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Thread: Amash votes in Favor of Obama's Transgender Executive Order

  1. #1

    Amash votes in Favor of Obama's Transgender Executive Order

    Amash voted in favor of an amendment that would prohibit funds from being used that would be in violation of Obama's transgender executive order:

    https://www.congress.gov/amendment/1...amendment/1128
    http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2016/roll258.xml

    None of the funds made available by this Act may
    be used in contravention of Executive Order No. 13672 of July
    21, 2014 (``Further Amendments to Executive order 11478,
    Equal Employment in the Federal Government, and Executive
    Order 11246, Equal Employment Opportunity'').
    I really don't get what compelled him to vote for this.
    Support Justin Amash for Congress
    Michigan Congressional District 3



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  3. #2
    My guess is that he believes the Executive branch has the right to make this policy

  4. #3
    Seriously
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it."
    James Madison

    "It does not take a majority to prevail ... but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." - Samuel Adams



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  5. #4
    Epic fail.
    #NashvilleStrong

    “I’m a doctor. That’s a baby.”~~~Dr. Manny Sethi

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    My guess is that he believes the Executive branch has the right to make this policy
    It must be because it pertains to the federal workforce. He's still has some 'splaining to do.
    Support Justin Amash for Congress
    Michigan Congressional District 3

  7. #6
    I'll wait to see his explanation. But this strikes me as very foolish, both ethically and politically. This could be bad enough to end his career.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    It must be because it pertains to the federal workforce. He's still has some 'splaining to do.
    Yeah. He has not updated his page with his votes for a quite a while.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    Epic fail.
    Um, did anyone read that amendment?

    It prevents funds from being used to punish states which refuse to bow down to Obama's transgender nonsense.
    Last edited by acptulsa; 05-26-2016 at 12:43 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You only want the freedoms that will undermine the nation and lead to the destruction of liberty.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Um, did anyone read that amendment?

    It prevents funds from being used to punish states which refuse to bow down to Obama's transgender nonsense.
    Dude, don't rock the boat and ask people to read. This site thrives on reacting to headlines. Are you going to take that away from people? Do you hate America?

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Um, did anyone read that amendment?

    It prevents funds from being used to punish states which refuse to bow down to Obama's transgender nonsense.
    Where did you see that? The text is really long, and the purpose is stated as:
    An amendment to prohibit the use of funds in contravention of Executive Order No. 13672 of July 21, 2014 ("Further Amendments to Executive order 11478, Equal Employment in the Federal Government, and Executive Order 11246, Equal Employment Opportunity").

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Mad Raven View Post
    Dude, don't rock the boat and ask people to read. This site thrives on reacting to headlines. Are you going to take that away from people? Do you hate America?
    Withholding judgement is one of the weaknesses of people here, and probably people in general.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    Amash voted in favor of an amendment that would prohibit funds from being used that would be in violation of Obama's transgender executive order:

    https://www.congress.gov/amendment/1...amendment/1128
    http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2016/roll258.xml



    I really don't get what compelled him to vote for this.
    Perhaps Amash thinks the federal government shouldn't discriminate hiring based on gender issues? I don't have a problem with that.

    https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Executive_Order_13672

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Um, did anyone read that amendment?

    It prevents funds from being used to punish states which refuse to bow down to Obama's transgender nonsense.
    Here's the relevant portion of the text. I don't see it saying anything like what you said.
    Amendment Offered by Mr. Sean Patrick Maloney of New York

    Mr. SEAN PATRICK MALONEY of New York. Mr. Chairman, I have an
    amendment at the desk.
    The Acting CHAIR. The Clerk will report the amendment.
    The Clerk read as follows:

    At the end of the bill (before the short title), insert the
    following:

    Sec. __. None of the funds made available by this Act may
    be used in contravention of Executive Order No. 13672 of July
    21, 2014 (``Further Amendments to Executive order 11478,
    Equal Employment in the Federal Government, and Executive
    Order 11246, Equal Employment Opportunity'').

    The Acting CHAIR. Pursuant to House Resolution 743, the gentleman
    from New York and a Member opposed each will control 5 minutes.
    The Chair recognizes the gentleman from New York.
    Mr. SEAN PATRICK MALONEY of New York. Mr. Chairman, last week, I came
    to the floor to offer an amendment to preserve basic workplace
    protections for LGBT Americans. My amendment would have kept taxpayer
    dollars from going to government contractors who discriminate against
    LGBT employees. That is it. It said you cannot take taxpayer dollars
    and fire people just for being gay.
    There are 28 million Americans working for employers who receive
    taxpayer dollars, and simple math will tell you millions would have
    been protected from arbitrary firing. So it made sense, it was fair,
    and it deserved a fair vote.
    When the vote was held, a bipartisan majority of this House,
    including 36 members of the majority party, supported my amendment.
    That tally clock right there showed 217 ``yes'' votes--4 more than the
    213 needed that day to pass. With all time expired, it was clear as can
    be that equality had won the vote.
    But when the world watched, something else happened. Something
    shameful happened. Something about sticking up for basic workplace
    fairness for LGBT Americans rankled certain people around here.
    Even though my amendment simply would have applied the same standard
    to LGBT employees that we have long applied when people are fired
    because of their race or gender or religion or disability, it simply
    was too much. Even though we would have preserved time-honored
    religious exemptions, it was too much. Something about treating LGBT
    people fairly just wouldn't do.
    So people went to work. Even though all Members had voted, strangely,
    the expired clock stayed up four times longer than it should have. The
    gavel did not fall. And as we all watched, the tally began to change:
    217, 216, 215. The votes in support were dropping. Members of this
    House were changing their votes. Why? From being in support of
    fairness, they were now changing them to be opposed to it.
    Down the vote went, 214, 213, and yet no one came to the well, as is
    customary, to announce their vote. It was all in secret, happening out
    of sight, so no one might see the ugly reality of what was happening.
    And what happened? Well, when it hit 212, one vote shy of the
    majority it needed to pass--one vote shy of the majority it had a few
    moments earlier--the gavel came down and the result was declared. A
    defeat.
    It was a shameful exercise, made more shameful in that it took place
    on a civil rights vote that enjoyed a bipartisan majority of support in
    this House. From Portland, Maine, to Des Moines, Iowa, to southeast
    Oregon, to Bakersfield, California, newspaper editorial boards, radio
    hosts, and ordinary citizens joined a chorus that was heard first on
    this floor. ``Shame,'' they said. Shame on those who would betray the
    will of this House, who would betray this vote, and shame on anyone who
    would rig this vote and rig our democracy.
    Shame on those who snatched discrimination from the jaws of equality,
    especially those ``Switching Seven'' who, having at first voted for
    fairness, allowed themselves to be dragged backward into voting for
    discrimination.
    On Friday, at a meeting of my Veterans' Advisory Board back home, I
    spoke to decorated military heroes and civilians who have dedicated
    their lives to the service of this country. To a person, they were
    outraged by what happened on the floor of this House.
    One member of the group, Edie, who served as a first lieutenant and
    combat medic in Vietnam, said when she heard about the rigged vote, she
    thought of her daughter, who right now is serving her country in the
    military. And Edie's daughter is a lesbian.
    Edie said:

    When my daughter finishes her active military service, she
    will enter the civilian workforce--perhaps for a government
    contractor, as so many vets do. Will they be able to fire
    her, even though she and I are both veterans?

    Mr. Chairman, does Edie's service in combat count for anything here?
    Does her daughter's service right now to this country count for
    anything here?
    Her daughter isn't alone. There are 71,000 Active Duty LGBT
    servicemen and -women right now and over 1 million LGBT veterans.
    Making it easier to fire LGBT Americans, even LGBT veterans, isn't
    honoring our values. It is sacrificing them to preserve a worn out and
    dying prejudice that weakens our Nation rather than strengthening it.
    So, today, I want to thank Speaker Ryan for allowing an open process
    so that I can offer my amendment again. It is through this open process
    that we can give our colleagues another chance--a second chance--to do
    the right thing and to stand for equality.
    Let us this time ensure that no taxpayer dollars will be used to
    discriminate against hardworking Americans simply because of who they
    are, simply because of who they love. And we will also reaffirm
    legitimate religious exemptions that the President also included in his
    executive orders on this subject.
    Discrimination has no place in our law. It does not make our water
    cleaner. It does not power our homes. It doesn't defeat ISIS. It
    doesn't support our veterans.
    Every American deserves the right to work, support a family, and
    achieve the American Dream, regardless of who they are or who they
    love.

    [[Page H3235]]

    I urge my colleagues to stand up to discrimination and adopt my
    amendment to the bill.
    The Acting CHAIR. The time of the gentleman has expired.

  16. #14
    "1 million LGBT veterans"

    Are there now? That sounds like a fib.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sister Miriam Godwinson View Post
    We Must Dissent.

  17. #15
    It prevents funds from being used if it violates Obama's executive order.

    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Um, did anyone read that amendment?

    It prevents funds from being used to punish states which refuse to bow down to Obama's transgender nonsense.
    It doesn't say that. It says none of the funds in the bill can violate Obama's executive order.


    Quote Originally Posted by specsaregood View Post
    Perhaps Amash thinks the federal government shouldn't discriminate hiring based on gender issues? I don't have a problem with that.

    https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Executive_Order_13672
    I don't really either. But the problem is this amendment gives legitimacy to a law (the EO) that was never defined by Congress.
    Support Justin Amash for Congress
    Michigan Congressional District 3

  18. #16
    Are we talking about this amendment?

    According to that link, this is the amendment:

    Mr. PITTENGER. Mr. Chairman, I have an amendment at the desk.
    The Acting CHAIR. The Clerk will designate the amendment.
    The text of the amendment is as follows:

    At the end of the bill (before the short title), insert the
    following:
    Sec. __. None of the funds made available by this Act may
    be used to revoke funding previously awarded to or within the
    State of North Carolina.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You only want the freedoms that will undermine the nation and lead to the destruction of liberty.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Are we talking about this amendment?



    According to that link, this is the amendment:
    It looks like you just copied the first part of the text at the link. That's not the part describing the amendment in question. If you look further down you'll see the part I quoted in post #13.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    I don't really either. But the problem is this amendment gives legitimacy to a law (the EO) that was never defined by Congress.
    But if it only applies to funds for federal agencies then that shouldn't really be a problem either. This seems like much ado about nothing.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Are we talking about this amendment?



    According to that link, this is the amendment:
    That was a proposed amendment to this amendment. If Justin voted for this there wouldn't be an issue.
    Last edited by EBounding; 05-27-2016 at 09:29 PM.
    Support Justin Amash for Congress
    Michigan Congressional District 3

  23. #20
    He's responding on Twitter to a lot of people. You have to check his "with replies" feed:

    https://twitter.com/justinamash/with_replies



    There's a nasty National Review article slamming him that I won't bother to post here but here's a quote:

    Michigan’s Justin Amash is (or was) a tea-party favorite, a fan of Ron and Rand Paul, the great next-gen hope of the Liberty Movement. I called Amash’s office to ask why he voted as he did. Jordan Bush, Amash’s district director, referred me to his boss’s Twitter account, where he wrote, “They are mischaracterizing the amdt. It simply prohibits discrimination by VA/military construction contractors in hiring.” In response to another question about his vote, Amash wrote, “Contrary to what some claim, this amendment preserves all existing religious liberty protections from the Bush administration,” leaving unanswered the question of whether refusing to let people with penises into women’s most private spaces is really discrimination or not.

    I still don't get why he voted for it. If the position is ambiguous it's almost always best to vote no.
    Last edited by EBounding; 05-27-2016 at 09:26 PM.
    Support Justin Amash for Congress
    Michigan Congressional District 3

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Spikender View Post
    "1 million LGBT veterans"

    Are there now? That sounds like a fib.
    Veterans?
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Spikender View Post
    "1 million LGBT veterans"

    Are there now? That sounds like a fib.

    How would they even know? Nobody asked and nobody told.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by EBounding View Post
    But the problem is this amendment gives legitimacy to a law (the EO) that was never defined by Congress.
    I think this is what people are really worried about. Now it's just an EO, but that would have made it US Code. Once it is US Code, it will propagate everywhere. This ends up with the President writing legislation, which is upside down and bass-ackwards. Thank goodness the bill died.

  27. #24
    I was looking for this, and I believe Amash made a mistake to allow this code a threat to law. The apparent miniscule ramifications of the amendment are minor enough that I am not angry it got overlooked, but appearances are deceiving, and the way law works once a code is written it is cross referenced out into everything else in new law, and when bills are written to "clean up" old laws. The bill died, a danger was averted, and I hope Congressman Amash will be more careful with the walnut inside a mustard seed trick in the future. Lord knows I am sure I let a couple get by. They are hard to spot as they fly by at mach 2.



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  29. #25
    There's no problem from a libertarian point of view.

    The government can set whatever terms it likes for its own contractors; they don't like the terms, they don't have to take the contract.

    This isn't about governmental restrictions on private property owners.

    That said, it was probably a political error, as a lot of people are inexplicably hopped up about this nonsense at the moment.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Veterans?
    Veterans.

    Quote Originally Posted by GunnyFreedom View Post
    How would they even know? Nobody asked and nobody told.
    Maybe they're trying to say there are a bunch of retired veterans who admitted to be LGBT. I have no idea.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sister Miriam Godwinson View Post
    We Must Dissent.

  31. #27
    Support Justin Amash for Congress
    Michigan Congressional District 3



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