or its political subdivisions or representatives or agents, solely on account of such person's belief, speech, or action in accordance with a sincerely held religious belief or moral conviction that marriage is or should be recognized as the union of one man and one woman.

    Do you want me to look up the other bills?

    He's stuck. Either Johnson is in favor of forcing clergy to perform marriages (as he is directly against these bills), or he doesn't know what the $#@! he's talking about and thinks the bills are something else.

    Which of those possibilities makes him a good candidate?
    There are no crimes against people.
    There are only crimes against the state.
    And the state will never, ever choose to hold accountable its agents, because a thing can not commit a crime against itself.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by fisharmor View Post

    He's stuck. Either Johnson is in favor of forcing clergy to perform marriages (as he is directly against these bills), or he doesn't know what the $#@! he's talking about and thinks the bills are something else.

    Which of those possibilities makes him a good candidate?
    See the post before yours...

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    There is a big difference. But, he is also not for forcing bakers to bake gay wedding cakes. A facebook post of his I think should clear it up.
    From his FB....
    https://www.facebook.com/govgaryjohn...53109454754364
    Note, I don't agree with him. I think businesses should be able to serve who they want.
    I bumped the interview from a year ago where he was asked specifically about it and it sure sounded like he wanted to make it a federal law forcing bakers to make gay cakes and do weddings. He specifically referenced the civil rights act and said it should include gays.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    I bumped the interview from a year ago where he was asked specifically about it and it sure sounded like he wanted to make it a federal law forcing bakers to make gay cakes and do weddings. He specifically referenced the civil rights act and said it should include gays.
    Meh, I dunno. GJ is not my choice. I don't even know why he is allowed in the LP. But, they seem to want his kind so...<shrug>.

  25. #22
    The more I hear from GJ the less I like him. Also never liked what he said about the Pauls and how he thinks he's better or more libertarian than them and this video just reinforces that.

    Plus I really don't think he's a very good candidate. At this point I think I could only support AP (yes I know he said some questionable stuff in the past) and maybe McAfee

  26. #23
    I'm going to support who ever gets the nomination but I prefer them in this order.... 1) McAfee 2) Peterson 3) Johnson.

    - ML

  27. #24
    It is just truly amazing the type of crap that Rand Paul had to put up with from the so-called true libertarians, all the while we have pretenders like gary johnson possibly getting nominated again. So for the record, the GOP had a golden opportunity to run against Hillary, and screwed it up...then the LP had a golden opportunity to run against Hillary and Trump, and we are going to nominate the glass sherpa.



  28. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  29. #25
    This thread is a prime example of why the LP and libertarians are a circular firing squad. You won't support Gary because of [insert your impossibly nuanced pet issue here].

    We have a LP candidate polling double digits. He's a well liked 2 term governor and his likely running mate was a governor too. The presumptive nominees for the D and R are the least liked in generations. This could be a huge breakthrough in cracking the stranglehold of the 2 party system.

    I don't think Gary is the greatest candidate. I don't agree with him on issues, I'm pro life, he isn't. I sucked it up and voted for him last time anyway and will again. He's the best candidate the LP has with the most name recognition. I say just go with it. He's not going to be potus anyway, but you might make a difference in the future voting for him.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    Could the LP win a state seat if they pooled all their resources into one race?

    They should just pick McAfee since he's going to get the most attention.
    Maybe, the LP of Maine is going to be real party here they just won their court case. CD2 could be winnable, Ron won a lot of counties in the past.


    MacAfee would be a huge mistake. He would bring nothing but negative attention. He's kind of nuts.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by CPUd View Post
    That's what Gary should have done in 2012, run for the Senate in NM under the LP. That would have made him the only LP in Congress. Instead he ran for POTUS as a GOP for about 5 minutes, then switched to LP. I don't see any 3rd party winning POTUS until they get some representation in Congress.
    He thinks he is too good for Congress.
    ================
    Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.

    Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America

    The Property Basis of Rights

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    “The more I listen to Ron Paul the more I think he actually despises this country” -Austin Petersen.

    WTF is AP yammering aboout?
    Where are you getting that from, Phill?
    ================
    Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.

    Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America

    The Property Basis of Rights

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    This thread is a prime example of why the LP and libertarians are a circular firing squad. You won't support Gary because of [insert your impossibly nuanced pet issue here].

    We have a LP candidate polling double digits. He's a well liked 2 term governor and his likely running mate was a governor too. The presumptive nominees for the D and R are the least liked in generations. This could be a huge breakthrough in cracking the stranglehold of the 2 party system.

    I don't think Gary is the greatest candidate. I don't agree with him on issues, I'm pro life, he isn't. I sucked it up and voted for him last time anyway and will again. He's the best candidate the LP has with the most name recognition. I say just go with it. He's not going to be potus anyway, but you might make a difference in the future voting for him.
    Well liked? What did he accomplish in 2012? What has he done to improve on that? Oh right trash other libertarians, but hey it's our fault he isn't getting more support.

    Just an fyi I voted for him in 2012 even though I wasn't a fan of his and disagreed with a lot of his positions.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    Where are you getting that from, Phill?
    AP said that in an interview a few months back. His point was not that blowback doesn't exist... but that by focusing on it it, however true it may be, makes ron sound anti-american to the average flag waver.

    'We endorse the idea of voluntarism; self-responsibility: Family, friends, and churches to solve problems, rather than saying that some monolithic government is going to make you take care of yourself and be a better person. It's a preposterous notion: It never worked, it never will. The government can't make you a better person; it can't make you follow good habits.' - Ron Paul 1988

    Awareness is the Root of Liberation Revolution is Action upon Revelation

    'Resistance and Disobedience in Economic Activity is the Most Moral Human Action Possible' - SEK3

    Flectere si nequeo superos, Acheronta movebo.

    ...the familiar ritual of institutional self-absolution...
    ...for protecting them, by mock trial, from punishment...


Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •